Cardinals' Management Still Clueless

[john h]

With some unease, I am ready to give the front office the benefit of the doubt right now --

I do beleive the Cards need better depth at the tackle slot (as many have pointed out), but beleive that a OT will be taken on the first day of the draft. Between the Browns, Wells, Step and Leckey, the three interior o line positions are set (in management's eyes)

Why the benefit of the doubt?

I also beleive that coaching matters. I beleive the continuity matters and that just keeping the top seven healthy and in the same general positions will help. I believe that Edge will help : Edge 4.2 yards a carry -- all other Colt RB's -- a very Cardinalesque circa 2005 3.5 yards a carry.

and as NEZ pointed out -- Green and Graves are staking their jobs on the line working.

Our OL will clearly be better as any OL coach is better than what we had.
We will have fewer injuries, hopefully. We have added a couple of guys and have a tad more experience. The question is not whether we will be better but how much better? Better enough to make the playoffs? No doubt our running game will be better. How could it not as we were the worst in the NFL. Improvement is not enough. We need enough improvement to be in or near the playoffs. Can we match up with Seattle? I do not think so at this point. Am I nervous about our signings to this point. You bet I am and will continue to be unless we sign a couple of FA Ol.

 

[john h]

If nothing else Mitch brings out the best, and worst, in us Cardinal fans. I think he often offers great insight, especially with the game to game analysis during the season. At the same time, I think he longs for Denny to fail, and I really don't know why. Mitch was Pete Kendall really that great of player?

Our line will be better. It couldn't be worse. We will have better coaching, but the real key will be the health of the line. If the line can play the pre-season together, and then get 16 games without more than 1 or 2 major injuries, I think they will be much better. No offensive line would be successful with the injuries we suffered last season.

So here's to a healthy 2006. Go Cards. Go Mitch, Go Denny!!

I do not think it was a matter of it being Kendall. It was a matter of letting go a person who we had no one to replace him with. That was and remains a dumb move. We were behind the eight ball from day one with a rookie center starting. We cannot afford to many dumb moves like that even if Kendall was the devil himself (he was not).

 

[john h]

Very true, were building this team overall with youth - with some veterans sprinkled in from yr. to yr.

It bodes well for the long term stability of the franchise.

And your right , Seattle will be in a lot of CAP trouble in the coming yrs. Their run is right now. But they're gonna have some problems. Especially if injuries hit them.

What do board members mostly want? Building for the future or make the playoffs this year? Which are we doing? In this day of FA teams build to win this year. Teams go from last to first in one year. The future is NOW in the NFL>

 

[john h]

because some people on this board need something to complain about

that is what the board is all about. to share ideas and opinions. it would be a strange board if we all agreed on everything. complaining helps relieve the tension caused by our sorry record over the years. this helps me avoid therapy.

 

[Russ Smith]

Damn Mitch, lighten up. Still appreciate your insight but take a chill pill...and Larry Allen had his mind made up about signing on the West Coast where he has a house anyways...he was a Niner as soon as he got released.

He played in college at Sonoma State so yes he wanted to go home.

 

[Shane]

He played in college at Sonoma State so yes he wanted to go home.

Ive never heard of the Sonoma State? Is there still only 50?

 

[DieHardFromMO]

The Redskins also dont have any draft picks this year, they havent had many draft picks the last 2-3 years as well. So they dont have to spend anything on the rookie cap. But it also means the team cant build the core of their team with young talent, then retian them like all the other really succesfull teams in the league.

The draft is a crapshoot. Personally, I would rather invest my money in proven talent that has performed on Sunday's rather than prospective talent that has never played a down on Sunday's before.

 

[DieHardFromMO]

And Wells. But you are right.

But Snyder also cant keep those players for long periods of time before their contracts are to much for the cap. Which means a lot of turn over and the biggest reason why his team isnt a team. Just a glob of players who dont know how to work together. It also means little to no depth at all.

Sorry, I did neglect to show Reggie as a FA signing but just like Warner that just maintains the status quo.

I can see the chemistry risk by having to mix in new blood on a regular basis, but the Cardinals formula hasn't proven to work yet either at least not for the Cardinals. By the time they get finished building then veteran players on the club like Bert Berry will be ready for the retirement farm and the cycle keeps going and going and going. I would like to win today rather than tomorrow.

 

[War Birds]

that is what the board is all about. to share ideas and opinions. it would be a strange board if we all agreed on everything. complaining helps relieve the tension caused by our sorry record over the years. this helps me avoid therapy.

haha....to each his own

 

[kerouac9]

Sorry, I did neglect to show Reggie as a FA signing but just like Warner that just maintains the status quo.

I can see the chemistry risk by having to mix in new blood on a regular basis, but the Cardinals formula hasn't proven to work yet either at least not for the Cardinals. By the time they get finished building then veteran players on the club like Bert Berry will be ready for the retirement farm and the cycle keeps going and going and going. I would like to win today rather than tomorrow.

The Cardinals have never tried the "continuity" formula on the offensive line, because every year they've either replaced or been forced to replace (due to injury) at least 2/5 of the line.

It's hard to say that something's not working when it's never been tried. On the other hand, the idea of throwing money at the line and making wholesale changes has been so successful the past decade, we should keep on doing it.

 

[BACH]

It is not to early for criticism as the well of good players is drying up fast. SF had no where near the CAP space we had and now are ready to sign Larry Allen. Every day I look in the paper to read about teams without a lot of Cap signing people we could use. Dallas adds another piece to their puzzle by signing a big time kicker. Dallas and the Bears will be forces to deal with this year. It is like I watch a rerun every year at this time. The only big time deal we have done is James and the resigning of Warner which was a no brainer.

But what if Ferguson falls to us at #10, what if Graves trades up and drafts McNeil and add a top 3 guard in the 3rd. We don't know what's going to happen, so why throw yourself of the cliff untill we know it?

And BTW... Do you honestly think giving Allen $4M a year was a smart move???

 

[DieHardFromMO]

But what if Ferguson falls to us at #10, what if Graves trades up and drafts McNeil and add a top 3 guard in the 3rd. We don't know what's going to happen, so why throw yourself of the cliff untill we know it?

And BTW... Do you honestly think giving Allen $4M a year was a smart move???

Have the Cardinals ever traded up in the first round? We know they have ill-advisedly traded down. The Cardinals usually play the hand they are dealt on draft day rather than be proactive and move up to get a desirable player.

I think some of us just don't believe the current hodgepodge of an offensive line is that much improved from a year ago and it is unrealistic to expect to discover gold in the draft for an offensive lineman.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

It's hard to say that something's not working when it's never been tried. On the other hand, the idea of throwing money at the line and making wholesale changes has been so successful the past decade, we should keep on doing it.

Yeah, it's pretty funny how the Mac Kool-Aiders (who have now become the voices of doom) always advocate blowing everything up and spending all sorts of money on high round draft picks and free agents for the o-line. The truth of the matter is when looking at recent history of both the Cardinals and the rest of the NFL, o-lines performing below standards have been fixed by only replacing a player or two while improving the talent at skill positions and with coaching. Meanwhile the teams that invest a lot of money on bringing in new faces on the offensive line both via the draft and free agency usually lack the positive results they wer hoping for - see McTobin's Big Red Lie.

 

[kerouac9]

Yeah, it's pretty funny how the Mac Kool-Aiders (who have now become the voices of doom) always advocate blowing everything up and spending all sorts of money on high round draft picks and free agents for the o-line. The truth of the matter is when looking at recent history of both the Cardinals and the rest of the NFL, o-lines performing below standards have been fixed by only replacing a player or two while improving the talent at skill positions and with coaching. Meanwhile the teams that invest a lot of money on bringing in new faces on the offensive line both via the draft and free agency usually lack the positive results they wer hoping for - see McTobin's Big Red Lie.

From your keyboard to Snakester/Mitch/Harry's brains.

 

[BACH]

Have the Cardinals ever traded up in the first round? We know they have ill-advisedly traded down. The Cardinals usually play the hand they are dealt on draft day rather than be proactive and move up to get a desirable player.

I think some of us just don't believe the current hodgepodge of an offensive line is that much improved from a year ago and it is unrealistic to expect to discover gold in the draft for an offensive lineman.

Just two years ago Graves wanted to trade up and get CB Chris Gamble (CB was a clear need). The 49'ers publicly said that the Cards offered the most, but that they would not trade with a division rival.

Unrealistic to expect gold in the draft? Ehh... But where the heck does quality O-Linemen come from then? I'm assuming you mean that it's unrealistic to expect rookies to perform well on the OL.

I don't know where this idea comes from... The OL is just like any other position. Some players are ready from day one and others aren't. The Patriots played most of their season with a rookie LT and a rookie LG. They still managed to rank #7 in sacks allowed. Many experts believe that Saints' RT Jamal Brown was the best rookie in the entire league, but overlooked because he's an OL and he plays for the Saints.

On the OL's improvement.. There were 6 OL on IR last season. Do you honestly believe that having them back won't help.

I have my doubt about the OL, too... But I'm not going to panic and demanding Graves to sign every over-the-hill player to a huge contact in order to get a minimal improvement.

 

[Redsz]

I like the signings of M Brown and Clancy for depth.

Sorry Gary, but they are starting calibur players and will start at RG and NT.

 

[DieHardFromMO]

Just two years ago Graves wanted to trade up and get CB Chris Gamble (CB was a clear need). The 49'ers publicly said that the Cards offered the most, but that they would not trade with a division rival.

Unrealistic to expect gold in the draft? Ehh... But where the heck does quality O-Linemen come from then? I'm assuming you mean that it's unrealistic to expect rookies to perform well on the OL.
I don't know where this idea comes from... The OL is just like any other position. Some players are ready from day one and others aren't. The Patriots played most of their season with a rookie LT and a rookie LG. They still managed to rank #7 in sacks allowed. Many experts believe that Saints' RT Jamal Brown was the best rookie in the entire league, but overlooked because he's an OL and he plays for the Saints.

On the OL's improvement.. There were 6 OL on IR last season. Do you honestly believe that having them back won't help.
I have my doubt about the OL, too... But I'm not going to panic and demanding Graves to sign every over-the-hill player to a huge contact in order to get a minimal improvement.

Wanting to move up in the draft and actually moving up are two different animals. The Cardinals have not moved up in round 1 since 1993 and even then it was only 1 spot.

You are correct in your assumption that by discovering gold I was meaning finding a starting offensive lineman to play as a rookie.

The OL may have been riddled with injuries last year but I am not convinced like some that these players can fit the bill even when healthy.

 

[Doc Cardinal]

When did Walter Mitchell morph into Mitch?

 

[imaCafan]

When did Walter Mitchell morph into Mitch?

I think it happened right after MacG left.......

 

[Redrage]

A few thoughts on what dudes have ben saying:

1) I agree about the folly of not picking up a backup QB now. The best possible scenerio is that the Cards would sign a Collins type as a backup and still draft QBOF.

2) The siging Edge is what we've been waiting for for years. The Cards sign the best FA in its history and some people moan. Look, if Garrison Hearst could pick up 3.7 ypc behind that '95 line then I expect James to get 4.2 ypc behind the current crop. Or for that matter is this lineup worse than the '98 line? No, and Murrel rushed for over 1000 yards and we were in the playoffs.

3) What's with all the San Snyder love? He stock piles # 2 receivers at #1 prices and signs the most overrated safety this side of Roy Williams. Newsflash people, Adam is toast!

4) Oh, and what about all those free agents we didn't sign. Here's a second scoop for you, we're still talking about the Arizona Cardinals! Signing Edge was a coup, to be sure, but we are still not on most FAs wish list. If Runyun, Allen and etc. don't want to be here then they're not coming. Furthermore, it's not like every team in the NFL is waiting around for the Cards to raid all the FAs and then take what's left over. I would have liked to sign Brooks as a backup and Hope to play FS. Other teams landed them though. That's life.

5) Remember when Mac ran the team and he was constantly filling out the underbelly of the team?

 

[jstadvl]

i actually don't believe Navarre will be a badd back up.
If the line can pass protect, Navrre could be a very good #2.
I'm not worried as much about Navarre as I am some other(still) positions.

 

[WildBB]

Both Warner & James expressed their concern with the O-line prior to signing. It would seem apparent that the plan for addressing the line was discussed with them, and they bought into the program.

If both of these players can buy into the plan, I don't see why I wouldn't.

The Shark

AT least I hope James didn;'t just come here for the weather and the dinero.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

When did Walter Mitchell morph into Mitch?

When he stopped taking his meds...

 

[ajcardfan]

I think it happened right after MacG left.......

He vowed to never post again until Dennis Green was fired. I guess the name change was his way around that.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

It's funny how the three big guns, Walter, Harry and Snakester, who usually are very optimistic regarding the cardinals, are all suddenly in the "very concerned" camp.