Buydown Option

Irish

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The Suns have managed to paint themselves into a corner, although the naute of the problem is that they are trying (or should be trying) to do so many thing.

1. Prepare for the future: It is hard to know when Hill will retirue, but loadding up on SF's is necesssary if they are goind to be ready.

2. Develop better wing defense: The Suns ended up having to use the zone too much in the playoffs and could not deal with outside shooters. Chill should be much better at this than Barbosa.

3. Keeping the cap space for a quality inside free agent next summer. This means not trading J-Rich for just role players, but it is hard to get teams wanting the clear cap space to give high quality.

4. Add a strong rebounder who will be willing to play on a one year contract.

5, Using Hedo without having to use him at PF where his rebounding is weak.

It seems clear that Jefferson is going to Utah, so that option seems closed. Considering how he is not a good fit and injury prone, it was a doubtul strategy anyway. But the paradox of trading a $14 million man AND still keeping the cap space seems very aqkeward. So I came up with a new stategy - buydown of J-Rich.

Let me show how this might work. Let's say the Suns would like to have Kt for a year. He is currently a free agent. At 38 years old, he's not looking for a long term contract; but last year he averaged 4.2 rpg in 15 minutes and 7.9 rpg in 28.2 minutes a game in the playoffs. Last season he played in 70 games. IMHO he would be a huge upgrade from Jarred Collins. He was never very quick and may be even slower, but he solves the most obvious problem the Suns have.

But there is no way the Bucks want to take on J-Rich's contract. But they might be interested if the Suns did a partianl buydown to about $3 million or do a three way. The point is that a buydown opens up a roster lot in the wing wiithout blowing next year's cap space.

While I am thinking KT, this might work with someone else. It just makes sense when going for a one year player and solves the wing clutter.

I'm not enthsiastic about Hedo at PF and I figure he would better suited to play wing with J-Rich gone. Assuming Warrick startes at PF, then KT should be a quaality substitute and change the team's finese image.

Ordinarily, buydowns arfe simply money saving deals. That is not really necessary here. It doesn't work if the Bucks value KT more than J-Rich, but the Suns can set the price of J-Rich at a level the Bucks would like.
Also it does give the Bucks m an option when Redd becomes a free agent next year.
 

OldDirtMcGirt

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J-Rich shouldn't be included in any sign and trade for KT. We've still got six million in the TPE, which is more than enough. Bucks get some cap flexiblity, and we get the defense and rebounding we desperately need (although not nearly enough). If we do sign Kurt, he should be in the starting lineup. He would matchup better with the other premiere front lines in the NBA. Warrick's a nice fit for our second unit, which is much more of an explosive offensive spark plug. Our interior defense with Frye at center will always be poor, but they won't be playing that often against a team's starting front line, so the need for defense isn't as important.
 
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Irish

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J-Rich shouldn't be included in any sign and trade for KT. We've still got six million in the TPE, which is more than enough. Bucks get some cap flexiblity, and we get the defense and rebounding we desperately need (although not nearly enough). If we do sign Kurt, he should be in the starting lineup. He would matchup better with the other premiere front lines in the NBA. Warrick's a nice fit for our second unit, which is much more of an explosive offensive spark plug. Our interior defense with Frye at center will always be poor, but they won't be playing that often against a team's starting front line, so the need for defense isn't as important.

You may be right, but the clutter of wings remains. Where do you think Hedo should play? I don't like him at PF since he's more a shooter than a guy to go to the basket on the pick and role. J-Rich is a great offensive player, but far from ideal on the defensive end. I would move Hill to SG nad Hedo to SF. I don't know if Warrick is the guy, but I don't see KT at at 30 mpg either.

I'd rather have KT off the bench. I'm gust guessing, but I think KT's game will be too similar to that of Lopez on offense. Ideally, Warrick's abiltiy to block shots will make him an asset. At the same time, I like the combination of KT with Frye because KT would compliment Frye more than Warrick would.

Here is my projected roster:

C - Lopez
PF - Warrick
SF - tur
SG - Hill
PG - Nash

BACKUP

C - KT
PF - Frye
SF - Dudly
SG - Childress
PG - Dragic

OTHER

Clark
Lawal
Reynolds (or anther PG)
 

Chaplin

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JRich isn't going anywhere and Turkoglu is going to be our starting PF. Might as well start getting used to it.
 
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Irish

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JRich isn't going anywhere and Turkoglu is going to be our starting PF. Might as well start getting used to it.

Can Turk run the pick and roll? If not, this begins to looks suspiciously like the Warriors.

Admittedly, J-Rich may have a classic "contract year" type season. But I'm not quite sure how everyone is supposed to fit together. Who is going to sit?

J-Rich
Grant Hill
Hedo
Chidlress
Dudley
Clark
Warrick
Dragic is big enough he could play SG in a three guard lineup.

Last year the Suns played 10 guys, so Clark and Jarrrod Collins were the last two guys on the bench. If I'm building for the future, do I want to give a big chunk of my wing minutes going to a guy very very likely to be leaving?
 

Sunburn

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That would wipe-out a very valuable asset and trade chip for KT. I don't like it.
 
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Mainstreet

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JRich isn't going anywhere and Turkoglu is going to be our starting PF. Might as well start getting used to it.

We agree. I don't see where the Suns have any better options than starting Turkoglu at PF. One might consider him as an aggressive Boris Diaw. The Suns paid Turkoglu 40M+ to be a starter at PF unless someone better comes along.
 

Mainstreet

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The Suns have managed to paint themselves into a corner, although the naute of the problem is that they are trying (or should be trying) to do so many thing.

1. Prepare for the future: It is hard to know when Hill will retirue, but loadding up on SF's is necesssary if they are goind to be ready.

2. Develop better wing defense: The Suns ended up having to use the zone too much in the playoffs and could not deal with outside shooters. Chill should be much better at this than Barbosa.

3. Keeping the cap space for a quality inside free agent next summer. This means not trading J-Rich for just role players, but it is hard to get teams wanting the clear cap space to give high quality.

4. Add a strong rebounder who will be willing to play on a one year contract.

5, Using Hedo without having to use him at PF where his rebounding is weak.

It seems clear that Jefferson is going to Utah, so that option seems closed. Considering how he is not a good fit and injury prone, it was a doubtul strategy anyway. But the paradox of trading a $14 million man AND still keeping the cap space seems very aqkeward. So I came up with a new stategy - buydown of J-Rich.

Let me show how this might work. Let's say the Suns would like to have Kt for a year. He is currently a free agent. At 38 years old, he's not looking for a long term contract; but last year he averaged 4.2 rpg in 15 minutes and 7.9 rpg in 28.2 minutes a game in the playoffs. Last season he played in 70 games. IMHO he would be a huge upgrade from Jarred Collins. He was never very quick and may be even slower, but he solves the most obvious problem the Suns have.

But there is no way the Bucks want to take on J-Rich's contract. But they might be interested if the Suns did a partianl buydown to about $3 million or do a three way. The point is that a buydown opens up a roster lot in the wing wiithout blowing next year's cap space.

While I am thinking KT, this might work with someone else. It just makes sense when going for a one year player and solves the wing clutter.


I'm not enthsiastic about Hedo at PF and I figure he would better suited to play wing with J-Rich gone. Assuming Warrick startes at PF, then KT should be a quaality substitute and change the team's finese image.

Ordinarily, buydowns arfe simply money saving deals. That is not really necessary here. It doesn't work if the Bucks value KT more than J-Rich, but the Suns can set the price of J-Rich at a level the Bucks would like.
Also it does give the Bucks m an option when Redd becomes a free agent next year.

This would be similar to the Suns previous KT debacle all over again, when the Suns viewed KT as having no value and dealt him for nothing to Seattle with two first round draft picks. Jrich not only holds more value as a player than KT but he has a 14M dollar expiring contract. He especially will have value at the trading deadline. The thought of the Suns buying out a valuable player in JRich to sign KT is one of the worst ideas I have heard in a long time. Also JRich is not clutter.
 

OldDirtMcGirt

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Another guy we could look at is Varejao. He's the ideal hustle/rebound/defense guy, but Cleveland really doesn't need that now they're no longer a contender. They do, however, desperately need some scoring options and financial flexibility. J-Rich for Varejao/West (who can be bought out for 500k), seems like it makes sense for both teams. Varejao would also fit comfortably in an up-tempo system.
 

Mainstreet

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Another guy we could look at is Varejao. He's the ideal hustle/rebound/defense guy, but Cleveland really doesn't need that now they're no longer a contender. They do, however, desperately need some scoring options and financial flexibility. J-Rich for Varejao/West (who can be bought out for 500k), seems like it makes sense for both teams. Varejao would also fit comfortably in an up-tempo system.

I like Varejao as he is a FC and would fit the Suns system. However, I think his long term salary is too steep. Also, it would seem Cleveland needs him more than the Suns with the deaparture of Z and Shaq.
 
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Irish

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This would be similar to the Suns previous KT debacle all over again, when the Suns viewed KT as having no value and dealt him for nothing to Seattle with two first round draft picks. .

Debacle? That was the year the Suns came as close to the finals as any team since the 90's. Sarver was despirate to get rid of him because even without him they were well into luxury tax. What part of a "totally financially driven decision" is so hard to understand?

In Game 5 of that series after Amare and Boris were disqualified, KT was one of only 6 guys to play more than a few minutes and the Suns only lost by 3 points. KT had 12 rebounds and 15 points. Debacle, what debacle?

If you said "massive blunder" when it came to getting rid of KT and then turning around and trading for Shaq the following year, now that was debacle.
 

Sunburn

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Debacle? That was the year the Suns came as close to the finals as any team since the 90's. Sarver was despirate to get rid of him because even without him they were well into luxury tax. What part of a "totally financially driven decision" is so hard to understand?

In Game 5 of that series after Amare and Boris were disqualified, KT was one of only 6 guys to play more than a few minutes and the Suns only lost by 3 points. KT had 12 rebounds and 15 points. Debacle, what debacle?

If you said "massive blunder" when it came to getting rid of KT and then turning around and trading for Shaq the following year, now that was debacle.

Mainstreet is referring to the trade where we gave up valuable assets to unload a contract. In this scenario, the valuable asset is the contract, as well as the player. Jason Richardson for KT would be a very, very bad deal, which the Suns organization would take a lot of flack for, similar to the flack taken in the wake of the previous KT trade. KT's name would forever go down synonymous with cursed Suns trades from that point on.
 

PhxGametime

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How much is left of TPE??


I'd like to know if the Suns could afford the: Maxiell's; Bass'; N Collison's; etc. - of the NBA.
 

PhxGametime

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Nevermind, $6.5.


I also read that Mehmet Okur might get Traded for a wing. Another 3PT shooter, that can post...
 
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