Cards not planning go after big names FA

[Espo]

Still waiting for someone to answer This:

The Bidwills specifically promised that when the new stadium opened(this year) they would go out and "compete with other teams in FA" Im sorry but signing mid tier guys is no hard thing. We have done that for years.

I wouldnt consider the status quo of signing 5 to 6 mid tier guys as any type of change in the organizations direction or consider it competing with the big guys.


Does anyone else think that signing mid tier guys like we have always done is competing with the big guys?

It's not competing! This year is playoffs or bust and if they Bidwill's don't open the purse strings and bring in some big name guys to the new stadium I'm going to be pissed. If they just think they can sit back and watch the money roll in from the new stadium and not spend any on the team they better be ready for a revolt from the fans.

 

[Denny Green Fan]

Well I don't know myself.

I'd reserve judgement until I see how FA plays out but if they sign some no name guys those guys better turn out to be studs if we could have had Hutch or Bentley or Edge or Alexander and we don't get any of those and the guys we get are lunch pail guys I will be HIGHLY PO'D.

I was willing to wait for the new stadium, it's here, SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!

The running back situation to me can be fixed in the draft if we draft White but you cannot fix our O line with draft choices, we need at least one if not two high profile Oline signings or we are waisting the talents of a lot of other people we pay big money to.

Nice post man

 

[Denny Green Fan]

Would you be happy if the Cards signed Jamal, Bentley, Chris Hope, and Kemoeatu? and maybe Stephen Neal.

That list is a good one. I think I would cry tears of joy.

 

[D-Dogg]

Sorry but Bentley would be considered a high profile FA. He is arguably the best OL available. By Graves statement we wont be interested.

He is not IMO opinion a high profile FA. That's reserved for league superstars like Edge and Alexander. MVP candidate type players.

While Bentley is a stud, and the best OL out there, I don't think he's the high profile mold of player alluded to by graves. I fully expect the team to go after him hard and heavy, especially since their stated goal in FA is to get OL help, and this is a young stud who can be had for around 5 million...yeah, it's a lot, but not a 8 or 9 million player like edge or alexander.

I think some are reading far too much into this...I think all that was being said was that they aren't going after the big names out there. Bentley is a "big name" for an Olineman, but Olineman in general aren't big names overall.

I will not be upset with this FA period if we don't go after Edge and Alexander (I'd prefer LenDale myself who has younger legs). But if we don't do all we can to get Bentley then I'll join the angry side of the fence. Our number one problem is the offensive line, from poor run blocking to mediocre pass blocking to false starts and stupid penalties, this unit needs to be punched up big time. Number one, two and three priority in FA, IMO.

Bentley isn't a Big Name MVP type player, but he's a big name in my book as he can have instant POSITIVE impact. I don't think for a second that Green and Graves are ruling him out in this statement.

 

[conraddobler]

He is not IMO opinion a high profile FA. That's reserved for league superstars like Edge and Alexander. MVP candidate type players.

While Bentley is a stud, and the best OL out there, I don't think he's the high profile mold of player alluded to by graves. I fully expect the team to go after him hard and heavy, especially since their stated goal in FA is to get OL help, and this is a young stud who can be had for around 5 million...yeah, it's a lot, but not a 8 or 9 million player like edge or alexander.

I think some are reading far too much into this...I think all that was being said was that they aren't going after the big names out there. Bentley is a "big name" for an Olineman, but Olineman in general aren't big names overall.

I will not be upset with this FA period if we don't go after Edge and Alexander (I'd prefer LenDale myself who has younger legs). But if we don't do all we can to get Bentley then I'll join the angry side of the fence. Our number one problem is the offensive line, from poor run blocking to mediocre pass blocking to false starts and stupid penalties, this unit needs to be punched up big time. Number one, two and three priority in FA, IMO.

Bentley isn't a Big Name MVP type player, but he's a big name in my book as he can have instant POSITIVE impact. I don't think for a second that Green and Graves are ruling him out in this statement.

Well that would be fine, I don't think RB is a problem you can't solve in the draft.

They can often play right out of the gate but asking an O line player to do that is stupid.

 

[joeshmo]

Yes I will give him Berry, Okeafor, and Warner. Very good signings. I dont consider Obefemi any type of difference maker. Macklin is already being thrown out there as possible being replaced in the starting line-up.

Macklin being replaced in starting lineup has never once came out of anyone from the Cards organization. It came from one local media who was thrwoing our a rumor. The only thing has ever said about Macklin is that Eric Green will have a chance to compete, which is something that should be said about every position, every player every year. We have been ranked in the top 10 in passing ever since Macklin has been here, He was every bit a big part of that turn around and not to Berrys level of a FA pickup but he is up there, easily.

 

[ChandlerCard]

I believe many of you are missing the point.

First of all, at least in negotiations I've been in, "Top of the Market" refers to % of value, not amount, and we know that Graves and Green will not overpay someone. That doesn't mean that they wouldn't consider a "Top Tier" player at a reasonable amount (even if it's expensive).

Secondly, we've known both of them to use the media and official announcements to keep people off the scent. I don't blame them for making obvious lies in such situations (i.e. this guy is our QB) because that's how you play the game.

Finally, the Bidwill's promised that we'd compete when we were in the stadium. That's next year. Granted, Michael has indicated that we'd start using more money now that it's a done deal, and over the last two years they have done just that.

Does this mean we'll be signing Edge next week? Do we even need to? Who knows. But don't over-read into this and jump off a cliff.

 

[joeshmo]

Can you say they didnt suck?

I can for Huff, not for Ross.

Was Huff great, no, but he was better then average which was an upgrade compared to that spot in 2004. How anyone can say that he sucked especially after what we saw out of the position in 2004, what his price tag is, and the amount of injuries to the front 4 in front of him is beyond me.

 

[Shane]

I believe many of you are missing the point.

First of all, at least in negotiations I've been in, "Top of the Market" refers to % of value, not amount, and we know that Graves and Green will not overpay someone. That doesn't mean that they wouldn't consider a "Top Tier" player at a reasonable amount (even if it's expensive).

Secondly, we've known both of them to use the media and official announcements to keep people off the scent. I don't blame them for making obvious lies in such situations (i.e. this guy is our QB) because that's how you play the game.

Finally, the Bidwill's promised that we'd compete when we were in the stadium. That's next year. Granted, Michael has indicated that we'd start using more money now that it's a done deal, and over the last two years they have done just that.

Does this mean we'll be signing Edge next week? Do we even need to? Who knows. But don't over-read into this and jump off a cliff.

You shouldnt underread into it either. We havent started spending more money please show me proof of that? we have spent money but have never gone after a high profile FA or two. It would be nice to finally be able to do that and have the Bidwills live up to that promise.

It would also be nice to use the "its a big smokescreen excuse" but The G&G brigades history over the last 2 years clearly shows otherwise. They like looking for younger less proven talent who may be coming into their own.

 

[Shane]

I can for Huff, not for Ross.

Was Huff great, no, but he was better then average which was an upgrade compared to that spot in 2004. How anyone can say that he sucked especially after what we saw out of the position in 2004, what his price tag is, and the amount of injuries to the front 4 in front of him is beyond me.

You calling his play better than average is VERY NICE Joe. Im sure he would be flattered. There were times when he was adequate at best and many othe rtimes where he was non existent.

 

[Duckjake]

Johnny Johnson in 91

Larry Centers in 1995,1996 of course it was for his receiving skills but hey he was a RB.

Last Qb was Lomax in 1987.

 

[joeshmo]

Does anyone else think that signing mid tier guys like we have always done is competing with the big guys?

Why are we still talking about mid tier guys. They only said we wouldnt sign elite tier guys such as Edge or Alexander. Nothing about top tier guys.

We signed 2 guys at 5 mill a year last year, one didnt work out but that is both top tier money which means we will spend money on top tier talent again. Just not Edge or Alexander. I think we are making a mountian out of a mole hill on this one just becuase they said no to the what will be the highest paid FA's. There are still plenty of others people. You are putting the cart before the horse on this one.

If we dont sign any top tier FA's and some mid tier FA's, then I will lead the charge with you guys with the burning sticks to the Cards Front office. But until then just because we said we wont sign high priced Edge or Alexander doesnt tell me anything about the other good FA's to be had. I think we are getting worked up over nothing as of right now.

 

[joeshmo]

We are consistently terrible, and had one of the worst rushing attacks in history. People can try to justify it as much as they want, these "mid tier" acquisitions that sometimes pan out, sometimes don't. We have multiple top tier running backs out there, and supposively increased revenues from the new stadium. I'm sorry, if we get a bunch of mediocre players, and end up 6-10, 7-9 next year, I will be incredibly pissed.

High profile FA's bust just as much as the mid tier ones. They just crash harder becuase they cost more.

What high priced FA's have worked out for their respective teams the past 3 years. There are far, far, more that have bombed then have succeeded. The numbers are staggering actually.

 

[joeshmo]

Still waiting for someone to answer This:

The Bidwills specifically promised that when the new stadium opened(this year) they would go out and "compete with other teams in FA" Im sorry but signing mid tier guys is no hard thing. We have done that for years.

I wouldnt consider the status quo of signing 5 to 6 mid tier guys as any type of change in the organizations direction or consider it competing with the big guys.


Does anyone else think that signing mid tier guys like we have always done is competing with the big guys?

There are more then just mid tier guys though Shane. There are still top tier guys such as Berry and Okeaker and what we though was Ross. One didnt pan out. We spent 5 Mill on each one.

Just becuase we wont go after the elite big money FA's doesnt mean only Mid tier FA's. 5 mill a year which is what we did last year for 2 guys isnt mid tier status that is top tier. And we will do it again this year. Whether those top tier guys will work out is another story.

 

[joeshmo]

See, this right here is the mindset problem that our organization and many of the fans clamoring for us to remain cheap seem to spout. I'm sorry, Joe, but I expected much better out of you. WE HAVE the cap space to sign a big name FA AND a few other quality starters. If we continue offering flat, uncreative contracts like we did to the players you mentioned, no, we won't. Then again, this year we supposedly have the monety to be creative.

Not once did I clamor to be cheap, not once at all. Have you been reading my posts. There are more FA's then just Edge and Alexander that will cost money, top tier guys, not mid tier guys.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

If we sign a RB in free agency, I expect it will be either Jamal Lewis or Micheal Bennett.

Both are a notch above top level, both would fit for different reasons.

 

[joeshmo]

I just want to make sure that I am making myself clear.

I am not for signing a bunch of mid-tier FA. A few yes.

I think that Edge and Alexander are in the Elite class which is what I believe Green and Graves are talking, but there is still the top tier class such as the okeafers and berrys of the world.

If we dont sign more then three top tier of those FA's, I will be pissed off.

 

[slanidrac16]

This is the same philosophy that Denny has always used and has been successful for the most part. He will go after and get perhaps 3 or 4 more (note we already resigned Warner) solid starters to fill needs. He will then go and get BPA in the draft. So called solid starters could include:
DT Kemoeatu Ravens
OG Neal Patriots
FS Demps Ravens
OG Reyes Panthers or OT Ashworth Patriots
RB Wells Texans or RB Davenport Packers

Then how about a draft that has us taking:
1st Round Lendale White RB USC
2nd Round Best OL Available (Scott, Lutui, etc.)
3rd Round Best QB available ( Whitehurst, Jacobs, etc.)

IMO this would give us an excellent off season.

Ahhhh.....a voice of reason. I agree. This would be a fantastic off season. If we were to put all of our eggs in the Edge basket and he were to go done with a season ending injury, where the hell would that leave us? I would prefer us to sign 4 or 5 above average free agents than 2 "superstars".

 

[Sandan]

Jeff we have been hearing for years that the Cards will go after the high profile FA's once they get the new stadium.

Not true. We, make that I have been told by M Bidwill [as near as I can remember] "We are adjusting our business plan on the assumtpion of revenues from the new stadium"

I interpreted that to me that we are going to be more agreesive in FA and more create in contracts both for FAs and draftees. Both os these has come to pass.

Nowhere have they ever said that Big Name free agents were a priority or even of any great interest. I have always got the distinct impression that they felt that most Big names get way overpaid based on PAST production.

JWe have been hearing that they will have the cash flow to compete with other teams for better players. We have been promised by the Bidwills that we will go after those type of players.

We will/do have better cash flow but I have heard nothing to suggest that the Big names are in the frame. Personally I also think that in most circumstances they are way overpaid and we would do better to find the guys on the verge of becoming a big name.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I just want to make sure that I am making myself clear.

I am not for signing a bunch of mid-tier FA. A few yes.

I think that Edge and Alexander are in the Elite class which is what I believe Green and Graves are talking, but there is still the top tier class such as the okeafers and berrys of the world.

If we dont sign more then three top tier of those FA's, I will be pissed off.

My feelings exactly. Elite is different from top teir.

I'd love to have the Cardinals sign an elite guy like Edge. But only if it does't put the team into Cap hell. If Edge wants to break the bank then I say no way.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Larry Centers in 1995,1996 of course it was for his receiving skills but hey he was a RB.

Last Qb was Lomax in 1987.

I was thinking strictly RB, not FB...I was being technical about it..

 

[Sandan]

Does anyone else think that signing mid tier guys like we have always done is competing with the big guys?

Mid tier is not the same as up and coming.

In years past we would sign mid range players who really wanted a last big paycheck.

DG is looking for hungry unerrated players Like Berry.

Huge difference

 

[Sandan]

Still waiting for someone to answer This:

I did answer you, including as close to a quote from M Bidwill as I can remember.

 

[seesred]

MId tier, top tier, under tier...You all are screaming about minute differences. You say potatoe and I say well you know the stoty. Coach Green interviewed just two weeks ago stated that they are going to try and fix the o-line in FA and the draft. As far as top guys isnt Berry and Okeafer top guys?

Huff and Ross came in with high expectations..I'm sure Starks went to NE and they had high expectations.It happens with all FA's. Look at this years list and thgere are names some on this board wanted so bad and we didn't get and just two or three years latter gone they prriced themselves off the team..IMO they did all right especially after Ross came back from his injury. Not great but this year is thier second year in the system. Will they piuck up a NAME" RB? I don't know. What I do know if many of you are so passonate about it, WRITE COACH GREEN and GRaves an E-mail. Tell them you want every top guy around especially this one or that one.

Just keep in mind yes, Green has had the team only 2 training camps, only two seasons and he took over a wreck. WE have turned over 98% of the players. This year there will be more. He has not stood still for bad coaching even during the season. I think Edge would be the most important fa signing others think Bently and I don't disagree. But at what price. 50-60 million, 10-12 up front? All I'm saying is don't get mad before the fact. Wait IMO it will work out and we will be better for it.

GBR
40

 

[Stout]

Yeah, well, call it 'elite', call it 'top tier', or whatever...I smell a rat, and the smell had better be dispelled come FA. If we end up singing a few mid-tier guys with the ability we have to be major players, it'll be same old, same old. WE CAN MAKE A SPLASH AND GET SOME REAL IMPACT PLAYERS. DO IT!!!