Browns' Desperation

[Reddog]

These guys are putting a bandaid on a severed limb. Signing these older guys to these deals is going to bind their hands in the future. This is why you build a team through the draft and develop players to contribute in their rookie contract. 28 for Whitner isn't bad but Los will be hard pressed to earn at that level at 35/36. If they were serious about Revis too then this would be like a 72 pinto with diamond studded rims. Where is the QB, the line etc. Oh well it will be fun to watch anyway.

Browns | Expected to sign Karlos Dansby

Tue, 11 Mar 2014 11:55:10 -0700
The Cleveland Browns are expected to sign free-agent LB Karlos Dansby (Cardinals) to a four-year deal worth $24 million with $14 million guaranteed.


Browns | Expected to sign Donte Whitner

Tue, 11 Mar 2014 12:43:29 -0700
Updating a previous report, the Cleveland Browns are expected to sign free-agent FS Donte Whitner (49ers) to a four-year deal that averages $7 million per season.

http://www.kffl.com

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Would have liked to have Whitner, but not as those numbers.

 

[football karma]

consider what has transpired for Cleveland over the last 18 months:

Fired, hired, fired and hired coaching staffs
fired and hired a front office

the owner is under a federal investigation

they still dont have a QB


it almost says that no matter where the Browns were in rebuilding: they had to make a giant splash in free agency for the sake of their fans

 

[TJ]

Cleveland is a garbage organization and city. They have to overpay for talent. If Dansby were 27-29, that deal would be fine. He's 32. By the 2nd or 3rd year of the deal, he won't be nearly as productive.

 

[CardsFan88]

Don't forget Mack is probably on his way out. His agent said he knows he can sign a deal the Browns won't match. (though after what they've doled out and perhaps interest in Revis, it might not be vary hard to achieve that)

...and Joe Thomas was very vocal about needing stability.

 

[football karma]

there is this to consider as well:

last year the Browns had DQwell Jackon at ILB and TJ Ward at S

they just let both go, and spent nearly $30 mm in guaranteed money on replacements.

Said differently, they spent all that money to move two positions from "good" to "very good", but also get older at the same time

ugh

 

[kerouac9]

Fans are so silly. I'll believe that these contracts will tie the hands of any team when that actually happens.

If I'm a young team without an identity but a ton of talent on defense (and the Browns are that), then I'm paying a premium for Karlos Dansby, who's galvanized two or three good young defenses in his career with his leadership and dynamism.

Dansby gathered players like Matthieu, Campbell, Peterson, and Washington into his orbit. He's a second-team All-Pro. He's an exceptional leader, and has been his entire career.

Cleveland was 4-12 last year, but had a win expectation of 5.5 wins. They'll be better at quarterback next year, and they have two dynamic weapons on offense. They have two first-round picks this year in what is widely considered a quality draft.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Fans are so silly. I'll believe that these contracts will tie the hands of any team when that actually happens.

If I'm a young team without an identity but a ton of talent on defense (and the Browns are that), then I'm paying a premium for Karlos Dansby, who's galvanized two or three good young defenses in his career with his leadership and dynamism.

Dansby gathered players like Matthieu, Campbell, Peterson, and Washington into his orbit. He's a second-team All-Pro. He's an exceptional leader, and has been his entire career.

Cleveland was 4-12 last year, but had a win expectation of 5.5 wins. They'll be better at quarterback next year, and they have two dynamic weapons on offense. They have two first-round picks this year in what is widely considered a quality draft.

May come as a shock, but 'fans' includes you.

 

[kerouac9]

May come as a shock, but 'fans' includes you.

I think my record on this site is that I'm more of an observer/appreciator than I am a "fan" who believes that the Cards can do no wrong, a Cardinal who is off the roster was always overrated and not as important as believed before he was cut/waived/left as a free agent, etc., etc.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I think my record on this site is that I'm more of an observer/appreciator than I am a "fan" who believes that the Cards can do no wrong

I would say eternal pessimist

But I do agree with your argument, Cleveland isn't too far away from becoming a very good team. The flipside is that they have a few huge holes that they haven't even touched (QB and RB).

Now if the Cardinals Traded Dansby and Roberts for Veldheer and DWare straight up, who would you say won that trade? We can make a move like signing Ware ($7 mill per) that would offset the loss of Dansby.

 

[Chopper0080]

Fans are so silly. I'll believe that these contracts will tie the hands of any team when that actually happens.

If I'm a young team without an identity but a ton of talent on defense (and the Browns are that), then I'm paying a premium for Karlos Dansby, who's galvanized two or three good young defenses in his career with his leadership and dynamism.

Dansby gathered players like Matthieu, Campbell, Peterson, and Washington into his orbit. He's a second-team All-Pro. He's an exceptional leader, and has been his entire career.

Cleveland was 4-12 last year, but had a win expectation of 5.5 wins. They'll be better at quarterback next year, and they have two dynamic weapons on offense. They have two first-round picks this year in what is widely considered a quality draft.

14 mil guaranteed is a big number for a 32 year old anyway you cut it. Would you have wanted him to re-sign with the Cardinals at that rate? I understand Cleveland is trying to bring in a new identity after the past two years have put a foul taste in everyone's mouth, but they are literaly paying millions for it.

 

[Buckybird]

Fans are so silly. I'll believe that these contracts will tie the hands of any team when that actually happens.

If I'm a young team without an identity but a ton of talent on defense (and the Browns are that), then I'm paying a premium for Karlos Dansby, who's galvanized two or three good young defenses in his career with his leadership and dynamism.

Dansby gathered players like Matthieu, Campbell, Peterson, and Washington into his orbit. He's a second-team All-Pro. He's an exceptional leader, and has been his entire career.

Cleveland was 4-12 last year, but had a win expectation of 5.5 wins. They'll be better at quarterback next year, and they have two dynamic weapons on offense. They have two first-round picks this year in what is widely considered a quality draft.

I agree K9. I think the Cards D took a step backward & is less talented today without Los & lost its defensive leader! I understand the organization not wanting to overpay, but people here whom think Minter can do the things Dansby did in coverage are highly mistaken IMO. Karlos will be missed by the Cards on the field.

 

[Buckybird]

We can make a move like signing Ware ($7 mill per) that would offset the loss of Dansby.

Btw I heard here in Dallas today, Demarcus still believes he's a $10 mil/yr player who was playing out of position as a DE in the 4-3. If we added him, I'm not sure a 3-4 OLB will offset the loss of a talented ILB. Someone's gonna pay him big $$$

 

[football karma]

Fans are so silly. I'll believe that these contracts will tie the hands of any team when that actually happens.

If I'm a young team without an identity but a ton of talent on defense (and the Browns are that), then I'm paying a premium for Karlos Dansby, who's galvanized two or three good young defenses in his career with his leadership and dynamism.

Dansby gathered players like Matthieu, Campbell, Peterson, and Washington into his orbit. He's a second-team All-Pro. He's an exceptional leader, and has been his entire career.

Cleveland was 4-12 last year, but had a win expectation of 5.5 wins. They'll be better at quarterback next year, and they have two dynamic weapons on offense. They have two first-round picks this year in what is widely considered a quality draft.

The Cowboys and Saints disagree with the first part

I dont begrudge the contracts necessarily -- its getting older and more expensive at two positions that weren't exactly areas of need.

Those signings make sense for a team that is close -- while you never know, the Browns don't seem close

 

[cardncubfan]

Fans are so silly. I'll believe that these contracts will tie the hands of any team when that actually happens.

If I'm a young team without an identity but a ton of talent on defense (and the Browns are that), then I'm paying a premium for Karlos Dansby, who's galvanized two or three good young defenses in his career with his leadership and dynamism.

Dansby gathered players like Matthieu, Campbell, Peterson, and Washington into his orbit. He's a second-team All-Pro. He's an exceptional leader, and has been his entire career.

Cleveland was 4-12 last year, but had a win expectation of 5.5 wins. They'll be better at quarterback next year, and they have two dynamic weapons on offense. They have two first-round picks this year in what is widely considered a quality draft.

I had to do a google search to see if this was even a word. Lol.

 

[kerouac9]

I would say eternal pessimist

But I do agree with your argument, Cleveland isn't too far away from becoming a very good team. The flipside is that they have a few huge holes that they haven't even touched (QB and RB).

Now if the Cardinals Traded Dansby and Roberts for Veldheer and DWare straight up, who would you say won that trade? We can make a move like signing Ware ($7 mill per) that would offset the loss of Dansby.

I don't know if they're that far away from being a "very good team"; for me that definition is teams like Green Bay and New England. I think they're close to being a team that is close to average, but just need some direction and definition.

RB is an easy, easy, easy hole to fill, particularly with the offensive line they have set up right now. QB is a bigger question, but they certainly are going to have some options.

I don't think we're going to get DeMarcus Ware, and I never really thought we were going to keep Roberts. I don't accept your comparison. Do I think we got better on offense while getting worse on defense? I absolutely do. Are we a better team right now than we were yesterday? I don't think so. I think we're about the same, but some strengths shifted around.

14 mil guaranteed is a big number for a 32 year old anyway you cut it. Would you have wanted him to re-sign with the Cardinals at that rate? I understand Cleveland is trying to bring in a new identity after the past two years have put a foul taste in everyone's mouth, but they are literaly paying millions for it.

I'm fine with the Cards not paying that freight. You don't see me here complaining about the Cards being cheap, and I didn't four years ago the last time Dansby left. I don't think that the Browns' decision was a disasterous one, though. I think it can be defended.

The Cowboys and Saints disagree with the first part

I dont begrudge the contracts necessarily -- its getting older and more expensive at two positions that weren't exactly areas of need.

Those signings make sense for a team that is close -- while you never know, the Browns don't seem close

The Cowboys made dumb errors re-signing their own players, not signing free agents. The Saints have a problem (clearly) re-signing their own guys right now. I don't think their shedding contracts because of bad free agent deals; I think they're shedding salary because they too made some dumb extensions.

 

[PDXChris]

I think the Cards D took a step backward.

I think you said this exact same thing last year. Just sayin'

 

[football karma]

The Cowboys made dumb errors re-signing their own players, not signing free agents. The Saints have a problem (clearly) re-signing their own guys right now. I don't think their shedding contracts because of bad free agent deals; I think they're shedding salary because they too made some dumb extensions.

maybe - but money is fungible. for every bad Ware extension, there is also a terrible Brandon Carr f/a signing ( the second highest paid CB in the league).

 

[GuernseyCard]

I think my record on this site is that I'm more of an observer/appreciator than I am a "fan" who believes that the Cards can do no wrong, a Cardinal who is off the roster was always overrated and not as important as believed before he was cut/waived/left as a free agent, etc., etc.

Self describe as you see fit, and I appreciate your view, but you are no longer a fan the day someone pays you to show up at the team facility.

 

[GuernseyCard]

I agree K9. I think the Cards D took a step backward & is less talented today without Los & lost its defensive leader! I understand the organization not wanting to overpay, but people here whom think Minter can do the things Dansby did in coverage are highly mistaken IMO. Karlos will be missed by the Cards on the field.

Yup... and we took a step back when Horton left.

 

[kerouac9]

maybe - but money is fungible. for every bad Ware extension, there is also a terrible Brandon Carr f/a signing ( the second highest paid CB in the league).

Yeah, I get that. Bill Barnwell had a good article a couple months ago that discussed the bad contracts that Jerry Jones has given to his own guys. Here it is:

http://grantland.com/features/bill-barnwell-jerry-jones-cowboys/

Self describe as you see fit, and I appreciate your view, but you are no longer a fan the day someone pays you to show up at the team facility.

Is that really the only guideline? Everyone's a fan until they're inside the building (where I have been, in a very limited capacity)? That's nonsense.

Yes, to the broader world, I'm a fan. But on this board, where we're all fans (or largely fans and some trolls), I'm much more of an unbiased observer than many here.

 

[TJ]

I agree K9. I think the Cards D took a step backward & is less talented today without Los & lost its defensive leader! I understand the organization not wanting to overpay, but people here whom think Minter can do the things Dansby did in coverage are highly mistaken IMO. Karlos will be missed by the Cards on the field.

No one thinks Minter is equal to Dansby unless they're a LSU alum or completely delusional. We will take a step back; it's a matter of how far back. Also, I'm not sure he was "the" leader of the defense. Influential figure, yes. But he'd been off the squad for 3 years before returning for what apparently was an audition.

The thing I'm more concerned with is why we cut Brinkley. Not that he's a budding star, but it compromised our depth at ILB. I hope Keim and co. have a plan to put players behind (or perhaps in front of) Minter.

While it sucks, remember that before Dansby returned, we had a championship caliber defense. IMO, we still do.

 

[PDXChris]

But on this board, where we're all fans (or largely fans and some trolls), I'm much more of an unbiased observer than many here.

Sorry, but you are about as unbiased as I am.

 

[crisper57]

Ha ha. Just saw a comment on PFT that said they were spending the owner's money before it could be used as evidence against him in court!

 

[GuernseyCard]

No one thinks Minter is equal to Dansby unless they're a LSU alum or completely delusional. We will take a step back; it's a matter of how far back. Also, I'm not sure he was "the" leader of the defense. Influential figure, yes. But he'd been off the squad for 3 years before returning for what apparently was an audition.

The thing I'm more concerned with is why we cut Brinkley. Not that he's a budding star, but it compromised our depth at ILB. I hope Keim and co. have a plan to put players behind (or perhaps in front of) Minter.

While it sucks, remember that before Dansby returned, we had a championship caliber defense. IMO, we still do.

We're down one, but Lorenzo Alexander was the number one back up inside in Washington.