Dual Center offense?

[jagu]

Rolo and Gortat? It would be the first time I can think of where we had two defensive minded centers roaming the paint. Frye could be wearing down from the tough defense on power forwards and returning him to the bench might invigorate his shot as well. He kind of looks like he has no power in his legs when he is shooting and who can blame him?

Rolo
Gortat
Hill
Pietrus
Nash
(Thats 4 solid defensive players around Nash)

Frye
Warrick
Childress
Dudley
Dragic

Peace out: Siler, Barron
Bench warmers: Lawal

All of a sudden the Suns look more of a defensive team than an offensive team.

 

[Mainstreet]

All of a sudden the Suns look more of a defensive team than an offensive team.

This emphasis on defense should really please Mojorizen7.

Maybe he might even give Steve Nash some slack.

 

[sunsfan88]

Yea I think we should do this too.

Gortat can play the pick & roll with Nash just like last year with Amare. And Lopez can continue to do what he does.

I have been sayin for a while that Frye should be on the bench, I'm glad someone else noticed too.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Rolo and Gortat? It would be the first time I can think of where we had two defensive minded centers roaming the paint. Frye could be wearing down from the tough defense on power forwards and returning him to the bench might invigorate his shot as well. He kind of looks like he has no power in his legs when he is shooting and who can blame him?

Rolo
Gortat
Hill
Pietrus
Nash
(Thats 4 solid defensive players around Nash)

Frye
Warrick
Childress
Dudley
Dragic

Peace out: Siler, Barron
Bench warmers: Lawal

All of a sudden the Suns look more of a defensive team than an offensive team.

I just can't envision that starting 5 in the kind of offense we run. Who's going to spread the court? Pietrus? By his lonesome? Unless Gortat is a real weapon from the 3 point line I don't see much room for Nash to do what he does best. And we can become a much better defensive team but I just don't see that truly coming to fruition while Nash is still the centerpiece of this team.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

I just can't envision that starting 5 in the kind of offense we run. Who's going to spread the court? Pietrus? By his lonesome? Unless Gortat is a real weapon from the 3 point line I don't see much room for Nash to do what he does best. And we can become a much better defensive team but I just don't see that truly coming to fruition while Nash is still the centerpiece of this team.

Steve

Was Amare a 3pt threat for us last year?

And Hill can spread the floor too. While he's not exactly a 3pt threat, hecan knockdown long jump-shots.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Was Amare a 3pt threat for us last year?

And Hill can spread the floor too. While he's not exactly a 3pt threat, hecan knockdown long jump-shots.

That's a fair point. However, Amare was a unique talent. His ability to score off his own moves, his deep mid-range jumper and his pick and roll finish put a lot of pressure on the defense. Hill has a nice mid-range game and Pietrus looks to be pretty fair from distance but I just don't see it having the same success with two centers clogging the lane.

Steve

 

[Chaplin]

Was Amare a 3pt threat for us last year?

No, but he certainly was automatic from 15-17 feet.

 

[sunsfan88]

That's a fair point. However, Amare was a unique talent. His ability to score off his own moves, his deep mid-range jumper and his pick and roll finish put a lot of pressure on the defense. Hill has a nice mid-range game and Pietrus looks to be pretty fair from distance but I just don't see it having the same success with two centers clogging the lane.

Steve

I hope Gentry gives it a shot though. Watching Lopez knock down that 10-15 jumper these past two games, makes me think that he can do it for the rest of the season.

If he can, then it won't be clogging up the paint. Nash can run the p&r with Gortat can if Gortat's not open, he can dish it out to the open man.

After watching 27 games of teams just out-muscling us in the paint, I think its about time we have some fun too.

 

[Chaplin]

Barron just got waived, so less competition.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Barron just got waived, so less competition.

Well, there goes my dream of a Steve Nash and 4 centers offense.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

Barron just got waived, so less competition.

First he trades away Clark.

Now they waive Barron?

**** you $arver!!!!!

 

[Mainstreet]

Barron just got waived, so less competition.

I'm glad the Suns are holding onto Siler, at least for now, because I think he is a project center with some upside. The Suns roster is now the league minimum of 13 players.

 

[desertdawg]

If we are some how redefining/remodeling ourselves to beat the Lakers, I like the recent moves and departures. If we can play "big" with Nash distributing the rock, I love the defense it brings.

I hope Lopez and Gortat can co-exist on the floor together, that would be good stuff.

 

[jagu]

I'm glad the Suns are holding onto Siler, at least for now, because I think he is a project center with some upside. The Suns roster is now the league minimum of 13 players.

Really? From what I've seen of Siler, I find him nothing more than D-League fodder. I wouldn't mind if they ditched him and got a 3rd point guard.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Really? From what I've seen of Siler, I find him nothing more than D-League fodder. I wouldn't mind if they ditched him and got a 3rd point guard.

He hasn't shown much but every now and then you get a glimpse of some raw talent. Slim him down and get him into great shape and he might have some value. I don't know if that kind of conditioning is in his makeup though.

Steve

 

[BC867]

Rolo
Gortat
Hill
Pietrus
Nash
(Thats 4 solid defensive players around Nash)

Frye
Warrick
Childress
Dudley
Dragic

The problem with that is playing our two power guys (Gortat and Lopez) side-by-side on the first team leaves the two light guys (Frye and Warrick) for the second team.

Ideally our two power players should cover the Center position at least 40 minutes per game. Frye might get some time at Center if we're playing a light team.

Conversely, playing our two lighter guys at Power Forward would allow the switch to both Centers if we are playing against a power front line like the Lakers.

I have been hoping for two defensive/rebounding/blocking Centers covering just about the whole game for a long time.

Maintaining balance, regardless of who is on the floor is what leads to championships, because substitutions won't represent radical changes in chemistry, regardless of who comes into the game.

 

[Mainstreet]

Really? From what I've seen of Siler, I find him nothing more than D-League fodder. I wouldn't mind if they ditched him and got a 3rd point guard.

Siler has good hands and a soft shooting touch. I also like the room he occupies in the lane. He looks to me like he has slimmed down. When he has played I find his problems tend to focus on learning where he needs to be on the court, a problem he should be able to correct.

 

[BC867]

Really? From what I've seen of Siler, I find him nothing more than D-League fodder. I wouldn't mind if they ditched him and got a 3rd point guard.

I've always believed that an NBA roster should always have three legitimate Point Guards and three legitimate Centers, so you always have two ready, regardless of injury or foul trouble.

Ideally, the 3rd Center would also be the 3rd Power Forward for the same reason.

All you have to do at the wings is run a 3-man rotation at the "2" and "3".

That's a team that won't take a major step back in case of injury or foul trouble, or even just a player out of synch or in a bad matchup.

 

[Mainstreet]

The problem with that is playing our two power guys (Gortat and Lopez) side-by-side on the first team leaves the two light guys (Frye and Warrick) for the second team.

Ideally our two power players should cover the Center position at least 40 minutes per game. Frye might get some time at Center if we're playing a light team.

Conversely, playing our two lighter guys at Power Forward would allow the switch to both Centers if we are playing against a power front line like the Lakers.

I have been hoping for two defensive/rebounding/blocking Centers covering just about the whole game for a long time.

Maintaining balance, regardless of who is on the floor is what leads to championships, because substitutions won't represent radical changes in chemistry, regardless of who comes into the game.

This is my initial take as well. I would also like to have a center on the court for near 48 minutes as possible. Lopez and Collins was about as close as the Suns came last season. It worked well for the most part. Frye can be a tough match-up at center when opposing teams go small or opposing teams front lines are not mobile.

 

[AfroSuns]

He hasn't shown much but every now and then you get a glimpse of some raw talent. Slim him down and get him into great shape and he might have some value. I don't know if that kind of conditioning is in his makeup though.

Steve

Maybe he can be our own Glenn baby

 

[BC867]

This is my initial take as well. I would also like to have a center on the court for near 48 minutes as possible. Lopez and Collins was about as close as the Suns came last season. It worked well for the most part. Frye can be a tough match-up at center when opposing teams go small or opposing teams front lines are not mobile.

I can't remember now if Gentry said recently that he wants Gortat and Lopez at Center for at least 40 minutes per game . . . or if that was just wishful daydreaming on my part.

And, I do believe that after three games or so with Gortat coming off the bench, Gentry will switch him to permanent starter at Center, to have the better pick-and-roll player alongside Nash and the lesser one alongside Dragic, who is not in Steve's class yet as a P&R Point Guard (but who I think will be much improved in the future).

 

[sunsfan88]

The problem with that is playing our two power guys (Gortat and Lopez) side-by-side on the first team leaves the two light guys (Frye and Warrick) for the second team.

Ideally our two power players should cover the Center position at least 40 minutes per game. Frye might get some time at Center if we're playing a light team.

Conversely, playing our two lighter guys at Power Forward would allow the switch to both Centers if we are playing against a power front line like the Lakers.

I have been hoping for two defensive/rebounding/blocking Centers covering just about the whole game for a long time.

Maintaining balance, regardless of who is on the floor is what leads to championships, because substitutions won't represent radical changes in chemistry, regardless of who comes into the game.

The second team is just a pure energy group. They shouldn't be having heavy guys. Running should be all that they do.

Lawal can probably play over Warrick to have an inside presence but I don't even think that's needed.

 

[BC867]

The second team is just a pure energy group. They shouldn't be having heavy guys. Running should be all that they do.

Lawal can probably play over Warrick to have an inside presence but I don't even think that's needed.

That may work on offense but, as you alluded to - then discounted, that covers only half of the action. Actually, less than half when you factor in offensive rebounds and setting picks.

If basketball (or hockey or soccer) were played like football, where your offensive unit is in the game only when you are advancing to the opponent's goal, you can succeed with a pure energy group.

It is why point-a-minute players, such as Leandro Barbosa, don't sustain. Their one-dimensional pure-energy offense is offset by their weak defense.

Playing your two big Centers together for part of the game, then not at all, is going to average out to mediocre -- a .500 team. That is exactly what we are. Now we have the bodies to move up.

 

[dodie53]

that dual center line up is slow

 

[sunsfan88]

That may work on offense but, as you alluded to - then discounted, that covers only half of the action. Actually, less than half when you factor in offensive rebounds and setting picks.

If basketball (or hockey or soccer) were played like football, where your offensive unit is in the game only when you are advancing to the opponent's goal, you can succeed with a pure energy group.

It is why point-a-minute players, such as Leandro Barbosa, don't sustain. Their one-dimensional pure-energy offense is offset by their weak defense.

Playing your two big Centers together for part of the game, then not at all, is going to average out to mediocre -- a .500 team. That is exactly what we are. Now we have the bodies to move up.

Yea but just because Gortat & Lopez start doesn't mean that one of them can't also play with the bench. For example put Lopez out like 6 minutes into the game and play Frye. Then play Lopez and sit Gortat for the first 7 minutes of the 2nd QTR. Then put Frye out and Lopez & Gortat are on the court together with Nash.

or something like that. I'm sure Gentry can figure out how to do it.