Fanboy article pimps Iguodala

[Chaz]

First of all he misses an option in that the Suns could trade out as has been mentioned elsewhere on the board.

I really like Iguodala but I don't agree he should be the Suns pick. The Suns need a shooter and scorer or a big man. I am not sure Andre would be effective enough to be effective outside 15ft. He is a real athletic player but he seems like a guard version of Harvey to me in that he needs to get closer to the basket to be effective scoring the ball and he is not a natural point guard. If the Suns are looking at Iguodala as a PG then it seems there will be better option for that position at number 7.

I guess he makes some good points but Childress would be a better option if he lasts untill #7.

WTH is he talking about with wooing Steve Nash? Does anyone really think we should get Steve Nash?

I guess it is a good hometown article but I am not sure it is realistic.

Iguodala should be Suns' guy

FanBoy
azcentral.com
May. 27, 2004 03:51 PM

Who should the Suns select with the #7 pick? Devin Harris
Ben Gordon
Andre Iguodala
Josh Smith
Other

All the pingpong balls have bounced and the Phoenix Suns are right where they thought they would be – sitting in the seven hole of the upcoming NBA Draft.

Once Russ Granik opened up the big white envelope with a No. 7 printed on it, the speculation on what the Suns would do with that pick has begun. There are three options for the Suns: keep it and pick a player, trade up or trade down.

It is pretty obvious that trading up isn’t going to happen. The Magic would be crazy to trade that first pick since the selection of Emeka Okafor is the key to keeping Tracy McGrady happy for at least this season. And there really isn’t a player the Suns would be willing to trade up for after Okafor.

Unfortunately, I don’t see the Suns trading the pick, moving down or out of the first round. They are going to make some calls to GMs around the league to trade the pick, but there won’t be many takers. The first option would be to trade the pick, but it just doesn't seem likely that a team will be willing to give up anything of significance.

Bryan Colangelo and Mike D'Antoni have stated that they are not interested in getting any younger, so you figure the Suns won’t be risking their pick on any high school kids or European project. The logical choice for the Suns at this point would be selecting a player many fans around here are familiar with – Arizona swingman Andre Iguodala.

Iguodala has been rocketing up most teams' draft boards after showing some improvement in his shooting stroke, which was his glaring weakness with the Wildcats. Taking Iguodala at the seventh pick might be a reach, but at least the Suns would know more or less what to expect. Can we say the same thing about Martynas Andriuskevicius or Andris Biedrins? And anyway, the Suns should call a moratorium on selecting foreign-born players until one of them actually makes a shot in the playoffs.

The other options would be Devin Harris or Ben Gordon, but would the Suns really want to draft another point guard? The fact that they have Leandro Barbosa, Howard Eisley and presumably Milos Vujanic pretty much excludes Harris and Gordon from the Suns' board. The Suns are also going to try and woo Steve Nash away from the Mavericks and selecting another point would be useless.

The Suns’ most glaring weakness is in the paint but there isn’t a player in this draft that would be an upgrade over Antonio McDyess, if he is willing to come back for a lot less money, or Majec Lampe. The Suns need to address their problems in the front court through free agency because the cupboard is pretty barren when it comes to big men that can actually play.

Iguodala isn’t going to be a player that will make an immediate impact on the Suns, but aside from Okafor most of the guys selected in the first round probably won’t even start for their teams. Nonetheless, Iguodala is a player that can play a role on the Suns next year.

His versatility is a big asset and he can easily slip into the role of backing up Joe Johnson and when needed even provide some depth at the small forward and given his handle and court vision, he could also develop into an NBA point. He’d be an upgrade on Casey Jacobsen simply because he can actually play defense and would push Johnson at the shooting guard position.

It might not be very exciting but given the options the Suns can do much worse than adding a player who could turn into a solid NBA player. Taking Iguodala would be a good step heading into a summer where the Suns are going to be major players in the free agent market.

Reach FanBoy at fanboy@azcentral.com

 

[Chaplin]

Igoudala. Cannot. Shoot.

How many people don't understand those three simple words.

We can get a defensive swingman in Free Agency for cheap if it is one of our major needs. As it stands, it is not, so why is he even being discussed? Oh, because he went to Arizona, and he's probably the only player this guy knows anything abou.

 

[George O'Brien]

I am not totally opposed to Iggy, but I agree he is not really a good fit for what the Suns are looking for. However, I think he is a better fit than Childress.

It is hard for me to take this guys seriously after he states:

Can we say the same thing about Martynas Andriuskevicius or Andris Biedrins? And anyway, the Suns should call a moratorium on selecting foreign-born players until one of them actually makes a shot in the playoffs.

Since all three foreign born players joined the team this past season, it is simply a silly cheap shot.

Ironically, of the college centers (discounting Okafor who is really a PF), the best is probably Araujo who was born in San Paulo, Brazil.

 

[Errntknght]

George I didn't take that cheap shot to refer to the Suns players - I think he was talking about foreign players around the league. It has not been a stellar postseason for teams featuring foreign players - though SA did fine with them last year.

If we're going to bring Vujanic over then Iguodala doesn't sound like a bad choice even if he isn't much of a shooter. I'd rather see a tough defender getting Casey's minutes - CJ doesn't score a significant amount and his defense is an illusion. If we aren't getting Vujanic a PG would be a reasonable way to go.

The only 'big' we have a chance of getting that sounds appealing to me is Biedrins. All I have to go on is the second hand hype but at least it's hyping the right stuff - defense and toughness and size. If a guy can't hold his on defense he will get picked on relentlessly in the playoffs so he's essentially useless, even though you might sneak him on the floor a good bit during the regular season. That's why I didn't want Zarko last year and why I don't want Martynas this year.

 

[PhxGametime]

FG: .45 FT: .79 3PT: .32

Those shooting numbers aren't that bad. Iguodala is a premiere defender/passer/athlete in this Draft. Shawn Marion had worse #'s from 3PT coming into Draft - atleast a ton fewer 3PTers and from I remember not a great percentage. Iguodala is also a above average rebounder, good in steals, (size at guard, length) penetration skills, and scoring wasn't too bad with several NBA Prospects on team.

 

[slinslin]

Jason Kidd, TJ Ford... can't shoot lets draft Joe Crispin or Casey Jacobsen.

Not to mention all those players that didn't have a shot really and develloped it in the NBA. Jason Richardson, Michael Finley, Richard Jefferson and many others.

 

[Joe Mama]

Igoudala. Cannot. Shoot.

How many people don't understand those three simple words.

We can get a defensive swingman in Free Agency for cheap if it is one of our major needs. As it stands, it is not, so why is he even being discussed? Oh, because he went to Arizona, and he's probably the only player this guy knows anything abou.

A couple of months ago I was right there with you, Chap. I was opposed to drafting Iguodala because of his perimeter shooting. I do believe it's something that can be worked on however. It's not like he has terrible form. Besides, this article implies that he has been working on his shooting, and that's one of the biggest reasons he is flying up the draft charts.

I think Iguodala would be a lot like Shawn Marion was as a rookie. He's a very good dirt worker, but he has much better handles and passing skills. He's also better defensively.

Frankly if he is showing a lot of improvement with his shooting I wouldn't be surprised if he has taken before #7.

Joe Mama

 

[Freddie]

Today's insider says that Igoudala has an outsie shot at going #3 to the Bulls.

I'd post it, but I don't know how to copy it. They don't let you click on the page. Can anyone help me out?

 

[slinslin]

sunsfn will do that later I guess. He has gotten a bit sloppy posting insider however.

 

[Joe Mama]

Actually, I'm thinking the most important and correct piece of information in this article has nothing to do with Iguodala. I know I come up with different ideas and players I like every other day, but I've been saying for some time that most of us are overestimating the value of #7 draft pick in a trade. I agree with the Fanboy that the Suns are probably better off taking a player they like because what they get him a trade won't be that great.

Joe Mama

 

[George O'Brien]

The Insider piece was interesting. It led me consider the "Josh Howard Effect". Josh was a fine college player who somehow fell to the bottom of the first round and ended up playing like a lottery pick - better than several.

Guys like Childress, Luke Jackson, and Iggy may be benefitting from renewed respect for college players. Who knows, maybe next year some of these HS guys will consider going to college isn't such a bad idea after all.

 

[F-Dog]

Igoudala. Cannot. Shoot.

How many people don't understand those three simple words.

They said the same thing about LeBron last year. For that matter, we were saying the same thing about Joe Johnson a few months ago.

Like LeBron, Joe J, Richard Jefferson, etc., Iguodala's shot will get better as he starts to play more and shoot more. On the Suns, that will probably take a couple of years, but so what?



George, the college guys moved up to the top last year, too; remember how far Barbosa and Lampe dropped? IMO, it's not a matter of renewed respect for college players by pro personnel people as much as continued disrespect for college players by the mock draft people.

 

[Chaplin]

They said the same thing about LeBron last year. For that matter, we were saying the same thing about Joe Johnson a few months ago.

Like LeBron, Joe J, Richard Jefferson, etc., Iguodala's shot will get better as he starts to play more and shoot more. On the Suns, that will probably take a couple of years, but so what?

It matters if you actually care about winning a championship. All many on this board care about is drafting average young players and watching them develop for 3 years. Then after 3 years, we acquire more young players and watch THEM develop for 3 years.

That's a college team, not a team in the NBA looking to win a championship.

 

[Joe Mama]

It matters if you actually care about winning a championship. All many on this board care about is drafting average young players and watching them develop for 3 years. Then after 3 years, we acquire more young players and watch THEM develop for 3 years.

That's a college team, not a team in the NBA looking to win a championship.

I'm lost. You want the Phoenix Suns to take a big man in the draft, but all of them are reportedly several years from being real contributors in the NBA. You told us that drafting the most ready players (Iguodala, Gordon, Harris) is a terrible mistake, and they had to draft a frontcourt player. Now you're saying that most of us only care about drafting players that will take three years to develop.

I don't think anybody would argue that if there is a big man available at #7 who the Phoenix Suns believe will develop into a good, solid center or frontcourt player and they should take him. However if all the big men they like are off the board why not take a point guard or swingman they really like? I'm not understanding.

Joe Mama

 

[George O'Brien]

Unless they trade it, they have to take somebody.

Actually, I am not sure there is going to be a really good choice at #7. I like Biedrins, but he not only might not be available, he might not be ready to contribute right away even if he is. Chap is right, the Suns cannot afford a team full of "promising youngsters" who aren't ready to produce.

At the same time, I'm not ready to buy the theory that the Suns should takie Harris or Gordon because the other options are worse. I am not convinced either of these guys is ready to be an NBA point guard right away, so it means just one more "point guard in training".

It strikes me that the one thing team workouts don't test is the ability to run a team from the point. Combo guards that did not have that experience are just guesses (btw, Kirt Heinrich played PG his first two years at Kansas). Working the guys out won't tell anything about running a team.

Some people have suggested that Iggy might be convented to PG. I have not seen enough of his play to know if that is just wishful thinking or a real possibility. Is Gordon a better PG prospect, or is it just that he is shorter so he must be a PG? I honestly don't know.

 

[Chaplin]

I'm not understanding.

Joe Mama

That's the understatement of the year.

I actually don't want the draft pick at all. I want to use it to get rid of a bloated contract (preferably Eisley, but more realistically Jahidi) or use it in some other capacity.

I know you've softened to just about every single player in the draft, but I still think it's not very good. My pick would be Biedrins, but outside of him, I could care less who is available at #7. And I say that with knowing virtually nothing about him. If we HAVE to make the pick, I'd say Biedrins, but I say trade.

But, of course, you are bound to come back with your "draft pick isn't worth anything" arguement, and you may be right, but what we get with the pick probably wouldn't be any better than what we could possibly trade with it. If it helps us add 6 million dollars to our salary cap number, then I'm all for it.

 

[Joe Mama]

The Phoenix Suns do not need a pure point guard. They need a point guard who can knockdown open shots and break down opposing defenses in the half-court set. Barbosa can knock down the open shots around the three-point line, but he showed very little as a playmaker. Both Harris and Gordon fit this bill, and they are both solid defenders.

Iguodala is a point guard like Joe Johnson is.

Joe Mama

 

[F-Dog]

It matters if you actually care about winning a championship. All many on this board care about is drafting average young players and watching them develop for 3 years. Then after 3 years, we acquire more young players and watch THEM develop for 3 years.

That's a college team, not a team in the NBA looking to win a championship.

Are you implying that Amare Stoudemire is "average"?


In any case, your logic is flawed. Drafting young players and competing for championships are not mutually exclusive, as Detroit, Indiana and San Antonio have proved.


(Thx for the spelling tip, slin.)

 

[slinslin]

Are you implying that Amare Stoudamire is "average"?

Definately not Amare Stoudemire.

 

[elindholm]

In any case, your logic is flawed. Drafting young players and competing for championships are not mutually exclusive, as Detroit, Indiana and San Antonio have proved.

His logic may be flawed, but your "proof" isn't much better. Only the Spurs are a valid example, and they had the good fortune to draft both Robinson and Duncan with #1 overall picks.

The Pacers' key players are O'Neal and Artest, both of whom they acquired in trade. And the Pistons' key players are Wallace, Wallace, and Hamilton, none of whom was drafted by the team.

 

[F-Dog]

In any case, your logic is flawed. Drafting young players and competing for championships are not mutually exclusive, as Detroit, Indiana and San Antonio have proved.

His logic may be flawed, but your "proof" isn't much better. Only the Spurs are a valid example, and they had the good fortune to draft both Robinson and Duncan with #1 overall picks.

The Pacers' key players are O'Neal and Artest, both of whom they acquired in trade. And the Pistons' key players are Wallace, Wallace, and Hamilton, none of whom was drafted by the team.

All three teams kept drafting projects once their core was in place, though, and it didn't seem to prevent them from competing for championships.

 

[slinslin]

All three teams kept drafting projects once their core was in place, though, and it didn't seem to prevent them from competing for championships.

Not really.

Tony Parker didn't turn out to be a project.
Ginobili was drafted a long time before he came to the league.

Indiana drafted Harrington and Bender before they got their key players. Their latest picks were Fred Jones and Jamaal Tinsley. Not projects.

Detroit passing up on Carmelo is generally looked at as a stupid decison. And other than Milicic what projects did they draft? None.
Only some rather "old" Euros and Tayshaun Prince.

Except for Milicic and Bender none of their draft picks were high lottery picks either. Bender was drafted at a time Indiana rebuilt their team.
If you are drafting at #20-30 taking a risk on a project is much easier anyway.

 

[F-Dog]

Not really.

Tony Parker didn't turn out to be a project.
Ginobili was drafted a long time before he came to the league.

Indiana drafted Harrington and Bender before they got their key players. Their latest picks were Fred Jones and Jamaal Tinsley. Not projects.

Detroit passing up on Carmelo is generally looked at as a stupid decison. And other than Milicic what projects did they draft? None.
Only some rather "old" Euros and Tayshaun Prince.

Except for Milicic and Bender none of their draft picks were high lottery picks either. Bender was drafted at a time Indiana rebuilt their team.
If you are drafting at #20-30 taking a risk on a project is much easier anyway.

San Antonio was a contender long before last year, though. Same with Indiana--they were a contender when they traded to draft Bender and drafted Al Harrington; they didn't 'rebuild' until they traded for JO.

Detroit also has Carlos Delfino, who hasn't played a minute for them yet. Whether Carmelo would have been better is irrelevant--they're out there scrapping for the finals anyway.

 

[George O'Brien]

One of the things I get from looking at Indiana and Detroit is how important it is to be able to evaluate personnel. With the exception of Sheed, none of their traded-for players were stars when they picked them up. In every case, they exploited teams which lacked to patience or vision to develop their players effectively.

Trading "name players" like Jalen Rose for "who's he" players can work out well if you know what you are doing: "Traded by the Pacers with Travis Best, Norman Richardson, and a second-round draft pick to the Chicago Bulls for Brad Miller, Ron Mercer, Ron Artest and Kevin Ollie on 2/19/02."