Illini get screwed

[Dback Jon]

Horrible, horrible officiating in the Washington - Illinois game.

Only two frickin free throws for Illinois in the second half, while Washington took 20+

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Has Illinois ever legitimately lost a Tournament game? Every year it seems to be the ref's fault.

 

[Dback Jon]

Yes, they have had a couple of bad games the past two years (and don't think that thought didn't cross my mind Sunday). The only other time I can remember refs screwing Illinois in the tourney was in 1988, when we played in the Elite 8 against Kentucky AT Kentucky - that was a bad homer job.


BTW - did you watch the Illinois-Washington game?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I seem to recall some complaining about the officiating in last year's title game. I thought the game was officiated poorly, but Illinois lost because Dee Brown was ineffective and stopped giving Augustine touches.

 

[Dback Jon]

I seem to recall some complaining about the officiating in last year's title game. I thought the game was officiated poorly, but Illinois lost because Dee Brown was ineffective and stopped giving Augustine touches.

Yup - that was the other game that I complained about as referenced above. It was hard for Illinois to run their offense with half the team on the bench due to phantom fouls.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

So it's the ref's fault Dee shot 5-18 and Jamar Smith went cold from the field?

I don't want to pile on, but I've always thought the referee excuse is a cop-out. Some Arizona fans have whined about the offficials in certain games over the past few years but I never bought into it. Great teams overcome bad officiating, other teams use it as an excuse for why they lost.

 

[Dback Jon]

Oh - Illinois could have played better, but it is criminal when the refs don't allow the teams to play, and clearly Illinois was not allowed to get into their rythym. Washington had a lot to do with it, but if you are going to call hand-checking fouls on one team, you need to call them on both. The Huskies did not play a clean game, and should have been called for many defensive fouls.

 

[Russ Smith]

I'll be honest, I'm probably Pac 10 biased but I thought UW just played smarter than Illinois. UW had a 14 point lead when 3 plays in a row UW took a charge that was called a block and Illinois got 3 three point plays. 2 of those were bad calls, the 3rd was 50/50 so you can take it. That was the 3rd time in the first half that Brandon Roy had clearly taken a charge and all he had to show for it was one no call and 2 block fouls.

It seemed to me that at the half Romar decided look guys they are not going to call the charge, so let's go to the basket. Once Illinois started getting fouls, even though UW was behind, you could see what was coming, UW was going to parade to the line. The final total appeared very one sided but if the story I read this morning was right, UW took 15 3's in the game, only 5 in the 2nd half, and Illinois took 18, 12 in the 2nd half. Seems to me UW figured out they weren't calling charges so take the ball to the rim, while Illinois was settling for 3's too much? Augustine was killing UW but Illinois stopped going to him.

I found this quote in the game story that seems to be Dee Brown admitting they were fouling a lot.

Illinois was called for 28 fouls and the Huskies 17.

"They were physical. They were banging me," Roy said. "I came off screens and they were grabbing me."

Said Brown: "We were hacking more. We were undisciplined on defense."

I will say this, if that was UCLA not Illinois I'd be complaining too, so I suspect I'm just biased because I'm a big Brandon Roy fan, but I really felt like UW figured out that Illinois was grabbing guys coming off screens and so they started going to Roy a lot knowing they could get Illinois in foul trouble.

Tough game to watch though, the fouls took the whole flow away. That same thing happened the 2nd time UCLA played UW the refs were calling fouls (both ways) like crazy.

 

[Russ Smith]

FWIW, Jay Bilas was just calling in to Mike and Mike and he said the same thing I just wrote. he said UW was smarter, they realized that Illinois had picked up a few quick fouls early in the 2nd half, they realized the refs weren't calling charges, so they made a concerted effort to drive the ball and draw fouls. He said Illinois settled for too many jumpers.

he said if you just look at the attempts it looks oneside, and yeah there were mystery calls(he said both ways) during the game, but he said in the end, UW simply took advantage of a situation they recognized, and Illinois didn't.

So if Bilas agrees with me, I must be wrong.

 

[Southpaw]

Nothing against Illinois, but Big 10 basketball resembles Big 10 Football. Maybe it did catch up to Illinois, but that is Big 10 style ball. Just pound the opponent and the refs might get tired of calling the fouls. This time it didn't work. Maybe the NCAA has decided to curtail the muggings.

BTW, the Big 10 is now outta the Tournament. Nobody left.

 

[DWKB]

Nothing against Illinois, but Big 10 basketball resembles Big 10 Football. Maybe it did catch up to Illinois, but that is Big 10 style ball. Just pound the opponent and the refs might get tired of calling the fouls. This time it didn't work. Maybe the NCAA has decided to curtail the muggings.

BTW, the Big 10 is now outta the Tournament. Nobody left.

This is true with the Big 12 as well. Much rougher style of play. I think a lot of it has to do with where the refs come from. You take a Pac 10 school against a Big 10 school in the tournament and throw in ACC refs, the Pac 10 gets the advantage. Throw in Big 12 refs, the Big 10 gets the advantage.

 

[Russ Smith]

This is true with the Big 12 as well. Much rougher style of play. I think a lot of it has to do with where the refs come from. You take a Pac 10 school against a Big 10 school in the tournament and throw in ACC refs, the Pac 10 gets the advantage. Throw in Big 12 refs, the Big 10 gets the advantage.

that's the key to the UCLA/Gonzaga game tonight IMHO. If UCLA is allowed to play their physical Big East style defense I think they win, if the refs call it tight(like the 2nd UCLA/UW game), I think UCLA is in trouble because Morrison and Batista shoot a lot of FT's and very well. If the refs are calling it close, UCLA is going to watch Gonzaga parade to the line the way Illinois watched UW, or they're going to have to adjust their style and that's not easy to do at this point in a season.

 

[Dback Jon]

This is true with the Big 12 as well. Much rougher style of play. I think a lot of it has to do with where the refs come from. You take a Pac 10 school against a Big 10 school in the tournament and throw in ACC refs, the Pac 10 gets the advantage. Throw in Big 12 refs, the Big 10 gets the advantage.

yup - we play basketball like real men in the middle of the country, not that wimpy, sensative kind played on the coasts.....

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Lute has called before to get rid of conference officiating. I don't think it's a realistic solution, but it would be nice to have every official hearing the same thing instead of there being noticeable differences between each conference.

And what DBack Jon calles "real" basketball, I call football with a hoop.

 

[Dback Jon]

Lute has called before to get rid of conference officiating. I don't think it's a realistic solution, but it would be nice to have every official hearing the same thing instead of there being noticeable differences between each conference.

And what DBack Jon calles "real" basketball, I call football with a hoop.

That would be a good idea - bring some uniformity to officiating, and let the game be decided on the court by the players.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Jon - Did you watch the UConn-UW game last night? UW got absolutely hosed and kpet swinging nback. They might have lost, but they overcame the officials and probably should have won the game. Much, much props to Romar and the Dogs.

 

[Dback Jon]

Jon - Did you watch the UConn-UW game last night? UW got absolutely hosed and kpet swinging nback. They might have lost, but they overcame the officials and probably should have won the game. Much, much props to Romar and the Dogs.

I missed that game, but understand that the officiating was horrific - which is too bad, 'cause I want UW to win that one.