Defense

[Griffin]

After 10 games the Suns are giving up 105 PPG, worst in the league (109.3 over last 8). They are third-worst in NBA in field goal percentage allowed.

 

[jagu]

Michael Beasley can't play D at all.

 

[elindholm]

After 10 games the Suns are giving up 105 PPG, worst in the league (109.3 over last 8). They are third-worst in NBA in field goal percentage allowed.

Is their offense any better?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Michael Beasley can't play D at all.

He's not good but do you really think that's our problem out there? I think Scola and Dudley both leave a lot to be desired right now which is a surprise because they're both supposed to be smart, effort guys.

Steve

 

[SirStefan32]

He's not good but do you really think that's our problem out there? I think Scola and Dudley both leave a lot to be desired right now which is a surprise because they're both supposed to be smart, effort guys.

Steve

Scola is actually vastly overrated as a defender. He does draw charges, he does get some steals/ deflections, but he is not a good defender.

Not sure what Dudley's deal is. He is really struggling, even on defense. I think there is too much pressure on him.

Edit:
Having said all that, I do think Beasley is really bad- approaching the Steve Nash/ Hakeem Warrick level of bad.

 

[jagu]

Yea, Beasley is Warrick bad. Dudley is having a poor year. Scola is just smart but he isn't the greatest defender.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Scola is actually vastly overrated as a defender. He does draw charges, he does get some steals/ deflections, but he is not a good defender.

Not sure what Dudley's deal is. He is really struggling, even on defense. I think there is too much pressure on him.

I'm so glad to hear someone else say this. I have a deep dislike of Scola and it's tough for me to be unbiased when I watch him play but it sure looks to me like our defense gets better when he's off the floor. Now that he can't flop (or act), he can't even draw charges that well. He's not very quick so he has to take up position early and he can no longer rely on violently throwing himself to the floor to convince the refs he actually took contact. The problem is, instead of actually playing defense he still constantly tries to set up for that charge even though he's getting fewer calls.

Steve

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yea, Beasley is Warrick bad. Dudley is having a poor year. Scola is just smart but he isn't the greatest defender.

Nah, Beasley isn't in Warrick's class. No one is in Warrick's class. I know that Scola isn't the greatest defender but I think he's much more of a liability that he's being credited for. His mid-range shot and clever moves around the hoop are earning praise and hiding his ineptitude at the other end of the court.

Steve

 

[SirStefan32]

I think that Scola actually just doesn't have the physical atrributes necessary to be a good (or even average defender.) He is slow and clumsy. I think he knows what he should do and where he should be on defense, but he just can't make it happen. I believe Scola would be fine if we had no other wholes on defense (mainly Beasley), but if you already have a bad defender on your team, Scola's weaknesses become more obvious and a lot easier to exploit.

At the end of the day, Scola is what he is- a one-year rental that will have some trade value. I realize Harden is gone, but Scola would have been a very nice asset to include in a trade proposal to a team like OKC. I imagine we'll be able to get something for him next summer.

 

[jagu]

Yea Scola's issues are that he isn't gifted enough to guard some guys now.. It's not lack of a brain like Beasley.

 

[Phrazbit]

Scola is a pretty lousy defender. He makes some "cagey vet" plays here and there but overall he is going to get beat defensively on most nights, kinda like Nash.

But Beasley is in his own class on defense right now. Absolutely abysmal. And I agree with the Warrick comparison. Beasley just gets lost on rotations and frequently ends up guarding no one, and bites on up fakes like its going out of style.

Coming into tonight we were giving up 115.9 points per 100 possessions with Beasley on the court and 99.9 with him off it... and that stat probably got much much worse with monster game he gave up to Metta World War and the -19 he put up in +/-.

 

[Griffin]

Is their offense any better?

Not really, obviously. But so much has been made of our past defensive issues and their alleged main perpetrators that you have to ask why the defense seems to have regressed even further without them around. If Nash was such a defensive liability, you'd think that replacing him with a good defensive PG like Dragic should improve the Suns defense overall. So far, not the case. Maybe it's early and the Suns will still improve in that area, but I think people sometimes neglect the fact that good defense requires a complete team effort, not one or two defensive-minded players. It also requires having smart, high basketball IQ players, but the Suns are getting dangerously thin in that department. And winning helps too.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Not really, obviously. But so much has been made of our past defensive issues and their alleged main perpetrators that you have to ask why the defense seems to have regressed even further without them around. If Nash was such a defensive liability, you'd think that replacing him with a good defensive PG like Dragic should improve the Suns defense overall. So far, not the case. Maybe it's early and the Suns will still improve in that area, but I think people sometimes neglect the fact that good defense requires a complete team effort, not one or two defensive-minded players. It also requires having smart, high basketball IQ players, but the Suns are getting dangerously thin in that department. And winning helps too.

I think we will see some improvement but Beasley and Scola are worse defenders than Nash and it's hard to overcome two holes on D. I know that's part of your point, just underscoring it.

Steve

 

[elindholm]

If Nash was such a defensive liability, you'd think that replacing him with a good defensive PG like Dragic should improve the Suns defense overall. So far, not the case.

I don't study all of these "advanced metrics," but slinslin has been telling us for years that Nash's defense really isn't that bad. And most of this board hated Lopez, but he was clearly better defensively than the patched-together rotation at backup center that the Suns are trying to use now. Hill is gone. Frye's defense was underrated by this board. Overall, the personnel are worse defensively than last year's.

 

[jagu]

I don't study all of these "advanced metrics," but slinslin has been telling us for years that Nash's defense really isn't that bad. And most of this board hated Lopez, but he was clearly better defensively than the patched-together rotation at backup center that the Suns are trying to use now. Hill is gone. Frye's defense was underrated by this board. Overall, the personnel are worse defensively than last year's.

When you add Beasley, Scola to your starting lineup the defense automatically drops a lot. Dragic is a good defender but Beasley missing out on rotations, getting lost on plays has burned the Suns a lot. And Dudley looks slower than years past and his defense has also dropped along with his offense. Outside of Dragic and Gortat, no one else is playing defense.

 

[SirStefan32]

When you add Beasley, Scola to your starting lineup the defense automatically drops a lot. Dragic is a good defender but Beasley missing out on rotations, getting lost on plays has burned the Suns a lot. And Dudley looks slower than years past and his defense has also dropped along with his offense. Outside of Dragic and Gortat, no one else is playing defense.

Right, exactly. Replacing Nash with Dragic is great defensively, but replacing Hill with Beasley really takes all that away. Throw in Dudley's struggles so far this year, as well as Scola, and it makes perfect sense that the Suns defense is worse than it was last year.

 

[Phrazbit]

Its worth noting that offense last year was down across the league as a result of the lockout. There was some ugly basketball during the first month of the year and then all of the back to backs seemed to wear teams down.

 

[95pro]

Scola and duds lack of athleticism kills us. Hurts even more when they are in at the same time. Then add Beasley to that equation. The problem with Beasley is that he seems lazy, always seems to be caught flat footed. If you look at some of the good defenders in the league, you notice the feet never stop moving. Perfect example is MWP. It's definitely not a lack of athleticism, it's something mental.

 

[95pro]

love the work tucker has been putting in on D. seems like he flustered lebron for a little stretch there in the game last night. seems like they were jawing each other too.