Current Officiating

[Hoop Head]

Saw this on Reddit and thought I'd post it here since there has been a bit of talk about the officiating lately. We're young and are learning but right now we have the 9th largest foul differential in NBA history.


So far this season, every 1 foul called on the Suns there are 0.82 fouls called on their opponents. Out of 1274 teams in NBA history that's the 9th worst ratio of all time. In fact it's by far the worst in the last 5 seasons.

1. PHX 2018-19: 0.82
2. ORL 2014-15: 0.86
3. SAC 2017-18: 0.87
4. MEM 2017-18: 0.88
5. NYK 2014-15: 0.88
6. PHI 2015-16: 0.88
7. ORL 2015-16: 0.88

The next worst so far this season is Golden State with 0.90.

For 9 consecutive games the Suns have been called for more fouls than their opponents and the difference is 0.73 in that time. That would be by far the worst in NBA history.

Here's a link to the post

So apparently we haven't been crazy or seeing things, we've been screwed by the refs lately.

 

[95pro]

We just need to be more physical.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

We just need to be more physical.

Hard to be more physical when you are being called for everything. Also the issue isn't so much that we aren't drawing enough calls, but that we're being called for far too many.

 

[Chaplin]

We just need to be more physical.

We're being called for more fouls than everyone and your solution is to be more physical?

 

[AzStevenCal]

There are several reasons for this. For one, we are a bad team and bad teams rarely get the breaks. Secondly, we have a soft reputation and physical teams typically get breaks that other's don't because it's their style of play and refs tend to reward the aggressor. Thirdly, we are a young team and rookies and young players rarely get an even break. There might even be some backlash for the fact we actively tanked last season and part of the previous one.

 

[Dback Jon]

There are several reasons for this. For one, we are a bad team and bad teams rarely get the breaks. Secondly, we have a soft reputation and physical teams typically get breaks that other's don't because it's their style of play and refs tend to reward the aggressor. Thirdly, we are a young team and rookies and young players rarely get an even break. There might even be some backlash for the fact we actively tanked last season and part of the previous one.

Spurs tanked TWO seasons and still got the calls.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The inconsistency is glaring. TJ's ejection was the icing on the cake.

We're being called for more fouls than everyone and your solution is to be more physical?

Yep. That's what I would say.

 

[JCSunsfan]

There are several reasons for this. For one, we are a bad team and bad teams rarely get the breaks. Secondly, we have a soft reputation and physical teams typically get breaks that other's don't because it's their style of play and refs tend to reward the aggressor. Thirdly, we are a young team and rookies and young players rarely get an even break. There might even be some backlash for the fact we actively tanked last season and part of the previous one.

I think I would agree with all of this. If you get a reputation for being a physical defensive team, you get more calls.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Spurs tanked TWO seasons and still got the calls.

Urban legend started and buoyed by a bitter Bill Simmons because his Celtics, which clearly tanked, lost out on Duncan. Don't believe me? Search the internet for "did the Spurs tank" and read all the refutations, of which there are many.

As for the Spurs getting the calls, it's quite true that the calls went their way regularly during the Pop/Duncan era. Interestingly enough, IMO, David Robinson was frequently treated like he was Mark West's brother.

 

[Dback Jon]

The Spurs did tank - and you can find just as many articles claiming they did. D Rob could have played. They absolutely tanked games at the end of the season.

And they tanked for Robinson as well.

 

[Dback Jon]

Just because SA got a little lucky in the lottery doesn't mean they didn't tank to get better odds.

 

[1Sun]

Two factors above all else here, and neither have to do with officiating:

1. The offensive "system" is over-reliant on passes along the perimeter, involves settling way too much for outside jump shots and does not employ drives or slashes to the hoop or pounding in the low post nearly enough.

2. Defensively, the fundamentals are very poor and there is way too much reaching and getting into defensive position way too late.

In other words, this historic statistic is yet another indictment on our historically poor coaching.

 

[AzStevenCal]

The Spurs did tank - and you can find just as many articles claiming they did. D Rob could have played. They absolutely tanked games at the end of the season.

And they tanked for Robinson as well.

Well, at that time, sitting a veteran at the end of the season or someone just returned from injury was not considered tanking. And I still don't consider it tanking. Just about every team has done that many times without ever being accused of tanking. That same year, Boston actively tanked from the top all the way down to the Head Coach. SA did not. When David came back from injury it would have taken a criminally stupid GM and Head Coach to risk a property like Robinson for a handful of meaningless games.

We actively tanked last season so whatever you want to call it, what they did is not the same thing as we did. And I see no evidence to support the claim that the Spurs tanked for Robinson. Robinson's selection came in the middle of a stretch where the Spurs won 35, 28, 31 and 21 games. They finished 3rd that season and only got Robinson because of luck in the lottery.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Saw this on Reddit and thought I'd post it here since there has been a bit of talk about the officiating lately. We're young and are learning but right now we have the 9th largest foul differential in NBA history.


So far this season, every 1 foul called on the Suns there are 0.82 fouls called on their opponents. Out of 1274 teams in NBA history that's the 9th worst ratio of all time. In fact it's by far the worst in the last 5 seasons.

1. PHX 2018-19: 0.82
2. ORL 2014-15: 0.86
3. SAC 2017-18: 0.87
4. MEM 2017-18: 0.88
5. NYK 2014-15: 0.88
6. PHI 2015-16: 0.88
7. ORL 2015-16: 0.88

The next worst so far this season is Golden State with 0.90.

For 9 consecutive games the Suns have been called for more fouls than their opponents and the difference is 0.73 in that time. That would be by far the worst in NBA history.

Here's a link to the post

So apparently we haven't been crazy or seeing things, we've been screwed by the refs lately.

I love how we assume it’s the refs. Maybe our players just suck historically. That’s kinda what the eye test points to . . .

 

[1Sun]

I love how we assume it’s the refs. Maybe our players just suck historically. That’s kinda what the eye test points to . . .

They're largely the same players as last year, with improvements in Ayton, Bridges and (at least theoretically) Ariza. It's bad coaching combined with Ariza dogging it.

 

[Hoop Head]

I love how we assume it’s the refs. Maybe our players just suck historically. That’s kinda what the eye test points to . . .

Up until this road trip I didn't notice that bad of officiating but against Philly, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Detroit we couldn't get a call and it seemed our opponents were getting all the calls they needed to get back into the game. It's something that has been mentioned multiple times by multiple posters in each of those game threads. When I saw someone actually looked into a little further I thought it was worth sharing. I am not blaming the officiating for our record or the early season blowouts though.

We suck, I don't deny that. The foul calls haven't lost us any games, except maybe the Pistons game yesterday but that was only 1 call, the TJ offensive foul that led to his ejection. If that didn't happen then it's an entirely different 2nd half. One call is not an excuse for a loss though.

We need an identity to help us with the officiating. Too often we try to emulate our competition and we get called for more physical plays because we don't have an identity of our own. I think that's the only way to change this. We need to find a style that we play well within and stick to that rather than making changes every other game. That way the refs learn who we are and what to expect. Maybe then we'll get a little slack.

 

[AzStevenCal]

We suck, I don't deny that. The foul calls haven't lost us any games, except maybe the Pistons game yesterday but that was only 1 call, the TJ offensive foul that led to his ejection. If that didn't happen then it's an entirely different 2nd half.

I believe the refs took a game from us but it wasn't in Detroit. That was a bad call but it wasn't horrible officiating. From the wrong angle I can see justification for the offensive foul. And other than the usual stuff that Griffin gets away with I thought it was a pretty fair refereeing job especially considering we were on the road. But IMO there is no justification for the one-sided calls we saw in Philadelphia.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Up until this road trip I didn't notice that bad of officiating but against Philly, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Detroit we couldn't get a call and it seemed our opponents were getting all the calls they needed to get back into the game. It's something that has been mentioned multiple times by multiple posters in each of those game threads. When I saw someone actually looked into a little further I thought it was worth sharing. I am not blaming the officiating for our record or the early season blowouts though.

We suck, I don't deny that. The foul calls haven't lost us any games, except maybe the Pistons game yesterday but that was only 1 call, the TJ offensive foul that led to his ejection. If that didn't happen then it's an entirely different 2nd half. One call is not an excuse for a loss though.

We need an identity to help us with the officiating. Too often we try to emulate our competition and we get called for more physical plays because we don't have an identity of our own. I think that's the only way to change this. We need to find a style that we play well within and stick to that rather than making changes every other game. That way the refs learn who we are and what to expect. Maybe then we'll get a little slack.

It should be noted that those were all road games. I don't feel like the disparity seems to be quite as bad when we are playing at home.

 

[GatorAZ]

As a P12 fan I made up my mind a long time ago to never complain about officiating b/c it would drive me insane. So whatever happens, happens. I’m going to play dumb and hope for the best.

 

[1Sun]

Up until this road trip I didn't notice that bad of officiating but against Philly, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Detroit we couldn't get a call and it seemed our opponents were getting all the calls they needed to get back into the game. It's something that has been mentioned multiple times by multiple posters in each of those game threads. When I saw someone actually looked into a little further I thought it was worth sharing. I am not blaming the officiating for our record or the early season blowouts though.

We suck, I don't deny that. The foul calls haven't lost us any games, except maybe the Pistons game yesterday but that was only 1 call, the TJ offensive foul that led to his ejection. If that didn't happen then it's an entirely different 2nd half. One call is not an excuse for a loss though.

We need an identity to help us with the officiating. Too often we try to emulate our competition and we get called for more physical plays because we don't have an identity of our own. I think that's the only way to change this. We need to find a style that we play well within and stick to that rather than making changes every other game. That way the refs learn who we are and what to expect. Maybe then we'll get a little slack.

That will never happen with someone as passive as Kokoskov at the helm.

 

[AzStevenCal]

As a P12 fan I made up my mind a long time ago to never complain about officiating b/c it would drive me insane. So whatever happens, happens. I’m going to play dumb and hope for the best.

As a college basketball fan I came to the realization that not all college refs are involved in wagering on the outcome. Many of them but not all. As a rule, I think NBA refereeing is far more agenda-free even if they tend to favor certain styles, certain teams and certain players.

I don't think we're getting a fair break from the refs but I don't think we're being historically screwed either. We've earned quite a bit of the lopsidedness by not playing sound defense. And we're bad enough on our own that better officiating isn't going to significantly impact our win total. And in the end, whining about refs grows tiresome even if it's justified.

 

[Matt L]

The Spurs did tank - and you can find just as many articles claiming they did. D Rob could have played. They absolutely tanked games at the end of the season.

And they tanked for Robinson as well.

They tanked twice in a 12 year span...The Suns have been outside of the playoffs for 8-9 years and actively tanked for 3 straight...there is a difference

 

[1tinsoldier]

Two factors above all else here, and neither have to do with officiating:
1. The offensive "system" is over-reliant on passes along the perimeter, involves settling way too much for outside jump shots and does not employ drives or slashes to the hoop or pounding in the low post nearly enough.
2. Defensively, the fundamentals are very poor and there is way too much reaching and getting into defensive position way too late.

In other words, this historic statistic is yet another indictment on our historically poor coaching.

i'll go with that theory.

trying to ditch their soft reputation, with more effort than skill, they're picking up more fouls.

at the same time there is something going on with the referees this season and i can only assume it's a coordinated philosophy by the NBA to increase offensive output for entertainment ratings.

i've never seen so many fouls called that i didn't spot. i'm guessing fouls are up around the league?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Up until this road trip I didn't notice that bad of officiating but against Philly, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Detroit we couldn't get a call and it seemed our opponents were getting all the calls they needed to get back into the game. It's something that has been mentioned multiple times by multiple posters in each of those game threads. When I saw someone actually looked into a little further I thought it was worth sharing. I am not blaming the officiating for our record or the early season blowouts though.

We suck, I don't deny that. The foul calls haven't lost us any games, except maybe the Pistons game yesterday but that was only 1 call, the TJ offensive foul that led to his ejection. If that didn't happen then it's an entirely different 2nd half. One call is not an excuse for a loss though.

We need an identity to help us with the officiating. Too often we try to emulate our competition and we get called for more physical plays because we don't have an identity of our own. I think that's the only way to change this. We need to find a style that we play well within and stick to that rather than making changes every other game. That way the refs learn who we are and what to expect. Maybe then we'll get a little slack.

I just think we aren’t normally the aggressor. We don’t have that mentality. If we did and we acted that way consistently the calls would eventually shift. Unfortunately I truly believe that reputation plays a big role in how games are called.

 

[BC867]

Up until this road trip I didn't notice that bad of officiating but against Philly, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Detroit we couldn't get a call and it seemed our opponents were getting all the calls they needed to get back into the game. It's something that has been mentioned multiple times by multiple posters in each of those game threads. When I saw someone actually looked into a little further I thought it was worth sharing. I am not blaming the officiating for our record or the early season blowouts though.

We suck, I don't deny that. The foul calls haven't lost us any games, except maybe the Pistons game yesterday but that was only 1 call, the TJ offensive foul that led to his ejection. If that didn't happen then it's an entirely different 2nd half. One call is not an excuse for a loss though.

We need an identity to help us with the officiating. Too often we try to emulate our competition and we get called for more physical plays because we don't have an identity of our own. I think that's the only way to change this. We need to find a style that we play well within and stick to that rather than making changes every other game. That way the refs learn who we are and what to expect. Maybe then we'll get a little slack.

Excellent point. Until the Suns establish positions of power as their identity, we will be on the wrong end of bad calls.

It is well known that the instigators get away with a lot more than the relatiators. Plus, with very few exceptions, the Suns have to overcome a half century history of being soft. It has to start somewhere. Rather, it will hopefully start somewhere. Or sometime.