Hawks point spreads

[CaptTurbo]

Holy crap 14??? Even I have a hard time taking -14. The hawks arent THAT good.

 

[mdamien13]

This is the only team to give us an ass-whuppin in our own home. I'm afraid to see what happens to us in their nest.

 

[Chaz]

Given the history of the last 12 road games I can't think of a safer bet than against the Cards even at +14.

Last 12 road games Cardinals average margin of defeat; 24 pts (37-13)

 

[justAndy]

haven't we...

been underdogs in EVERY game this year?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Re: Hawks pojnt spreads

Originally posted by swd1974
The hawks arent THAT good.

Neither were the Bears, Browns, Niners, Lions, and Steelers and we couldn't cover 14 against any of them on the road.

 

[Tangodnzr]

DUH....wasn't that last road win the one last year in Seattle?

Of course, this year we don't have Martay and Thomas Jones, and are saddled with Quan.

Yeah, its impossible to beat Seattle on their home turf. :roll:

 

[SECTION 11]

Re: haven't we...

Originally posted by andikrist
been underdogs in EVERY game this year?

When's the last time that happened? 16 games, the underdog in ALL of them?

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr
DUH....wasn't that last road win the one last year in Seattle?

Of course, this year we don't have Martay and Thomas Jones, and are saddled with Quan.

Yeah, its impossible to beat Seattle on their home turf. :roll:

Seattle is on a skid, but the best thing to do when you are on a skid: Play the Cardinals!!!

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr
DUH....wasn't that last road win the one last year in Seattle?

Of course, this year we don't have Martay and Thomas Jones, and are saddled with Quan.

Yeah, its impossible to beat Seattle on their home turf. :roll:

what the hell does last year's win - with a completely different cast of characters on both teams have to do with this year's trainwreck on the road going up against a team that shellacks bad teams at home. Way to make a point that has nothing to do with anything as usual! No why don't you go and try and challenge someone to a fight again - that thread is pretty humorous.

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
what the hell does last year's win - with a completely different cast of characters on both teams have to do with this year's trainwreck on the road going up against a team that shellacks bad teams at home. Way to make a point that has nothing to do with anything as usual! No why don't you go and try and challenge someone to a fight again - that thread is pretty humorous.

Tango and Cheez, you guys are like two jr. high students who are in love with each other. Just get it over with and ask Tango out already!!! Give him a note that says, "Will you go to the Christmas Dance with me? Check the right box for "yes", mark the left box for "no."

 

[AzCards21]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
what the hell does last year's win - with a completely different cast of characters on both teams have to do with this year's trainwreck on the road going up against a team that shellacks bad teams at home. Way to make a point that has nothing to do with anything as usual! No why don't you go and try and challenge someone to a fight again - that thread is pretty humorous.

Actually I'm with Tango on this one. This is where the curse began. And we need to go back there to shed it. Just for consideration.

2002- 2nd game of the season @ Seattle.
2003- 2nd to last game of the season @ Seattle.

Coincidence? I think not!

We had no business beating them then according to the experts and we have none now. A game ripe for the picking.

 

[AzCards21]

Originally posted by Oran
Tango and Cheez, you guys are like two jr. high students who are in love with each other. Just get it over with and ask Tango out already!!! Give him a note that says, "Will you go to the Christmas Dance with me? Check the right box for "yes", mark the left box for "no."

Jake and the Deer could be their escorts.

 

[WizardOfAz]

Originally posted by Oran
Seattle is on a skid, but the best thing to do when you are on a skid: Play the Cardinals!!!

Correction: Play the Cardinals at your stadium.

Totally different team on the road than at home for some strange reason.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I don't mean to rain on everybody's parade here but our last road win was actually at Carolina last year.

 

[AzCards21]

Originally posted by MaoTosiFanClub
I don't mean to rain on everybody's parade here but our last road win was actually at Carolina last year.

Thanks alot! Jerk.

I thought I had this whole curse figured out.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by AzCards21
Actually I'm with Tango on this one. This is where the curse began. And we need to go back there to shed it. Just for consideration.

2002- 2nd game of the season @ Seattle.
2003- 2nd to last game of the season @ Seattle.

Coincidence? I think not!

We had no business beating them then according to the experts and we have none now. A game ripe for the picking.

we were 3.5 dogs in that game compared to 14 point dogs in this game - I'd say "the experts" gave us a hell of a better shot of winning that one than this one. Bet the farm against us this week - if anything this game against Carolina cements in my head what will happen this week - we have a team who plays well at home and gets absolutely crushed by struggling, yet decent teams overall on the road.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Originally posted by AzCards21
I thought I had this whole curse figured out.

Don't flatter yourself

Anyone who is able to figure out the Curse of the Cardinals should be up for the Nobel Prize.

 

[Tangodnzr]

Sun 9/7 New Orleans W 27-10
Sun 9/14 at Arizona W 38-0
Sun 9/21 St. Louis W 24-23
bye
Sun 10/5 at Green Bay L 13-35
Sun 10/12 San Francisco W 20-19
Sun 10/19 Chicago W 24-17
Sun 10/26 at Cincinnati L 24-27
Sun 11/2 Pittsburgh W 23-16
Sun 11/9 at Washington L 20-27
Sun 11/16 Detroit W 35-14
Sun 11/23 at Baltimore L 41-44
Sun 11/30 Cleveland W 34-7
Sun 12/7 at Minnesota L 7-34
Sun 12/14 at St. Louis L 22-27

The Seahawks started out the year great. That second game in Arizona, their defense looked great. They were very very agressive defensively, and indeed really kicked some ass. Since then, though, I haven't seen that same aggressiveness on defense.

They have been a fairly schizophrenic team this year.
Using 20/20 hindsight, their schedule has not been all that tough this year.

I think some things to take into account are:
The Rams have beaten them twice. First, in Seattle, then last week in St. Louis. Seattle does not look real sharp right now. Certainly, to me anyway, not like they did at the beginning of the season.

The biggest reason we lost that 1st game was turnovers. They absolutely killed the team that game.

At home they managed to sqeak by the 49's 20-19 about the time the 49'ers were playing some of their worst ball (although they have been maybe even more shizo than the Seahawks).

A week a later they chalk up another win 24-17 over a bear team that, again was struggling mightily.

Likewise on Nov. 2....a 23-16 win over the struggling Steelers.

and then finally the last two home wins....they put up some bigger and better numbers against Cleveland and Detroit ...."cough, cough".

They've also had their butts kicked by Green Bay, and Minnesota, and lost to powerhouse "cough, cough" Washington.

I don't see anything there that warrants considering them invincible at home or that great a team period.

I think some people are over-rating them a bit.

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr

I don't see anything there that warrants considering them invincible at home or that great a team period.

I think some people are over-rating them a bit.

What makesd them invincible at home in relation to this weeks game is the Cards woeful, pathetic, embarrassing, hideous God-awful play on the road. Why on earth would the oddsmakers think otherwise when in 2003 the Cards have been outscored on the road 253-82

Again:

253-82

The Cards haven't given up less than 24 on the road this year and 4 of the seven road games thus far they have given up over 35 points per game.

The Cards are scoring a measly 12 points per game on the road (and I was generous in rounding up).

Sorry but based on short term history alone, the Seahawks are being under-rated right now.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by AZCB34
What makesd them invincible at home in relation to this weeks game is the Cards woeful, pathetic, embarrassing, hideous God-awful play on the road. Why on earth would the oddsmakers think otherwise when in 2003 the Cards have been outscored on the road 253-82

Again:

253-82

The Cards haven't given up less than 24 on the road this year and 4 of the seven road games thus far they have given up over 35 points per game.

The Cards are scoring a measly 12 points per game on the road (and I was generous in rounding up).

Sorry but based on short term history alone, the Seahawks are being under-rated right now.

exactly.

 

[Tangodnzr]

Just a couple of questons Cubby.

Is not the starting lineup a little different this week than what it has been?

Granted the coaching staff is still the same, but I also have to say, that last week, for once, the play calling and selection, actually seemed fairly decent. Along with McCown's play, that was probably the biggest surprise to me.

Shawn Alexander didn't exactly have a field day against the Cards earlier, and I don't think he will again either.

As has so often been the case this season, a lot is probably going to depend on CB play. If Robinson, Jackson, and Engram are allowed to roam free and the Cards don't get any pressure on Hasselbeck, then indeed it could be a long afternoon.

I think maybe one overlooked point here, is that Josh's play last week resulted in the Cards having a 38-22 min time of possession difference. That alone makes the defense look better. It's the old classic...They can't score if they aren't on the field.

The other thing is ....with Josh starting, and showing what he did last week, Seattle has to add another concern to the mix in their defensive planning. Some people have said that teams will now neutralize Josh by preparing game plans for him....well the other side of that coin is....in doing that, that takes away from other areas....and consequently opens up more options for the offense as a whole.
The biggest nightmare, for any defense, is trying to compensate against a mobile QB. For example, if they assign a player to "shadow" Josh to contain him, then that takes pressure off other areas, etc.

I'm certainly not guaranteeing a win in Seattle, but niether am I writing off the possibility of a nice upset here.

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr
Just a couple of questons Cubby.

Is not the starting lineup a little different this week than what it has been?

Granted the coaching staff is still the same, but I also have to say, that last week, for once, the play calling and selection, actually seemed fairly decent. Along with McCown's play, that was probably the biggest surprise to me.

Shawn Alexander didn't exactly have a field day against the Cards earlier, and I don't think he will again either.

As has so often been the case this season, a lot is probably going to depend on CB play. If Robinson, Jackson, and Engram are allowed to roam free and the Cards don't get any pressure on Hasselbeck, then indeed it could be a long afternoon.

I think maybe one overlooked point here, is that Josh's play last week resulted in the Cards having a 38-22 min time of possession difference. That alone makes the defense look better. It's the old classic...They can't score if they aren't on the field.

The other thing is ....with Josh starting, and showing what he did last week, Seattle has to add another concern to the mix in their defensive planning. Some people have said that teams will now neutralize Josh by preparing game plans for him....well the other side of that coin is....in doing that, that takes away from other areas....and consequently opens up more options for the offense as a whole.
The biggest nightmare, for any defense, is trying to compensate against a mobile QB. For example, if they assign a player to "shadow" Josh to contain him, then that takes pressure off other areas, etc.

I'm certainly not guaranteeing a win in Seattle, but niether am I writing off the possibility of a nice upset here.

I don't disagree with your points but in the context of establishing a point spread, the oddsmakers are looking at how the Cards play on the road and that line is the end product IMO.

I was on a Seahawks board and basically said "You guys should win this game...actually quite easily BUT this is the kind of game the Cards usually pull out of their backside and win it." This is a game where the Cards could "shock" everyone but based simply on recent history with this team/coaching staff a disaster looms this weekend.

I predicted a win against CAR but I cannot do it here.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Originally posted by Tangodnzr
Just a couple of questons Cubby.

Is not the starting lineup a little different this week than what it has been?

Granted the coaching staff is still the same, but I also have to say, that last week, for once, the play calling and selection, actually seemed fairly decent. Along with McCown's play, that was probably the biggest surprise to me.

Shawn Alexander didn't exactly have a field day against the Cards earlier, and I don't think he will again either.

As has so often been the case this season, a lot is probably going to depend on CB play. If Robinson, Jackson, and Engram are allowed to roam free and the Cards don't get any pressure on Hasselbeck, then indeed it could be a long afternoon.

I think maybe one overlooked point here, is that Josh's play last week resulted in the Cards having a 38-22 min time of possession difference. That alone makes the defense look better. It's the old classic...They can't score if they aren't on the field.

Tango - can't most the same be said of almost every home game this season - where we have shut down the run, dominated time of possession, had adequate QB play (Blake has put up similar numbers or better than Josh's at home (minus the Seattle game - and well that was Josh in there), seemed to have better offensive execution? Now consider that Seattle has already had a live look at McCown and will now have game tape as well - don't you think that they can be more prepared for him than Carolina was - and don't you think that it will be tougher for the kid to be playing on the road in front of a full house versus at home with zero pressure - not to mention being supported by a team that lays down and dies on the road?

I also don't really understand your "cough, cough" in regards to Detriot and Cleveland - I mean are those huge blwouts to be disregarded because those teams are so terrible - considering we got crushed by those teams as well? It's a road game - it's young QB going against a hungry defense who has made bad teams recently look just as they should - and we still have Coach Mac at the helm - I just don't see how this team covers the spread this week and completely reverses it's entire ineptitude it's shown on the road all season.

 

[AZCB34]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
Tango - can't most the same be said of almost every home game this season - where we have shut down the run, dominated time of possession, had adequate QB play (Blake has put up similar numbers or better than Josh's at home (minus the Seattle game - and well that was Josh in there), seemed to have better offensive execution? Now consider that Seattle has already had a live look at McCown and will now have game tape as well - don't you think that they can be more prepared for him than Carolina was - and don't you think that it will be tougher for the kid to be playing on the road in front of a full house versus at home with zero pressure - not to mention being supported by a team that lays down and dies on the road?

I also don't really understand your "cough, cough" in regards to Detriot and Cleveland - I mean are those huge blwouts to be disregarded because those teams are so terrible - considering we got crushed by those teams as well? It's a road game - it's young QB going against a hungry defense who has made bad teams recently look just as they should - and we still have Coach Mac at the helm - I just don't see how this team covers the spread this week and completely reverses it's entire ineptitude it's shown on the road all season.

Add to that a SEA team that quite frankly is in a must win if they hope to make the playoffs. They lose eitehr of these last 2 and they are likely done after tie breakers are put into place.

A desperate team that is better than ours, on the road. There were better odds for the people defending the Alamo.

 

[Tangodnzr]

Originally posted by cheesebeef
Tango - can't most the same be said of almost every home game this season - where we have shut down the run, dominated time of possession, had adequate QB play (Blake has put up similar numbers or better than Josh's at home (minus the Seattle game - and well that was Josh in there), seemed to have better offensive execution? Now consider that Seattle has already had a live look at McCown and will now have game tape as well - don't you think that they can be more prepared for him than Carolina was - and don't you think that it will be tougher for the kid to be playing on the road in front of a full house versus at home with zero pressure - not to mention being supported by a team that lays down and dies on the road?

I also don't really understand your "cough, cough" in regards to Detriot and Cleveland - I mean are those huge blwouts to be disregarded because those teams are so terrible - considering we got crushed by those teams as well? It's a road game - it's young QB going against a hungry defense who has made bad teams recently look just as they should - and we still have Coach Mac at the helm - I just don't see how this team covers the spread this week and completely reverses it's entire ineptitude it's shown on the road all season.

Well Cheesy, there seems to be a number of points here that I would tend to question or disagree with:
1 - I admit I'm "winging" this one a little, but I don't remember the Cards consistantly dominating time of possession this year.
In fact, what I have seen a lot of is Blake making some bad decisions and throws killing drives and time of possession...one of the biggest reasons I'm disappointed in his play most of this year.

2 - I do agree, that playing on the road, makes it tougher for the QB, .....no great revelation there. But, again, off the top of my head, I don't think Seattle has been selling out their home games. That crowd can be intimidating to anyone, and even though they aren't "packing the house" could stilll pose a problem. But again, Blake hasn't/didn't shown much in his leadership and handling of the offense in that respect either.

3- I would also have to disagree with the inference that Josh was under "zero" pressure last week and that it will be so much greater this week. I don't buy that. You think Josh getting his first real NFL start, having been announced the starter earlier in the week, in front of the home crowd, whatever their numbers were (which reminds me...I see some here claiming 14,000 yet NFL stats show 23,000, what's up with that?) is zero pressure??
If anything I think the "pressure" as such may even be a little less this week in that regard. You could see, last week, that the game was important to McCown, and that some of his team mates fed off that as the game progressed. On the + side, he will also go into this game with a little more confidence under his belt.

4 - I don't think this team is going to "lay down and die". Last week was a good example of that. It would have been very easy for a lot of players to flat-line, but they didn't. I give them credit for that.

5 - I also agree that the win over Cleveland was impressive. I really thought Cleveland's defense would contain the Seahawks better than they did. EVERYONE is running up scores on Detroit lately, which, again is kind of surprising, I thought their defense was better than its been showing.

6- and probably most of all....I disagree with labeling Seattle's defense "hungry" right now. Just the opposite. They don't appear nearly as hungry as they did earlier in the season.

7 - I also think that you, like many others, may be over-reacting to Mac's deficiencies. The offensive play calling did seem much improved last week. Most of the time, the defense wasn't too bad....until that last series or so....and that does still concern me.
The team showed "no quit" last week.....I don't expect that to change this week.