How high can you stack the BS?

[Ryanwb]

This is a question I have been rolling around the past few days as I see the draft threads slowly build and build.

When someone posts a thread about either liking or disliking a certain prospect...somebody else immediately attacks their position because "they have not seen him play". To take it a step further, if you claim to have watched a prospect play a few times, you will be attacked again because you are "wrong" because you didn't watch all their games.

So that brings me to my question: ..and this is specifically directed to the self proclaimed draft experts. The average college team plays 11 games a season. Then mostly half the games are played early Saturday and the other half are played later Saturday. How can you claim to have watched and "studied" all of these players "in person"? Futhermore, how can you claim to have watched "ALL" their games. If I piece together to the posts I can pretty much prove that one person on here has seen all the games of just about every 1st round prospect.

Then these draft experts will claim to have watched their sleeper pick all season at Eastern Middle Central Tennessee State all season. So the pure physics behind your claims is impossible. How can you be watching 10 games being played at the same time? Even with Superman working the remote it would be impossible to flip back and forth between all the games, let alone be able to study a certain player.

Just once I would like to read one of the Draft Jerks admit they are getting their opinions from somebody else or another draft publication because it is quite obvious they are full of $hit.

I try to watch as much College Football as i can and the only player I can really say I have an accurate opinion on is Terrell Suggs because I have seen all of his games for the past two years. So the experts on this board are either making half their crap up, or are seriously plagerizing some poor fool who is chained in his basement watching college football tapes

 

[Ed B]

Originally posted by Ryanwb


When someone posts a thread about either liking or disliking a certain prospect...somebody else immediately attacks their position because "they have not seen him play".

How foolish I am to criticize someone for offering opinions on guys without ever having seen them play.

You need to get over it, man. I never claimed to watch every game of every player. Like I said in the other thread, you go so far out of your way to insult me and criticize the draft stuff I do......if you want to start doing it, be my guest. I'd love to see your mock draft. Please, it'll save me all the time it takes me to watch games and write this stuff only to have people like you piss on it because you're so insecure.

 

[so far away]

I NEVER watch college football and I think we take Suggs, my reason for this is simple... HE'S THE HIGHEST RATED PLAYER AT OUR GREATEST NEED! The only disputable part of that comment is "greatest need" which could be WR also.

 

[Ryanwb]

Re: Re: How high can you stack the BS?

Originally posted by Ed B
How foolish I am to criticize someone for offering opinions on guys without ever having seen them play.

You need to get over it, man. I never claimed to watch every game of every player. Like I said in the other thread, you go so far out of your way to insult me and criticize the draft stuff I do......if you want to start doing it, be my guest. I'd love to see your mock draft. Please, it'll save me all the time it takes me to watch games and write this stuff only to have people like you piss on it because you're so insecure.

Sorry but I never mentioned you by name, and I am not insecure about anything. I don't claim to be a draftnik. I just read the paper the next day after the Cardinals draft and say "cool". You insult everyone saying people are "full of $hit". I just think it is about time some people take some responsibility for their outlandish remarks. Obviously you feel you are in this group so I won't dispute that.

 

[Ryanwb]

Also, if you bother to read my posts, I am not attacking anyones mock drafts or anything like that. What pisses me off is when someone posts an opinion about a prospect and gets ripped apart for it by the "pose". That just isn't cool at all.

.....god forbid someone post an opposing view point on your watch

 

[stlouiecard]

Originally posted by Ryanwb
This is a question I have been rolling around the past few days as I see the draft threads slowly build and build.

When someone posts a thread about either liking or disliking a certain prospect...somebody else immediately attacks their position because "they have not seen him play". To take it a step further, if you claim to have watched a prospect play a few times, you will be attacked again because you are "wrong" because you didn't watch all their games.

So that brings me to my question: ..and this is specifically directed to the self proclaimed draft experts. The average college team plays 11 games a season. Then mostly half the games are played early Saturday and the other half are played later Saturday. How can you claim to have watched and "studied" all of these players "in person"? Futhermore, how can you claim to have watched "ALL" their games. If I piece together to the posts I can pretty much prove that one person on here has seen all the games of just about every 1st round prospect.

Then these draft experts will claim to have watched their sleeper pick all season at Eastern Middle Central Tennessee State all season. So the pure physics behind your claims is impossible. How can you be watching 10 games being played at the same time? Even with Superman working the remote it would be impossible to flip back and forth between all the games, let alone be able to study a certain player.

Just once I would like to read one of the Draft Jerks admit they are getting their opinions from somebody else or another draft publication because it is quite obvious they are full of $hit.

I try to watch as much College Football as i can and the only player I can really say I have an accurate opinion on is Terrell Suggs because I have seen all of his games for the past two years. So the experts on this board are either making half their crap up, or are seriously plagerizing some poor fool who is chained in his basement watching college football tapes

Hey Ryan, you make some valid points. I think that there are some poster who are self proclaimed draft experts and they could use some toning down of the ego,however, I think one of the purposes of boards like this is to throw one's ideas out there and see if people can build on what you are saying. True very True, I have expressed opinions in the past and sure enough, like a barracuda, there comes some wisea$$ who has to critique and twist what was being said.

I posted a draft prospect on this board a few days ago(Justin Gage) who I have seen play on many occasions. Certainly I haven't seen all of his games, but from I have seen he really looks like he would fit in with what our needs are. I also put in my post that EVERY PLAYER IN THE DRAFT IS A CRAPSHOOT and I think that hopefully the other posters would certainly take that in the light that I am proclaiming that I am not an expert and thos who think they are simply are fooling themselves right into oblivian. Hell, even Mel Kiper is a Legend in his own mind...Although Mel does his homework it would certainly be nice for him to at least acknowledge that a big part of being a draft guru is luck, guessing and taking calculated risks.

But Remember that's what makes up these boards and it is certainly in everyone's right to unload their form of BS whenever they so desire!

 

[Ryanwb]

Re: Re: How high can you stack the BS?

Originally posted by stlouiecard
Hey Ryan, you make some valid points. I think that there are some poster who are self proclaimed draft experts and they could use some toning down of the ego,however, I think one of the purposes of boards like this is to throw one's ideas out there and see if people can build on what you are saying. True very True, I have expressed opinions in the past and sure enough, like a barracuda, there comes some wisea$$ who has to critique and twist what was being said.

I posted a draft prospect on this board a few days ago(Justin Gage) who I have seen play on many occasions. Certainly I haven't seen all of his games, but from I have seen he really looks like he would fit in with what our needs are. I also put in my post that EVERY PLAYER IN THE DRAFT IS A CRAPSHOOT and I think that hopefully the other posters would certainly take that in the light that I am proclaiming that I am not an expert and thos who think they are simply are fooling themselves right into oblivian. Hell, even Mel Kiper is a Legend in his own mind...Although Mel does his homework it would certainly be nice for him to at least acknowledge that a big part of being a draft guru is luck, guessing and taking calculated risks.

But Remember that's what makes up these boards and it is certainly in everyone's right to unload their form of BS whenever they so desire!

Thank you! I appreciate the feedback and am glad to realize I am not the only one who sees the egotists. I realize this is a sports board, but all I am saying is for the board gestapos to cool the attacks when someone expressess interest in drafting someone. Getting the "you have never seen him play!!!!" thrown into your face is not cool.

 

[stlouiecard]

Re: Re: Re: How high can you stack the BS?

Originally posted by Ryanwb
Thank you! I appreciate the feedback and am glad to realize I am not the only one who sees the egotists. I realize this is a sports board, but all I am saying is for the board gestapos to cool the attacks when someone expressess interest in drafting someone. Getting the "you have never seen him play!!!!" thrown into your face is not cool.

I know what you mean. It wasn't but a few weeks back that I had started a thread that posed the idea that the Cards should make a serious attempt to resign LJ Shelton and if Shelton refused or was interested in holding out for free agency next season that I would offer him up for trade bait. I still think that this a good idea. Sure enough, a couple of posters came along and all of a sudden I was the bad guy because I want to trade LJ Shelton. Totally twisted around. I was only looking for the Cards to start protecting themselves from the losses of quality players. I mean, a team can only lose so many 1st round picks without compensation before they have no chance to build something. I like LJ Shelton and would love to keep him, but only on our teams terms not his.

Just an example of some twisting that takes place regularly.

 

[JeffGollin]

I don't recall ever reading anyone - expert or otherwise - criticized because they only watched a few (instead of all) of a draft prospect's games.

Realistically, you have a large number of people who follow the draft. They range from so-called gurus, shills for agents and players, geeks who need to get a life, geeks who don't need to get a life, casual followers of teams and various folks who fall in between.

I put out a Cardinal draft report each spring on the BRS. 85% of what I post are comparative recaps of what various gurus say about the top 10 players by position. That way, it's up to the reader to read various opinions about each player and decide for themselves.

I also present my own analysis of top ten players by positions, based on (a) what I see (from game tapes) and (b) what I read and hear. In a perfect world, I'd base everything on personal observation, but (unless someone wants to pay me $65,000 to switch day jobs) there's not enough time in the 24 hour day. So I do the best I can. But usually I tell the reader whether I saw the dude or whether I'm basing my opinion on the facts and"body language" of what someone else said.

My point - we all do the best we can with what we've got. In the end, it doesn't really matter how each of us arrived at our conclusions - just the degree we tend to be right or wrong. Then it's up to anyone who reads, listens or enters into the debate with us to take us seriously or not seriously as they see fit.

What I don't understand is the rage behind bulletin board posts - just because someone has the "audacity" to suggest that they think your favorite player sucks (or vice versa). It's only football for chrissakes - why can't we agree to disagree? Lively debate is the whole point of following the draft. (If we all agreed, there'd be nothing to post).

Besides. The ultimate evaluator of who's good or not so good at scoping out the draft is the draft itself and how players and teams do later on. (That's why I leave one year's of BRS prognostication up for 12 months - It hangs me out to dry and is usually quite humbling).

Having said that - It is amusing to see how various beat writers report the draft. The shrewd ones in the NYC area publish nothing until the very last minute - after nearly all the trades have been made and they've had the chance to network with their various writer friends in other cities. They usually shine on draft day because their information is fresher than what magazine writers or draft publication publishers have to work with.

 

[Ed B]

Originally posted by JeffGollin
geeks who need to get a life, geeks who don't need to get a life

There's a gray area between the two that I desperately try to straddle.

 

[BuckeyeCardinal]

Gee

I thought the net and forums like this were for fun and therapy. Therapy as to getting things off our chest and fun as to sharing views with fans of your team.

Many of us have seen these guys play....we all read.....and we can smell bull$hit a mile away.


This isn't the only forum I frequent and there are less EXPERTS here than in others......EXPERTS as in people who think they are....no one here really takes themselves that seriously....do they?

 

[SECTION 11]

Re: Gee

Originally posted by BuckeyeCardinal
no one here really takes themselves that seriously....do they?

I do.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Re: Re: Gee

Originally posted by SECTION 11
I do.

That reply next to Martin Short is one of the funniest things I have ever seen. I'm satying off the war thread - arguing about sports is much more fun and there's nothing really at stake.