How do you do it? grading players?

THESMEL

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This is my method of grading as a fan, I understand it has flaws, but is fun for me each year, Its from free sites, If you have something better please share it.

I'll keep on keeping on, and try to be positive.

The skill sets for each position from evaluations on

http://www.cbssports.com/#!/nfl/draft/players/1632296

50 is may be developmental at some point up to 59 emergency player
60 is emergency up to back up 69
70 is low grade starter high grade back up to 79
80 is a solid starter up 89 borderline elite
90 is elite up to the best ever at 99
100 is better than the best ever at the position.

This is the best system I've found I welcome any body else's system. please share, more than How silly thesmel is.
It is the basic system ESPN uses for draft players, I adapted to FA and veteran players.

Look at the 1-100 scores on the right side of the draft board on the right side. They took off the actual grade scale, to make you pay to be an insider.
http://espn.go.com/nfl/draft



Now I look at the Scout.com FA rankings by position, and compare the player to the 5 star system at the position.
http://profootball.scout.com/a.z?s=127&p=9&c=12&nid=83&lnid=83&yr=2011

And in depth evaluation report from cbs, this is only a piece PP's read. as an example of position skill sets.

http://www.cbssports.com/#!/nfl/draft/players/1632296

Read & React: Possesses good instincts for the position. Reads his man and will sneak a peek at the quarterback, showing the anticipation necessary to make the big play. Can get over-aggressive and bite on double-moves, though he shows good straight-line speed to recover and possesses excellent ball skills. Could come up more aggressively when he reads run, as he's content with allowing teammates to make the tackle, but isn't afraid to come up in run support when he has to.

Man Coverage: Rare fluidity and straight-line speed for a defender of his size. Quick feet and balance when backpedaling and when he switches to a side shuffle technique. Rarely uses his hands to jam the receiver, opting instead simply to turn and run with his opponent. Will occasionally misjudge the speed of his opponent when in off-man coverage, allowing the receiver to eat up too much of the cushion. Easily flips his hips and shows very good burst out of his breaks (especially considering his size) to mirror the receiver. Good acceleration and has a burst to close. Good route-recognition. Good body lean and use of the sideline to ride wideouts out of bounds. Excellent size, overall physicality and competitiveness for jump-ball situations. Times his leaps well and can high-point the ball due to excellent hand-eye coordination.

Zone Coverage: Good recognition for zone coverage, but will drift out of position when he's reading the eyes of quarterbacks, resulting in some big-play interceptions, but also in allowing receptions when savvy passers bait him. Quick feet and balance to change directions. Good route anticipation. Switches off his target quickly when he sees the quarterback throwing elsewhere. Closes on the ball quickly.

Closing/Recovery: Some concern over what his time in the 40-yard dash will be, but shows very good field speed and possesses a second gear of acceleration to close on the ball. Locates the ball quickly and has the long arms to break up passes (or even make the interception) when it appears that he is beaten. Has good, but not elite burst to break downhill out of his cuts, making him susceptible to comeback routes against bigger receivers who challenge him vertically (see Alabama, Texas A&M). Among best attributes is his size, leaping ability and ball skills on fade and go-routes against bigger receivers. Matches up well in jump-ball situations. Isn't afraid to get physical in these confrontations, but because he's going for the ball, doesn't draw the flag. Very good ball skills. Times his leap well, showing a good vertical and possesses the long arms and soft, strong hands to pluck the ball out of the air. Excellent return skills once he has the ball in his hands.

Run Support: When not in press coverage, reads run quickly and either provides the contain to push the runner back inside or makes the tackle himself. Focuses on his primary target - the receiver - when he's in press coverage and can be a step slower to recognize run. Trusts his teammates to make the play, showing good strength and toughness to fight through blocks, but not always the sense of urgency scouts would prefer. Good effort in pursuit. Takes good angles to the ball and has the speed to run down the ballcarrier.

Tackling: Reliable open-field tackler. Breaks down well in space to make the stop against elusive athletes. Willing to take on the bigger ballcarrier and does a nice of wrapping his arms securely around the legs to make the effective stop. Good effort in pursuit. Not an explosive hitter, but plays his size, strength and long arms help him knock down ballcarriers quickly.

Intangibles: Confident, almost cocky demeanor on the field. Possesses the short memory of all great cornerbacks. Extremely competitive. Seems to relish the battles against top receivers in man coverage. Campaigned to be used on special teams and even offense while at LSU due to his natural playmaking skills. Good bloodlines. Cousins of NFL cornerback Bryant McFadden and wide receivers Santana and Sinorice Moss. Characterized as "freak" athlete.
 

Cheesebeef

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how do you grade Matt Leinart now that NO ONE in the NFL wanted to give him even a shot at competing for a starting job and he willfully took a position where he's got zero chance of starting and has to compete for the back up position?
 

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Time for me to become a NFL scout with thesmel as my coach.
 

Brian in Mesa

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how do you grade Matt Leinart now that NO ONE in the NFL wanted to give him even a shot at competing for a starting job and he willfully took a position where he's got zero chance of starting and has to compete for the back up position?

I noticed part of the grading scale was missing...

50 is may be developmental at some point up to 59 emergency player
60 is emergency up to back up 69
70 is low grade starter high grade back up to 79
80 is a solid starter up 89 borderline elite
90 is elite up to the best ever at 99
100 is better than the best ever at the position.
100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 is Matt Leinart. Best player ever.
 

O

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how do you grade Matt Leinart now that NO ONE in the NFL wanted to give him even a shot at competing for a starting job and he willfully took a position where he's got zero chance of starting and has to compete for the back up position?

Boom Shaka Laka!!!

:D
 
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THESMEL

THESMEL

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Ouch

The same as the last time I seen him on the field, and your asking for me to get threatened again. But I'll go there.

90 borderline elite on the Cardinals less (85) in a new system, for 1st year. Pete Carrol may accelerate that to him being elite 90 about the 10th game of 2011. to a top 10 QB in the NFL and top 5 next year.

6'5" 232 lbs prototypical size, Cool under pressure, accurate, great decision maker, pretty long ball with touch, makes all the throws, goood movement for his size. high intangibles. many NFL rookie records. including 405 yard game most by a rookie, scored 2 Td's in the first 1/4 of his first 2 NFL starts.

Stepped in for injured Kurt Warner in his last NFL reg season start. Without 1st string practice snaps went 20-30, lead the team to a 4th quarter TD, defense didn't hold the Titans on a 99 yard drive for the loss( just like his 4th NCAA championship game against Vince Young)

Preseason 4-6/7-8 as a starter under constant Blitz, checked down appropriate as the run game went for minus yards while he was in. minimal snaps for a young starting QB needing to gain confidence and timing.

Was benched by Whiz, came in relief of DA and went 9-10 with a 130+ QB rating, (how dare him perform so excellent) gained token snaps in the 4th preseason game and completed the preseason with 110+ Qb rating which earned him being cut after 5 full years of investment by the Cardinals.

why, I don't know? separated from the success of Kurt Warner and the failure of DA, Hall, Skelton and Bartel, graded all on his own merit. Matty remains a top QB prospect on the field.

Houston offered a 1st round tender, and continue to make efforts to keep him even though they have a top 10 QB in Matt S. Seattle feels comfortable with, Whitehurst, Jackson and Leinart. Leinart is the best QB in the NFCW by my grades. ( Bradford may be closing)

I give Skelton a 51 and Da a 50, Bartel and Hall are below 50 at my QB grade, I had DA at 60 last year but i was wrong, He is an emergency QB for a bad team.

Denny made great progress with him, Whiz well how would you know, He cut him 5 minutes before the miracle.

In summary he is not the best at no QB skill set but is very good at all of them, With no glaring weakness at any QB skill set. Making him an elite overall balanced QB.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/historical/415213

ositives: Has an athletic frame and while not overly muscled, he has good thigh and calf thickness, long arms, large hands and good mobility in the pocket … Has the foot work needed to get to his throwing point quickly … Has a compact release, keeping the ball high to unleash deep tosses with ease … Puts good velocity behind his tosses and is good at getting the ball over the outside shoulder of his target … Displays good touch and timing on his passes, showing good improvement in waiting for plays to develop rather than forcing the ball into a crowd in 2004 … Cool under pressure and has enough short area speed to step up to avoid the pass rush … Has good command on the field and in the huddle … His short touch allows him to hit his receivers in stride … Gets good trajectory and velocity behind his long throws … Makes good adjustment calls at the line of scrimmage and shows a good feel for the edge rush and inside blitzes … Does a good job of looking off his primary target to locate the secondary receivers … Has enough mobility to roll out in either direction … Runs with a normal stride, building to top speed on occasions when he runs with the ball … Has the leg strength to break tackles … Good decision maker who will absorb a few hits while waiting for his targets to get open.



how do you grade Matt Leinart now that NO ONE in the NFL wanted to give him even a shot at competing for a starting job and he willfully took a position where he's got zero chance of starting and has to compete for the back up position?
 
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Cheesebeef

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The same as the last time I seen him on the field, and your asking for me to get threatened again. But I'll go there.

90 borderline elite on the Cardinals less (85) in a new system, for 1st year. Pete Carrol may accelerate that to him being elite 90 about the 10th game of 2011. to a top 10 QB in the NFL and top 5 next year.

6'5" 232 lbs prototypical size, Cool under pressure, accurate, great decision maker, pretty long ball with touch, makes all the throws, goood movement for his size. high intangibles. many NFL rookie records. including 405 yard game most by a rookie, scored 2 Td's in the first 1/4 of his first 2 NFL starts.

Stepped in for injured Kurt Warner in his last NFL reg season start. Without 1st string practice snaps went 20-30, lead the team to a 4th quarter TD, defense didn't hold the Titans on a 99 yard drive for the loss( just like his 4th NCAA championship game against Vince Young)

Preseason 4-6/7-8 as a starter under constant Blitz, checked down appropriate as the run game went for minus yards while he was in. minimal snaps for a young starting QB needing to gain confidence and timing.

Was benched by Whiz, came in relief of DA and went 9-10 with a 130+ QB rating, (how dare him perform so excellent) gained token snaps in the 4th preseason game and completed the preseason with 110+ Qb rating which earned him being cut after 5 full years of investment by the Cardinals.

why, I don't know? separated from the success of Kurt Warner and the failure of DA, Hall, Skelton and Bartel, graded all on his own merit. Matty remains a top QB prospect on the field.

Houston offered a 1st round tender, and continue to make efforts to keep him even though they have a top 10 QB in Matt S. Seattle feels comfortable with, Whitehurst, Jackson and Leinart. Leinart is the best QB in the NFCW by my grades.

I give Skelton a 51 and Da a 50, Bartel and Hall are below 50 at my QB grade, I had DA at 60 last year but i was wrong, He is an emergency QB for a bad team.

so, tell me, with all of the above, why didn't ONE TEAM want to give Matt a starting job, much less... to even COMPETE for a starting job SMEL? Is it possible that your ratings are wrong... or is it that you're right and EVERYONE IN THE NFL IS WRONG?
 

Bert

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The same as the last time I seen him on the field, and your asking for me to get threatened again. But I'll go there.

90 borderline elite on the Cardinals less (85) in a new system, for 1st year. Pete Carrol may accelerate that to him being elite 90 about the 10th game of 2011. to a top 10 QB in the NFL and top 5 next year.

6'5" 232 lbs prototypical size, Cool under pressure, accurate, great decision maker, pretty long ball with touch, makes all the throws, goood movement for his size. high intangibles. many NFL rookie records. including 405 yard game most by a rookie, scored 2 Td's in the first 1/4 of his first 2 NFL starts.

Stepped in for injured Kurt Warner in his last NFL reg season start. Without 1st string practice snaps went 20-30, lead the team to a 4th quarter TD, defense didn't hold the Titans on a 99 yard drive for the loss( just like his 4th NCAA championship game against Vince Young)

Preseason 4-6/7-8 as a starter under constant Blitz, checked down appropriate as the run game went for minus yards while he was in. minimal snaps for a young starting QB needing to gain confidence and timing.

Was benched by Whiz, came in relief of DA and went 9-10 with a 130+ QB rating, (how dare him perform so excellent) gained token snaps in the 4th preseason game and completed the preseason with 110+ Qb rating which earned him being cut after 5 full years of investment by the Cardinals.

why, I don't know? separated from the success of Kurt Warner and the failure of DA, Hall, Skelton and Bartel, graded all on his own merit. Matty remains a top QB prospect on the field.

Houston offered a 1st round tender, and continue to make efforts to keep him even though they have a top 10 QB in Matt S. Seattle feels comfortable with, Whitehurst, Jackson and Leinart. Leinart is the best QB in the NFCW by my grades.

I give Skelton a 51 and Da a 50, Bartel and Hall are below 50 at my QB grade, I had DA at 60 last year but i was wrong, He is an emergency QB for a bad team.

Denny made great progress with him, Whiz well how would you know, He cut him 5 minutes before the miracle.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/historical/415213

ositives: Has an athletic frame and while not overly muscled, he has good thigh and calf thickness, long arms, large hands and good mobility in the pocket … Has the foot work needed to get to his throwing point quickly … Has a compact release, keeping the ball high to unleash deep tosses with ease … Puts good velocity behind his tosses and is good at getting the ball over the outside shoulder of his target … Displays good touch and timing on his passes, showing good improvement in waiting for plays to develop rather than forcing the ball into a crowd in 2004 … Cool under pressure and has enough short area speed to step up to avoid the pass rush … Has good command on the field and in the huddle … His short touch allows him to hit his receivers in stride … Gets good trajectory and velocity behind his long throws … Makes good adjustment calls at the line of scrimmage and shows a good feel for the edge rush and inside blitzes … Does a good job of looking off his primary target to locate the secondary receivers … Has enough mobility to roll out in either direction … Runs with a normal stride, building to top speed on occasions when he runs with the ball … Has the leg strength to break tackles … Good decision maker who will absorb a few hits while waiting for his targets to get open.


I hate to bring you back to reality, I know it's a long trip, but Leinart chose to stay in Houston and carrry Shaub's clipboard. Gonna be tough for Carrol to get him to hit 90elite.
 

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Pete Carrol may accelerate that to him being elite 90 about the 10th game of 2011. to a top 10 QB in the NFL and top 5 next year.
He opted to stay with Houston instead of compete with T. Jackson and C. Whitehurst for a starting position.
 

O

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Pete Carrol may accelerate that to him being elite 90 about the 10th game of 2011.

You do realize that he signed a contract with the Texans not the SeaHags?
To be the backup.
BTW, not as a first round tender either.
 

AzStevenCal

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The same as the last time I seen him on the field, and your asking for me to get threatened again. But I'll go there.

I don't think any of us will have a problem with you defending Matt in this thread. It fits in with both the topic and the flow of the thread.

Steve
 
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THESMEL

THESMEL

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nope

No i didn't know, thanks
Good for him, Maybe we should ask what they want for Matt Schaub?
Cause i bet Matty was promised a chance to compete, and he likes how Kubiak and Houston treats him.

So Houston has 2 great QB's while we fight for Philly scraps. By the way I have Kolb graded about an 83, less than Mcnabb but the same as Orton,
We can win with him if we run more than pass.

DRC dropped to a 90 elite, but we are desperate for 3 QB's, past desperate.

I have Fitz at 94 and Beanie at 92, PP is at 97 on ESPN, I think He is over rated by 2 and may not be better than DRC this year? but I hope.

Please share some of your own evaluations, using your fan method? They can kill you but they can't eat you, It is illegal!


You do realize that he signed a contract with the Texans not the SeaHags?
To be the backup.
BTW, not as a first round tender either.
 
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TJ

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No i didn't know, thanks
Good for him, Maybe we should ask what they want for Matt Schaub?
Cause i bet Matty was promised a chance to compete, and he likes how Kubiak and Houston treats him.

So Houston has 2 great QB's while we fight for Philly scraps. By the way I have Kolb graded about an 83, less than Mcnabb but the same as Orton,
We can win with him if we run more than pass.

DRC dropped to a 90 elite, but we are desperate for 3 QB's, past desperate.

I have Fitz at 94 and Beanie at 92, PP is at 97 on ESPN, I think He is over rated by 2 and may not be better than DRC this year? but I hope.

Please share some of your own evaluations, using your fan method? They can kill you but they can't eat you, It is illegal!

So you have a RB who has yet to surpass 1000 yards in a season, two notches below a perennial pro bowler and surefire HoFer?

 

Bert

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So you have a RB who has yet to surpass 1000 yards in a season, two notches below a perennial pro bowler and surefire HoFer?


Dont forget he also has PP at a 95 (1 point HIGHER than Fitz) and he's never played a down!
 
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Cheesebeef

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No i didn't know, thanks
Good for him, Maybe we should ask what they want for Matt Schaub?
Cause i bet Matty was promised a chance to compete, and he likes how Kubiak and Houston treats him.

jesus. this is based on absolutely ZERO evidence. "i bet Matty was promised a chance to compete". can you tell me WHY you bet this?
 

Bert

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No i didn't know, thanks
Good for him, Maybe we should ask what they want for Matt Schaub?
Cause i bet Matty was promised a chance to compete, and he likes how Kubiak and Houston treats him.

!

Yeah Smel, keep telling yourself that. If he wanted a chance to compete to start, he woulda gone to Seattle and played for his old coach and gone against TJ. That would have been his best chance to "Compete"

He has 0 chance to ever start unless Shaub gets hurt. Matt is perfectly content to carry a clipboard, his signing made that clear.
 

CardsFan88

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Numbers are foolhardy in many ways. Statistics aren't science, and statistics are misleading.

Everyone want to boil it down to numbers and develop some formula to mean something. It's all sophistry. While some numbers point to something, the best way is understanding the game, understanding if the other guy knows the game, watching them play, gauging how they are vs. the norm or guy across from him, anything unique or ahead of the curve, so on and so forth.

The best thing I can say is, ditch the number system.

4.3 doesn't mean he is a good rb/kr/wr
7 foot doesn't mean he'll be a good shot blocker
90 in madden doesn't mean he's good in real life
AAA rating doesn't mean it's guaranteed
Statistical modelling and confidence levels are complete guesses and anyone that puts faith in them are complete jokes. Most stats, especially the crazy newer ones, is a new found sophistry, dogma, wall street ivory tower bull that people take way too seriously, and believe in it like it's divine.

I go by what I see, and what I've seen before as comparison. Games are based on matchups and relationships based on what one guy has and the other don't...so on and so forth.

If people try to boil it down to numbers, and use that for the main basis of their decision, they've already screwed the pooch. Having confidence in a guess, doesn't mean it's any more right.
 

Duckjake

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Yeah Smel, keep telling yourself that. If he wanted a chance to compete to start, he woulda gone to Seattle and played for his old coach and gone against TJ. That would have been his best chance to "Compete"

He has 0 chance to ever start unless Shaub gets hurt. Matt is perfectly content to carry a clipboard, his signing made that clear.

And again, the Cardinals made Leinart their #1 pick in the 2006 draft. What did the Bidwills do to tick off the football gods? The guy was touted by many analysts as the most NFL ready QB in years. Unbelievable, our own Ryan Leaf.

:bang:
 

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