kelvin Sampson ugh

Russ Smith

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Unreal he can't even go a year on probation for violating rules for phone calls to recruits at OU, without doing it again now at Indiana. THe hoosiers have self reported at least 10 phone calls to recruits that violated NCAA rules because they were 3 way calls with Sampson, and assistant, and a recruit on the line together. Not sure why 3 way calls are against the rules but they are.

Sampson said only 1 of the 10 in question did he know it was a 3 way call, but he agrees he failed to live up to his mandate. He loses a 500k bonus, IU lost a scholarship and the info is forwarded to the NCAA to let them decide
what if anything else they will do with the case.
 

Skkorpion

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Doesn't matter. Loss of 1 scholarship is no big deal. Indiana knew Sampson was a cheater when they hired him.

As long as Sampson wins, nobody will care.

Cheating in college sports is so prevalent, it's not an issue with me any more. Schools should be allowed to set their own rules.

They do in every other issue. They individually decide on student admission standards, student body diversity in race, geographic origin, male/female proportions and many other factors. ASU gives illegal immigrants special scholarship opportunities not available to many of their other students.

The point is simple. Indiana's money is theirs to spend any way they wish. Is it fair? Who cares? Nothing in life is fair.
 
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Russ Smith

Russ Smith

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Doesn't matter. Loss of 1 scholarship is no big deal. Indiana knew Sampson was a cheater when they hired him.

As long as Sampson wins, nobody will care.

Cheating in college sports is so prevalent, it's not an issue with me any more. Schools should be allowed to set their own rules.

They do in every other issue. They individually decide on student admission standards, student body diversity in race, geographic origin, male/female proportions and many other factors. ASU gives illegal immigrants special scholarship opportunities not available to many of their other students.

The point is simple. Indiana's money is theirs to spend any way they wish. Is it fair? Who cares? Nothing in life is fair.

I actually commend IU for doing what they did although obviously if they cared that much why hire Sampson to begin with? And nobody seemed to care when he was hiring 2 coaches to get super recruit Eric Gordon.

When they change the rules to what you advocate I'll agree with you, but right now the rules are what they are and coaches who willfully violate them should not keep getting hired and given huge amounts of money because they win games.
 

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IU must clean house

Maybe he goes. 3rd year in a row at 2 different schools he lost a $500,000 bonus for the same recruiting infractions.

IndyStar.com Columnists Bob Kravitz
October 15, 2007

Kravitz: IU must clean house

At this point, Indiana University doesn't just have the right to fire coach Kelvin Sampson for just cause. It has a moral imperative to close the book on his short and sordid stewardship of the school's once-storied basketball program.

Happier times: Indiana University athletic director Rick Greenspan (left, seated) and basketball coach Kelvin Sampson share a laugh in March 2006, when Sampson was introduced as the Hoosiers' coach. Trouble following recruiting rules has followed the coach from Oklahoma. - Sam Riche / The Star

And once Sampson is gone, send athletic director Rick Greenspan on his way, as well. Maybe they can carpool.

Sampson was Greenspan's signature hire after Mike Davis was sent packing, a signature hire who came here with an NCAA storm cloud hanging over his head and a dubious history with graduation rates. Now, IU and a local law firm have uncovered additional phone-related improprieties, some more major than others. And while the school's grandstanding decision to self-report might assuage its institutional guilt, it will not alter the emerging view of IU as a sleazy operator.

You hire a guy with issues, you get a guy with issues. For whatever reason -- maybe hubris? -- Sampson doesn't seem to possess an accurate moral compass. It would be one thing if he was nailed for jaywalking. That, you can almost overlook, or at least forgive, the way you forgave Bob Knight all those hundreds of times.

But another phone violation? What part of the NCAA-imposed sanctions were so difficult to understand?

You can tell yourself these were minor violations, no big deal, a few calls among many thousands. But when you're talking about Sampson, and talking about a university that hired him and contractually stipulated it could fire him at the first hint of indiscretion, it's a big deal. A very big deal.
A lot of the talk Sunday centered around the approximately 10 conference calls, some initiated by the recruit, some initiated by an assistant coach, all eventually involving Sampson.

The real story, though, the one that was casually dismissed as an afterthought, was that IU assistant coaches made about 35 phone calls to recruits that were in violation of the NCAA limit to individual recruits.
In other words, all the same nonsense that got Sampson into trouble in the first place.

From the beginning of Sampson's house arrest, it has been fair to wonder how seriously the program was taking the penalty.

The letter of the NCAA law stipulated for one year, he could not call recruits, coaches or parents. That's when Sampson discovered what all of America's teenagers know: Text messaging is the way to communicate these days. By rule, texting was not a violation. It was just a giant loophole. By texting instead of calling, Sampson was following the letter of the law while flouting the spirit of the law.

At least until Aug. 1, when the NCAA, reacting to life in the 21st century, banned coaches from texting their recruits.
On Sunday, I heard a lot of the same terms I heard the day Sampson was introduced to the media and asked to explain his problems at Oklahoma.
Sloppiness. Clerical errors. Mistakes. No intent to break the rules.

Why, though, does this keep happening on Sampson's watch?
I was told that Sampson's home doesn't get good cellular service -- doesn't it figure? -- and so, a lot of times, a recruit would call him and get voice mail. Then the recruit would call an assistant coach, who would patch the recruit through to Sampson on a three-way call. OK, no big deal, right?

Here's where I hold Sampson accountable, even if a member of the Ice Miller law firm investigating this matter determined the head coach was not trying to circumvent the rule in any manner. On a few occasions, the assistant coach would call the recruit/coach/parent, and then patch Sampson through so he could be part of the conversation. Maybe I'm a cynic, but on the surface, that looks like someone who is trying to sidestep the rules. He can't call the kid directly, so have an assistant call and make it a conference call.
It's also interesting that Ice Miller's report noted that 10 to 12 of the calls in question were outgoing, while just six were incoming, and there's no confirmation those six incoming calls were from recruits. This stands in stark and troubling contradiction to Sampson's assertion that all of the calls were made by recruits.

All throughout the Sunday conference call, I kept hearing this was a minor violation, an innocent mistake. So why is IU rescinding a $500,000 pay raise for Sampson and sending assistant coach Rob Senderoff to his room without dinner? These are pretty harsh penalties for a minor slip-up. History tells us the NCAA generally goes easier on schools who report their violations as opposed to those who get caught. In this case, though, IU should expect the worst. This is happening in the NCAA's back yard. It wasn't so long ago that an NCAA member issued an angry, scathing report on Sampson's Oklahoma troubles, accusing him of being a willful cheater.

As for the local reaction, I fully expect the Hoosiers hardcore fans will go into justification mode. Sampson has not only established himself as a winner, but he brought home the biggest recruiting prize of the year, Eric Gordon. The Hoosiers could win the Big Ten this year. The coach is golden. If memory serves, most folks had no problem with Knight's behavioral excesses, at least until he started losing in the first round of the NCAA Tournament every year. Winning is the ultimate deodorant. No matter how badly this stinks.
 
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Russ Smith

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He won't be fired unless he loses, in my opinion.

I hope you're wrong but I expect you're dead on right.

The alumni won't call for his head because they were happy when he was hired and thrilled to get Eric Gordon.
 

abomb

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Keep it comin' Russ, I love this stuff. You are like the West-coast bureau chief for ASFN. ;)
 
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Russ Smith

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Well IU officially threw the assistant under the bus firing him and blaming him for the calls. Their official independent investigation basically concludes that Sampson had no idea that any of these calls(save 1) were 3 way calls.

oddly, several of the recruits who were involved including 3 in this years incoming class, have all said that both Sampson and the assistant were on the calls at the same time talking so Sampson HAD to know they were 3 way calls since he could hear the assistant.

http://indiana.scout.com/2/696209.html

Ought to be interesting. The NCAA has the final say on it, IU seems to think firing the assistant will solve the issue but now you have recruits directly contradicting Sampson's story?
 

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Good gawd I U just can't handle life without BB supremacy. Band aid management of this problem , at best. Rules are always meant for the other guy, I guess.
 

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Reminds me of when Penders threw his asst. under the bus at Texas for the whole grade publication thing.

As far as I know, that assistant of Penders has never gotten another college job, yet Penders marrily moved on to head coaching jobs at GW and Houston. Quite an unjust system.
 

Southpaw

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Reminds me of when Penders threw his asst. under the bus at Texas for the whole grade publication thing.

As far as I know, that assistant of Penders has never gotten another college job, yet Penders marrily moved on to head coaching jobs at GW and Houston. Quite an unjust system.

Yup.
In March of 1998, after going to the NCAA Tournament seven of the previous nine seasons, the UT men’s basketball team finished a disappointing 14-17. As mysterious rumors and behind the scenes maneuvering began to envelop the program, Coach Tom Penders made a fateful decision. He suspended freshman Luke Axtell for academic and other reasons. When Penders and his family took a vacation to the Caribbean, an unofficial grade report on Axtell was faxed to Austin radio station KVET. At the time, Assistant Coach Eddie Oran took the blame for the action that Axtell now says was a violation of the Buckley Amendment, which protects a student’s right to privacy.

After the controversy eventually led to UT buying out Penders’ contract, Penders came to GW, Axtell transferred to the University of Kansas, and Oran was not retained under the new UT coaching staff. Since then, Axtell has named KVET, UT, Athletic Director DeLoss Dodds and Penders in a lawsuit – with Oran (who now sells cars in Austin) testifying that he was ordered by Penders, with Dodds’ knowledge, to fax the grade report. Oran has also filed suit against Penders for slander and libel.
 
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Dback Jon

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The NCAA needs to fry IU - make them ineligible for the post-season THIS YEAR.

But, since former IU President Brand is now head of the NCAA, they will get a slap on the wrist.
 

Skkorpion

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Ah, Jon. Forget about the cheating, worrying about it will drive you crazy.
 
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Russ Smith

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That Axtell case is the one I was citing this offseason when Tim Floyd threw Gabe Pruitt under the bus and announced that if he had come back to USC he was going to be academically ineligible. He said he wished Gabe had stayed and put the effort in to get his grades back. The problem was, Gabe had already declared for the draft, and he dropped out to workout, and then hired an agent. So there was absolutely NO reason for Floyd to publicly comment that he would have been ineligible, he wasn't coming back to USC he'd hired an agent.

My understanding is Pruitt doesn't really hold a grudge over it but it was a same kind of situation the only reason anybody knows Pruitt was in academic trouble is because Tim Floyd announced it.
 
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Russ Smith

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FYI Scout's indiana board is reporting that Senderoff the assistant gets $66,000 in severance pay.

Not bad but as the person who posted it wrote, if he's an assistant at 99% of the schools in the country, he reports for work today, it's only because he works for Kelvin Sampson that he got into this predicament. Officially he resigned.
 

Southpaw

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FYI Scout's indiana board is reporting that Senderoff the assistant gets $66,000 in severance pay.

Not bad but as the person who posted it wrote, if he's an assistant at 99% of the schools in the country, he reports for work today, it's only because he works for Kelvin Sampson that he got into this predicament. Officially he resigned.

He is a good little soldier.
 
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Russ Smith

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He is a good little soldier.

Sounds like the immediate impact might be on recruiting, Senderoff had strong ties in New York, and IU had 3 prime targets there in 09 class. One of them just verballed to IU, the other 2 have basically said with Senderoff gone they're now re-evaluating their stance on IU. One of those 2 is Lance Stephenson the latest phenom PG at Lincoln in Brookly where Marbury and Telfair played. Stephenson is a top 5 in the country kid and his coach is saying with Senderoff gone he's not sure if IU is still in the running for Lance.

That's where you HOPE this stuff actually hurts, if a school is doing something wrong and gets caught all I can hope is that it costs them recruits so that it sends a message to DISCOURAGE them from doing it again.

Like when UW got caught doing this it cost them both Josh Heytvelt and another highly regarded prospect(name escapes me). Only reason Heytvelt went to Gonzaga was Cameron Dollar got caught breaking rules recruiting him.
 

abomb

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Sounds like the immediate impact might be on recruiting, Senderoff had strong ties in New York, and IU had 3 prime targets there in 09 class. One of them just verballed to IU, the other 2 have basically said with Senderoff gone they're now re-evaluating their stance on IU. One of those 2 is Lance Stephenson the latest phenom PG at Lincoln in Brookly where Marbury and Telfair played. Stephenson is a top 5 in the country kid and his coach is saying with Senderoff gone he's not sure if IU is still in the running for Lance.

That's where you HOPE this stuff actually hurts, if a school is doing something wrong and gets caught all I can hope is that it costs them recruits so that it sends a message to DISCOURAGE them from doing it again.

Like when UW got caught doing this it cost them both Josh Heytvelt and another highly regarded prospect(name escapes me). Only reason Heytvelt went to Gonzaga was Cameron Dollar got caught breaking rules recruiting him.

Good stuff.
 

Skkorpion

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Russ, how do you keep up with all this stuff on teams you don't even support? I'm snowed just keeping tabs on ASU, Irish, Suns and Cards.
 
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Russ Smith

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Russ, how do you keep up with all this stuff on teams you don't even support? I'm snowed just keeping tabs on ASU, Irish, Suns and Cards.

The UCLA board I read people always post stories like this and whenever there's even a remote Pac 10 angle(Sampson ex Pac 10 coach) I usually perk up my interest.

Stephenson the kid I mentioend from Brooklyn visited USC last weekend and has been saying for months he really likes UCLA(but UCLA isn't recruiting him), so even though he's in Brooklyn there's also a Pac 10 angle to him. He's basically doing what Mayo did his dad is calling colleges and saying we like you we'd like you to recruit us, IU was on that list, it's not clear now that they still are.
 

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