Cardinals: Fitzgerald not going anywhere

[Red Hawk]

By Jason Feller | NFL.com


INDIANAPOLIS -- The answer came in loud and clear: Wide receiver Larry Fitzgerald will be an Arizona Cardinal next year.

At the NFL Scouting Combine on Saturday, Cardinals Vice President of Football Operations Rod Graves put to rest any doubts that Fitzgerald would not be in Arizona for the 2008 season.

Larry Fitzgerald, WR
Arizona Cardinals
2007 statistics
Rec: 100
Yads: 1,409
Avg: 14.1
TD: 10

VIDEO: Fitzgerald on film
"No question, no question,” said Graves, when asked if Fitzgerald would be back. “He's a core player, and like so many other players we're excited about with respect to our football team, we are going to do what we have to do to keep that core player.”

The question arose because Fitzgerald is going to count $16 million against the salary cap next season, a hefty sum, even for one of the league’s premier wideouts.

Graves acknowledged that he would like to renegotiate Fitzgerald's original six-year deal, but affirmed that the wide receiver would remain with the team regardless. Fitzgerald has two years remaining on his contract.

"He's earned the right to be where he is," Graves said, adding that he had no problem with the original deal Fitzgerald signed, which included several escalator clauses. “We also determined that when we got to this point, that we would be back at the bargaining table to try to reach a long-term deal that would make it a little bit more palatable for us as an organization, and that's where we are. If we can't, then we'll move forward (with his current contract)."

Fitzgerald, a two-time Pro Bowl selection, caught 100 passes for 1,409 yards and 10 touchdowns in 2007.

In other Cardinals news, coach Ken Whisenhunt affirmed that quarterback Matt Leinart will be the team's starter in 2008.

Whisenhunt said Leinart started to throw "the other day" and the QB's shoulder is healed after he went on IR last season with a broken collarbone following Week 5.

Kurt Warner is expected to return in a backup role and Whisenhunt was appreciative of Warner's play while filling in for Leinart.

"As we go forward, Matt's our starter," Whisenhunt said. "Certainly we respect what Kurt has done, but Matt's our starter."

 

[RugbyMuffin]

"No question, no question,” said Graves, when asked if Fitzgerald would be back. “He's a core player, and like so many other players we're excited about with respect to our football team, we are going to do what we have to do to keep that core player.”


That is all I need to hear.
Sounds like a good idea to me. Fitzgerald is a BEAST of a WR.

 

[red desert]

By Jason Feller | NFL.com


INDIANAPOLIS -- The answer came in loud and clear: Wide receiver Larry Fitzgerald will be an Arizona Cardinal next year.

At the NFL Scouting Combine on Saturday, Cardinals Vice President of Football Operations Rod Graves put to rest any doubts that Fitzgerald would not be in Arizona for the 2008 season.

Larry Fitzgerald, WR
Arizona Cardinals
2007 statistics
Rec: 100
Yads: 1,409
Avg: 14.1
TD: 10

VIDEO: Fitzgerald on film
"No question, no question,” said Graves, when asked if Fitzgerald would be back. “He's a core player, and like so many other players we're excited about with respect to our football team, we are going to do what we have to do to keep that core player.”

The question arose because Fitzgerald is going to count $16 million against the salary cap next season, a hefty sum, even for one of the league’s premier wideouts.

Graves acknowledged that he would like to renegotiate Fitzgerald's original six-year deal, but affirmed that the wide receiver would remain with the team regardless. Fitzgerald has two years remaining on his contract.

"He's earned the right to be where he is," Graves said, adding that he had no problem with the original deal Fitzgerald signed, which included several escalator clauses. “We also determined that when we got to this point, that we would be back at the bargaining table to try to reach a long-term deal that would make it a little bit more palatable for us as an organization, and that's where we are. If we can't, then we'll move forward (with his current contract)."

Fitzgerald, a two-time Pro Bowl selection, caught 100 passes for 1,409 yards and 10 touchdowns in 2007.

In other Cardinals news, coach Ken Whisenhunt affirmed that quarterback Matt Leinart will be the team's starter in 2008.

Whisenhunt said Leinart started to throw "the other day" and the QB's shoulder is healed after he went on IR last season with a broken collarbone following Week 5.

Kurt Warner is expected to return in a backup role and Whisenhunt was appreciative of Warner's play while filling in for Leinart.

"As we go forward, Matt's our starter," Whisenhunt said. "Certainly we respect what Kurt has done, but Matt's our starter."

What a freakin' idiot Graves is. Honestly. What, his quotes are supposed to prove how sharp a GM he is? They disclose just the opposite, IMO.

No wonder he and Eugene Parker have a good working relationship. Graves is making him look like a genius. And filling his pockets to no end. Good grief. What exactly does Graves (as the organization's agent) hope to accomplish by spitting out those comments? Seriously, especially when he is in the midst of perhaps thee most important contract negotiations of his illustrious (i say that with towering mountains of sarcasm).

Regardless if Fitz restructures or not, Graves comments continually disclose his ineptitude to the opposition.

So Parker tells Fitz, "let's play for 16 or 17 or whatever million dollars this next year. They're gonna pay it. Why should we settle for less? You're 24, healthy, and the cap and players's salarys will only go up. Just like they could have had you for less last year, they are going to have to pay you more after next season. Why? Because a "three year" pro bowl player on a 10 or 11 win playoff team deserves more that a "two-year" pro bowl player on an 8-8 team."

Unreal. Un-freakin' real.

 

[Stout]

Yeah, it's not very bright for Graves to say this as it pertains to negotiations. I mean, sure, Fitz could reasonably assume we wouldn't cut or trade him, but there's still the chance. Now all of a sudden Graves tells Fitz and his agent that they basically have him over the barrell, and gives them LESS, not MORE, reason to get a deal done. What a schmuck.

 

[SuperSpck]

They disclose just the opposite, IMO.
Unreal. Un-freakin' real.

The Organization could believe this tactic makes Graves (and the Cardinals) look like the good guys. No matter what happens they're paying a "core" guy. Like someone (skorrp, joe, someone) said, perception of players among other players is important. To a lesser extent, but still worth mentioning, is how fans and ticket holders view Fitzgerald's (and agent) willingness to restructure.

 

[Stout]

The Organization could believe this tactic makes Graves (and the Cardinals) look like the good guys. No matter what happens they're paying a "core" guy. Like someone (skorrp, joe, someone) said, perception of players among other players is important. To a lesser extent, but still worth mentioning, is how fans and ticket holders view Fitzgerald's (and agent) willingness to restructure.

Yeah, I kind of got that take. It seems like Graves is trying to play the good guy, and hoping Parker will deal with them in good faith--hoping he will give the organization a break. Not a good tactic in this situation, I think. Not saying we should try not to look like good guys, but we shouldn't pass this kind of leverage on to Fitz's agent for no other reason than wanting to look good. Meh, just not a good idea, Mr. Graves. You need to pull that rabbit out of your hat.

 

[red desert]

The Organization could believe this tactic makes Graves (and the Cardinals) look like the good guys. No matter what happens they're paying a "core" guy. Like someone (skorrp, joe, someone) said, perception of players among other players is important. To a lesser extent, but still worth mentioning, is how fans and ticket holders view Fitzgerald's (and agent) willingness to restructure.

I understand the tactic. But this comment does absolutely nothing towards the intended goal. I mean, exactly how many player in the locker room are going to be swayed by this sort of comment? The players, who all have agents, and who I'm sure are pressing their agents for the latest of what is really going on here. You don't think they know what is what?

I'm not attacking you. Sorry if it came off that way. Just bugged with Graves.

 

[Skkorpion]

As most of you know, I usually stay out of these Rod Graves bash fests but every now and then a few of you, in this case, red desert and stout, write things that are so silly in their knee-jerk hatred, they must be pointed out.

To wit, answer me this honestly, both of you:

Do you really think Eugene Parker is so uninformed, so terminally incompetent an agent, so stupid as to need an admission by Graves that Parker and Fitz have the upper hand in these negotiations?

Is Eugene sitting there right now, rubbing his hands with glee, telling his wife 'I've got Graves now!" because of what Graves said today?

 

[red desert]

As most of you know, I usually stay out of these Rod Graves bash fests but every now and then a few of you, in this case, red desert and stout, write things that are so silly in their knee-jerk hatred, they must be pointed out.

To wit, answer me this honestly, both of you:

Do you really think Eugene Parker is so uninformed, so terminally incompetent an agent, so stupid as to need an admission by Graves that Parker and Fitz have the upper hand in these negotiations?

Is Eugene sitting there right now, rubbing his hands with glee, telling his wife 'I've got Graves now!" because of what Graves said today?

Absolutely not. But first, let me ask you this question.

Do you think that Graves comments are absolutely benign?

Here's where I'm going with this.

I am a trial lawyer in solo practice. I litigate for a living. I negotiate for a living. And on more than one occasion for seven figures. Not always, and not often, but I've been there. So I am of the belief that these sorts of comments are not without consequence. They are placed in "the file" of every nfl agent on the planet. It's called homework. For future dealings, if you will. Including those agents representing others on the team. They are all watching how poorly Graves is handling the situation.

Ask yourself this: why the hell would he spout off like this? Do you hear any other gms popping off in a similar manner? No. And there is a reason.

Graves is exactly the kind of opponent I look forward to meeting. Someone that is in above their head, but gets hired because the boss is equally clueless. I am being totally serious.

Skkorp, it has nothing to do with a hatred of Graves. Just like my posts criticizing Denny Green were not about hating the guy, but about the belief that he was not good at his job.

With respect to Graves, there comes a time where the fact that someone is a "good guy" isn't enough.

 

[Stout]

As most of you know, I usually stay out of these Rod Graves bash fests but every now and then a few of you, in this case, red desert and stout, write things that are so silly in their knee-jerk hatred, they must be pointed out.

To wit, answer me this honestly, both of you:

Do you really think Eugene Parker is so uninformed, so terminally incompetent an agent, so stupid as to need an admission by Graves that Parker and Fitz have the upper hand in these negotiations?

Is Eugene sitting there right now, rubbing his hands with glee, telling his wife 'I've got Graves now!" because of what Graves said today?

Like I said, of course Parker and Fitz reasonably believed Fitz would be on the team regardless. On the other hand, going and shouting the fact from the rooftops is just another way of acknowledging that the negotiating partner has you by the short hairs. Not a good negotiating ploy.

Mostly, right now, I'm upset that it appears as if, after continually dragging his feet with this, Graves is going to make the mistake of the century and not get it done. A horrific mistake which would seriously set us back. The kind of mistake that could and definitely should get you fired. Unfair on Graves, because maybe Fitz and Parker don't want to deal? Not unfair at all. The situation is what it is; it MUST be fixed. Ergo, Graves needs to fix it. It might sound unfair, but it is reality. Fairness doens't factor in.

 

[PoolBoy]

we def need to draft a WR in this years draft at some point.

 

[slanidrac16]

Fitz will need to be offered what would basically amount to a lifetime contract.
The going rate for a Top 5 FA wr is around 8 m. The Cards are going to have to offer a 42m signing bonus but demand a 6 to 7 year deal with a large base in the final year.
Forty two mil over 6 years is 7m per year. Since he will be gauranteed 42 mil we could have a lower base the first 5 years. Say 1,2,2,3,4 and in the final year 8 mil.
Thats 62 mil over 6 years with cap hits of:
8,8,8,9,11 and the final year 15 mil.

Would I do this deal? I don't know. I do know I don't want to pay any player 17m per year, nor do I feel any player is worth about 1/6th of you salary cap. We could sign an awful lot of very good players and a trade would get us a few extra picks.

Fitz needs to step up for his team and team mates. I mean , how much does a guy need to be happy?

 

[cardsfanmd]

we def need to draft a WR in this years draft at some point.

Agreed. I nominate Donnie Avery, Houston.

Also, you need to change your User title, 'cause Donte needs to stick around another year. With Deivendorf and Routens back and Harris, Flynn and Green can really take this team to the National Championship.

GGGOOOOOO 'CCCCUUUUUUSSSSEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Bottom line: Graves screwed the pooch when he concocted this deal in the 1st place.

You must be registered for see images

"What a Maroon!"

 

[Stout]

Bottom line: Graves screwed the pooch when he concocted this deal in the 1st place.

You must be registered for see images

"What a Maroon!"

No, this was a normal deal. Remember the bells and whistles people whined that we never used? These are them, and we finally started using them. The only problem is, other teams deal with these kinds of problems before they get to the 11th hour.

 

[imaCafan]

Agreed. Should have been done by AT LEAST mid season this past year. On another note, would you take, what is it, $14.5 mil. this year and $17 mil. next. Or would you take a $38-$42 mil. in your pocket signing bonus this year knowing there is a slight possibility you might not see the $17 mil. next year?

 

[RugbyMuffin]

WOW!


IN my opinion:

Anyone hinting that we should get rid of Fitzgerald is not thinking right, and furthermore I would hope to not find there names on a "We should have drafted AP" thread. Talking about how the Cardinals never have these kind of dominant players on the team. Cause right now you have a dominant player in Fitzgerald who is going to command big time money. In order to keep this dominant player you have to fork over the bills. There is no two ways about it.
Not to mention you are not going to find another WR to replace the guy.


My next point is that Graves is just telling people that Fitzgerald is not going anywhere. If you were to hear the nonsense that I hear over on the East coast you would think Fitzgerald is a as good as gone. Philly is so certain they are wondering who they are going to send to the desert in order to get Larry.
I am glad to hear Graves say Fitzgerald is staying no matter what, and that he is willing to do what it takes to keep Fitz here in AZ.

At this point I don't think Graves, Fitzgerald or anyone can do anything that would make some people happy. But to each his own.

As I stated before I am happy to hear Graves say that Fitzgerald is going to be a Cardinal for a loooooong time. I can't understand why more people are as well.

 

[Skkorpion]

red desert, yes, I believe Rod Graves' statements are absolutely benign. Maybe that makes me naive.

As others, like joeschmo, have pointed out, Graves is out front with everything. If he says something, it's the truth. He does not lie. If he does not want to answer a question, he'll dodge it or change the subject, rather than lie.

All people who deal with him, particularly agents, know this.

In those few cases, as with Edge, when we pursued him, when Rod had indicated we would not, it is my opinion that the conditions and situation that existed at the time Rod had taken a position had changed.

You can certainly choose to believe otherwise.

It can be argued that Rod Graves' modus operandi is inappropriate for the GM of an NFL team. This year will prove or disapprove that in the case of Rod Graves. And there, I agree with stout.

I appreciate the civility of the discussion. Graves inspires strong responses, for and against him.

For this ownership, I think he's the right guy. However, if he botches this offseason, I think Mike Bidwill will not hesitate to make a change.

Not re-signing Fitz may not be a botch. It takes two to make a deal and only one to kill it. If Fitz is asking or too much or just forcing an eventual parting, so be it. We'll move on.

 

[Jetstream Green]

for me

as a person who has supported this team for years on end, I like what Graves said and glad he is willing to tell everyone that the Cardinals will not let this player go. In the end, regardless of what anyone says, it says the team respects Fitz and this is a comment that should make Larry Fitzgerald respect the organization even if it was a tactic in negotiations. As a fan, I needed to hear Graves say this.

 

[Stout]

I appreciate the civility of the discussion. Graves inspires strong responses, for and against him.

For this ownership, I think he's the right guy. However, if he botches this offseason, I think Mike Bidwill will not hesitate to make a change.

Yeah, I'm behaving myself

As for your second part, if that is the case, then ownership still has not committed to winning. The strategy being followed, IMO, is not a good one to follow to build a winning team. You have to take risks in order to succeed, and we are about as scared at taking risks as Chamberlain was of defying Hitler in Europe.

 

[HookemCards]

I'm not sure whats worse. The fact that he said this publicly, or the fact that trading Fitz is completely out of the question with a 17 mil price tag. Either way it doesn't exactly inspire confidence in RG.

Don't get me wrong I love Fitz, think he is a great receiver, probably top 5 in the NFL, but 17 mil for a guy who only touches the ball 8 times a game, and scores a touchdown every two games seems a bit much. No way would I pay him that much this year, if he doesn't restructure I would trade him for a 1st and 2nd rd pick and a starter. Then use the 17 mil saved to resign Pace, Faneca, Florence, and a couple of depth guys.

 

[football karma]

For this ownership, I think he's the right guy. However, if he botches this offseason, I think Mike Bidwill will not hesitate to make a change.

the underlined captures my belief perfectly --

as for the comments, I dont think they are a big deal. Interestingly in his comments, Rod talks about "next year" -- not the next two years.

From a practical matter, Larry's 2008 salary is guaranteed. All he has to do is pass a physical. Only a significant off the field injury (or some heinous personal conduct issue) stands in the way of Larry getting that salary. Lets say Larry blows both ACLs on the first drill of offseason workouts. He goes on IR and gets his contractual salary.

His real risk is the $17mm in 2009. Could be injured in 2008. Could be cut. Heck - the Cards could go all the way through 2009 free agency and then cut him (after all the money has been spent). There is motivation on their part to convert that scheduled salary into guaranteed money.

 

[40yearfan]

the underlined captures my belief perfectly --

as for the comments, I dont think they are a big deal. Interestingly in his comments, Rod talks about "next year" -- not the next two years.

From a practical matter, Larry's 2008 salary is guaranteed. All he has to do is pass a physical. Only a significant off the field injury (or some heinous personal conduct issue) stands in the way of Larry getting that salary. Lets say Larry blows both ACLs on the first drill of offseason workouts. He goes on IR and gets his contractual salary.

His real risk is the $17mm in 2009. Could be injured in 2008. Could be cut. Heck - the Cards could go all the way through 2009 free agency and then cut him (after all the money has been spent). There is motivation on their part to convert that scheduled salary into guaranteed money.

And therein lies the crux of the whole matter. Fitz and agent have no real incentive to work a deal this year. They can wait until next year because this year is already in the bank and the last year of a contract is when teams normally redo it. Because Fitz hit all of his incentives and bonuses (something probably neither the team or Fitz thought would happen), we are now looking at redoing a contract two years before it expires because of a tremendous cap hit. Why some people think we should have anticipated this and redone the contract last season is beyond me. I guess they think the FO is clairvoyant.

 

[football karma]

And therein lies the crux of the whole matter. Fitz and agent have no real incentive to work a deal this year.

the incentive to work a deal this year is to mitigate or eliminate the risk of a serious injury happening during the 2008 season.

If Fitz blows out a knee in the 14th game of the season -- he is facing the prospect of getting cut, and settling for a much smaller deal.

The other risk is that the owners lock the players out after this season to bargain for a better deal -- and who knows what the landscape looks like after the new deal.

 

[Stout]

And therein lies the crux of the whole matter. Fitz and agent have no real incentive to work a deal this year. They can wait until next year because this year is already in the bank and the last year of a contract is when teams normally redo it. Because Fitz hit all of his incentives and bonuses (something probably neither the team or Fitz thought would happen), we are now looking at redoing a contract two years before it expires because of a tremendous cap hit. Why some people think we should have anticipated this and redone the contract last season is beyond me. I guess they think the FO is clairvoyant.

Actually, this year isn't in the bank, so your point is wrong. If he gets hurt today, he won't get all of this year's money.

And we're talking about having the contract re-done this year, not last year. That would have taken no clairvoyance at all.