LeBron James may be the best ever...

sly fly

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I'll go on record as saying that LeBron James is a first team All-NBA player THIS YEAR. At 18 years of age.

He's starting to throw up freakish numbers. Tonight against Portland, he goes 32/10/9.

He's a true leader.

Someone check this kids birth certificate.
 

slinslin

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He isn't better than Kobe, TMac, Pierce, Iverson, Kidd or Marbury yet.

In a few individual games he is but not on a consistant basis.
 
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sly fly

sly fly

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Would you trade any one of those players straight up for Lebron?

I think I would (with maybe the possible exception of Kobe).
 

DaFlogger

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No way is this guy 18 years old! Just look at him, his physical features make him look at least mid-20's. Either he's a freak of nature or some kind foul play is going on...

Just my opinion.
 

Chaplin

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There's really only one player I'd ever trade for anybody--no matter who it is, and that player is Kevin Garnett. Tim Duncan to a lesser degree.

That said, his statistics are nice, but don't get carried away. He's a very valuable commodity but certainly shouldn't be considered the best of anything. Maybe best high school player, but that's it right now.
 

slinslin

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Originally posted by sly fly
Would you trade any one of those players straight up for Lebron?

I think I would (with maybe the possible exception of Kobe).

I would probably throw in Marion even if Lebron made as much salary as both combined.
 

Joe Mama

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Originally posted by slinslin
He isn't better than Kobe, TMac, Pierce, Iverson, Kidd or Marbury yet.

In a few individual games he is but not on a consistant basis.

Right now I'm not sure I would put Marbury in the same class as any of those other players either.

Joe Mama
 

matt_whitlock

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I dunno. From what I've seen of the guy, he's kind of awkward. His handle is fair at best, and the same could be said about his jumper. He's a very good leaper in the open court, but in traffic he seems to have trouble elevating above the rest of the defense. Has anybody else noticed this? If he gets his two steps in stride, he'll jump over anybody, but when he's dribbling down the lane and goes in the air, he usually has to contort his body, shoot a bad shot, and then go get the rebound and put it in.

He's certainly not half as good a scorer as TMac, Kobe, Marbury, Garnett, Carter, Pierce, or those guys. Not that he can't put up 20+ point games, but I don't see him doing that on a consistent basis until he develops a more versatile repetoire of shots. Right now, he is okay scoring going to the basket, is usually out of control going away from it, and his midrange game leaves much to be desired. I'd say he has about the scoring prowess of a more shot-conscious Jason Kidd. He's not a great shooter but can make shots, not overly creative off the dribble but can get to the hoop, and not great with the fadeaway jumper, but he will knock it down with a consistency that instills at least relative confidence in his fans.

He's more physically developed than Kobe or TMac were at 18, but I'm not sure he's any better. I never really cared about those two when they were younger because 1) they were on the Lakers and Raptors, 2) everybody seemed to say they were overrated (although, when everybody says they're overrated, they're not really rated that high afterall), and 3) they never got a lot of minutes. Anyway, it's hard to compare the players with Lebron because Lebron has known for about 2 years now that he was going to go to the NBA and be expected to carry whatever team he was on, and for some weird reason his physical maturation process seemed to suggest that this was alright. Just because Kobe Bryant didn't quite mature into an NBA body until he was 21 doesn't make him any less good. Maybe he'll be able to play until he's 2 years older than Lebron.

Ever see the movie "Jack" with Robin Williams? At this rate, my bet is that Lebron will have to retire by the time he's 27. I already see a patch of gray hair in that little goatie thing he has seemingly spay-painted on his chin.
 

matt_whitlock

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Originally posted by Joe Mama
Right now I'm not sure I would put Marbury in the same class as any of those other players either.

Joe Mama

I know how you feel, but he'll bounce back. Marbury is a special type of person. He's a strong, resillient little guy who should weigh about 170 pounds but doesn't because he willed himself not to be. I still have faith in him.
 

George O'Brien

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LeBron is certainly benefiting from the trade of Ricky Davis to Boston. They are playing him at SG and not pretending a HS player can play point in the NBA. I am very excited by his potential, but I don't think he is an elite player quite yet.

LeBron had much better coaching at the HS level than Amare did, but both of them have an awful lot to learn. Even a year of college ball is a help and two or three is better. Older European players like Zarko are light years ahead of HS players in terms of skill development.

Someday I think LeBron will a franchise player, but it is unrealistic to compare him to T-Mac and Garnett at this point in his career.
 

Ryanwb

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Originally posted by DaFlogger
No way is this guy 18 years old! Just look at him, his physical features make him look at least mid-20's. Either he's a freak of nature or some kind foul play is going on...

Just my opinion.

There is no way they would hold this kid back from the NBA until his 20's, that would cost him millions of dollars. The key to kids coming out of high school is they can play out their rookie contract and sign the first of atleast TWO big money deals before they even hit their prime. Look at Kevin Garnett close to 30 and is on his second 100 million deal
 

slinslin

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Among guards that get more than 17.5FGA per game Lebron ranks third.

Vince Carter .425
Paul Pierce .421
TMac .414
AI .397
Baron .389

The only guards better are Redd with .449 and Marbury with .428.
 

Divide Et Impera

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Lebron the best ever already? It's a bit early, don't ya think? I mean, Jordan did, after all, average like 27.2ppg as a rookie and he had an entire season at 38ppg/8rpg/8apg. Those averages came at a time when some of the absolute greatest players in the history of the game were playing (Showtime Lakers, Ewing, Olajuwon, Bird and crew, Thomas, Barkley, Malone, etc....). There's no list of current players that can come close to that list. Lebron has A LOT to do before you can rightfully go around calling him the best ever....

PS - Am I the only one who hopes that Lebron's season high in points will be no more than 37?
 

George O'Brien

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Best ever? If Jordan wasn't the greatest guard ever, it might very well have been Oscar Robertson. It's sad that he played before they counted assists because I'm told he was close to a triple double every night.
 

BC867

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Originally posted by George O'Brien
Best ever? If Jordan wasn't the greatest guard ever, it might very well have been Oscar Robertson. It's sad that he played before they counted assists because I'm told he was close to a triple double every night.
One year, the Big O averaged a triple-double for the season. That was amazing!
 

scotsman13

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yea there are two players that i believe dont get near the credit for what they were. "the big o" oscar robinson and bill russell. o because he has 2 season (his first 2 in the nba) where he averaged a triple double. and russell the player who really brought shot blocking into the nba and lead his team to 10 championships in 11 years.
 

George O'Brien

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It's sad that the NBA in the 60's was not televised very often. Many of the super stars of the era such as Jerry West, Elgin Baylor, Wilt Chamberlin, Bill Russell, Bob Cousy, Bob Pettite (sp?), Nate Thurmond, etc. are know today mostly as names in the record book. It is hard to know how they would have done under today's rules, but their overall skills were exceptional.
 

slinslin

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Originally posted by Joe Mama
Right now I'm not sure I would put Marbury in the same class as any of those other players either.

Joe Mama

Well

Steph ranks
#1 in total minutes played
#2 in mpg
#12 in ppg
#2 in apg
#11 in assists/turnover
#16 in FTA
#9 in steals
#2 in FG% among players that get more than 17FGA per game.


He is scoring a little less but his rebounds are up, his steals are up, his assist are up, his turnovers are down, his 3pt% is up and his FT% and FG% is a little down.

Individually he is having an as good or better season than before.
 

George O'Brien

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It is not realistic to compare a PG to a SG or a forward. The value of a point guard has to do with the effectiveness of the entire offense and not just individual stats.

For a single game, I suspect that Kidd is a bit more valuable because he is a better defender and a great rebounder for a guard. But Stephon is not much below Kidd in overall effectivenss and is 4 years younger - which will really matter in the last few years of their respective contracts.

Is there another point guard better than these two?
 

slinslin

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I don't think Kidd is a better defender than Stephon. Kidd regularly gets beat up by quick PGs.
He is a more versatile defender because of his size but not better. This season he isn't even getting more steals than Steph.
 

George O'Brien

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Originally posted by slinslin
I don't think Kidd is a better defender than Stephon. Kidd regularly gets beat up by quick PGs.
He is a more versatile defender because of his size but not better. This season he isn't even getting more steals than Steph.

You may be right. I think Kidd has lost a step. I'm not convinced Steph is a first rate man defender, but he is a lot quicker than Kidd.
 
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