Draft Thoughts

[RugbyMuffin]

Free Agency is done for the Cardinals.

Going into the draft I fully expect to see Clarck Haggans, Monty Beisel, Bertrand Berry, and possibly Ralph Brown back in Cardinal red. Which I think is a good thing. All good situational and depth players.

I also expect to see Boldin and Leinart playing for the Cardinals next year as well. Free agency has dictated so.

Finally Wilson, and Dansby will be extended, and possibly Boldin.

That leaves the 8 picks for the draft, and some UDFA (getting a 6th or 7th comp. pick for Calvin Pace)

So pretty much we are going into the draft with the same roster, but without
Antonio Smith, Terrelle Smith, and Elton Brown. Terrelle Smith the only player who we do not have a replacement for YET. While Elton Brown's spot will be taken by Brandon Keith, and Antonio Smith's spot will be taken by Calais Campbell.

Cardinal Draft Needs:
QB - Not a need, and not going to be addressed in the draft.

RB - Look for the Cardinals to get a RB with the 31 pick in this year's draft, and where thinigs will get interesting is when, and where the Cardinals get there other running backs from. Possibly UDFA's or use that extra 6th or 7th to "take a flyer out" on a running back. I would be surprise but not shocked if the Cardinals don't take a stud RB in the first round, but they will not let two rounds go by without picking a RB.
(Cardinals use 1 or 2 picks for this position)

FB - UDFA all the way. The Cardinals have been looking to replace the fullback positioin with a bargin basement player. It is obvious with Warner coming back we will be passing a lot so it is not a big position to spend a lot of money

WR - Not a need, and not going to be addressed in the draft

TE - There are a lot of good blocking TE's in this draft that will be available in the 5 - 7 round area. Ben Patrick is a great pass catcher, and is ever improving on his blocking. What the need at this position is, is a strict blocking TE, and the Cardinals are going to go after one in the draft
(Cardinals use 1 pick for this position)

OL - It is always wise to pick up a good offensive lineman, and it is safe to say Lyle Sendlien is our starting center (which is not a bad thing). The Cardinals will probably pick up an offensive linemen somewhere in the draft, maybe two. The nice thing is that this is an area where the Cardinals can go BPA. They can go for a good value pick in the 3-7 rounds.
(Cardinals use 1 or 2 picks for the position)

DL - Like it or not. Barring some great UDFA signing, or some late round pick that comes out of no where Alan Branch is going to be part of the 2009 Cardinals. Once again I think the Cardinals are going to use at least one pick on a defensive linemen, but later in the draft and by using the BPA thought process. They will go with a value pick in the 3-7 rounds.
(Cardinals use 1 pick for the position)

OLB - This is the only other area of "need" on the Cardinals roster. Even if they bring Okeafor, Haggans, Berry, and LaBoy back they need to invest in the future at OLB. It is not out of the question that an OLB could be picked at the 31st spot, but I feel that will only happen if a big time player drops down to us. I think the 62nd pick in the draft (Cardinals 2nd round) will be an OLB. That being said I think the Cardinals will also look for another Chris Harrington type pick up as a "project" and groom into an OLB.
(Cardinals use 1 or 2 picks for the position)

ILB - The future of Ali Highsmith and Monry Biesel hang in the balance. I can see the Cardinals getting an ILB in the very late rounds, if they go strictly BPA at that point. They would probably look to pick up a ILB in the later rounds, 6 and 7.
(Cardinals may use 1 pick for the position)

DB - Signing Bryant McFadden has solidified the Cardinals secondary, IMO. Any draft pick in this draft, that is for a defensive back spot will be because he was the best player available. Whether it be a safety or cornerback that will be the situation. I could see a pick being used in the 6 or 7 rounds on a prospect with good measurables.
(Cardinals may use 1 pick for the position)


So the Cardinals draft should be a choatic structure that looks like the following:

Need a big time RB, and OLB within the first two rounds
Need to get a blocking TE in the first five round.
If we are looking at another OLB, get one in the first five rounds
Get a DL, or OL, BPA, in the first six rounds
Look for a steal at RB, ILB, DB, if the oppourtunity arises in the 6th and 7th rounds.

1st Round - RB#1 or OLB#1
2nd Round - OLB#1 or RB#1
3rd Round - OL, DL, OLB#2, TE
4th Round - OL, DL, OLB#2, TE
5th Round - RB#2, OL, DL, OLB#2, TE
6th Round - RB#2, OL, DL
6th Round - RB#2, ILB, DB
7th Round - RB#2, ILB, DB

Anyone want to try and put some names to those positions ?

 

[imaCafan]

Thanks for starting this thread. Was just looking at a bunch of mocks from here:

http://walterfootball.com/draftdata.php

I'm personally hoping Wells or Moreno fall to #31. But, if they are selected before us, and we don't trade up (won't happen) to get one of them, is LeShon McCoy or Donald Brown too much of a reach at #31? If we wait 'til round 2, is R. Jennings a good choice there? A mock or 2 has Brown at #63. That would awesome, yes? We need a RBOF......to go with TH....

 

[cgolden]

First, great write-up. Here's my thoughts:

- I think we'll still see a veteran running back brought in before the draft. We don't want Edge and he certainly doesn't want to be here. They'll sign another 30-something running back to take his spot, then draft a 1st or 2nd rounder to fill out the depth chart.

- I was hoping that they'd bring in another safety to push Francisco to strictly special teams but that appears to be a dying wish. Several decent safeties have signed very small, short term deals in the past couple of weeks and I'm thinking that's the #3 need heading into the draft.

- At OL and DL, I'd go strictly BPA with a slight lean to the offensive line. Both sides seem to be set at starter and at least have decent depth so if they don't draft a guy at either b/c there wasn't value when they picked, then so be it.

- Inside linebacker is the most intruiging position in my mind b/c I think if or when they draft an ILB will tell us how much they like their chances of locking up Dansby to a long term deal. For example, if they use a third round pick on a guy like Gerald McRath or Dannell Ellerbe then we might assume that Dansby's days are numbered. But on the other hand if they wait till the 6th round or 7th round or don't draft one at all, I think we can all rest assured that Dansby will be locked up.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Good Stuff.

As for the veteran RB you speak of, who is available ?
http://www.nfl.com/freeagency?icamp...r-position/players-list-links-position:pos-rb

I would love to see Duece McAllister in Cardinal red but he is injury prone, and mighty expensive.

I also like Jessie Chatman.

 

[cgolden]

Good Stuff.

As for the veteran RB you speak of, who is available ?
http://www.nfl.com/freeagency?icamp...r-position/players-list-links-position:pos-rb

I would love to see Duece McAllister in Cardinal red but he is injury prone, and mighty expensive.

I also like Jessie Chatman.

I'd take a run at either Warrick Dunn (first choice) b/c he'd be the perfect third down back and compliment to Hightower. He's the highest quality person as well and him and KW might just come up with a plan for world peace if they were on the same team.

Second choice would be Dominic Rhodes. Not near as sexy but he's a career backup who can catch pretty well and they wouldn't have to worry about him complaining about only getting the ball 5 times a game. Plus he's got plenty of experience protecting a highly immobile QB and running draws out of shotgun formation.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

I'd take a run at either Warrick Dunn (first choice) b/c he'd be the perfect third down back and compliment to Hightower. He's the highest quality person as well and him and KW might just come up with a plan for world peace if they were on the same team.

Second choice would be Dominic Rhodes. Not near as sexy but he's a career backup who can catch pretty well and they wouldn't have to worry about him complaining about only getting the ball 5 times a game. Plus he's got plenty of experience protecting a highly immobile QB and running draws out of shotgun formation.

FYI you are becoming one of my favorite posters on the board. Great insight.

Rugby this write up is awesome as well. I have been thinking about this in my head but its nice to have it written down to see.

I hope Urban is wrong and we bring in a couple other rotation/depth guys for the DL and OL and even RB (I like the Dunn idea provided we go with a back in 1 or 2.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Dominic Rhodes would never be brought in, I don't think he fits the organizations mold.

I think I am officially on the Warrick Dunn bandwagon.

http://www.nfl.com/players/warrickdunn/profile?id=DUN705495

Not a bad year for a 34 year old, 187 lbs running back last year.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

One more thing Rugby. I wouldn't use FA as an indicator that Boldin is coming back either. Both Clayton and King continue to say they feel strongly that Q will be traded and with the stockpiling that Philly is doing, it would be silly for them not to make a run. Esp with the cap space they have available.

I think the F.O. has let Q know that if he comes back it on their terms and I see his getting a little more compromising in that he might want to stay.

So I don't know whats going to happen but if the Cards get a Roy Williams bounty (which I see happening as the Eagles have the room and it will almost be to keep him away from NY as well) they will pull the trigger closer to the draft. Probably it will happen once pick #21 is on the clock and the Cards know who is available.

As much as we hate to see Q leave for what an extra #1 and #3 could mean to this franchise going forward I think it has to be considered. If they hit on 3 of those first 5 picks with starters at that point we are all of a sudden in Patriot/Steeler territory in terms of affordable depth and playmakers year after year up and down the roster.

 

[WildBB]

I'd take a run at either Warrick Dunn (first choice) b/c he'd be the perfect third down back and compliment to Hightower. He's the highest quality person as well and him and KW might just come up with a plan for world peace if they were on the same team.

Second choice would be Dominic Rhodes. Not near as sexy but he's a career backup who can catch pretty well and they wouldn't have to worry about him complaining about only getting the ball 5 times a game. Plus he's got plenty of experience protecting a highly immobile QB and running draws out of shotgun formation.

I would bring in Dominick Rhodes too. Wright from Clevland is only in his 4th yr. so he'd be a good possibility too. Chatman wouldn't be bad, but he's a little injury prone. Duece McAlister or DeSaun Foster could be a possibility too.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

I would bring in Dominick Rhodes too. Wright from Clevland is only in his 4th yr. so he'd be a good possibility too. Chatman wouldn't be bad, but he's a little injury prone. DeSaun Foster could be a possibility too..

I like that Foster idea. Especially if we go with a speed back like Brown in the draft.

Otherwise Moreno + HT + Foster might start to get a little redundant.

This happens every year. I start to get excited about a player that I really like that the mocks have falling to us that probably shouldn't - and inevitably we either pass on the person if he does fall or he gets scooped up alot earlier.

I really want Moreno but I should probably save myself the stress and just realize he ain't going to be the pick.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Both Clayton and King continue to say they feel strongly that Q will be traded and with the stockpiling that Philly is doing, it would be silly for them not to make a run. Esp with the cap space they have available.

While that is a possibilty, no doubt. Clayton and Peter King are two of the worse points of reference when it comes to the Cardinals.

Peter King is pretty much a East Coast football beat writer. If it is not on the east coast he spends no time looking into the facts. He proves it time and time again.

Clayton has been wrong on so many Cardinal issues that he has become a joke, IMO.

 

[WildBB]

Both Clayton and King continue to say they feel strongly that Q will be traded and with the stockpiling that Philly is doing, it would be silly for them not to make a run. Esp with the cap space they have available.

So I don't know whats going to happen but if the Cards get a Roy Williams bounty (which I see happening as the Eagles have the room and it will almost be to keep him away from NY as well) they will pull the trigger closer to the draft. Probably it will happen once pick #21 is on the clock and the Cards know who is available.

Philly has a lot of holes to fill still. With DeShaun Jackson coming along with Curtis and a very deep draft of WR's this year, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they held on and went with youth. They've also stated they don't feel pressured to use up their cap space in the changing economic environment.

If anyone makes a move it may be the Giants, and that would be unfortunate because even with their problems down the stretch, they still came into UoP and beat us. That's one deal I don't want to see this franchise make, because with the signing of Warner , we're ALL IN.

 

[cgolden]

FYI you are becoming one of my favorite posters on the board. Great insight.

Thanks.

Dominic Rhodes would never be brought in, I don't think he fits the organizations mold.

Why do you think he doesn't fit the mold? Considering our offense looks very much like the system they're running in Indy, I was thinking he might be the best fit. Plus he'd probably be the cheapest which would please the man writing the checks.

One more thing Rugby. I wouldn't use FA as an indicator that Boldin is coming back either. Both Clayton and King continue to say they feel strongly that Q will be traded and with the stockpiling that Philly is doing, it would be silly for them not to make a run. Esp with the cap space they have available.

I gotta agree with Rugby on King. He's almost irrelevant in my mind. I don't mind Clayton but I don't think either of them spends much time in Arizona talking to the Cardinals front office, so I'd take their insights with a grain of salt.

I know it's been said on here many times, but I think Warner and Boldin were basically a package deal. If KW came back than Q would be back, but if KW retired or signed elsewhere, I think we'd have seen a massive overhaul that started with Q being dealt.

 

[Urubu Rei]

Good Stuff.

As for the veteran RB you speak of, who is available ?
http://www.nfl.com/freeagency?icamp...r-position/players-list-links-position:pos-rb

I would love to see Duece McAllister in Cardinal red but he is injury prone, and mighty expensive.

I also like Jessie Chatman.

I would only look for a veteran, who could also be a factor in the return game.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

i also think the Cards will look hard at trading Boldin and adding 2-3 more draft picks.I'm fine with either keeping or trading him but from the Cards point of view they have to consider it. They haven't really mentioned Boldin in any of their plans,at least not at the top of the list. They drafted Doucet last year as an eventual replacement just like CC fro Smith. Breaston's development has to be taken into account. The fact that Cards won their 2 biggest games with Boldin being a non-factor is in the mix. And ,mainly,they can acquire a boatload of young, very talented players at positions of need who will be with the Cards for years and build a strong foundation for a long run at the top.

 

[cgolden]

I would only look for a veteran, who could also be a factor in the return game.

I don't think there are many options out there that fit that criteria. Here are your best options that have any experience in the return game:

Jason Wright: He's about to be 27 and with only 159 career carries he might not even be a 'veteran.' He's returned 5 kickoffs in his career with poor results (16.2).

Jesse Chatman: Five year vet with 212 attempts (4.5 avg) and eight career kick returns for pretty poor results yet again (18.9).

Tatum Bell: We all know about him and he's never returned kicks but with his speed, I don't know why he couldn't.

Aveion Cason: He might be the best option if you want a returner. He's got decent speed and has averaged 23.4 per kick return. He offers almost nothing on offense though and will turn 30 before the season starts.

Aaron Stecker: The former Saint has plenty of experience returning kicks but he's been phased out of the role the past two years (just 8 returns total) and his age (34) might have sapped all of his speed.

 

[Cards Czar]

Philly has a lot of holes to fill still. With DeShaun Jackson coming along with Curtis and a very deep draft of WR's this year, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they held on and went with youth. They've also stated they don't feel pressured to use up their cap space in the changing economic environment.

If anyone makes a move it may be the Giants, and that would be unfortunate because even with their problems down the stretch, they still came into UoP and beat us. That's one deal I don't want to see this franchise make, because with the signing of Warner , we're ALL IN.

But the WR comming have not played a down in the NFL yet. Are they proven? Cant miss? (see Det #1's that where supposed to be cant miss).

Boldin is a known commodity and also the Eagles have to spend at least 84% of there cap or they are in trouble with the NFL. Thats 20 mil that they have to spend.

I have a feeling that the NYG and the Eagles will get desperate and just might get into a bidding war for Boldin on or close to draft day. Just a gut feeling.

Philly sends #21, 85, 133= 1054 pts or NYG sends #29 ,45 = 1090 pts.

You never know on draft day.

 

[AntSports Steve]

I think you need to add Kick Returner to that list of players the Cards need to draft.

Breston is now a full time WR and his heart is not into punt return duty as much as it used to be. I just don't see him adding kickoff return duty back to his roles.

A late round speedster WR or a fast RB is needed needed to take over punter and kickoff returns.

 

[az jam]

Most wrs take several years to really do well in the NFL. The Eagles and Giants need an experienced wr to help their team this fall not a rookie. Lets face it Boldin is in his prime and a starting all pro bowl selection this past year. I like Boldin but if the Giants and Eagles get into a bidding war on draft day it would be to the Cards advantage to trade him.

 

[Assface]

I think you need to add Kick Returner to that list of players the Cards need to draft.

Breaston is now a full time WR and his heart is not into punt return duty as much as it used to be. I just don't see him adding kickoff return duty back to his roles.

A late round speedster WR or a fast RB is needed needed to take over punter and kickoff returns.

What are you basing that on? I can't recall any time during the season where I thought, "this should be an opportunity for a great return." I don't know if it was because our guys couldn't block their gunners or if it was opposing teams going for hangtime over distance but the coverage was on him by the time he caught the punt pretty much every time. My assessment is that he's still plenty motivated to be a good punt returner because as the season went on and he wasn't getting any good return opportunities, he started pressing and wasn't calling for fair catches even though he was getting hit right away.

I do agree that we need to add more returners to the roster, though.

 

[WildBB]

But the WR comming have not played a down in the NFL yet. Are they proven? Cant miss? (see Det #1's that where supposed to be cant miss).

Boldin is a known commodity and also the Eagles have to spend at least 84% of there cap or they are in trouble with the NFL. Thats 20 mil that they have to spend.

I have a feeling that the NYG and the Eagles will get desperate and just might get into a bidding war for Boldin on or close to draft day. Just a gut feeling.

Philly sends #21, 85, 133= 1054 pts or NYG sends #29 ,45 = 1090 pts.

You never know on draft day.

*Philly allready HIT last yr. with Jackson in the 2nd (just ahead of the C. Campbell pick). They probably feel with this 09 group they can land another. I would.


You make a point on them having to spend so much, we'll see what they wind up doing. They may extend some players yet.

But come draft day with all those holes they have, OT, L, WR, RB help ,
ect. it's gonna be hard for them to give up that 21. Come 28 it'll be more of a bidding war if we want to make it that. I'd tell them to give up 21 or we're going to the Giants for sure. Like you said draft day, you never know how it plays out.

 

[joeshmo]

Without a doubt our biggest need is pass D.

Pass attempts per sack - 20th
Comp % - 22nd
TD's allowed - 32nd - almost 10 more allowed then the 31st team.
QB Rating allowed - 30th
20+ - 12th
40+ - 24th
average - 22nd

We fixed the DB part with McFadden and DRC improving. But we still havent fixed the pass rush part. That doesnt mean the old 5 sack Berry or the 19 tackles 1 sack Haggans coming back either, it means we need a new infusion of speed, talent and youth. Bring back Berry but bringing back Haggans and his one and only sack just isnt needed or wanted IMO. 3-4 OLB is a huge need and we are pigeon holed into taking one in the first two rounds.

For the other position we take in one of the first two rounds it all depends. Are coaches willing to let Hightower grow behind better blockers and selecting a new center or TE. Or are they OK with the blockers and would rather build a two head RB system.

OUr biggest needs IMO.

#1 - Pass Rush - I dont care how they improve it, most likely a 3-4 OLB but if they can also do it with a DE as well and let CC continue to be a rotational guy it doesnt matter, just fix it.

#2 - Special Teams - One of the worst coverage units and one of the worst return units in the league. It is horrid when compared to the rest of the league. Bottom 3 in both catagories.

#3 - Run game - Better Blocking TE, better Interior OL, better RB, combo of the 3, what ever. Anyways I list this as the 3rd biggest need because our O is just fine with scoring points.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Without a doubt our biggest need is pass D.

Pass attempts per sack - 20th
Comp % - 22nd
TD's allowed - 32nd - almost 10 more allowed then the 31st team.
QB Rating allowed - 30th
20+ - 12th
40+ - 24th
average - 22nd

We fixed the DB part with McFadden and DRC improving. But we still havent fixed the pass rush part. That doesnt mean the old 5 sack Berry or the 19 tackles 1 sack Haggans coming back either, it means we need a new infusion of speed, talent and youth. Bring back Berry but bringing back Haggans and his one and only sack just isnt needed or wanted IMO. 3-4 OLB is a huge need and we are pigeon holed into taking one in the first two rounds.

For the other position we take in one of the first two rounds it all depends. Are coaches willing to let Hightower grow behind better blockers and selecting a new center or TE. Or are they OK with the blockers and would rather build a two head RB system.

OUr biggest needs IMO.

#1 - Pass Rush - I dont care how they improve it, most likely a 3-4 OLB but if they can also do it with a DE as well and let CC continue to be a rotational guy it doesnt matter, just fix it.

#2 - Special Teams - One of the worst coverage units and one of the worst return units in the league. It is horrid when compared to the rest of the league. Bottom 3 in both catagories.

#3 - Run game - Better Blocking TE, better Interior OL, better RB, combo of the 3, what ever. Anyways I list this as the 3rd biggest need because our O is just fine with scoring points.

Who is going to run the rock ?

Chris Vincent ?

 

[joeshmo]

Who is going to run the rock ?

Chris Vincent ?

"Are coaches willing to let Hightower grow behind better blockers and selecting a new center or TE. Or are they OK with the blockers and would rather build a two head RB system."

We didnt run the rock last year either and are O did just fine. Its why I put run game as our 3rd biggest need.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Aveion Cason: He might be the best option if you want a returner. He's got decent speed and has averaged 23.4 per kick return. He offers almost nothing on offense though and will turn 30 before the season starts.

Re-signed with Detroit, I believe.