ESPN on Pace

[SeattleCard]

You guys see this?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=3268771

Pace is as good as gone in my opinion.

 

[WildBB]

It's gonna be a contract like 30 Mil. over 5 yrs. with 17-18 Mil. guar. That's what we're gonna be dealing with, to match it.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

It's gonna be a contract like 30 Mil. over 5 yrs. with 17-18 Mil. guar. That's what we're gonna be dealing with, to match it.

hell no. He isn't worth more than about 10-12 guaranteed. If he asks for that much, let him go.

 

[WildBB]

hell no. He isn't worth more than about 10-12 guaranteed. If he asks for that much, let him go.

Thankfuly it's not up to me and you. It's just what the market is. Just like with Fitz. I don't like what he'll get. No one is worth what they're getting nowadays.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Thankfuly it's not up to me and you. It's just what the market is. Just like with Fitz. I don't like what he'll get. No one is worth what they're getting nowadays.

Indeed.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

hell no. He isn't worth more than about 10-12 guaranteed. If he asks for that much, let him go.

I totally agree.

The guy wasn't even a starter at the beginning of the year.

 

[WildBB]

I totally agree.

The guy wasn't even a starter at the beginning of the year.

And obviously there are gonna be more GM's that disagree. He's what 27!

 

[dreamcastrocks]

And obviously there are gonna be more GM's that disagree. He's what 27!

Sure, Dallas can have him.

 

[cardsfanmd]

hell no. He isn't worth more than about 10-12 guaranteed. If he asks for that much, let him go.

I totally agree.

The guy wasn't even a starter at the beginning of the year.

You guys are hilarious. I like the both of you, you are so far off here it really isn't even funny. Keep in mind that for one, PACE WAS OUR BEST LB LAST YEAR. That is not my opinion either, it is a fact. Doesn't hurt his case that he plays the rarest hardest to fill position in the league.

The whole "he wasn't a starter" thing holds no water. Warner wasn't a starter when he won the league MVP. You know who was a starter? Terry Holt.

As an organization, there will be much regret when they lose a player of his caliber in order to overpay a damned WR.

 

[imaCafan]

I totally agree.

The guy wasn't even a starter at the beginning of the year.

Berry wasn't a starter before we got him. Look how that turned out....

 

[football karma]

the Cards paid Berry an average of $5 mm per year four years ago, and the same to Chike three years ago.

Wouldnt it stand to reason Pace is going to get more per year than those two?

 

[dreamcastrocks]

You guys are hilarious. I like the both of you, you are so far off here it really isn't even funny. Keep in mind that for one, PACE WAS OUR BEST LB LAST YEAR. That is not my opinion either, it is a fact. Doesn't hurt his case that he plays the rarest hardest to fill position in the league.

The whole "he wasn't a starter" thing holds no water. Warner wasn't a starter when he won the league MVP. You know who was a starter? Terry Holt.

As an organization, there will be much regret when they lose a player of his caliber in order to overpay a damned WR.

First Holt, now this. Dansby >>> Pace. Even Hayes = Pace He was about or 5th or 6th best player after, Dansby, Dockett, Watson, Rolle.

 

[DevonCardsFan]

You guys are hilarious. I like the both of you, you are so far off here it really isn't even funny. Keep in mind that for one, PACE WAS OUR BEST LB LAST YEAR. That is not my opinion either, it is a fact. Doesn't hurt his case that he plays the rarest hardest to fill position in the league.

The whole "he wasn't a starter" thing holds no water. Warner wasn't a starter when he won the league MVP. You know who was a starter? Terry Holt.

As an organization, there will be much regret when they lose a player of his caliber in order to overpay a damned WR.

Pace the on year wonder can go. You saw a crap load of players this year step there game up with a real coaching staff, Pace is not a world beater and I will not lose any sleep if he leaves. Just a couple seasons ago we were wondering if he would even make the team. I would rather see Dansby tied up to a Longer deal and Fitz get the moon, then to worry about Pace. Teams will fork over a crap load for a guy who had one good year, let him go, he doesn't need to make that much money on the Cards!!

 

[jefftheshark]

Now I see the Fitz situation for what it is:

The Cardinals have created a great excuse for not overpaying anyone in FA this year. When you look at players like Pace and compare the contracts they are going to get verses the warts on them, I think that we are better off not being forced to overpay for them.

When the first wave of FA craziness has past, I would guess that the Fitz deal is re-done and then Graves will have the cap space to start looking at the second wave of more reasonably priced "depth" players.

This at least makes some kind of business sense. And if Okeafor and Berry return to form, it makes a certain amount of football sense also.

On the flip side, however, the Cards could have extended Pace last offseason and had his services for a long time and on the very, very cheap.

That was both short-sighted and a bad business decision. But that, my friends is the mixed bag we get with Mr. Graves.

JMHO

JTS

 

[SECTION 11]

Pace is a talent, letting him go would be stupid.
I can't believe we 'kept our powder dry' for what seems like years only to be rewarded with this crap.

 

[Shane]

First Holt, now this. Dansby >>> Pace. Even Hayes = Pace He was about or 5th or 6th best player after, Dansby, Dockett, Watson, Rolle.

You just lost all credibility with your defensive evaluations saying that Rolle and Watson were better players then PAce last year. Just as cardsfanmd lost it by saying Pace was better then Dansby and Hayes.

Rolle had two good games and that was it. Watson was solid at DT when he was in there but he did not make the impact Pace did.

 

[Shane]

On the flip side, however, the Cards could have extended Pace last offseason and had his services for a long time and on the very, very cheap.

That was both short-sighted and a bad business decision. But that, my friends is the mixed bag we get with Mr. Graves.

No no no way do you extend Pace last year after the first 3 years worth of production he had. No way you could see that Okeafor would get hurt and would turn out that Paace blossoms into a VERY GOOD plaer.

They made the right choice. JMHO!

 

[cardsfanmd]

You guys are hilarious. I like the both of you, you are so far off here it really isn't even funny. Keep in mind that for one, PACE WAS OUR BEST LB LAST YEAR. That is not my opinion either, it is a fact. Doesn't hurt his case that he plays the rarest hardest to fill position in the league.

The whole "he wasn't a starter" thing holds no water. Warner wasn't a starter when he won the league MVP. You know who was a starter? Terry Holt.

As an organization, there will be much regret when they lose a player of his caliber in order to overpay a damned WR.

First Holt, now this. Dansby >>> Pace. Even Hayes = Pace He was about or 5th or 6th best player after, Dansby, Dockett, Watson, Rolle.

You just lost all credibility with your defensive evaluations saying that Rolle and Watson were better players then PAce last year. Rolle had two good games and that was it. Watson was solid at DT when he was in there but he did not make the impact Pace did.

yup

Just as cardsfanmd lost it by saying Pace was better then Dansby and Hayes.

I didn't say he was better than either of them. I said he was better than they were last year, and I'll stick to it. He played every game and was super consistant. Go look at the stats if you dont believe me, he outperformed the both of them.

Pace the on year wonder can go. You saw a crap load of players this year step there game up with a real coaching staff, Pace is not a world beater and I will not lose any sleep if he leaves. Just a couple seasons ago we were wondering if he would even make the team. I would rather see Dansby tied up to a Longer deal and Fitz get the moon, then to worry about Pace. Teams will fork over a crap load for a guy who had one good year, let him go, he doesn't need to make that much money on the Cards!!

I dont want to be mean, you just really dont know what you are talking about. 100tackles in a year is no accident. For the billionith time, ITS NOT PACE'S FAULT HE WAS DRAFTED BY A BUNCH OF IDIOTS WHO COULD N'T EVEN COMPREHEND WHAT SORT OF POSITION/SCHEME HE WAS MADE TO PLAY.

 

[jefftheshark]

No no no way do you extend Pace last year after the first 3 years worth of production he had. No way you could see that Okeafor would get hurt and would turn out that Paace blossoms into a VERY GOOD plaer.

They made the right choice. JMHO!

Of course I am saying this with the benefit of hindsight, however our Front Office has far, far more information to go on than we do and it is not out of the realm of possibilities that they could have foreseen this situation.

As I recall, there were some on this board who questioned Dockett's abilities and yet his extension turned out to be both a smart business and football move.

JTS

 

[Shane]

Of course I am saying this with the benefit of hindsight, however our Front Office has far, far more information to go on than we do and it is not out of the realm of possibilities that they could have foreseen this situation.

As I recall, there were some on this board who questioned Dockett's abilities and yet his extension turned out to be both a smart business and football move.

JTS

Yes but Dockett showed many flashes of dominance in actual games prior to the extension. Pace never did. Im right your wrong now deal!

 

[Duckjake]

I didn't say he was better than either of them. I said he was better than they last year, and I stick to it. He played every game and was super consistant. Go look at the stats if you dont believe me, he outperformed the both of them.

People just keep overlooking the fact that Pace is a natural 3-4 OLB but a weak DE. It's no surprise to me at all that Calvin played far better last season than in previous years.

It's just like Leonard Davis who is a natural G but not nearly as well suited to play left tackle.

If Berry wasn't over 30 and injury prone you could say we just can't afford 3 talents like Bert,Chike and Calvin at OLB. But Berry is and so you can't.

 

[imaCafan]

And if you extended him last year on the cheap and he starts to kick butt, it would be "re-do my contract" time.........how come it never works in the reverse, you know, "I suck and make too much money" and re-do then, saving money on a "bust"......

 

[dreamcastrocks]

You just lost all credibility with your defensive evaluations saying that Rolle and Watson were better players then PAce last year. Just as cardsfanmd lost it by saying Pace was better then Dansby and Hayes.

Rolle had two good games and that was it. Watson was solid at DT when he was in there but he did not make the impact Pace did.

COMPLETELY disagree. Watson was more than solid. You guys are using Pace's own standards when judging him. He more than doubled his entire career's production this year, and you guys are treating him like he had 20 sacks last year.

He was just solid, nothing more. Rolle did more in the "two games" than Pace did all year. If you don't think that Watson did anything this year, then neither of us have any credibility.

 

[Shane]

I didn't say he was better than either of them. I said he was better than they were last year, and I'll stick to it. He played every game and was super consistant. Go look at the stats if you dont believe me, he outperformed the both of them.



[/B]

ABSOLUTELY WRONG!

Pace:

Tackles 98
Sacks 6.5
Forced Fum 1
Int's 1

Hayes:

Tackles 99
Sacks 4
Forced Fum 1
Int's 1

Dansby: (All in only 14 games mind you)

Tackles 99
Sacks 3.5
Forced Fum 4
Ints 3

Pace had less tackles then both by one. Hayes had 4 sacks from his position in which getting pressure on the passer isnt his primary objective like it is for Pace. Pace only having 2.5 more isnt that impressive. They bpth had equal forced fumbles and equal Ints. and both played 16 games. I would at most call that a wash.

Dansby out tackled him forced more fumbles and had 2 more ints. He also had 3.5 sacks which is less. But overall his impact on the games based on the turnovers and sheer # of tackles in 2 less games makes him a helluva a lot more of an impact player.

Overall our LB's are pretty solid.

 

[Shane]

COMPLETELY disagree. Watson was more than solid. You guys are using Pace's own standards when judging him. He more than doubled his entire career's production this year, and you guys are treating him like he had 20 sacks last year.

He was just solid, nothing more. Rolle did more in the "two games" than Pace did all year. If you don't think that Watson did anything this year, then neither of us have any credibility.

I say that Watson was solid. Very solid. But he in no way was the player Pace was last year. I know they are hard to compare because of positon and responsibility.

Just because Rolle had two big games doesnt excuse his absolute horrid and inconsistent play in the other 14. To say he was a better player then Pace is quite simply off the hook.