Gaga isn’t the Only One Concerned with Shallow.

[wa52lz]

When 12 rookies make your final 53 it points to how lacking your depth is and where your team really is. Eight more are second year players. That is almost half of your team made up of first and second year players.

It's pretty similar to the other teams in the division. Sea- 10 Rookies and 1yr players and 11 second year, LA- 12 R/1st and 7 2nd year, SF- 10 R/1st and 11 2nd year, we have 13 and 7.

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[Arz101]

Which position group of th Cardinals is in the top 5 across NFL?

None.

This a bad team after a few good starters at the top.

So naturally most of the depth guys are starting and guys behind them are bad.

Only hope is K1 and K2 both show they belong in NFL by the end of the year. That will be the Cardinals super bowl for 2019.



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[BACH]

Some thoughts about a scary preseason.
Hundley has looked weaker the more he’s played.
How did Nichols get to game 4?
Seals-Jones was too soft to play TE.
Keep in mind guys like Dogbe & Miles are not playing against first teasers.
Those guys making the active roster tells you how weak this team is.
How did Brandon Williams play so many seasons; no gunner is that good?
Someone will pick up Cooper.
KJ is everything I said he would be and maybe more. Think Boldin.
Thompson has got to respond quicker in zone. He needs to anticipate.
I think teams will run early hoping to force Swearinger up, then throw deep.
Lucky TEs aren’t critical to this offense. This set is pitiful, including the 2 they kept.
I’m not ready to give up on Isabella but it’s easy to disrupt his routes.
Kanoff has peaked at too low a point. He’s not going to be an NFL QB.
How did Chad Williams last this long.
If any opponent controls the Cards’ pass rush, they’ll kill this secondary.
Richardson should make the practice squad.

Making the cuts on this squad must have been tough because you’d know you’d be keeping players who don’t belong in the NFL. This is the worst depth I’ve seen as far back as I can recall. Certainly the worst Cards’ depth since the league went to 16 teams. That expansion meant injury losses were inevitable and put a premium on depth. While I think his last draft was fine I think Keim needs to go. He was waiting to grab roster cuts for positions that were universally tight. His system of one year deals once worked but no longer does. This lack of depth is one of the reasons I predicted 4-12. There are some talented starters but not enough.

BTW I asked an experienced NFL coach what he thought about the Cards opening with an offense they’ve only run in practice. He said he would be concerned because even if the Cards’ defense tried to run a wide array looks to acclimate Murray they likely wouldn’t have the talent to run most of them effectively. So Murray would be led to believe he had control of things he didn’t. Expect teams with stunting defenses to be a major problem. They’re tough for any rookie, but likely will be harder for Murray.

It depends on how you rate the total roster. This is not the worst roster IMO. but it is the thinnest. There is serious talent on this team, but I'm scarced ****less about the depth of the team.

Our back-up OL situation is so bad, that it looks like we are carrying 11 Offensive Linemen because there is young (but not ready) talent and the back-ups are bad.

The same for the DL. 8 players for 3 starting positions.

The coaching staff is betting that Thompson twins are growing up fast

Tight-Ends are horrible.

 

[iLLmatiC]

By week 3 we will know if he was right.

Maybe even by game one. I hope not.

Truthfully, I expect to be disappointed.

 

[cardsfanmd]

Lol. The sky is falling. If this team and it’s current situation is making you all so miserable, why bother? One depressing yet laughable read after another.

 

[BACH]

When 12 rookies make your final 53 it points to how lacking your depth is and where your team really is. Eight more are second year players. That is almost half of your team made up of first and second year players.

I totally get your point, but at the same time, this rookie class is on paper the best rated rookie class in years - by Any team.

It Makes it tricky. What If your rookie class is really Good, But not ready to contribute yet?

 

[PACardsFan]

When 12 rookies make your final 53 it points to how lacking your depth is and where your team really is. Eight more are second year players. That is almost half of your team made up of first and second year players.

We needed to get younger, and quickly. With the early success that BA had, he somehow convinced MB those last couple years that the window was still open. BA loved the older, experienced roster, and the window slammed shut on us. I loved the BA years, but Michael realized that the run was over & BA wasn't the guy to build with a younger roster. Wilks was an abomination, so that only dug us a deeper hole. So, here we are. I'm fine being younger, and much younger. The beauty of the NFL is that you can reverse your fortunes. Last year, we were rudderless & clueless from a coaching perspective, we were old/slow, we were boring, we were unwatchable. Improvements in those last 4 areas this year will at least make me want to watch them again.

 

[slanidrac16]

We were a very old and slow team with limited cap space going into this year.

We really didn’t have a choice but to go young. We may regret not trading Peterson before the draft for a #1 plus. His value will never be as high as it was. It may still happen if we start out 1-6.

As fans we are all too impatient and lament over passed mistakes by the front office. The biggest mistake was believing we could compete going into 2018. This team is better today. We should be in a little better shape than we are. The millions spent on Bradford could had been spent on a couple of real offensive lineman.

 

[ARZCardinals]

Seeing after 3 games the offense couldn’t even get the clap right any fan should be highly concerned
And the defense looked as bad as last season
They say preseason means nada
We will find out

I’m not optimistic with them....but time will tell

 

[PACardsFan]

We were a very old and slow team with limited cap space going into this year.

We really didn’t have a choice but to go young. We may regret not trading Peterson before the draft for a #1 plus. His value will never be as high as it was. It may still happen if we start out 1-6.

As fans we are all too impatient and lament over passed mistakes by the front office. The biggest mistake was believing we could compete going into 2018. This team is better today. We should be in a little better shape than we are. The millions spent on Bradford could had been spent on a couple of real offensive lineman.

Agree. An even bigger mistake was believing that we could compete going into BA's last season in 2017. Not to belittle Keim's overall responsibilities, but many of the small school, and complete reaches for diamonds in the rough, had BA's fingerprints all over them. It was BA's arrogance about his system that actually made him a very good coach. But, that same arrogance is what led him to convince SK/MB to draft guys like Brandon Williams, Logan Thomas, & Chad Williams. As any great coach believes, he felt he could coach up any player to greatness. We got too cute with these small school picks & it bit us in the a$$. For as long as Keim is here, I don't think you'll see him do that again.

 

[BigRedRage]

Seeing after 3 games the offense couldn’t even get the clap right any fan should be highly concerned
And the defense looked as bad as last season
They say preseason means nada
We will find out

The refs couldnt get the clap right. The QBs were fine.

 

[Morty]

This has been my refrain all preseason. As impressed as I have been with Murray, Kingsbury has made some maddening decisions

Prepare your rookie QB for success > a one game advantage for hiding your offense.

This would be a good poll question. Not practicing offence during preseason help/hurt team in regular season?
I'd go with hurt and other teams can always find tape of your offense - even at the college level. Maybe it helps delay criticism.

 

[Morty]

Agree. An even bigger mistake was believing that we could compete going into BA's last season in 2017. Not to belittle Keim's overall responsibilities, but many of the small school, and complete reaches for diamonds in the rough, had BA's fingerprints all over them. It was BA's arrogance about his system that actually made him a very good coach. But, that same arrogance is what led him to convince SK/MB to draft guys like Brandon Williams, Logan Thomas, & Chad Williams. As any great coach believes, he felt he could coach up any player to greatness. We got too cute with these small school picks & it bit us in the a$$. For as long as Keim is here, I don't think you'll see him do that again.

And this could be a good reason to keep Keim around - if he did learn that lesson. This last draft was very different from previous ones.

 

[football karma]

When 12 rookies make your final 53 it points to how lacking your depth is and where your team really is.

also a function of $35mm in dead cap -- the team literally cannot afford an extra 4-5 or so vets at ~$5mm each that is the difference between NFL avg 7 rookies making the squad vs Cards today.

the Cards had a franchise false start last year. Consider the $35mm the franchise equivalent of the 5 yard penalty for a false start

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Which position group of th Cardinals is in the top 5 across NFL?

None.

This a bad team after a few good starters at the top.

So naturally most of the depth guys are starting and guys behind them are bad.

Only hope is K1 and K2 both show they belong in NFL by the end of the year. That will be the Cardinals super bowl for 2019.



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We're going to get our brains beat in at least a couple of times this season, as we pay for Keim's sins of the last two or three years. But I'm willing to accept this, as long we show progress through the season, and we're in a position to compete for the playoffs next season.

It's not great, but that's where we're at.

 

[Morty]

I understand your concern. However the situation is so different than anything we’ve seen before.

We have a rookie qb that knows the offense. No other rookie qb has ever been in this position. But like every other rookie qb he’s doesnt know what he doesn’t know. Early success especially against the blitz will slow defenses down. Up tempo play calling will keep defenses in their base defense for longer than they want. We are faster on offense than we have been in a long time.

If we can use that speed in match ups we won’t need the o- line to hold up for 4 to 5 seconds. I’m not looking at big plays until we have them set up for it or extended plays. I see an offense that is going to make first downs, if we limit penalties. Hopefully our speed can also turn the little swing pass into big plays.

We will all have a better idea in about 7 days. I think K1 and K 2 have a plan. Is it 100% fool proof? No. Will it be unstoppable. No. But we will no longer be totally inept and helpless if we are looking at 2nd and 10. I believe we will be able to create enough mismatches to keep things close and competitive.

There was one play in preseason where Johnson faked blocked and got a quick pass and about 5-10 yards. How will that affect defenses? Murray seems good at seeing the field and not locking in on one guy. Like you said - 7 days.

 

[football karma]

And this could be a good reason to keep Keim around

warning: pure speculation

Keim sold Mike B on a complete reset of the team. in doing so, he "earned" himself this year and next to show serious progress.

not speculation:

While Mike B is far better than his dad ( a low bar), he is similar in that he values familiarity for important positions. Its why Keim was promoted in the first place -- long tenure with the org. Its why he got another chance. (Also why Minegar was kept. --lonnnng time employee). its why Adrian Wilson is being groomed for GM now. If Mike B makes a change, he wants someone he has known for several years to fill that role.

 

[kerouac9]

Agree. An even bigger mistake was believing that we could compete going into BA's last season in 2017. Not to belittle Keim's overall responsibilities, but many of the small school, and complete reaches for diamonds in the rough, had BA's fingerprints all over them. It was BA's arrogance about his system that actually made him a very good coach. But, that same arrogance is what led him to convince SK/MB to draft guys like Brandon Williams, Logan Thomas, & Chad Williams. As any great coach believes, he felt he could coach up any player to greatness. We got too cute with these small school picks & it bit us in the a$$. For as long as Keim is here, I don't think you'll see him do that again.

This is such a strange meme that people seem to have just accepted because it’s too horrifying to consider that we kept a talent evaluator who is Actually Bad the last two seasons.

Bruce Arians didn’t make Keim take Josh Rosen. It’s very strange that people can think that Arians thought he could coach anyone up and loathe playing rookies at the same time.

 

[JeffGollin]

Lol. The sky is falling. If this team and it’s current situation is making you all so miserable, why bother? One depressing yet laughable read after another.

+1.

 

[PACardsFan]

Lol. The sky is falling. If this team and it’s current situation is making you all so miserable, why bother? One depressing yet laughable read after another.

Yep! If preseasons meant anything, we would have been in the SB last year. For me, the start of every season is like Christmas morning as kid. I was excited last year until halftime of the opener

 

[MadCardDisease]

Which position group of th Cardinals is in the top 5 across NFL?

None.

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I disagree. We have the best punter in the NFL.

 

[MadCardDisease]

We were a very old and slow team with limited cap space going into this year.

We really didn’t have a choice but to go young. We may regret not trading Peterson before the draft for a #1 plus. His value will never be as high as it was. It may still happen if we start out 1-6.

As fans we are all too impatient and lament over passed mistakes by the front office. The biggest mistake was believing we could compete going into 2018. This team is better today. We should be in a little better shape than we are. The millions spent on Bradford could had been spent on a couple of real offensive lineman.

2017 was the year of the AARP Cardinals. 2018 was rebuild 1.0 of the Cardinals as they initially went younger. 2019 is rebuild 2.0 of the Cardinals as they try to forget 2018.

The big problem is that in 2019 the Cardinals are forced to get way younger because of all bad mistakes they made in the previous two-three years. Those mistakes equated to $35M in Dead Cap Money.

When 20% of your cap is tied up in players who are no long on the roster, your only choice is to keep a bunch of young unproven guys because they are cheap and can fit under the cap.