Diamondbacks nearing crossroads with Paul Goldschmidt

[AZ Native]

More speculation about Goldy.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/spor...nearing-crossroads-paul-goldschmidt/97800456/

 

[Dude]

More speculation about Goldy.

http://www.azcentral.com/story/spor...nearing-crossroads-paul-goldschmidt/97800456/

I hate to say it but I would rather put the money in another ace pitcher.

 

[Bodha]

This is why Baseball is lame and dying. In what other sport do you regularly get rid of your best players? This is like that "Selling youre hair for a comb" (or whatever) idiom.

Arizona Cardinals: We need a WR and RG...lets trade David Johnson, thatll make us a better team!

Dumb and you deserve to be awful.

 

[DWKB]

This is why Baseball is lame and dying. In what other sport do you regularly get rid of your best players? This is like that "Selling youre hair for a comb" (or whatever) idiom.

Arizona Cardinals: We need a WR and RG...lets trade David Johnson, thatll make us a better team!

Dumb and you deserve to be awful.

Football has a hard cap and cheats its players out of their deserved share of the pie, so you don't have to trade your talent (but you sure let them go via FA), Basketball only needs 10 players to form a winning team, so an individual contributes a high percentage to the team wins and keeping them makes sense.

Baseball is more a team sport than basketball, but the players have a stronger union that generates higher salaries than football. So you need to balance the two (salaries and talent). That's why the farm system is so important, exclusive control of cheap talent before they get paid.

Goldy is not going to contribute to the next DBacks WS winner and he's on the downward slide of his career. He will get more expensive and less productive on average every year from here on out.

 

[Bodha]

Football has a hard cap and cheats its players out of their deserved share of the pie, so you don't have to trade your talent (but you sure let them go via FA), Basketball only needs 10 players to form a winning team, so an individual contributes a high percentage to the team wins and keeping them makes sense.

Baseball is more a team sport than basketball, but the players have a stronger union that generates higher salaries than football. So you need to balance the two (salaries and talent). That's why the farm system is so important, exclusive control of cheap talent before they get paid.

Goldy is not going to contribute to the next DBacks WS winner and he's on the downward slide of his career. He will get more expensive and less productive on average every year from here on out.

For the fact baseball has no cap, its even more illogical.

Sports with caps, it makes sense to get rid of the big pay guys, because you have to fill out a roster and dont want to spend all of your cap on one guy.


Baseball you can buy championships. Theres a luxury tax, but who cares so long as youre winning rings?

Other than ownership being cheap, there is positively no reason you have to get rid of big salary superstars.

Goldy is 29. Hes a young man in baseball where guys like Mark Teixeira are still getting paid at 37

 

[AZ Native]

Well said. The last paragraph is difficult to accept but it is true.

 

[DWKB]

Goldy is 29. Hes a young man in baseball where guys like Mark Teixeira are still getting paid at 37

Baseball players statistically peak at the age 27 as a group.

Let's look at Teixeira, he's really easy to parse:

Age 23-27 with TEX, put up a .901 OPS getting paid ($750k-$9M)
Age 27-28 with ATL put up a .943 OPS getting paid ($12.5M)
Age 28 with LAA put up a 1.081 OPS getting paid ($12.5M)
Age 29-36 with NYY put up a .822 OPS getting paid ($20.625M-$23.125M)

 

[overseascardfan]

ARZ is in a bad spot, they have no farm to build the team from and they are a small market team that can barely afford the team they have now let alone bring in other impact players to help immediately. Its hard to imagine a team that just signed a multi-billion dollar television deal is going to have to make some difficult payroll decisions soon. They didn't make the team better through FA so they are banking on the team just naturally being better than last year's. I think ARZ will have a fire sale at the deadline, I just don't see this team competing with LA & SF and having a Greinke on a 3rd place team division team at best is not practical if he puts up the same numbers as last year. Now if Greinke somehow puts up numbers he had in LA then that would change things or make his contract a little more movable, maybe even get a nice return for him. This team's success going forward will be tied to how well they draft, if they can't do that then get ready for perennial cellar dweller teams.

 

[Dude]

ARZ is in a bad spot, they have no farm to build the team from and they are a small market team that can barely afford the team they have now let alone bring in other impact players to help immediately. Its hard to imagine a team that just signed a multi-billion dollar television deal is going to have to make some difficult payroll decisions soon. They didn't make the team better through FA so they are banking on the team just naturally being better than last year's. I think ARZ will have a fire sale at the deadline, I just don't see this team competing with LA & SF and having a Greinke on a 3rd place team division team at best is not practical if he puts up the same numbers as last year. Now if Greinke somehow puts up numbers he had in LA then that would change things or make his contract a little more movable, maybe even get a nice return for him. This team's success going forward will be tied to how well they draft, if they can't do that then get ready for perennial cellar dweller teams.

IMO buy the Greinke's and develop the hitters.

 

[Matt L]

IMO buy the Greinke's and develop the hitters.

This sounds like a plan that immitates Theo Epstein's Cubs.

 

[GatorAZ]

Sell sell sell

No way is Goldy re-signing here.

 

[overseascardfan]

IMO buy the Greinke's and develop the hitters.

This sounds like a plan that immitates Theo Epstein's Cubs.

ARZ doesn't have CHI money, that is the issue. The price of aces will only continue to sky rocket, so unless ARZ has north of $200M to spend on a SP, they are going to have to go the OAK/TB route.

 

[Dude]

ARZ doesn't have CHI money, that is the issue. The price of aces will only continue to sky rocket, so unless ARZ has north of $200M to spend on a SP, they are going to have to go the OAK/TB route.

Trade Goldy for one. IMO better than paying him. That would give us two.

 

[Matt L]

2017 29 Arizona Diamondbacks $8,875,000 5.059
2018 30 Arizona Diamondbacks $11,100,000
2019 31 Arizona Diamondbacks *$14,500,000 $14.5M Team Option, $2M Buyout

He has a reasonable contract through 2019...I wouldn't mind keeping him till at least the trade deadline in 2018.

 

[DWKB]

2017 29 Arizona Diamondbacks $8,875,000 5.059
2018 30 Arizona Diamondbacks $11,100,000
2019 31 Arizona Diamondbacks *$14,500,000 $14.5M Team Option, $2M Buyout

He has a reasonable contract through 2019...I wouldn't mind keeping him till at least the trade deadline in 2018.

His reasonable contract is exactly why the decision needs to be made ASAP. The longer you wait, the less return you get. It's the worst of both worlds IMO to wait and THEN trade him.

 

[Phrazbit]

His reasonable contract is exactly why the decision needs to be made ASAP. The longer you wait, the less return you get. It's the worst of both worlds IMO to wait and THEN trade him.

True. IMO, unless we have a miraculous turn around, he goes in the table this June/July. I hate to see him go, he is a great player, great community guy and I think there are good odds his best season will be an upcoming one, but it won't matter if the team around him is trash.

 

[overseascardfan]

I can understand why Hazen might be tempted to see if this team can perform better than last years or maybe he thinks Goldy's value will skyrocket at the deadline with teams looking for an impact bat to put them over the top. But as painful as it would be, ARZ should at minimum get 3 MLB ready prospects in return, maybe more depending on how good a negotiator Hazen is. Now, if no one has made a strong offer then maybe that is why Hazen is being non commital on dealing him.

 

[DWKB]

I think there are good odds his best season will be an upcoming one, but it won't matter if the team around him is trash.

What makes you think that? Not saying he's sucking, but since mid June of 2015, he's been putting up a pedestrian (for Paul) line of .295/.408/.490/.898 in 1113 PAs.

 

[GatorAZ]

His reasonable contract is exactly why the decision needs to be made ASAP. The longer you wait, the less return you get. It's the worst of both worlds IMO to wait and THEN trade him.

He's kinda the position player equivalent of Chris Sale. Both have 3 years left on their deals and Chicago got the best prospect in baseball for him.

Not sure what contenders that could trade for Goldy have those caliber of prospects. Maybe Washington

 

[DWKB]

He's kinda the position player equivalent of Chris Sale. Both have 3 years left on their deals and Chicago got the best prospect in baseball for him.

Not sure what contenders that could trade for Goldy have those caliber of prospects. Maybe Washington

HOU, NYM, STL, TEX? I honestly don't know enough about other teams needs or their trade chips.

 

[GatorAZ]

HOU, NYM, STL, TEX? I honestly don't know enough about other teams needs or their trade chips.

Reyes needs TJ surgery and he was rated #1 last week... Bregman and maybe another 1-2 top-5 guys from Houston could get it done.

If Pollack looks good early I think Hazen could look to extend him if AJ wants security now. His bat may not reach his 2015 numbers but he'll always have value in CF.

 

[Matt L]

His reasonable contract is exactly why the decision needs to be made ASAP. The longer you wait, the less return you get. It's the worst of both worlds IMO to wait and THEN trade him.

I understand where you are coming from but I would hate to see him go before this season starts. If we have a complete dumpster fire in the first half I could understand looking at trade options.

 

[Matt L]

He's kinda the position player equivalent of Chris Sale. Both have 3 years left on their deals and Chicago got the best prospect in baseball for him.

Not sure what contenders that could trade for Goldy have those caliber of prospects. Maybe Washington

HOU, NYM, STL, TEX? I honestly don't know enough about other teams needs or their trade chips.

Another thing to think about is that we may be at a place where he's not as valuable to the rest of the league as we think he is. Don't get me wrong, he's a great all around player but look at where teams are going with 1B. Hanley Ramirez is in Boston, New York has a guy coming off of a shoulder injury and Chris Carter, a guy who was waived because the team was worried about an arbitration figure. Peak Pollock is probably more valuable then Goldschmidt to the rest of the league and we pretty much in the same spot with him as we are with Goldschmidt.

 

[Bert]

But, but,,, I like Goldy!

 

[overseascardfan]

HOU, NYM, STL, TEX? I honestly don't know enough about other teams needs or their trade chips.

I could see HOU or TEX being interested as he could eventually move to DH if necessary.

HOU - Martes, Tucker, Paulino & Riley Farrell
TEX - Mendez, Taveras, Guzman & Jurado