Cardinal Tough: Assessing the Off. Line Situation

[Mitch]

Ken Whizenhunt needs to either commit to a ball control running game or start to cater his personnel decisions to adding players who fit his preference for the dink and dunk. Whiz will argue that the ineffectiveness of the running game is what caused him to go dink and dunk. Well, that sounds like a logical excuse---but the reality is Whiz became enamored with the dink and dunk when Warner was in command of it---Whiz also mostly likely recognizes that in light of having one of the best WR units in the NFL and continuing to spend 3rd round draft picks on WRs instead of O-Linemen---that his heart as a play caller is in the passing game.

The dink and dunk DOES fit the current personnel, except at QB now that Warner is gone, except in the offensive line and except in trying to utilize a RB like Beanie Wells.

We've talked already about the QB and RB situations...and thus far the recommendations are:

QB:

Trade for Palmer or Orton (if not, sign Hasselbeck or Gradkowski)
Keep grooming Skelton
Draft Dalton or McElroy

RB:

Hightower is a very good fit
Trade Beanie Wells
LSH is a very good fit as situational speed RB
Draft Demarco Murray or Shane Vereen (versatile runners and receivers)
Draft an all-purpose FB/TE/HB type like Charles Clay, Shaun Chapas, or Preston Dial
Try to sign Mike Tolbert (UFA-Chargers)

Now it's time to rethink, tweak and retool the offensive line.

Fits:

C Lyle Sendlein
RG Deuce Lutui

It is imperative that the Cardinals re-sign both these players. Sendlein is smart, plays hurt, makes the calls well, snaps the ball accurately and plays with good leverege. He's solid. Lutui has developed into an all-purpose RG who can run and pass block with equal efficiency and tenacity.

Biggest Need:

A pass protecting LT.

Best Immediate Solution: Sign Matt Light, UFA (Patriots). Light thrived in Belicheck's and Brady's version of the dink and dunk.

Draft Prospect Fits at LT:

*Anthony Castonzo, Boston College
*Nate Solder, Colorado
*Derek Sherrod, Mississippi St.
+Jason Pinkston, Pittsburgh
+ Ben Ijalana, Villanova

* can start right away
+ needs development


Castonzo and Solder are perfect fits---but should be long gone when the Cardinals pick at #38. Sherrod is also an excellent fit and may squeak by to #38, but that's unlikely. #38 may be a little too early for Pinkston and Ijalana.

The draft does not appear to set up well for the Cardinals in adding an immediate starter at LT...which makes a UFA acquisition like Matt Light all the more significant.

What to do with Levi Brown?

Slide him down to LG where he can use his strong arms and brute strength to wall off inside defenders. Put him in the mix with Rex Hadnot---who played solidly when called upon.

What about LG Alan Faneca?

Faneca was solid---but it would be surprising if he didn't retire at this point.

What about RT?

Brandon Keith and Jeremy Bridges will be slugging it out. Keith showed strong imporvement last year before his injury. And Bridges has now been solid at LT and RT when filling in for injured starters.

Draft Prospects at RT:

Three players to keep an eye on---who may be still on the board when the Cardinals pick in the 6th round:

Marcus Gilbert, Florida
Jah Reid, Central Florida
Derek Hall, Stanford

They have the feet and athleticism to be good pass protectors, but need added strength and improved technique.

Draft Prospects at Guard and Center:

Danny Watkins, Baylor. The Cardinals like him---if he's on the board at #38 don't be surprised if he's the pick there.
Will Rackley, Lehigh
Clint Boling, Georgia
Rodney Hudson, Florida St.
Steve Wisniewski, Penn. St.
Jake Kirkpatrick, TCU
Chase Beeler, Stanford

And two of my favorites:

Andrew Sullivan, Fresno St.
David Arkin, Missouri St.

Cardinal Tough Decisions:
1-Re-sign Sendlein and Lutui
2-Sign LT Matt Light
3-Slide Levi Brown to LG to compete with Rex Hadnot and Tom Pestock
4-Draft RT Jah Reid in the 6th Round
5-Draft G David Arkin in the 6th round
6-Have Brandon Keith, Jeremy Bridges and Jah Reid compete at RT
7-Draft LT Derek Sherrod if he is still on the board at #38

 

[seesred]

MItch I love reading your thoughts on the board. I don't know that Beanee should be given up on so soon. He reminds me of a few players that we gave up on that became star Thomas Jones, Hearst etc.. I give him this year to make a splash. BUT he needs to play.

Your slide over of Brown makes great sence. He is slow for a tackle, but is and can become a pro bowler at LG. Sendlein and Lutui are the two constance of our current line. People sometimes takes shots at Sendien but he is in for all the snaps.

Our biggest need is a LT. That will be interesting to see how that position lines up.

GBR
40

 

[Mitch]

MItch I love reading your thoughts on the board. I don't know that Beanee should be given up on so soon. He reminds me of a few players that we gave up on that became star Thomas Jones, Hearst etc.. I give him this year to make a splash. BUT he needs to play.

Your slide over of Brown makes great sence. He is slow for a tackle, but is and can become a pro bowler at LG. Sendlein and Lutui are the two constance of our current line. People sometimes takes shots at Sendien but he is in for all the snaps.

Our biggest need is a LT. That will be interesting to see how that position lines up.

GBR
40

Seesred: If Beanie starts lowering his shoulder to protect the ball and deliver the hit on his runs...if he emerges as a legitimate pass receiving threat...and if he starts making his blocks on a more regular basis...I am on board. But, it's been these things that keep him on the sidelines---and as we know, Whiz plays the guys whom he thinks are the best fits. It makes you wonder if Whiz had any say in drafting Beanie---because Whiz has been loathe to play him from the start.

 

[Mitch]

I thought you might be curious to see Scouts' Inc.'s ratings of the o-linemen.

Rating Scale: 1-Exceptional; 2-Abv. Avg.; 3-Avg; 4-Bel. Avg.; 5-Minimal

O-Line Categories: Left to right---

Toughness---Pass Protection---Run Blocking---Intangibles---Durability

Tyron Smith (RT, USC): 2---2---2---3---4
Mike Pouncey (C, FLA): 1---2---1---1---1
Ant. Castonzo (LT, BC): 2---2---3---1---1
Nate Solder (LT, COL): 2---2---2---1---1
Gabe Carimi (LT, WIS): 1---3---1---2---4
Danny Watkins (G, BAY): 1---2---2---2---3
Derek Sherrod (LT, MSST): 3---2---2---3---2
Marcus Cannon (G/T, TCU): 3---3--2---2---3
Clint Boling (G-GA): 2---3---3---2---1
Will Rackley (G/T, LEH): 2---2---2---3---3
Ben Ijalana (G/T, VIL): 3---2---3---2---4
Rodney Hudson (G, FSU): 2---2---2---1---2
Paul Carpenter (T/G, ALA): 2---2---2---2---1
Orlando Franklin (T, MIA): 2---3---2---4---4
Marcus Gilbert (RT, FLA): 4---2---3---2---3
John Moffitt (G, WIS): 3---3---3---2---3
Lee Ziemba (T/G, AUB): 3---3---3---2---2
James Brewer (LT, IND): 4---4---4---2---4
Joseph Barksdale (T, LSU): 3---3---3---3---1
Adam Arkin (G, MZST): 1---3---3---1---1
Steve Wisniewski (C/G, PSU): 2---3---3---2---2
DeMarcus Love (RT, ARK): 2---2---3---2---3

Scouts' Grades:

95-Smith
93-Pouncey
93-Castonzo
92-Solder
91-Carimi
89-Watkins
86-Sherrod
84-Cannon
82-Boling
81-Rackley
80-Ijalana
80-Hudson
80-Carpenter
79-Franklin
77-Gilbert
74-Moffitt
71-Ziemba
67-Brewer
63-Barksdale
63-Arkin
62-Wisniewski
59-Love

 

[splitsecond]

Here is my assessment: fire Grimm.


This line is going to continuously have problems as long as he is in charge.

 

[Mitch]

Here is my assessment: fire Grimm.


This line is going to continuously have problems as long as he is in charge.

You may have a great point, splitsec. Not sure how the dink and dunk fits in with his philosophy or pedagogy.

 

[lobo]

You may have a great point, splitsec. Not sure how the dink and dunk fits in with his philosophy or pedagogy.

if pedagogy is what i think it is that's a big time felony....by the way for what it's worth your OL analysis is point on...no way will sherrod be around long enough for team to get him. he is the best UNDER the radar to a point, LT on the board...has excellent movement skills.

oops i misread...sherrod just might be around at 38..

 

[WildBB]

Why does Steve Wisniewski (C/G, PSU): 2---3---3---2---2 have a grade of 62, when he has 2's and 3's?

Dude can play.


Levi Brown would be better than any rookie this year at LT. Hopefully we find one to groom for next year. Sherrod would be good. Watkins awesome.

 

[PJ1]

Sendlein is an overachiever and a nice story but we need a physical center and another quality guard to be considered a threat to run the ball. Deuce is fine and I agree we need to re-sign him.

 

[splitsecond]

You may have a great point, splitsec. Not sure how the dink and dunk fits in with his philosophy or pedagogy.

I agree. Grimm's work with big ben and the backs they had in Pittsburgh worked. It sort of worked with Warner because Warner was so ridiculously efficient at getting the ball out under pressure. One thing you are definitely spot on about is the fact that Whis' offensive philosophy has shifted because of warner. He hasn't made any attempt to go back to a 2 RB pound first, pass big offense like he ran when the Steelers won the super bowl in 2005/2006. Grimm's philosophy has not shifted with Whis, and it's a real problem.

 

[Cardiac]

Cardinal Tough Decisions:
1-Re-sign Sendlein and Lutui
2-Sign LT Matt Light
3-Slide Levi Brown to LG to compete with Rex Hadnot and Tom Pestock
4-Draft RT Jah Reid in the 6th Round
5-Draft G David Arkin in the 6th round
6-Have Brandon Keith, Jeremy Bridges and Jah Reid compete at RT
7-Draft LT Derek Sherrod if he is still on the board at #38

Really good stuff Mitch. I agree with all the above except drafting a RT. We have plenty of them on the team so why add another one?

 

[Mitch]

One thing to add: if Alan Faneca retires, it might be good to bring back Reggie Wells, who is a free agent. Wells was a very good pass protector for us. In fact, I was always curious as what he would look like a tackle, because Wells has good feet and good balance. In either case, he would add very good depth.

 

[ARodg]

#5 for #17 and #28

#17: Castonzo
#28: Houston
#38: Ponder

-----------------------------------------------

Castonzo-Levi-Sendlein-Lutui-Keith: With an actual QB would be a massive improvement.

Also, numerous people have said that Gilbert is a late 2nd early 3rd rounder. No way in hell is he there in the 6th round.

Also #2, Solder needs work. He's not ready to be a franchise LT yet. Maybe in a year or two but he doesn't have a good enough anchor. Not even close. He needs to put on more weight and still needs to keep the amazing feet.

 

[Seandonic]

Fits:
C Lyle Sendlein
RG Deuce Lutui

Biggest Need:
A pass protecting LT.

Best Immediate Solution: Sign Matt Light, UFA (Patriots). Light thrived in Belicheck's and Brady's version of the dink and dunk.

Draft Prospect Fits at LT:
*Anthony Castonzo, Boston College
*Nate Solder, Colorado
*Derek Sherrod, Mississippi St.
+Jason Pinkston, Pittsburgh
+ Ben Ijalana, Villanova

* can start right away
+ needs development


Castonzo and Solder are perfect fits---but should be long gone when the Cardinals pick at #38. Sherrod is also an excellent fit and may squeak by to #38, but that's unlikely. #38 may be a little too early for Pinkston and Ijalana.

The draft does not appear to set up well for the Cardinals in adding an immediate starter at LT...which makes a UFA acquisition like Matt Light all the more significant.

What to do with Levi Brown?

Slide him down to LG where he can use his strong arms and brute strength to wall off inside defenders. Put him in the mix with Rex Hadnot---who played solidly when called upon.

What about LG Alan Faneca?

Faneca was solid---but it would be surprising if he didn't retire at this point.

What about RT?

Brandon Keith and Jeremy Bridges will be slugging it out. Keith showed strong imporvement last year before his injury. And Bridges has now been solid at LT and RT when filling in for injured starters.

Draft Prospects at RT:

Three players to keep an eye on---who may be still on the board when the Cardinals pick in the 6th round:

Marcus Gilbert, Florida
Jah Reid, Central Florida
Derek Hall, Stanford

They have the feet and athleticism to be good pass protectors, but need added strength and improved technique.

Cardinal Tough Decisions:
1-Re-sign Sendlein and Lutui
2-Sign LT Matt Light
3-Slide Levi Brown to LG to compete with Rex Hadnot and Tom Pestock
4-Draft RT Jah Reid in the 6th Round
5-Draft G David Arkin in the 6th round
6-Have Brandon Keith, Jeremy Bridges and Jah Reid compete at RT
7-Draft LT Derek Sherrod if he is still on the board at #38

I agree with all of this wholeheartedly.

I love Castanzo. I wish there was some way of acquiring him. The only way would be to trade something and pick up an extra selection in the first round...I don't see that happening however.

 

[Mitch]

I agree with all of this wholeheartedly.

I love Castanzo. I wish there was some way of acquiring him. The only way would be to trade something and pick up an extra selection in the first round...I don't see that happening however.

ARog's scenario: #5 for #17 & #28 and

17. Castonzo, LT
28. Houston, 34OLB
38. Ponder, QB

would have me elated, and even more especially elated if at #38 we took Randall Cobb, WR.

 

[ARodg]

I see it playing out something like this.

Tier 1 (1st round locks)
Smith, Castonzo, Pouncey, Sherrod

Tier 2 (Late 1st early 2nd)
Carimi, Watkins, Ijalana



Tier 3 (2nd-top of 3rd)
Wisnewski, Hudson, Cannon*, Franklin,

Tier 4 (3rd)
Rackley, Gilbert, Carpenter, Brewer, Boling, Barksdale

Tier 5 (4th-5th)
Moffit, Fusco, Ziemba, Love, Reed

*Cannon having a benign tumor that could turn into testicular cancer might cause him to drop a little bit, but everything I'm hearing says that it's nothing to worry about. I wouldn't downgrade him at all, I'd just make it part of his contract that he is to go in for quarterly screenings.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I was always curious as what he would look like a tackle, because Wells has good feet and good balance.

Surprised you don't remember, Wells actually did play tackle for us for a couple games and did a very good job. His skills were always better as a tackle than a guard. (Very athletic feet, quick - not a road grader at all)

 

[Snakester]

I would put Levi Brown back at RT where he belongs. Bringing in Matt Light at LT for a year or two would be a good idea. Sendlein should be the backup center. Re-sign Lutui at RG. Draft Stephen Wisniewski to be the new center and draft John Moffit to be the new LG.

 

[ARodg]

I would put Levi Brown back at RT where he belongs. Bringing in Matt Light at LT for a year or two would be a good idea. Sendlein should be the backup center. Re-sign Lutui at RG. Draft Stephen Wisniewski to be the new center and draft John Moffit to be the new LG.

If I have to pick a C/G combo with a 2nd and 5th.

I'm going Watkins (G) and Moffit (C), not Moffit (G) and Wisnewski (C).

 

[Seandonic]

ARog's scenario: #5 for #17 & #28 and

17. Castonzo, LT
28. Houston, 34OLB
38. Ponder, QB

This would be great.

 

[Krangodnzr]

It's funny, three months ago I mentioned we should sign Matt Light as a free agent. But if FA happens, we really should be looking at plucking Jammal Brown away from the Skins or stealing Jared Gaither. Both are young and could be above average starters to good starters and would be a longer term solution than Matt Light, who has struggled against speed rushers as of late.

 

[Snakester]

If I have to pick a C/G combo with a 2nd and 5th.

I'm going Watkins (G) and Moffit (C), not Moffit (G) and Wisnewski (C).

Either or would be fine with me. Ijalana would also be a good pick in the second. I figure Moffit wont make it past the fourth round and could even go in the third. The problem with this draft is all the good tackles will most likely be gone in the first round. If Carimi or Sherrod were to fall to the second I think the Cards would sprint to the podium. We need tackles like we need passrushers.

 

[Duckjake]

This is probably the most divisive area of the football team for us fans.

Some think we need a complete overhaul with 2-3 draft picks or free agents.

Others think we need to put the guys back where they were when we were Division Champs.

Still others think we're fine the way we are and just need better coaching.

It is just so hard to analyze any area of the offense considering the crud we had at QB last season.

Much easier to analyze the Defense which seems to have the same problems they had with McCown, Warner and the Terrible trio as QBs.

 

[john h]

Ken Whizenhunt needs to either commit to a ball control running game or start to cater his personnel decisions to adding players who fit his preference for the dink and dunk. Whiz will argue that the ineffectiveness of the running game is what caused him to go dink and dunk. Well, that sounds like a logical excuse---but the reality is Whiz became enamored with the dink and dunk when Warner was in command of it---Whiz also mostly likely recognizes that in light of having one of the best WR units in the NFL and continuing to spend 3rd round draft picks on WRs instead of O-Linemen---that his heart as a play caller is in the passing game.

The dink and dunk DOES fit the current personnel, except at QB now that Warner is gone, except in the offensive line and except in trying to utilize a RB like Beanie Wells.

We've talked already about the QB and RB situations...and thus far the recommendations are:

QB:

Trade for Palmer or Orton (if not, sign Hasselbeck or Gradkowski)
Keep grooming Skelton
Draft Dalton or McElroy

RB:

Hightower is a very good fit
Trade Beanie Wells
LSH is a very good fit as situational speed RB
Draft Demarco Murray or Shane Vereen (versatile runners and receivers)
Draft an all-purpose FB/TE/HB type like Charles Clay, Shaun Chapas, or Preston Dial
Try to sign Mike Tolbert (UFA-Chargers)

Now it's time to rethink, tweak and retool the offensive line.

Fits:

C Lyle Sendlein
RG Deuce Lutui

It is imperative that the Cardinals re-sign both these players. Sendlein is smart, plays hurt, makes the calls well, snaps the ball accurately and plays with good leverege. He's solid. Lutui has developed into an all-purpose RG who can run and pass block with equal efficiency and tenacity.

Biggest Need:

A pass protecting LT.

Best Immediate Solution: Sign Matt Light, UFA (Patriots). Light thrived in Belicheck's and Brady's version of the dink and dunk.

Draft Prospect Fits at LT:

*Anthony Castonzo, Boston College
*Nate Solder, Colorado
*Derek Sherrod, Mississippi St.
+Jason Pinkston, Pittsburgh
+ Ben Ijalana, Villanova

* can start right away
+ needs development


Castonzo and Solder are perfect fits---but should be long gone when the Cardinals pick at #38. Sherrod is also an excellent fit and may squeak by to #38, but that's unlikely. #38 may be a little too early for Pinkston and Ijalana.

The draft does not appear to set up well for the Cardinals in adding an immediate starter at LT...which makes a UFA acquisition like Matt Light all the more significant.

What to do with Levi Brown?

Slide him down to LG where he can use his strong arms and brute strength to wall off inside defenders. Put him in the mix with Rex Hadnot---who played solidly when called upon.

What about LG Alan Faneca?

Faneca was solid---but it would be surprising if he didn't retire at this point.

What about RT?

Brandon Keith and Jeremy Bridges will be slugging it out. Keith showed strong imporvement last year before his injury. And Bridges has now been solid at LT and RT when filling in for injured starters.

Draft Prospects at RT:

Three players to keep an eye on---who may be still on the board when the Cardinals pick in the 6th round:

Marcus Gilbert, Florida
Jah Reid, Central Florida
Derek Hall, Stanford

They have the feet and athleticism to be good pass protectors, but need added strength and improved technique.

Draft Prospects at Guard and Center:

Danny Watkins, Baylor. The Cardinals like him---if he's on the board at #38 don't be surprised if he's the pick there.
Will Rackley, Lehigh
Clint Boling, Georgia
Rodney Hudson, Florida St.
Steve Wisniewski, Penn. St.
Jake Kirkpatrick, TCU
Chase Beeler, Stanford

And two of my favorites:

Andrew Sullivan, Fresno St.
David Arkin, Missouri St.

Cardinal Tough Decisions:
1-Re-sign Sendlein and Lutui
2-Sign LT Matt Light
3-Slide Levi Brown to LG to compete with Rex Hadnot and Tom Pestock
4-Draft RT Jah Reid in the 6th Round
5-Draft G David Arkin in the 6th round
6-Have Brandon Keith, Jeremy Bridges and Jah Reid compete at RT
7-Draft LT Derek Sherrod if he is still on the board at #38

Mitch: since we clearly are going to have a QB problem for a few years it may be wise to make a commitment to a running game??? NFL ready RB's are there to be had coming out of the draft. RB is one position you do not need a lot of time to make a big impact. You can be a star your first year. Most teams now use 2 RB's rather than a primary RB. At the moment, aside from lineman, we IMHO do not have the quality or number of backs needed to become a good running team. We need an elusive runner like the Alabama RB. He is both elusive and strong. We have been primarily a power running team for the past few years. No elusive fast runners. A runner like an Emmit Smith would sure help. If we are going to be a running team then we should put a runner high on our draft list. Perhaps a #2. Which comes first? Good runners or good lineman. OL takes time to learn position. Probably more so than DL so no matter who we draft on OL it is unlikely they will make a big impact this year. I just do not see this team being any better than 8/8 this year unless we get very lucky and find some older QB who becomes a Kurt Warner. Now is the time at this draft to decide just what sort of team we are going to be.

I personally think you need to have a core OL that have been together for about three years before you have an OL that can really make a difference. You just do not become a good running team in 1-2 years.

 

[john h]

MItch I love reading your thoughts on the board. I don't know that Beanee should be given up on so soon. He reminds me of a few players that we gave up on that became star Thomas Jones, Hearst etc.. I give him this year to make a splash. BUT he needs to play.

Your slide over of Brown makes great sence. He is slow for a tackle, but is and can become a pro bowler at LG. Sendlein and Lutui are the two constance of our current line. People sometimes takes shots at Sendien but he is in for all the snaps.

Our biggest need is a LT. That will be interesting to see how that position lines up.

GBR
40

Wells and Hightower are just to much alike. Both primarily power runners. We need a change of pace runner to go with one or the other. A guy like a Reggie Bush perhaps. Most teams now use two RBs neither of which is the primary runner. Trying to be a running team with just one real good runner does not work well. Run or pass you have to be able to do both. As we all know if you cannot run effectively if the opposition stacks up against the run. No matter how good your running game is you are not going to run against a defense set up to stop the run. You may be a primarily a running team but you still need an effective passing game.