Front Page Article: Can the Cardinals Win Keeping Status Quo?

[Mitch]

Big question...I offer an overview and some answers. I'll be very interested to hear yours.

 

[Stout]

Mitch, that was an excellently written piece...well done! I disagree with a few points, but overall, you hit the nail on the head.

Item: We will not win with our mix of pass rushers, even if we keep Pace. We need at least another skilled rusher to help pressure the QB, and keep pressure off the secondary.

Item: We need secondary help. I disagree that we absolutely must shore up the safety spot. I think that's one of those positions that may not be perfect, but that you can live with going into the season. I think we MUST add a high-quality CB to the mix. If we don't do that in FA, it has to be as close to a sure thing draftee as possible.

Item: Special teams. I agree that we need to get much better on special teams, and that a few specialists might be just what the doctor ordered.

Item: Guard. We must, must, MUST upgrade this position. Wells is NOT good enough and does NOT fit the system properly to start. Faneca is perfect, and if he's the guy we spend the money on, I'm all for it.

Item: RB. I agree we need to upgrade, but disagree that we should cut James. The only way I would cut James is if we added Turner and a good rookie prospect. If we just draft a RB in the 1st round, we'll still need Edge, even at his cap number.

I'm sure I'm missing a few points, but dang, that was a well-written piece, Mitch.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Mitch, that was an excellently written piece...well done! I disagree with a few points, but overall, you hit the nail on the head.

Item: We will not win with our mix of pass rushers, even if we keep Pace. We need at least another skilled rusher to help pressure the QB, and keep pressure off the secondary.

Item: We need secondary help. I disagree that we absolutely must shore up the safety spot. I think that's one of those positions that may not be perfect, but that you can live with going into the season. I think we MUST add a high-quality CB to the mix. If we don't do that in FA, it has to be as close to a sure thing draftee as possible.

Item: Special teams. I agree that we need to get much better on special teams, and that a few specialists might be just what the doctor ordered.

Item: Guard. We must, must, MUST upgrade this position. Wells is NOT good enough and does NOT fit the system properly to start. Faneca is perfect, and if he's the guy we spend the money on, I'm all for it.

Item: RB. I agree we need to upgrade, but disagree that we should cut James. The only way I would cut James is if we added Turner and a good rookie prospect. If we just draft a RB in the 1st round, we'll still need Edge, even at his cap number.

I'm sure I'm missing a few points, but dang, that was a well-written piece, Mitch.

I'm with you on all points, but... will leave it to Grimm to judge the value of Wells.

 

[football karma]

i think its a good analysis --

as for Pendergast's schemes, i think they were a reflection on the coaching staff's confidence in the corner play and the free safety. They didnt want any of those three to have to cover anybody man for man for anything other than a couple plays a game.

Also -- if a corner has no confidence in his free safety being there on time -- he will play softer than otherwise.

On special teams, at least this year the team "broke even" overall after being abused in 2006. Evened out in terms of punt returns for TD and blocked punts. Excellent on-side kick execution. Next year, the team needs to win that battle.

Finally (and not directed at you Mitch) -- I will stick by my assertion from last year -- nobody on this board is qualified to evaluate individual offensive line play, much less interior offensive line play. We see the "effect" watching games, not root causes.

 

[john h]

I'm with you on all points, but... will leave it to Grimm to judge the value of Wells.

I have not read your article but "NO" we cannot win with our current team. We have no idea how Leinart will pan out. We do not have running back depth. We are in desperate need of an experienced DB and depth on both the DL and OL. Aside from all that we are apparently short on CAP money. Other than all this we are fine.

 

[ajcardfan]

We need to add some pieces to go up a level. But, we're not going to get there by quantity. We just aren't going to add to many new guys. The guys we do add, need to come through. No "Holts this year. " There's a lot of pressure on the scouts and GM this year. More than usual.

If we stay "Status Quo" we'll be mediocre. That could actually get us in the playoffs.

 

[Stout]

We need to add some pieces to go up a level. But, we're not going to get there by quantity. We just aren't going to add to many new guys. The guys we do add, need to come through. No "Holts this year. " There's a lot of pressure on the scouts and GM this year. More than usual.

If we stay "Status Quo" we'll be mediocre. That could actually get us in the playoffs.

See, that's the problem. If we remain uber-conservative, we cannot afford a single one of the players we get, in the early part of the draft or FA, to fail. Not a single one. If we come out of our shell, we'll have at least a little more wiggle room. No risk, no reward.

 

[ajcardfan]

See, that's the problem. If we remain uber-conservative, we cannot afford a single one of the players we get, in the early part of the draft or FA, to fail. Not a single one. If we come out of our shell, we'll have at least a little more wiggle room. No risk, no reward.

Oh, I agree with you stout. One way we could be more aggressive in adding new guys is cutting guys like Berry. Other than Holt though, I doubt we go too far in that direction. I think we'll cut most salary at the end of the offseason when it's time to sign draft picks. Like we did last year. I think Graves believes his plan has the team heading in the right direction and he won't change it.

 

[Stout]

Oh, I agree with you stout. One way we could be more aggressive in adding new guys is cutting guys like Berry. Other than Holt though, I doubt we go too far in that direction. I think we'll cut most salary at the end of the offseason when it's time to sign draft picks. Like we did last year. I think Graves believes his plan has the team heading in the right direction and he won't change it.

I just hope we don't cut Berry without having someone to replace him. I don't think he'll be what he used to be, but he's better than nobody. Actually, I want to keep him, at his current salary if necessary if no one else is signed, or at a pay cut if he'll take it and/or if we get someone else to replace him.

 

[BigRedMO]

I dont think there is any such thing as status quo in era of free agency even for the Giants. NFL teams are like sharks. They have to continually move forward or die.

 

[joeshmo]

I dont think there is any such thing as status quo in era of free agency even for the Giants. NFL teams are like sharks. They have to continually move forward or die.

Especially considering our schedule wont be the 3rd easiest in the league next year like it was this year. We have to move forward just to get back to 8-8.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

I have not read your article but "NO" we cannot win with our current team. We have no idea how Leinart will pan out. We do not have running back depth. We are in desperate need of an experienced DB and depth on both the DL and OL. Aside from all that we are apparently short on CAP money. Other than all this we are fine.

I was responding to Stout's view, not Mitch's.

 

[football karma]

Interesting recent parallel:

Last year Green Bay finishes 8-8.

They do absolutely nothing in the offseason, other than let Ahman Green go. Not only no big name free agents, but even no medium free agents. They did talk to a bunch of guys, but offered their price and stuck to it and watched guys sign elsewhere.

Green Bay fans were on the ledge.

Result: NFC championship game. Go figure.


TO BE CLEAR: this isnt to suggest the Cards should do nothing.

Its just that I think sometimes free agency is over rated, and continuity is underrated.

 

[Mulli]

Interesting recent parallel:

Last year Green Bay finishes 8-8.

They do absolutely nothing in the offseason, other than let Ahman Green go. Not only no big name free agents, but even no medium free agents. They did talk to a bunch of guys, but offered their price and stuck to it and watched guys sign elsewhere.

Green Bay fans were on the ledge.

Result: NFC championship game. Go figure.


TO BE CLEAR: this isnt to suggest the Cards should do nothing.

Its just that I think sometimes free agency is over rated, and continuity is underrated.

 

[Skkorpion]

Interesting recent parallel:

TO BE CLEAR: this isnt to suggest the Cards should do nothing.

Its just that I think sometimes free agency is over rated, and continuity is underrated.

Correct in all three cases.

As far as Mitch's article, I need a while to ruminate on his lengthy treatise. I do think Whisenhunt wants to move Edge off the team quickly if we can find two RBs, one of whom can start right away. Those who don't see the smoke signals on that, rising from south Tempe, are in denial.

 

[BradMannTX]

I hate to dig on you Walter because I value your contributions to ASFN, but since I seem to recall that you're in school to be a sports journalist I have to tell you: although your content is well thought out, I find your style of writing obnoxious. All I ever see is question marks. You seem to be getting better, but I just get really annoyed with the questions. I find it unreadable. I'm not a professional writer, nor do I aspire to be one, however, I do read a lot and this is my opinion -- perhaps shared by others and likely not.

 

[football karma]

Correct in all three cases.

to riff further--

I wonder how a big dollar free agent signing impacts the lockerroom and collective psyche of the team.

Was there a portion of the SF team ( to pick one) that said to themselves last year:

"we had this awesome offseason with adding Clements, et al -- we will now win" -- with the implication that the existing players concluded that they themselves didnt have to get better in order to win. Kinda like -- "hey, we were 7-9 last year, we added some guys that will be worth 3 wins, 10-6 here we come".

By not adding somebody -- you say to your team: "You can win. You need to get better -- its up to you to improve this team".

food for thought.

 

[slanidrac16]

If status quo meant scoring 400 points then the offense might be good enough IF measures were taken to beef up the "D". That means signing Dansby, Pace, and a pass rush specialist which could come by means of the Draft , perhaps Harvey or Calias. I say that because I feel you can put a rookie in there and tell him go sig the qb. We wouldn't be depending on him to rush , read ,react and/or cover.

I like the comparison to Green Bay. I was thinking that earlier this year. The Titans and Bucaneers both went from mediocre and poor to good.

We are definite a team whose stock is rising.

 

[Mitch]

I hate to dig on you Walter because I value your contributions to ASFN, but since I seem to recall that you're in school to be a sports journalist I have to tell you: although your content is well thought out, I find your style of writing obnoxious. All I ever see is question marks. You seem to be getting better, but I just get really annoyed with the questions. I find it unreadable. I'm not a professional writer, nor do I aspire to be one, however, I do read a lot and this is my opinion -- perhaps shared by others and likely not.

I am sorry you feel this way, Brad. I am not in writing school. I am a high school English teacher of 28 years, a retired high school football coach who had a rare opportunity to work for John Madden, and a long-time fan of the Cardinals.

I am not trying to be obnoxious. Just honest. For example, if it were up to me and someone gave me the roster choice of Faneca or Edgerrin James, I would take Faneca. I liked james' effort last year, but I feel as if Faneca's toughness and leadership would galvanize the running game, regardless of who is running ther ball.

The questions are inevitable, especially when last year the Cardinals began the free agency period with a great deal of cap space to work with...they signed no marquis free agents and now this year we fans are told that the Cards will not be major players in free agency. To me this is inexcusable, and piss poor management.

 

[Stout]

to riff further--

I wonder how a big dollar free agent signing impacts the lockerroom and collective psyche of the team.

Was there a portion of the SF team ( to pick one) that said to themselves last year:

"we had this awesome offseason with adding Clements, et al -- we will now win" -- with the implication that the existing players concluded that they themselves didnt have to get better in order to win. Kinda like -- "hey, we were 7-9 last year, we added some guys that will be worth 3 wins, 10-6 here we come".

By not adding somebody -- you say to your team: "You can win. You need to get better -- its up to you to improve this team".

food for thought.

Meh, I think that's a bit of a reach. Just as easy to say that the players might think, 'Jesus, isn't our FO even going to try and get us better' if we go too conservative.

 

[Stout]

Interesting recent parallel:

Last year Green Bay finishes 8-8.

They do absolutely nothing in the offseason, other than let Ahman Green go. Not only no big name free agents, but even no medium free agents. They did talk to a bunch of guys, but offered their price and stuck to it and watched guys sign elsewhere.

Green Bay fans were on the ledge.

Result: NFC championship game. Go figure.


TO BE CLEAR: this isnt to suggest the Cards should do nothing.

Its just that I think sometimes free agency is over rated, and continuity is underrated.

We aren't in the same boat as the Packers are, though. At their biggest position of need, as many experts thought WR was, they had young talent that needed to develop. Well, at our big positions of need on defense, CB and pass rush, who do we have that we're waiting on? The best answer is Pace, and he's arguably not going to be on the roster.

It's fine to stand pat if you're trying to bring along young talent and can fall back on that questionable backup plan. It's not fine to stand pat if you've got no one waiting in the wings.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Can the Cardinals Win Keeping Status Quo?

why not? It's worked so well in the past

A mish-mash of thoughts:


I think en fuego makes some really good points.

To challenge Joe'e sentiment that we need to improve just to get back to 8-8:

I think you need to look at it in the context of players getting better and continuity.Do I think the offensive line will be better this year even if do nothing? Yes and the premise is simple.

Latui/Brown getting more reps and better + another year of Russ Grimm + players knowing their roles = an improved running game next year.

Simple? Maybe - but lets break it down into players who are likely to improve, stay the same and those who likely will regress:

Improve: Leinart, Latui, Pope, Levi, Breaston, Rolle, Branch and Eric Green.

Consistent production: Fitz, Q, Johnson, Wells, Dockett, Dansby, Hayes, Wilson, Hood, Okeafor, Pace

Likley to decline: James, Antonio Smith, Berry, Ross, Gandy, Warner

What am I basing this on? Mostly youth and getting used to the system. Plus guys like Smith and Gandy who played above their heads last year are likely to come back to earth IMO.

So i think with those guys getting better and another year in the system we have a lot of room for improvement still.

So what would I do? As much as I love Faneca and think he would be just what this team needs, to me its more important to get depth. The NFL is a battle of attrition and the hardest thing to do is to have enough depth as to where the inevitable injuries don't completely derail your season.

Thats why there is no way in hell I cut James. I cut Holt, Berry and Ross as they either can't be relied on to stay healthy or just plain suck. But everywhere else across the board i get a player who is going to be 1 or 2 on the depth chart.

Am I crazy to think that this is best Cardinals team yet? I mean unlike in past years, what position do we NEED a starter? Sure I want a shut down corner, I would like to add a OLB, and an OL and RB would be nice too.

But I can't ever remember going into an offseason like this. Lets say we decided to get a RB, OLB and OL as our only units we addressed as that was the focus. WOuld you write us off because we didn't get a CB? Probably not. What about if you switched CB and OLB? Would you be very upset with our LB corp? I wouldn't - in fact I like every starter.

To me it is paramount that we resign Pace and then add depth in FA. If I am going for a star its in the first two rounds of the draft.

Am I crazy to think that's enough?

And Mitch - for the record - I love your "obnoxious" writing - Keep it up

 

[Arizona's Finest]

We aren't in the same boat as the Packers are, though. At their biggest position of need, as many experts thought WR was, they had young talent that needed to develop. Well, at our big positions of need on defense, CB and pass rush, who do we have that we're waiting on? The best answer is Pace, and he's arguably not going to be on the roster.

It's fine to stand pat if you're trying to bring along young talent and can fall back on that questionable backup plan. It's not fine to stand pat if you've got no one waiting in the wings.

I think a lot of people are sleeping on Green. I also think Antrell Rolle will be a Pro Bowler next year, although at FS. I also think we will add a CB and OLB in the draft. So really there is alot of guys who can develop next year to make those percieved weaknesses, instead strengths.

 

[imaCafan]

Exactly, AF! All we need to complete the picture is a new OG...........

 

[ajcardfan]

I think a lot of people are sleeping on Green. I also think Antrell Rolle will be a Pro Bowler next year, although at FS. I also think we will add a CB and OLB in the draft. So really there is alot of guys who can develop next year to make those percieved weaknesses, instead strengths.

I think there is hope that Branch could develop and help the pass rush up the middle. That was supposed to be his strength.