Chill

[Red on White]

Since 1919

As only a third year Cards (and NFL) fan the weight of history doesn't impact me as it would the lifetime diehards.

The coaches and staff shouldn't carry ills of the past on their shoulders though. Should be judged purely on here and now. Which may well not be good enough (I'm not making comment there either way) but just because a bunch of teams and coaches and GMs have screwed up in the past shouldn't intensify how Kingsbury and Co are judged.

 

[Broseph]

If this Same team was ran by that patriots organization and coaching we’d be 12-4

 

[Arz101]

As only a third year Cards (and NFL) fan the weight of history doesn't impact me as it would the lifetime diehards.

The coaches and staff shouldn't carry ills of the past on their shoulders though. Should be judged purely on here and now. Which may well not be good enough (I'm not making comment there either way) but just because a bunch of teams and coaches and GMs have screwed up in the past shouldn't intensify how Kingsbury and Co are judged.

Agree.

The franchise is doomed and when the franchise ends (hopefully a very very long time from now) it will be sadness for most of it's existence for her fans. It has seen it's share of Keim's and Kliff's. It is not their fault. Most of them gave their best.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

 

[tnmike]

The tender judgment of youth. You clearly have no clue as to the scope of suffering many here have endured. And while this is just another blip, long-time fans of this team are tired of the same old crap. So yeah, you can chill. We'll be over here seething.

For your information I have been a Cardinals fan since 1973, probably much longer than you so I have seen and experienced much worse. You sure ain't no psychic

 

[AZfaninMN]

Lot of people in this community basically saying "be miserable like me" cause my football team didnt win

Nah, sorry I wont do it. I'm not blind, deaf, or dumb and I see GLARINGLY OBVIOUS year over year improvement. I'm enjoying this season of growth.

You’re young, you’ll learn

 

[AZfaninMN]

As only a third year Cards (and NFL) fan the weight of history doesn't impact me as it would the lifetime diehards.

The coaches and staff shouldn't carry ills of the past on their shoulders though. Should be judged purely on here and now. Which may well not be good enough (I'm not making comment there either way) but just because a bunch of teams and coaches and GMs have screwed up in the past shouldn't intensify how Kingsbury and Co are judged.

You’re correct, which is why the KK tenure is a failure. Based on NFL standards it’s not good, but based on cardinals standards it’s an improvement. An improvement from 2 years ago doesn’t mean we’re good.

 

[Buckybird]

this team and coaching staff are a year away. It is what it is.

You know what this franchise needs?

To admit it made a mistake in retaining a mediocre GM (whose best attribute is waiver pickups), hiring a mediocre overhyped HC who can’t manage game situations that never won jack & hiring a suspect mediocre DC & move on from all 3 just like they did when they moved on from Josh Rosen. It’s Michael Bidwill’s turn to try & get the ship back on course imo.

 

[AZman5103]

I don't think we are really improved as a team this year. We choked away winnable games last year, and the exact same problems persist. Penalties, mental mistakes, and poor game management....every single week.

As much as I wouldn't mind Keim getting fired...he gave the coaches what they needed to win. Hopkins, Drake, Arnold, Defensive free agents, a top 10 pick on D...etc. he actually improved the team more in this off-season than most gms....the problem is the same loser coaches showed they can't win even with better talent.

If we were even a decently coached team, we would have beaten Detroit, New England, and Seattle once....because those games were flat out lost by poor coaching. We choked them away.

With a decent coach, we would have been a min of 10-4 this week and be in a completely different situation.

I'm being dead serious, I think if we had a mid level coach like Zimmer, Bowles, even a Marv Lewis...this team would have won the division this year

 

[jmt]

I don't know know how winning 3 then 5 then 8 is not an improvement? Maybe 11 next year!

 

[AZfaninMN]

I don't know know how winning 3 then 5 then 8 is not an improvement? Maybe 11 next year!

That’s now how it works. Just because we won 3 two year ago means on the pace we’re on we’ll win 11 next season. There needs to be Improvement and we can’t lose to bad teams.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

The tender judgment of youth. You clearly have no clue as to the scope of suffering many here have endured. And while this is just another blip, long-time fans of this team are tired of the same old crap. So yeah, you can chill. We'll be over here seething.

We have endured so much suffering that 8-8 feels like 12-4 to other teams.

 

[Solar7]

As only a third year Cards (and NFL) fan the weight of history doesn't impact me as it would the lifetime diehards.

The coaches and staff shouldn't carry ills of the past on their shoulders though. Should be judged purely on here and now. Which may well not be good enough (I'm not making comment there either way) but just because a bunch of teams and coaches and GMs have screwed up in the past shouldn't intensify how Kingsbury and Co are judged.

You began your fandom in a year that really wasn't as bad as the Cardinals have been in the past. Yeah, three wins was lame, Wilks wasn't very good, but a ball this or that way didn't remove that we had multiple Pro Bowl players, and key guys at positions that other NFL teams would have loved to have. In the 90s, we'd hope 7 undrafted rookie free agents could hold down starter positions. In 1998 we tore down the goalpost at Sun Devil Stadium for going 9-7 in a 16-13 game, and going to the playoffs for the first time since 1975. We had our first win in the playoffs since 1947.

The point is, people here are battered so much that many have extremely low expectations. Please don't do the same to yourself. The 3 win team you saw when you started watching, and our mediocrity today is not acceptable because it's a little better. Many NFL teams rebound.

 

[cardcrazy]

It’s not hard to improve on 3 wins and 5 wins. Going 8 wins is forgettable. Nobody cares about or remembers an 8-8 team!
I’m sure all of us were hoping for better at year 2.
Down 14-12...4th & 3 on your own 30....10 minutes to go...Go for it and misfire...turn the ball over, they score an easy TD.
What other NFL coach makes that decision?
I’m still yelling,”PUNT!”

 

[Solar7]

I’m still yelling,”PUNT!”

I watched the game on a Zoom with a 49ers fan, and he was yelling "WHY DOES KINGSBURY REFUSE TO PUNT?"

 

[Zeem_Freeze]

You’re young, you’ll learn

Learn what? to be miserable? Lol I can guarantee I’ve attended more Cardinals games than you. My family has had season tickets since they moved here and I’ve attended every home game since I was 6.

get out of here with “you’re young, you’ll learn.”

I’ve witnessed, in person, more crappy Cardinals football than you ever will. I’ve also seen us win playoff games and NFC championships. This team and coaching regime is a lot closer to THAT than they are 3 wins and the first overall pick.

since you’re interested in age based slander, I’ve got a question for ya. Who taught this grouchy old man how to Internet?

 

[pmacLean]

This many wins ..this..that many wins ..that blah..de blah d blah..
This was the most important Cardinal game in years, no contest..
And they once again make a 3rd Sting QB/RB duo.look like superstars..in a game we should have been all.a
Out and locked in and we look like putzes.. QB/team/coaches.. a bunch of putzes not ready ( even remotely) for primetime..

Next year i have no expectations, don't be putzes and win me back... I'm not holding my breath ir getting excited for this team again...

 

[Red on White]

You began your fandom in a year that really wasn't as bad as the Cardinals have been in the past. Yeah, three wins was lame, Wilks wasn't very good, but a ball this or that way didn't remove that we had multiple Pro Bowl players, and key guys at positions that other NFL teams would have loved to have. In the 90s, we'd hope 7 undrafted rookie free agents could hold down starter positions. In 1998 we tore down the goalpost at Sun Devil Stadium for going 9-7 in a 16-13 game, and going to the playoffs for the first time since 1975. We had our first win in the playoffs since 1947.

The point is, people here are battered so much that many have extremely low expectations. Please don't do the same to yourself. The 3 win team you saw when you started watching, and our mediocrity today is not acceptable because it's a little better. Many NFL teams rebound.

My experience in other sports is that perennial under-performing clubs tend to be less patient than more successful organisations.

If we just had Coach X then we'd be successful. Quick hire and fires. Start over every couple of years. Build nothing.

Win a couple of games and get giddy on bathwater. We should be a playoff team. QB MVP etc. Then when it falls flat...?

Underperforming clubs get too excited about wins (big contracts for all, expectations sky high on small sample size) and too angry about losses (sack them all, start over).

Means that any time there are a few losses it impacts heavily on the whole group because jobs are on the line. Sackings imminent. Self preservation abounds. Blame apportioned.

Fans are battle scarred. "Here we go...." eyerolls every time there's an error and that mood is internal as well as external.

At some point there needs to be a pick and stick. Grow. Understand that improvement won't be a straight line

Rather than always looking for the magic bullet to fix things next season.

The macro is 3 wins, 5.5 wins, 8 wins. Trending up slowly. QB and HC now with two seasons behind them. The micro is we blew a playoff spot from 6-2.

Are KK, Kyler and Vance worth investing the time in? I don't have a clue.

Change risks going back to square one and if the franchise history is as dire as people seem to be describing in this thread then I imagine that has happened plenty of times. This time it'll be different of course

 

[tnmike]

The tender judgment of youth. You clearly have no clue as to the scope of suffering many here have endured. And while this is just another blip, long-time fans of this team are tired of the same old crap. So yeah, you can chill. We'll be over here seething.

OK let's do the math. Since you are 44 years old that means that you were born around 1976. I became a fan of the Cards in 1973 when they were in St Louis. Using simple math that means I was a fan 3 years before you were born. So yes I have MUCH more experience with their futility than you do. So let's take it a step further. Since YOU assumed what I made my observation on was the tenderness of youth you obviously are prone to making judgements with little or no information so it puts probably most if not all of your opinions in question. So there, you opened the door and got it slammed on your foot. It's a frikin game dude. Like I said in the beginning....CHILL OUT

 

[BritCard]

this team and coaching staff are a year away. It is what it is.

I don't buy the "trending" the right direction narrative. Every season has no relation the the previous one. Look at the Eagles, Texans etc vs last year. So much depends on schedule, injuries etc

This team was not only capable of making the playoffs this year but also of winning playoff games.

The issues that have lead to loses are not those little things that coaches only fix with experience. They are huge, gaping, obvious issues I would expect any year 1 NFL HC to resolve.

The worst of which is Kyler is being coached down. His mechanics have gotten worse. He's still not seeing the field or reading defenses well. And it's being allowed to slide.

Every single time the camera cuts to Kyler on the sideline he's either sitting on the bench staring at the floor or he's sat on the grass watching the defence.

All season I've never seen him with a tablet studying what the defense are doing or going over plays for the next drive. Never seen him with other players trying to work things out or gee them up.

I don't want to get into Mitch level conjecture but combined with the rumours he'd rather be in the gym than watching film it feels like Kyler treats football as something he does between Twitch streams.

Frankly, the form we have been in since the Bye week I'm not too disappointed we won't make the playoffs. I think it's better for next year to be 8-8 and close playoff contenders than 9-7 and the team that got destroyed by the Saints in the playoffs.

 

[juza76]

What a difference yesterday about the coaching and playcalling
They had surely a better plan to put the Cardinals in a position to fail
Our coaches did poor studies regarding other teams cause they look often unprapared
Shanahan is a great coach, he got the best he could get from a mediocre qb, meanwhile KK doesn't get anything close about the offense potential
I've been so disappointed and I'm skeptical a year can change much since I didn't see any improvements from the beginning of the season

 

[Stout]

OK let's do the math. Since you are 44 years old that means that you were born around 1976. I became a fan of the Cards in 1973 when they were in St Louis. Using simple math that means I was a fan 3 years before you were born. So yes I have MUCH more experience with their futility than you do. So let's take it a step further. Since YOU assumed what I made my observation on was the tenderness of youth you obviously are prone to making judgements with little or no information so it puts probably most if not all of your opinions in question. So there, you opened the door and got it slammed on your foot. It's a frikin game dude. Like I said in the beginning....CHILL OUT

If you've been a fan for that long, then shame on you for telling Cards fans to "chill" after that monstrous performance. You (should) know better, if you've been a fan that long. I assumed you were young because no long-time Cards fan would have the temerity to tell others to "chill" after a game like that. Hell, we have a 24-hour moratorium on bans on this board specifically so the fans/posters DON'T have to chill.

 

[swagron]

I don't buy the "trending" the right direction narrative. Every season has no relation the the previous one. Look at the Eagles, Texans etc vs last year. So much depends on schedule, injuries etc

This team was not only capable of making the playoffs this year but also of winning playoff games.

The issues that have lead to loses are not those little things that coaches only fix with experience. They are huge, gaping, obvious issues I would expect any year 1 NFL HC to resolve.

The worst of which is Kyler is being coached down. His mechanics have gotten worse. He's still not seeing the field or reading defenses well. And it's being allowed to slide.

Every single time the camera cuts to Kyler on the sideline he's either sitting on the bench staring at the floor or he's sat on the grass watching the defence.

All season I've never seen him with a tablet studying what the defense are doing or going over plays for the next drive. Never seen him with other players trying to work things out or gee them up.

I don't want to get into Mitch level conjecture but combined with the rumours he'd rather be in the gym than watching film it feels like Kyler treats football as something he does between Twitch streams.

Frankly, the form we have been in since the Bye week I'm not too disappointed we won't make the playoffs. I think it's better for next year to be 8-8 and close playoff contenders than 9-7 and the team that got destroyed by the Saints in the playoffs.

Listening to his press/post game comments, I don’t believe the QB is much of a cerebral sort. What you see now is what you’re going to get. He relies on his athleticism and gets mix results and will be a flash in the pan as far as his career is concerned.

 

[AZfaninMN]

Learn what? to be miserable? Lol I can guarantee I’ve attended more Cardinals games than you. My family has had season tickets since they moved here and I’ve attended every home game since I was 6.

get out of here with “you’re young, you’ll learn.”

I’ve witnessed, in person, more crappy Cardinals football than you ever will. I’ve also seen us win playoff games and NFC championships. This team and coaching regime is a lot closer to THAT than they are 3 wins and the first overall pick.

since you’re interested in age based slander, I’ve got a question for ya. Who taught this grouchy old man how to Internet?

It was a joke. I’m only 30 years old and that’s usually what people say to me in every aspect of life, not just football. I’ve lived outside of Arizona for 22 years now and yet I’ve attended games in almost every stadium in the NFL. Before that we had season tickets in old SDS. Don’t talk to anyone on the board like you’ve endured so much with this team because so has everyone else. My dad taught me the game and taught me to love the Cardinals and neither him or I are grumpy or miserable when it comes to the Cardinals

 

[Solar7]

My experience in other sports is that perennial under-performing clubs tend to be less patient than more successful organisations.

If we just had Coach X then we'd be successful. Quick hire and fires. Start over every couple of years. Build nothing.

Win a couple of games and get giddy on bathwater. We should be a playoff team. QB MVP etc. Then when it falls flat...?

Underperforming clubs get too excited about wins (big contracts for all, expectations sky high on small sample size) and too angry about losses (sack them all, start over).

Means that any time there are a few losses it impacts heavily on the whole group because jobs are on the line. Sackings imminent. Self preservation abounds. Blame apportioned.

Fans are battle scarred. "Here we go...." eyerolls every time there's an error and that mood is internal as well as external.

At some point there needs to be a pick and stick. Grow. Understand that improvement won't be a straight line

Rather than always looking for the magic bullet to fix things next season.

The macro is 3 wins, 5.5 wins, 8 wins. Trending up slowly. QB and HC now with two seasons behind them. The micro is we blew a playoff spot from 6-2.

Are KK, Kyler and Vance worth investing the time in? I don't have a clue.

Change risks going back to square one and if the franchise history is as dire as people seem to be describing in this thread then I imagine that has happened plenty of times. This time it'll be different of course

Conceptually, I don't think you're wrong, but the problem is that Kliff hasn't shown the ability to win at any level, and Keim's inability to draft is really glaring at this point.

Here's an issue you might not know about Keim, he's been with the organization for many many years, part of a series of internal hires at GM, basically giving us a continuous front office structure that began with Bob Ferguson in 1996. This team hasn't had a fresh, outside-of-the-organization perspective in nearly 25 years. Keim is even worse in that he has never even been a scout outside of the Cardinals.

It's time for some new blood. And again, I don't think that will happen this off-season, but it needs to happen before we ever become a contender again, IMO.

 

[Chopper0080]

Conceptually, I don't think you're wrong, but the problem is that Kliff hasn't shown the ability to win at any level, and Keim's inability to draft is really glaring at this point.

Here's an issue you might not know about Keim, he's been with the organization for many many years, part of a series of internal hires at GM, basically giving us a continuous front office structure that began with Bob Ferguson in 1996. This team hasn't had a fresh, outside-of-the-organization perspective in nearly 25 years. Keim is even worse in that he has never even been a scout outside of the Cardinals.

It's time for some new blood. And again, I don't think that will happen this off-season, but it needs to happen before we ever become a contender again, IMO.

I am actually going the other way with all of this. I think I am ready to give Kliff and Keim the entire span of Kyler's rookie contract, outside of his option year. Give them two more and see what happens. It can't get worse than it has been and ultimately, Kyler is such an outlier in his skill set and experience, let's see where it goes. We will essentially waste a rookie deal but if Kyler isn't getting better and making us a playoff contender, it tells you what you need to know about him as well.

 

[tnmike]

If you've been a fan for that long, then shame on you for telling Cards fans to "chill" after that monstrous performance. You (should) know better, if you've been a fan that long. I assumed you were young because no long-time Cards fan would have the temerity to tell others to "chill" after a game like that. Hell, we have a 24-hour moratorium on bans on this board specifically so the fans/posters DON'T have to chill.

Who died and made you the decider who to shame? You know where you can go Bud