Gentry has the team in a downward spiral

[Errntknght]

The key to the Suns in their stretch run was Gentry showing confidence in his bench. He's getting away from that and their play is declining as he cuts back their minutes. We'll probably survive Portland but it certainly bodes ill for the rest of the playoffs.

I have to wonder if he's registering whats happening on the floor - Collins does very little worthwhile and his minutes double. Barbs is having flashes of his old self but mostly he's playing out of control but suddenly he's getting more minutes than Dragic. Frye's shooting has consistently been off but he's out there 30 minutes a game. The way Nash played in the last game, he was hurting the team more than he was helping at the end yet his plays 39 minutes in a losing cause - Dragic should have been out there. Nash could only lose from the extra minutes but they would have boosted Dragic even though it probably wouldn't have altered the outcome.

Damn, I really thought Gentry had gotten himself past this blind reliance on his starters. Its very much like the stretch run the previous season when he coached them to eight defeats in nine games with all the losses coming at the end of games - and the starters dragging their tired butts around the floor.

I suppose its progress - going into a panic in the first round of the playoffs instead of stretch run...

Its probably better if we lose to Portland - if we do win it might make Alvin think he did the right thing in choking the life out of the bench. Besides we won't have to suffer though another series of panic stricken coaching.

 

[Chaplin]

Are you kidding?? We BLEW THEM OUT twice in the last 3 games. You are the epitome of the sky is falling, aren't you?

I understand being a little distraught over this loss, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

 

[cly2tw]

The key to the Suns in their stretch run was Gentry showing confidence in his bench. He's getting away from that and their play is declining as he cuts back their minutes. We'll probably survive Portland but it certainly bodes ill for the rest of the playoffs.

I have to wonder if he's registering whats happening on the floor - Collins does very little worthwhile and his minutes double. Barbs is having flashes of his old self but mostly he's playing out of control but suddenly he's getting more minutes than Dragic. Frye's shooting has consistently been off but he's out there 30 minutes a game. The way Nash played in the last game, he was hurting the team more than he was helping at the end yet his plays 39 minutes in a losing cause - Dragic should have been out there. Nash could only lose from the extra minutes but they would have boosted Dragic even though it probably wouldn't have altered the outcome.

Damn, I really thought Gentry had gotten himself past this blind reliance on his starters. Its very much like the stretch run the previous season when he coached them to eight defeats in nine games with all the losses coming at the end of games - and the starters dragging their tired butts around the floor.

I suppose its progress - going into a panic in the first round of the playoffs instead of stretch run...

Its probably better if we lose to Portland - if we do win it might make Alvin think he did the right thing in choking the life out of the bench. Besides we won't have to suffer though another series of panic stricken coaching.

I share your concern. The memory of last season after Gentry took over is so vivid. Without hope after Amare out, he trusted his bench and got within striking distance of making playoffs. And all of a sudden, he came back to playing Nash over 40 min. to lose crucial games all in the 4th quarter, for the very same reason of worn-out and thus ineffective Nash.

We lost many such games in Dec. and Jan in the same manner too. Only after ASB did they start to re-gameplan around Nash and featured Amare more, I believe partially due to management needing to know whether they could build around Amare after the failed trades.

In game 3, with about 25 pts lead and nothing really working due to lack of focus of the starters in the 3rd qu., he still played Nash the whole 3rd to only bring him back 2 min. into 4th.

If Gentry cannot stop being this myopic and safety-worried, we aren't going deep with it. No way we win with worn-out Nash against either of Spurs or Mavs.

 

[AfroSuns]

I thought the Suns should have won this too but the Blazers came to play. They had an emotional lift from Roy playing and with the way the Suns played, i am surprised they didnt lose by at least 20. Nash is mostly responsible for today's loss, they better win this series by simply protecting home court the rest of the way.

 

[JS22]

PANIC PANIC PANIC!

This series is going exactly as I thought it would. The Suns would let up in game 1, blow them out in 2 & 3, and barely lose to an extremely desperate team in game 4.

Suns will win game 5 at home, then eek out a victory to close it out in 6.

 

[jagu]

For the love of god, stop playing Frye and COllins..... I don't even care if we win the series or not. I can't watch another minute of basketball with these two guys on the floor.

 

[Errntknght]

Are you kidding?? We BLEW THEM OUT twice in the last 3 games. You are the epitome of the sky is falling, aren't you?

I understand being a little distraught over this loss, but this is absolutely ridiculous.

I'm not distraught by the losses nor am I jubilant over the blowouts, which you might have guessed if you actually read what my post said.

We've had a good number of this kind of exchange over the years - I criticize the Suns' coach in some quite specific way and you counter with an outburst which does not address the issue. In the fullness of time, you adopt my arguments to denigrate the coach after he's departed.

Gentry is actually worse in one way than D'Antoni - the latter never let you get your hopes up that he would use his bench as a positive force. Now and then he did say, in retrospect, that he might have done more with his bench but ten games into the next season it was apparent he was on his familiar old track.

 

[Chaplin]

I'm not distraught by the losses nor am I jubilant over the blowouts, which you might have guessed if you actually read what my post said.

We've had a good number of this kind of exchange over the years - I criticize the Suns' coach in some quite specific way and you counter with an outburst which does not address the issue. In the fullness of time, you adopt my arguments to denigrate the coach after he's departed.

Gentry is actually worse in one way than D'Antoni - the latter never let you get your hopes up that he would use his bench as a positive force. Now and then he did say, in retrospect, that he might have done more with his bench but ten games into the next season it was apparent he was on his familiar old track.

That's bull. In the playoffs you have to put the people on the floor that give you the best chance of winning. Pretty simple, really.

And unless you're completely blind, our bench looked absolutely horrid in this game. Lou Amundson was a waste, Goran couldn't run the team and, well, we all know how bad LB has been playing. When your best bench player is Channing Frye in a game, you know you're in trouble.

Now we have people saying to bench Channing AND Collins! Unbelievable how out of touch people are after a loss. Next thing you know people are going to wanting a D-League scrub to start at center for us! Oh. Wait.

 

[Errntknght]

That's bull. In the playoffs you have to put the people on the floor that give you the best chance of winning. Pretty simple, really.

Exactly - glad to see that you agree with me about that. Our best chance of winning is to employ the strategy that got us here. Changing it up when the going gets tough was stupid last year and even stupider this year, since one ought to learn from one's mistakes.

The biggest difference between Collins and our D-League player is that Jarron has played enough to show beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is all but worthless. Right now, an unknown quantity is starting to look pretty good.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm not distraught by the losses nor am I jubilant over the blowouts, which you might have guessed if you actually read what my post said.

We've had a good number of this kind of exchange over the years - I criticize the Suns' coach in some quite specific way and you counter with an outburst which does not address the issue. In the fullness of time, you adopt my arguments to denigrate the coach after he's departed.

it's funny cause it's true.

and while I have some reservations about how Gentry's changed up the rotation, I do believe that "he's leading them in a downward spiral" is a tad bit an over-reaction.

 

[Chaplin]

Exactly - glad to see that you agree with me about that. Our best chance of winning is to employ the strategy that got us here. Changing it up when the going gets tough was stupid last year and even stupider this year, since one ought to learn from one's mistakes.

I'm assuming you watched the game tonight, and your strategy didn't work. He put the bench in and they were ineffective. What is your solution to that problem? Because I'm sure the coaching staff would love to hear it.

The biggest difference between Collins and our D-League player is that Jarron has played enough to show beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is all but worthless. Right now, an unknown quantity is starting to look pretty good.

You only say that because of your history of wanting a big body--any big body--to be our center. Well, you get your wish and you still have problems with it. After awhile, it gets pretty old.

 

[mojorizen7]

Chaplin,i'm STILL waiting for you to actually stick your own neck out there with an opinion.......rather than continuously playing it safe by calling out others who have the balls to do so. It wouldn't be such a big deal however,if you weren't such a jackass with your responses.
Also,being a homer isn't a bad thing either,but again...no reason to be a turd.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...ternet_forum_and_message_board_pg2.html?cat=4

 

[TJ]

The Thunder just tied up the series w/ L.A. Its a similar scenario. L.A. got a little too fat off the situation (playing the 8th seed and winning the first 2) and took their foot off the gas.

The Suns realized after Game 1 that they had to take these guys seriously and they did the next 2 games. To me, the effort wasn't there in Game 4 and they seemed content to just win one in Portland.

But the one thing about Gentry is that he's good at adjusting. It's been a while since we've lost 2 games in a row. He will recognize the things Portland is doing, such as the double teams, and counter with something else. In addition, coming back home should help. The Suns need some positive mojo from the fans. Those guys in Rip City are bonkers and really help their team take it to another level.

My game plan is to beat Portland so handily in Game 5, they believe they have no shot at winning the series

 

[elindholm]

Our best chance of winning is to employ the strategy that got us here. Changing it up when the going gets tough was stupid last year and even stupider this year

Your hidden assumption is that Gentry has been deciding in advance how long the bench is going to play. Toward the end of the regular season, it was usually the case that the second unit started playing well within their first few minutes of being on the floor together. That showed that they could handle the job, and Gentry stuck with them. It's much different from D'Antoni's old technique of pulling bench players after only a few minutes even when they were doing well.

In this series so far, the second unit has been flat-out awful, from the moment they take the floor until Gentry can't stomach it anymore and has to pull them. They've been bad on defense and worse on offense. Your theory is that Gentry would have stuck with them in the regular season if they had been this ineffective, but that isn't a safe assumption.

I think Gentry has treated every individual game like a must-win since at least the All-Star break, and it has been to everyone's good fortune that the bench started to play so well. For whatever reason, they haven't gotten it done in this series, but maybe they'll match up better with the Suns' next opponent if they are fortunate enough to advance. Or, maybe their playoff jitters will ease as early as Game 5.

The biggest difference between Collins and our D-League player

Boy, it sure would be a shame if someone were to accuse you of arrogance for not using the D-League player's name. It's Jones.

 

[TucsonDevil]

Chaplin,i'm STILL waiting for you to actually stick your own neck out there with an opinion.......rather than continuously playing it safe by calling out others who have the balls to do so. It wouldn't be such a big deal however,if you weren't such a jackass with your responses.
Also,being a homer isn't a bad thing either,but again...no reason to be a turd.

...I thought it was only me that felt this way about Chaps posts.

To be honest, the second unit has struggled to score. Their defense hasn't been the worst, but they have struggled to score. Gentry also needs to understand that Frye is a basket case on the road, he can't hit the 3-ball away from home - especially against his former team.

I don't panic too much. Game 4 would have been miles different if the Suns had hit some open jumpers down the stretch. It was nearly that simple. They had a chance to run away with it when the Blazers went cold, but couldn't do it.

On a separate note - agree with Kenny and Charles - they are risking Roy's long term health by letting him play so early. Dumb Dumb Dumb.

 

[Chaplin]

Chaplin,i'm STILL waiting for you to actually stick your own neck out there with an opinion.......rather than continuously playing it safe by calling out others who have the balls to do so. It wouldn't be such a big deal however,if you weren't such a jackass with your responses.
Also,being a homer isn't a bad thing either,but again...no reason to be a turd.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...ternet_forum_and_message_board_pg2.html?cat=4

Um, saying the bench has been terrible isn't an opinion? You're attacking just to attack, aren't you? Like always.

One person writes that we are in a "downward spiral". I disagree. Maybe you and your cronies didn't take any English classes, but that IS an opinion.

And I ALWAYS stick my neck out there, which is why you and many more of your buddies tend to attack me usually for no reason.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

LOL at this thread title.

How is this for being specific in response to your initial post? You are being way overdramatic and it takes away the validity of any opinion you may have, no matter how true.

A thread title such as "Why isn't Gentry playing the bench more" would probably inspire more discourse and less laughter at the over all tenor of your message.

And for the record, I disagree with your premise as well. The benefit to Gentry using his bench all regular season was to keep the good players and eventual Hall of Famers, rested for this very time.

I want to see Dragic and Admunson get 20+ minutes of playoff basketball like I want a hole in the head. Nash should be playing the majority of the game and the only time he should come out is when he needs a rest.

 

[TJ]

For all of those in panic mode. Take two and call me in the morning

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Cheesebeef]

LOL at this thread title.

A thread title such as "Why isn't Gentry playing the bench more" would probably inspire more discourse and less laughter at the over all tenor of your message.

agreed.

And for the record, I disagree with your premise as well. The benefit to Gentry using his bench all regular season was to keep the good players and eventual Hall of Famers, rested for this very time.

I want to see Dragic and Admunson get 20+ minutes of playoff basketball like I want a hole in the head.

no one has ever said they want Dragic playing 20 minutes so I'm not sure why you'd bring it up. Do they want him getting more than 9 minutes? Probably... and probably they want that time to be at Leo's expense (who's been mostly horrendous).

Nash should be playing the majority of the game and the only time he should come out is when he needs a rest.

No one's saying he shouldn't get a majority of the minutes, but he shouldn't be playing 38. He's too old and just isn't effective at the end of games when he has to do so and we've seen that in both Game 1 and 4 of this series. Nash needs to get 34-5 minutes top. That's when he came play at his freshest at the end of games, which is where we're going to need him as this series has just tightened up.

 

[Cheesebeef]

and I've got to question those people saying the bench has been terrible so far in this series. Were they bad yesterday? Yeah.

But in Game 1, it was the bench who dug us out of the hole the starters put us in and then pushed us into the lead in the first half before the starters came back in... and gave back up the lead. They then pushed us to the lead midway through the fourth whereupon the starters were put back in... and gave up the lead in a heart-beat.

In Game 2, the bench helped build and maintain a 30 point lead throughout the night... and then they helped build and maintain a 30 point lead throughout the first 2 quarters of Game 3 before EVERYONE went to sleep in the second half of that game.


Seems to me, we've seen the bench play very well for 2.5 games in this series. My biggest problem continues to be Barbs getting the minutes that Goran got. He's just so out of control/predictable...

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Seems to me, we've seen the bench play very well for 2.5 games in this series. My biggest problem continues to be Barbs getting the minutes that Goran got. He's just so out of control/predictable...

Agreed. I am hoping Leo is done as a Sun after this season. He just doesn't fit anymore.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Agreed. I am hoping Leo is done as a Sun after this season. He just doesn't fit anymore.

why do you think Gentry keeps playing him the way he has? I can't figure it out for the life of me. I understand getting him a little run, but in the fourth quarter yesterday, he played 6 minutes and was just horrendous. The Grant/Goran group was really cooking during the season before LB came back.

 

[BC867]

During Game 4, I had a different take on why Gentry cut bench time.

The bench is primarily a defensive unit to hold leads.

We weren't leading in Game 4.

So the starters played more minutes.

With Leandro not providing as much instant offense (which is his only strength), it comes down to Frye.

But a 3-point shooting Center is a novelty. He does well, we win. He does poorly, our big man liabilities stand out. Putting more pressure on Amar'e.

It's why I've been campaigning for Gentry to get Jones into the rotation at Center, once Collins showed that he's not contributing.

 

[mojorizen7]

why do you think Gentry keeps playing him the way he has? I can't figure it out for the life of me. I understand getting him a little run, but in the fourth quarter yesterday, he played 6 minutes and was just horrendous. The Grant/Goran group was really cooking during the season before LB came back.

The first reason that comes to mind is to showcase Barbs for a summer trade...but showcasing him versus sticking with the proven rotation during a playoff series would be........i'll let you fill in the blank.

I know many here have soured on Barbosa as of late,but i actually still feel that he has the skills to play an important role on a
championship-type team(this coming from a fan who can't stand players that are useless on defense). Unfortunately i doubt that the SUNS will ever be a defensive oriented elite team so maybe my point is moot.

I definately don't see Barbs as a sixth man on an elite team but he still causes matchup problems and his speed & offensive aggressiveness could be pretty valuable to an already talent-laden defensive oriented team.

There are a few other guys i'd rather not see on this roster next season than Barbosa. I could be wrong but IMO he's still coachable.....and i'm still all for more of a youth movement anyway but thats getting off the subject.

What type of situation do you think would most benefit Barbosa? An uptempo team with a familiar HC maybe?

 

[Arizona's Finest]

why do you think Gentry keeps playing him the way he has? I can't figure it out for the life of me. I understand getting him a little run, but in the fourth quarter yesterday, he played 6 minutes and was just horrendous. The Grant/Goran group was really cooking during the season before LB came back.

I think its a confluence of everybody liking LB so much and his being the one guy off the bench that can get you 10 points in 5 minutes all on his own.

Problem is he has been out of the flow pretty much all season and Dragic has improved so much to the point where it we can keep the flow of offense going, even when Nash out of the game. With Barbosa in the game, the team offense grinds to a halt as soon as the ball gets into his hands.

Either hes going to make it or miss it. And more often then not lately hes been missing.