Is Cardinals franchise regressing?

[Stout]

We can agree to disagree all day. For one thing, the defense will be much better when it comes to stopping the run. The few DL that we brought in vis FA may not be outstanding from an individual standpoint, but JG’s system of rotation will make these additions matter a ton! Who we had manning those positions last year made it impossible to not only stop the run, but to also made it impossible for the edge guys to get home too. Your edge guys are at a distinct disadvantage when your interior creates NOTHING up the middle. And as the injuries mounted on the interior, the opportunities for sacks completely went away. As pathetic as our run D became over time, this defense was literally never in 3rd and longs, which is the ideal situation for your edge guys to get more sacks. Hell, there were games late in the season when teams never ran a 3rd down play. We have very good safeties, we have a bevy of young, aggressive CB’s, and our LB play is vastly underrated. Even without Ojulari, this D will hurt people. As far as the offense is concerned, we ended up like 7th in the league in rushing, and that was with teams knowing that we had ZERO coming from the WR position. Petzing is an outstanding coordinator. He had teams guessing and being wrong with how to stop our run. Adding depth to the OL, adding MHJ, Zay Jones, a super confident Dortch, a hopefully healthier Wilson, Chris Moore, a run blocking beast in Reiman, a top 3 TE in McBride, a beast Benson to back up Conner, and a very deep RB room, and Murray poised to have an MVP like season, there’s no way that this offense won’t be elite. Of course, it’ll all hinge on Murray staying healthy for the most part. It’s OK if he misses a game or two, but he can’t have a major injury. Like any team in the NFL, the QB being healthy is paramount. I see this team winning 9-11 games, even with a brutal early schedule.

I want to engage in this discussion, but I need paragraph breaks to read this

 

[Stout]

Yeah..it's hard not to get impatient. But this year is really the first year of the build. Last year was all about tearing it down, installing the system, and tweaking the culture. This huge 12 pick draft class was the first steps towards rebuild... Paris last year, but we needed an OT anyway... we really need at least 6 of the 12 to hit...3 of 7 is usually considered an average to decent draft...so 6 of 12 is pretty good without being unrealistic expectations...

How not to rebuild a franchise lol If you can't simultaneously build year one while you're tearing it down, then you're not a competent NFL GM. The excuse making on this board is astounding.

Note: This is not saying I think Monti wasn't trying to build last year, too.

 

[THESMEL]

Steves Wilkes may be available tird tumblers

 

[Harry]

Get the St. Louis city fathers on the phone and ask them to makes us an offer.

Unless owneership changes, I think they might pay you to keep them.

 

[Outerlimits]

Wouldn't it make more sense to see how the team actually does this year?

We are in year 2 of an entire new regime, and our franchise QB missed most of Year 1. Yes, we all know the later Keim years were a complete dumpster fire. Michael Bidwill letting an alcoholic who hops behind the wheel make the decisions not shockingly was disastrous.

However, it seems our new coach is really good. Plus it seems he brought in very competent staff(especially OC).

Many here mocked all the young people Gannon was choosing under him, yet the team was competitive despite a horrific roster on paper.

I'm cautiously optimistic about Monti. Sure, I can nitpick some stuff, but it is early days for him still and overall I like the strategy. I hope it works.

Main concern is obviously the defense and the ridiculously brutal schedule first half of the season

 

[Garthshort]

Unless owneership changes, I think they might pay you to keep them.

I follow the baseball Cardinals, through the St. Louis Post Dispatch, and they actually like MB, the person. He's a SLU alum and has been a supporter of various civic charities over the years. The owner they do HATE is Stan Kroenke (Rams) who really screwed the city. They are very anxious to get an NFL team. And their fans are very loyal.

 

[slanidrac16]

Wouldn't it make more sense to see how the team actually does this year?

We are in year 2 of an entire new regime, and our franchise QB missed most of Year 1. Yes, we all know the later Keim years were a complete dumpster fire. Michael Bidwill letting an alcoholic who hops behind the wheel make the decisions not shockingly was disastrous.

However, it seems our new coach is really good. Plus it seems he brought in very competent staff(especially OC).

Many here mocked all the young people Gannon was choosing under him, yet the team was competitive despite a horrific roster on paper.

I'm cautiously optimistic about Monti. Sure, I can nitpick some stuff, but it is early days for him still and overall I like the strategy. I hope it works.

Main concern is obviously the defense and the ridiculously brutal schedule first half of the season

How soon we forget the total dumpster fire Monty took over. If we compete for a playoff spot this year it will be a terrific job.

 

[PACardsFan]

We get one or two really good seasons from the Cardinals each decade. Then mediocre to awful teams after that.

In the ‘90s we had Jake Plummer beating the Cowboys in the playoffs.

In the aughts we had Kurt Warner taking us to the Superbowl.

Last decade we had a loaded team with our best head coach, Bruce Arians, getting us into the playoffs a few times.

The Cardinals will probably have a brush with greatness this decade, too. I really like our current coaching staff and GM. But Michael Bidwill is a lousy owner and I don’t think he knows how to create a top tier franchise

You’re forgetting some really good teams in the 60’s (QB was Charley Johnson). We were 9-5 (1963), 9-3-2 (64), 8-5-1 (67), 9-4-1 (68). Unfortunately, we were in the same division with Cleveland & there were no wildcards back then. The 70’s had 4 really good teams under Jim Hart, winning the NFC East in 74 & 75. We missed the playoffs in 76 with a 10-4 record. But, we couldn’t sustain it because Bill Bidwill was a horrible owner and fired a good coach (Charley Winner) and a HOF coach (Coryell).

They interviewed Michael last night at halftime. He was very clear that he hired MOJG because they had the best plans to create sustained success. Whether or not they accomplish that remains to be seen, but sustained success has NEVER been a philosophical approach with this franchise. Not ever! And because of that, I’m more excited about where this organization is, and where they’re heading.

 

[Cardsmasochist]

You’re forgetting some really good teams in the 60’s (QB was Charley Johnson). We were 9-5 (1963), 9-3-2 (64), 8-5-1 (67), 9-4-1 (68). Unfortunately, we were in the same division with Cleveland & there were no wildcards back then. The 70’s had 4 really good teams under Jim Hart, winning the NFC East in 74 & 75. We missed the playoffs in 76 with a 10-4 record. But, we couldn’t sustain it because Bill Bidwill was a horrible owner and fired a good coach (Charley Winner) and a HOF coach (Coryell).

They interviewed Michael last night at halftime. He was very clear that he hired MOJG because they had the best plans to create sustained success. Whether or not they accomplish that remains to be seen, but sustained success has NEVER been a philosophical approach with this franchise. Not ever! And because of that, I’m more excited about where this organization is, and where they’re heading.

Absolutely true!

I was focusing on the team since they moved to AZ. Gene Stallings was a good coach. So was Don “Air” Coryall

 

[PACardsFan]

Absolutely true!

I was focusing on the team since they moved to AZ. Gene Stallings was a good coach. So was Don “Air” Coryall

Yes, Stallings was a good coach. He would have had far more success if Lomax’s career hadn’t abruptly ended when it did. Whiz was a good coach also. But, again, the Cardinals had no idea how to sustain success, so they never had a plan to replace Warner or how to build depth.

 

[Chopper0080]

Crazy how low the bar has been set and accepted by fans. The unpredictability of sports is what makes them great. Going from purposely tanking in one offseason to purposely leaving significant holes on the roster while sitting on 30 mil with a QB entering his prime is tough to tolerate. The franchise (Bidwill) just does not seem to be interested in being a franchise serious about winning.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Crazy how low the bar has been set and accepted by fans. The unpredictability of sports is what makes them great. Going from purposely tanking in one offseason to purposely leaving significant holes on the roster while sitting on 30 mil with a QB entering his prime is tough to tolerate. The franchise (Bidwill) just does not seem to be interested in being a franchise serious about winning.

Sad, but true

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

The Cardinals are different than the huge majority of NFL franchises since they are THE business of the Bidwills. Most NFL owners make a kabillion dollars in some other way and so don't worry about profit margin and spend big. Mike has certainly spent more than his Dad. But it's not like is making dough elsewhere to cover the big amount of dead money he is still paying the past coaches and GM, players. So, tighten the purse strings on current roster.

Just my view of it.

The Giants, Steelers, Colts, Raiders and even the Bengals don’t seem to have problems spending money and they’re all the family business.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I think we all agree that the coaching is head and shoulders above the KK crap show.

 

[Chopper0080]

I think we all agree that the coaching is head and shoulders above the KK crap show.

Yes though if that results in wins is still to be seen.

 

[TRW]

You’re forgetting some really good teams in the 60’s (QB was Charley Johnson). We were 9-5 (1963), 9-3-2 (64), 8-5-1 (67), 9-4-1 (68). Unfortunately, we were in the same division with Cleveland & there were no wildcards back then. The 70’s had 4 really good teams under Jim Hart, winning the NFC East in 74 & 75. We missed the playoffs in 76 with a 10-4 record. But, we couldn’t sustain it because Bill Bidwill was a horrible owner and fired a good coach (Charley Winner) and a HOF coach (Coryell).

They interviewed Michael last night at halftime. He was very clear that he hired MOJG because they had the best plans to create sustained success. Whether or not they accomplish that remains to be seen, but sustained success has NEVER been a philosophical approach with this franchise. Not ever! And because of that, I’m more excited about where this organization is, and where they’re heading.

What is depressing is that the 60's and 70's were the winningest decades for this team. Each decade they had FOUR winning seasons and ONE .500 season. They've had 19 non losing seasons in the last 6 DECADES.

Pretty pathetic.

 

[Garthshort]

The Giants, Steelers, Colts, Raiders and even the Bengals don’t seem to have problems spending money and they’re all the family business.

Well the Mara's (Giants) were in the same boat as us. They sold a half interest in the team to the Tisch family, who are super rich. So, now they have all the money that they need.

 

[PACardsFan]

What is depressing is that the 60's and 70's were the winningest decades for this team. Each decade they had FOUR winning seasons and ONE .500 season. They've had 19 non losing seasons in the last 6 DECADES.

Pretty pathetic.

Very depressing indeed. They consistently had good to great OL’s in the 60’s & 70’s. I’ve been following this team for an eternity, and I can count on one hand how many good defenses they’ve had. The closest thing to a great D they had was wasted when we had to play Lindley down the stretch & into the playoffs. If Palmer had stayed healthy, that team (2014?) was better than the 2015 team & could have gone very deep into the playoffs.

 

[Chopper0080]

The toughest part for fans is that it takes time for a franchise to establish credibility when they have been as awful as the Cardinals have been. Reputation, wins, stability, and a willingness to spend are some hallmarks of top franchises. If Monti and Gannon are still around in 8 years, and their tenure in AZ is above a .500 win rate...that's when this convo changes.

Up to this point, there are always "buts" that accompany any improvement which are deserved. A lot of this is because much of the Cardinals success almost comes by accident. Warner. Arians. Kliff/Keim playoff appearance. All seem like probability outliers vs actual planned moves which led to success.

 

[oaken1]

The toughest part for fans is that it takes time for a franchise to establish credibility when they have been as awful as the Cardinals have been. Reputation, wins, stability, and a willingness to spend are some hallmarks of top franchises. If Monti and Gannon are still around in 8 years, and their tenure in AZ is above a .500 win rate...that's when this convo changes.

Up to this point, there are always "buts" that accompany any improvement which are deserved. A lot of this is because much of the Cardinals success almost comes by accident. Warner. Arians. Kliff/Keim playoff appearance. All seem like probability outliers vs actual planned moves which led to success.

Yeah... it's the whole. Blind squirrel/Nut thing with a Bidwill in charge.

 

[GeorgiaCard88]

Definitely on the incline. I could write paragraphs echoing the belivers above, but the signs are there- blocks are being laid on a barren foundation for success. Don't expect immediate results, I have to remind myself constantly, but have to believe that the future is brighter for us.

 

[FB94]

We’ve had coaches who have had success over a window of time but it always seems to be in very short blocks. Is that on the coach not Being able to adapt, combined with poor front office performance keeping team growth going. JG and MO have injected some positive attributes thus far, but real test is if they can keep getting better year over year, and show consistent results. Would like nothing more than a 10 year run with the cards staying ahead of the curve. I think the new staff and front office still have a bit of a honeymoon period for this year, but year three is the first real marker for me.

 

[Totally_Red]

I really like the MOJG team and am hopeful that the sustained success stuff is real. The build through the draft model has worked well in GB.

If JG puts together a good season the Cardinals will be a more preferred FA destination instead of one where you have to overpay to attract and sign top tier talent.

 

[Mainstreet]

The key to the Cardinals future is Monti Ossenfort. He has to be the guy to turn it around, especially on a budget.

It starts with the GM.

 

[ajcardfan]

I really like the MOJG team and am hopeful that the sustained success stuff is real. The build through the draft model has worked well in GB.

If JG puts together a good season the Cardinals will be a more preferred FA destination instead of one where you have to overpay to attract and sign top tier talent.

If they want sustained success then this needs to be a real playoff contending, or playoff bound, year. Personally, I think another 4-13 season, 5-12, etc, will totally take the wind out of the sails. It will mean we have a QB issue and draft picks who are not doing well. So what if we have strong draft position in 2025? We had a great draft picks value in 2024 also. Free agents won't be expecting the next draft here to do much. "Same old Cardinals". That will be what free agents think of this franchise if we bomb yet another season.