Kobe's lost his mind

[fordronken]

Did anyone watch that game 4 just now? As my friend put it, "He should go to court every day." Pretty incredible. Nobody in the league does it like he does, and especially not when it matters the most.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Agreed - anyone that thinks this guy would possibly screw up a team that finished 2ND TO LAST PLACE IN THE WEST is a huge homer unable to see the pure greatness and once in a generation talent and drive that this kid has. You put him and Amare together out there and just some guys that can dribble, rebound the occassional ball and hit a layup and this team would win championships.

They must do everything they can this offseason to get Kobe - he is the answer to our championship hopes and I think deep down everyone knows it.

 

[Errntknght]

Okay we just saw the upside of having such a great player. But this series isn't over and I'm betting that we'll see the downside - the Spurs will find some way to contain Kobe and take the series because none of Kobe's teamates are ready to step up their game. For instance Pop can put Duncan on Shaq and double team Kobe... I expect that to be only a game seven tactic or game six should LA win game five. The way the refs are calling these games I don't think Shaq can foul TD out.

I think the Kings-Wolves series is instructive about the make up of teams - subtitutes like Hassell and Hoiberg are stepping up as Sac focuses on slowing KG and Sam. Also the series might be quite different if the Kings had Bobby Jackson or if the Wolves had Troy Hudson - both mere substitutes.

A team like you described - Kobe, Amare and assorted odd pieces - wouldn't even make the playoffs much less contend for the title.

In any case, it's not like Kobe is sitting there waiting with bated breath while we find a way to come up the the money to offer him. Hopefully, the C's will find some way to sound him out on the idea before they commit to the chase. If not, we are a good bet to look silly for cutting off all other avenues of improvement over the summer. Even suppose that Kobe did tell the Suns he'd sign with them but come August 30th the outcome of his trial is still in doubt and he says that he needs the offer within 24 hours or he'll re-sign with LA. What would JC do then? What would you have him do?

 

[Dr. Dumas]

A team like you described - Kobe, Amare and assorted odd pieces - wouldn't even make the playoffs much less contend for the title.

I disagree with this statement. If I were to compair teams to this comment, I would have to put Houston as a team with less talent then this who made the playoffs. How about the Jazz as well.

 

[Yuma]

Don't forget, next year the west gets tougher as the Hornets, I believe, or is it the Grizzlies, come over to the west while the East gets diluted more with the Bobcats. So it will be tougher to make the playoffs next year in the west! In theory anyway!

 

[George O'Brien]

Okay we just saw the upside of having such a great player. But this series isn't over and I'm betting that we'll see the downside - the Spurs will find some way to contain Kobe and take the series because none of Kobe's teamates are ready to step up their game. For instance Pop can put Duncan on Shaq and double team Kobe... I expect that to be only a game seven tactic or game six should LA win game five. The way the refs are calling these games I don't think Shaq can foul TD out.

I'm working a weird shift so I can't see the games, but unless I missed something the home team has won every game in the second round. I am only guessing, but the refs are letting the home teams get away with more than when the same team is on the road.

I think the Kings-Wolves series is instructive about the make up of teams - subtitutes like Hassell and Hoiberg are stepping up as Sac focuses on slowing KG and Sam. Also the series might be quite different if the Kings had Bobby Jackson or if the Wolves had Troy Hudson - both mere substitutes.

Miami is the only second round team with a really short bench. I think depth is underrated because being able to sustain game long intensity is crucial to winning at this level

A team like you described - Kobe, Amare and assorted odd pieces - wouldn't even make the playoffs much less contend for the title.

I think the Suns will have enough talent to compete for the playoffs with or without Kobe. But I agree with your main point which is that the whole rotation is what matters and not just two players.

In any case, it's not like Kobe is sitting there waiting with bated breath while we find a way to come up the the money to offer him. Hopefully, the C's will find some way to sound him out on the idea before they commit to the chase. If not, we are a good bet to look silly for cutting off all other avenues of improvement over the summer. Even suppose that Kobe did tell the Suns he'd sign with them but come August 30th the outcome of his trial is still in doubt and he says that he needs the offer within 24 hours or he'll re-sign with LA. What would JC do then? What would you have him do?

I'm not sure the answer is "JC will know" before he he has to make those decisions. Will we criticize the Colangelos if they don't "everything they can" to position themselves to possibly get Kobe, just because they don't know?

 

[carey]

Don't forget, next year the west gets tougher as the Hornets, I believe, or is it the Grizzlies, come over to the west while the East gets diluted more with the Bobcats.

Memphis is already in the Western Conference. It's the Hornets that will be moving over.

 

[George O'Brien]

It is quite likely that four teams in the west will fail to make the playoffs in spite of having better records than playoff teams in the East. This season Utah and Portland just missed. New Orleans has a competitive team and I think the Suns will be vastly improved. Only Golden State promises to be substantially worse next season and the Clippers are always the Clippers.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

A team like you described - Kobe, Amare and assorted odd pieces - wouldn't even make the playoffs much less contend for the title.


Even suppose that Kobe did tell the Suns he'd sign with them but come August 30th the outcome of his trial is still in doubt and he says that he needs the offer within 24 hours or he'll re-sign with LA. What would JC do then? What would you have him do?

To part 1, assuming the suns keep their same team (not resiging dice or getting vujanic), but add Kobe, they will definitely make the playoffs, and could very well compete for home court advantage.

The Mavs are on the downward trend, the Lakers would be done for. That leave the Wolves, Spurs and maybe the Kings (depending how their summer goes) as locks for the top 4. I think a suns team with Kobe would beat out Memphis, Denver, Houston, Dallas or a Kobeless LA (most likely payton and malone less too), any day of the week.


To part 2. For the last time, the trial is irrelevent. If he signs, and is found guilty shortly after, he contract is voided. Done. Gone. Has no affect on the cap next summer. There is a very minimal risk with signing Kobe before the trial is complete.

I will acknowledge a PR hit would be pretty big, but I bet the chance of getting a top 5 talent, combined with the very small chance of a conviction would allow any team, including the suns to "gamble" on signing him before a verdict is made.

 

[Joe Mama]

I know we could "what if" this to death, bull what if he is not convicted but clearly guilty ala O.J. Simpson? Even if he isn't clearly guilty, what if it looks like he probably did it? I don't think it's as easy as innocent or guilty. Are the fans in Arizona going to support a player like that?

Let's not forget that Kobe Bryant has a tendency to dominate the ball and the shots on a team with Shaquille O'Neal, Karl Malone, and Gary Payton. I don't imagine Amare Stoudemire will be happy if he can't get the ball from Bryant. There's always team chemistry to consider.

It's not so cut and dry. All of the possibilities for the Phoenix Suns this summer are starting to give me a headache. I just wish something would happen. Of course I would rather that they were in this position than strapped with $60 million in salary for a team going nowhere.

Joe Mama

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Are the fans in Arizona going to support a player like that?

Yes. Most people don't care about their own ethics, let alone those of other people. If Kobe Bryant comes to this team, and helps lead this team to a championship, it would rarely come up. Of course, if he were on another team, anytime he came to town he would get booed. Or, if the suns underachieved, people would instantly start citing his trial as a reason to trade him all of a sudden.

 

[elindholm]

I'm working a weird shift so I can't see the games, but unless I missed something the home team has won every game in the second round.

The Kings and Wolves have each won once on the road so far in their series.

 

[Errntknght]

George >>I'm working a weird shift so I can't see the games, but unless I missed something the home team has won every game in the second round. I am only guessing, but the refs are letting the home teams get away with more than when the same team is on the road. <<

I have seen almost no 'home team' favoritism on the part of the refs. They are letting the guys play as much or more as I've ever seen them do - even in the playoffs. Now and then they forget themselves and call a tickytack foul but by and large they're waiting until it's something that clearly affects the play of the game and they have no doubts about the foul being committed. Flops are rarely being rewarded. Too bad they can't ref like this all the time.
>>I think the Suns will have enough talent to compete for the playoffs with or without Kobe. But I agree with your main point which is that the whole rotation is what matters and not just two players.<<

I think Kobe added to this team probably gets them into the playoffs. I don't consider Marion and JJ to be typical of 'various, odd pieces' that I and the guy I quoted alluded to. Of course, he may consider them just that - but it sounded to me that he was saying the dregs of the league would do.

>>I'm not sure the answer is "JC will know" before he he has to make those decisions. Will we criticize the Colangelos if they don't "everything they can" to position themselves to possibly get Kobe, just because they don't know?<<

I don't know what the answer is either. Earlier you've stated that the odds of the Suns getting Kobe are 1 in 20 and that that low probability should be factored in the decision of what steps to take to clear cap space. I really have no idea of whether 1 in 20 is right but I sure agree that if it is then we shouldn't do 'everything possible' to clear cap space and hold it for Kobe. Are you switching into the 'do everything possible' camp despite the low odds? (Doing everything possible includes trading away the #1 pick should we luck out in the lottery. I base this on your analysis of the finances involved...)

 

[JCSunsfan]

Yes. Most people don't care about their own ethics, let alone those of other people.

That is truly a sad thing.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

That is truly a sad thing.

No debate here

 

[cly2tw]

Franchise players, by definition, imply that it's easy to build a contender surrounding them. With an Amare/Kobe core, without Marion and JJ, we'd have tons of cap room to sign the Marshalls, Jim Jacksons, Harprings, Hassles, Hoibergs, Bobby Jacksons of the world. Adding these players to an Amare/Marion/JJ core, however, won't get us far in the playoffs.