For all you wanting Whiz fired.

[CtCardinals78]

Absolutely, positively would NOT have. The Bidwill's showed no spine & caved to a relatively young & ignorant fan base. They have NO leverage without a QB to lure a decent replacement now. Especially with the crappy reputation that this franchise is so deserving of. What self-respecting legitimate coach wants to come to an Organization that just fired their winningest coach who took them to the only SB that they've ever sniffed?? I know I wouldn't. The Bidwills f----- up again! I'm too old to go through this crap again. This move today will set this franchise back at least a decade, probably more.

First of all this winningest coach talk is garbage. His win % with the Cards was .473. That's garbage. Secondly just because fans don't agree with your line of thinking doesn't make them "ignorant".

 

[Assface]

I think Whiz can go to a team like Chicago that already has most of the pieces in place and win. I don't think he can build a team up, though. He's just wasn't the right coach for us anymore.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think Whiz can go to a team like Chicago that already has most of the pieces in place and win. I don't think he can build a team up, though. He's just wasn't the right coach for us anymore.

Chicago would be a good fit for Whiz. He's already got decent pieces of offense and a solid D. His "system" would probably work there with a good QB, a dynamite WR and a good running back.

 

[PACardsFan]

First of all this winningest coach talk is garbage. His win % with the Cards was .473. That's garbage. Secondly just because fans don't agree with your line of thinking doesn't make them "ignorant".

The facts are the facts. Whiz is the winningest coach in Cardinal History. To think otherwise IS ignorant.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

It absolutely does. I may want to get rid of my Mustang II, but if all I can replace it with is a Yugo, getting rid of the pony is a mistake.

If the Mustang can't start up and drive then what you do?

Sent from Rugbymuffin's Super Phone

 

[CtCardinals78]

The facts are the facts. Whiz is the winningest coach in Cardinal History. To think otherwise IS ignorant.

He sure is with a .473 win percentage. Not that great and his cons greatly outweighed his pros.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The facts are the facts. Whiz is the winningest coach in Cardinal History. To think otherwise IS ignorant.

let me ask you this. what would it have taken in the future for you to believe it was time to move on from Whiz?

 

[CtCardinals78]

let me ask you this. what would it have taken in the future for you to believe it was time to move on from Whiz?

Nothing silly. He's the winningest coach in Cardinals history and took the Cardinals to the Super Bowl. He should have gotten a lifetime contract and to think otherwise is ignorant.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

The facts are the facts. Whiz is the winningest coach in Cardinal History. To think otherwise IS ignorant.

Correct.

Facts are facts.

6, 7 & 9 game losing streaks. Longest losing streak in AZ history.
No success without Kurt Warner
Never put together a decent offensive linr
Never found a QB

Facts.

If Whiz didn't deserve to get fired then why did he do so much to warrant it?

If Whiz is such a good coach then why did he lose so much?





Sent from Rugbymuffin's Super Phone

 

[CtCardinals78]

Correct.

Facts are facts.

6, 7 & 9 game losing streaks. Longest losing streak in AZ history.
No success without Kurt Warner
Never put together a decent offensive linr
Never found a QB

Facts.

If Whiz didn't deserve to get fired then why did he do so much to warrant it?

If Whiz is such a good coach then why did he lose so much?





Sent from Rugbymuffin's Super Phone

18-30 record since Warner retired

Failure to develop 6 QBs in three years

Failure to develop fix Oline

Failed to win the division in 2010 with playoff roster Seattle won with 7-9 record

But don't let a silly thing like the facts get in the way.

 

[82CardsGrad]

18-30 record since Warner retired

Failure to develop 6 QBs in three years

Failure to develop fix Oline

Failed to win the division in 2010 with playoff roster Seattle won with 7-9 record

But don't let a silly thing like the facts get in the way.

Seriously, after 6 years our offense is left with what? 2 WR's in Fitz and Floyd, and that is literally it! Incredible...

 

[Folster]

The reason Whiz needed to be fired struck me last night while watching the Redskins-Cowboy game. Had the Cardinals drafted RG3, Whiz would not have automatically named RG3 the starter. He would have incredulously stated that he would have to compete with Skelton and whoever else for the starting spot. We likely would have still had Skelton starting the season with RG3 as his back-up and he never would have tailored the offensive game plan around his strengths like Shanahan, because "the system works".

Whiz seems to have disdain/jealousy for the highly touted, superior talented player. He has no problem giving the UFA or late round pick a shot at the job, but the stud All American has to pay his dues. It happened with Patrick Peterson, Michael Floyd, Matt Leinart and many others. Maybe it has to do with the type of player Whiz was, the overachiever who had to bust his ass for everything he got in football. It's one of the main reason why he's not coaching here anymore.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The reason Whiz needed to be fired struck me last night while watching the Redskins-Cowboy game. Had the Cardinals drafted RG3, Whiz would not have automatically named RG3 the starter. He would have incredulously stated that he would have to compete with Skelton and whoever else for the starting spot. We likely would have still had Skelton starting the season with RG3 as his back-up and he never would have tailored the offensive game plan around his strengths like Shanahan, because "the system works".

Whiz seems to have disdain/jealousy for the highly touted, superior talented player. He has no problem giving the UFA or late round pick a shot at the job, but the stud All American has to pay his dues. It happened with Patrick Peterson and Matt Leinart and many others. Maybe it has to do with the type of player Whiz was, the overachiever who had to bust his ass for everything he got in football. It's one of the main reason why he's not coaching here anymore.

yeah, listening to what Shanahan did with his offense is what separates a good coach from a GREAT one. apparently, after drafting RG3, Shanahan and his offensive coaches just POURED over film of the read spread offense and completely rewrote their playbook. Adjusting his offense for the players he had. Wiz just never bothered to even CONSIDER this apparently. it's what separates the men from the boys. The ability to know that you aren't all knowing and that you can adapt. Wiz couldn't do that and couldn't identify for the life of him the talent needed to build even a mediocre offense in three years, so he's dunzo. simple as that.

 

[PACardsFan]

let me ask you this. what would it have taken in the future for you to believe it was time to move on from Whiz?

A very fair question. I firmly believe that multiple injuries on the offensive side of the ball completely derailed what could have been a playoff season. I would give Whisenhunt the benefit of the doubt based on how they finished strong last year & where they were heading this year before the injuries made it impossible for the offense to do anything. I would have given Whiz one more year and not given him ANY EXCUSES next year. None. That being said, I defintely wanted Grimm & Miller gone THIS year. We'll never know, but Whiz probably nixed that option, which resulted in his firing. If he truly did nix that option, then I'm fine with what went down. I could not stand another year of Russ Grimm!

 

[Cheesebeef]

A very fair question. I firmly believe that multiple injuries on the offensive side of the ball completely derailed what could have been a playoff season. I would give Whisenhunt the benefit of the doubt based on how they finished strong last year & where they were heading this year before the injuries made it impossible for the offense to do anything. I would have given Whiz one more year and not given him ANY EXCUSES next year. None. That being said, I defintely wanted Grimm & Miller gone THIS year. We'll never know, but Whiz probably nixed that option, which resulted in his firing. If he truly did nix that option, then I'm fine with what went down. I could not stand another year of Russ Grimm!

yeah... you know I differ with you on the injuries thing since wiz constructed a roster full of guys held together with pins and needles in the first place, but the above isn't completely ridiculous. I just don't understand how can just lambaste anyone who thinks it was time to go as idiots and ignorant and that this is the worst decision of all time when you yourself believe that he should have only gotten one more year.

 

[red desert]

Wiz is gone.

 

[PACardsFan]

yeah, listening to what Shanahan did with his offense is what separates a good coach from a GREAT one. apparently, after drafting RG3, Shanahan and his offensive coaches just POURED over film of the read spread offense and completely rewrote their playbook. Adjusting his offense for the players he had. Wiz just never bothered to even CONSIDER this apparently. it's what separates the men from the boys. The ability to know that you aren't all knowing and that you can adapt. Wiz couldn't do that and couldn't identify for the life of him the talent needed to build even a mediocre offense in three years, so he's dunzo. simple as that.

Not exactly a fair analogy. Whiz has never had a dynamic athlete like RG3. You really don't know what Whiz could do with a stud like RG3. Let's not gorget that Shanahan failed miserably with EVERY QB he every had whose name wasn't Elway. Don't all of a sudden make Shanahan out to be a genius developing a gameplan for RG3. Cowherd was discussing earlier that Shanahan dumbed down his offense to 2 simple reads for RG3. That as opposed to Luck, who had 5 reads. The key to the Skins this year was Morris. Now, I'll give Shanahan credit for the running scheme, because that's always been his forte.

 

[Red Dawn]

We'll never know, but Whiz probably nixed that option, which resulted in his firing. If he truly did nix that option, then I'm fine with what went down. I could not stand another year of Russ Grimm!

Per Mikey's interview Whiz was not given the option.

 

[red desert]

Not exactly a fair analogy. Whiz has never had a dynamic athlete like RG3. You really don't know what Whiz could do with a stud like RG3. Let's not gorget that Shanahan failed miserably with EVERY QB he every had whose name wasn't Elway. Don't all of a sudden make Shanahan out to be a genius developing a gameplan for RG3. Cowherd was discussing earlier that Shanahan dumbed down his offense to 2 simple reads for RG3. That as opposed to Luck, who had 5 reads. The key to the Skins this year was Morris. Now, I'll give Shanahan credit for the running scheme, because that's always been his forte.

Because he passed on AP. In many ways, you make your own luck.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Per Mikey's interview Whiz was not given the option.

I saw that mentioned a few times but never saw a quote. Did he actually state this or did he say something that led people to this conclusion? I know he said he'd decided to let him go last night but that certainly doesn't preclude the possibility that Mike and Ken discussed a change in his authority at some earlier time (following the 58-0 drubbing for example).

Steve

 

[gmabel830]

I saw that mentioned a few times but never saw a quote. Did he actually state this or did he say something that led people to this conclusion? I know he said he'd decided to let him go last night but that certainly doesn't preclude the possibility that Mike and Ken discussed a change in his authority at some earlier time (following the 58-0 drubbing for example).

Steve

He was asked directly if he gave Whiz the option of staying with less personnel control, and he answered no. But honestly, who knows? MB came out with an air of authority/very firm in his decision, but would it have instilled any confidence if he would have said "I gave Whiz the option to make changes and stay aboard, and he told me to take the job and shove it up my ass"?

 

[AzStevenCal]

He was asked directly if he gave Whiz the option of staying with less personnel control, and he answered no. But honestly, who knows? MB came out with an air of authority/very firm in his decision, but would it have instilled any confidence if he would have said "I gave Whiz the option to make changes and stay aboard, and he told me to take the job and shove it up my ass"?

Thanks for the comment. Your interpretation (or possible interpretation) makes sense.

Steve

 

[Red Dawn]

That's the gist of it. I think the whole press conference will probably be on arizonacardinals.com by tomorrow.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Then name some names. I feel pretty confident in my evaluation of Whis. He's maybe a Top 10 coach in the NFL right now. Easily Top 15. He has the respect of the rest of the league, unless you think that should he get fired he'd have to settle for a position coach job like Dave McGinnis did.

If Whiz is so good then why does he lose so much?

Sent from Rugbymuffin's Super Phone

 

[PACardsFan]

yeah... you know I differ with you on the injuries thing since wiz constructed a roster full of guys held together with pins and needles in the first place, but the above isn't completely ridiculous. I just don't understand how can just lambaste anyone who thinks it was time to go as idiots and ignorant and that this is the worst decision of all time when you yourself believe that he should have only gotten one more year.

Cheesebeef, it's called loyalty for me. I'm not sure enough of the posters on this forum have been Cardinal fans long enough to have experienced the entire Cardinal struggle. I started watching the Cardinals in 1963. The Cardinals had some decent teams in St. Louis during the 60's, 70's and even 80's. They were always so close to turning the corner. The Bidwill's ALWAYS made a horrible hire/fire that would set us back. In the mid 60's we had some decent teams coached by Charley Winner. It was tougher to make the playoffs then & we just missed with records like 9-4-1, 8-5-1, 8-5-1. Granted, somewhere in the middle of that he had a 4-9-1 season. He was fired after his last 8-5-1 season. We then proceeded to go 4-9-1 the next 3 years.

In the mid 70's, Air Coryell came along & we went 10-4, 11-3, 10-4. After ONE bad season of 7-7, he was fired. We then sucked for the next 3-4 years. Jim Hanifan then came along & had a few nice seasons with Lomax until he was fired & Stallings came on board. Stallings was a decent HC & should have been around longer than he was. Even Joe Bugel, who had 3 horrible season looked to have the Cardinals turned around & yet he was fired to bring in the blowhard Ryan. You know the rest.

The night the Cardinals beat the Eagles in the NFC Championship game was like no other. My Parents & I openly wept with joy. The struggle was so long & so painful that all I could do was cry when 9-0 hit the ground & the clock ran out. After all the bs Bidwill decisions, someone named Whiz made me cry tears of joy. I swore that I would always give him the benefit of the doubt. I'm not saying that Whiz was perfect, but I believe he deserved one more season. Had he not started 4-0, I'd be ok with this. I just think that with a litlle bit of health, we would have been a playoff team. I think he deserved one last shot with a healthier lineup. Sorry for the length of this.