malone and payton to la?

[boisesuns]

from the la times. should be interesting to see what actually happens.


The Lakers' negotiations with Karl Malone have gone so well that they are considering the possibility they could sign him and still offer their full mid-level exception to Gary Payton.

Sources with knowledge of conversations between Malone and General Manager Mitch Kupchak said Malone expressed a desire to sign with the Lakers as well as an appreciation for their wish for a guard, namely Payton.

Malone, it appears, has made the Lakers the perfect offer: his services for as low as the veteran's minimum exception ($1.5 million for the first year), or whatever rate they agree would be necessary to top off their roster with Payton. It is possible the offer is dependent on the mid-level money going to Payton. If not, the Lakers could split the mid-level to improve their depth in the backcourt and sign another front-court player, perhaps Robert Horry, or use the entire mid-level exception for Malone. The Lakers also could lose Malone if Payton declines their offer.

In the process, Malone has convinced the Lakers that his only agenda, in what would be his 19th NBA season, would be to win the championship that eluded him in Utah.

It would be an extraordinary gesture by a 39-year-old player still skilled enough to have been selected to last year's All-Star game and next year's Olympic team. Last season, Malone averaged at least 20 points for the 17th consecutive season and was the only power forward endorsed by Horry on the day Horry's option was not exercised.

Malone, who as a free agent also has drawn interest from the San Antonio Spurs, is still well regarded as a rebounder and defender, enough that Shaquille O'Neal already has given his blessing to any deal that would bring in Malone.

Payton is expected to sit down with Kupchak sometime this holiday weekend, perhaps today. He earned $12.6 million last season, which he split between the Seattle SuperSonics and the Milwaukee Bucks, and in the open market or in a sign-and-trade deal could fetch nearly three times the $4.7 million or so the Lakers have available for their mid-level exception.

As it stands, Malone is waiting on the Lakers, who are waiting on Payton.

The Lakers are hopeful that a multi-year contract taking Payton close to his 40th birthday, and the chance to play beside O'Neal, Malone and Kobe Bryant — four probable Hall of Famers in the same starting lineup — would be enough to convince him to pass up millions.

In the meantime, power forwards Juwan Howard and P.J. Brown continued to shop the NBA, for the moment with the Lakers intent on coming to an agreement with Malone. One possible snag: owner Jerry Buss is in Europe and Coach Phil Jackson is on a motorcycle, on his way to North Dakota for his 40th high school reunion, and so the ever-changing details of negotiations are taking time to run through the organization.

Teams may not sign free agents until July 16. Handshake agreements can be reached, however.




they would be tough. but there might be some ball hogging problems with that team. and probly no scoring title for malone.

 

[SirStefan32]

That is very scary, but Kobe, Shaq, Malone, and GP on the same team? That's four ego- maniacs. I don't know

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Nah I am sure they would find a way to make it work.

The Lakers last ride before Kobe rides off to his own team, Malone retires, and possibly Payton and Shaq as well.

 

[Goldfield]

As much as I hate the Lakers, that would be a fun team to watch with Payton at the Point...

 

[Joe Mama]

I think the key for the Lakers is to get a good power forward. If they can get Malone, Howard, or even P.J. Brown it will greatly increase their chances of another championship next season. If their only key addition is Gary Payton I'm not sold.

Joe Mama

 

[elindholm]

I hate to break this to everyone, but the Lakers will probably win the title next year even if they don't add a key free agent. If they get Payton they are a lock.

Why? Television. The only reason the Spurs were able to eliminate the Lakers this year was because the games were called fairly. The league figured that the fan base had had enough of the Laker dynasty, and they were still hearing the gumblings over the 2002 Game 6 debacle against the Kings. They allowed Duncan to outplay O'Neal, and the rest is history.

Well, we saw what happened to the TV ratings in the Finals -- they plummeted to something like a ten-year low. That can't happen again. The public wants their superstars, and Duncan, for whatever reason, doesn't count.

No, I'm not talking about games being "fixed." It's subtler than that. Everyone will read about how O'Neal has re-dedicated himself in the offseason, how Bryant has worked harder than ever, how Phil Jackson has renewed energy, and about how the team is showing the same focus as they did in their championship years.

And then O'Neal will start getting the officials on his side, and that will make him more confident, which in turn will make him more aggressive, which will keep the officials even more on his side. Pretty soon we'll see him running over people the same way we're all accustomed to. Similar things will happen with Bryant: he'll get entitled to more Jordan-style pushoffs and hooking elbows and so forth.

The Spurs deserved their championship this season, but it was a token nod to fairness. The Lakers will be ushered back into the NBA perch in 2004, no matter what they do to their roster between now and then.

 

[Errntknght]

Eric, that was one cynical post! I'm impressed!

But I disagree somewhat. I think Shaq has broken down too far to ever play like he did the two seasons the Lakers won the championship. I don't know whether you should credit Jackson for getting him to play so hard or blame him for riding him too long and hard. In any case, with that plus Fox and Horry missing the Lakers will need to add at least two solid contributors to be close enough for your scenario to work.

In particular, they need front court help and that's assuming Devean George can handle the starting SF slot. IMO, P.J.Brown would be a much better addition than Malone as he does well laboring in obscurity. Frankly, I'd add another front court player if I could get someone like Keon Clark rather than a guard. Jimmy Jackson might not be a bad choice backing up George. But if they're going to add a guard Payton would be a heck of a good choice, even though he's not a great fit for the triangle offense.

 

[Skkorpion]

Eric, sad but true comments.

At least we had one year of semi-honest playoff refereeing.

However, wasn't the Lakers/Nets final a TV bust as well? So having the Lakers in the finals with Jason Kidd didn't help much.

Maybe, just maybe, the NBA popularity is in temporary decline until Boston, the Knicks, and Chicago get good teams again.

 

[SirStefan32]

I think the problem is that the West is much stronger than the east. In other words, people would rather watch LA, Kings, Mav's, Spurs, Wolves, etc play each other than a superior team from the West playing an NBA JV team from the east.

On the other hand, playoffs sucked last year. San Antonio- Phoenix and Dallas- Sacramento were the only two enjoyable matcups.

 

[fordronken]

At least we had one year of semi-honest playoff refereeing.

This from the same message board that complained about the refs non stop throughout the entire playoffs? Did anyone watch LA-Minnesota? The Lakers could barely win last year against the T-Pups despite blatantly obvious pro-Laker reffereeing.

I was one of the people who got mad when posters kept saying the refs gave the Spurs the first round series. I generally like to believe that, despite refereeing, the team that deserves to win should find a way to do so. However, there are rather obvious moments when a single deciding incident can change things(Andre Miller).

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by fordronken
This from the same message board that complained about the refs non stop throughout the entire playoffs? Did anyone watch LA-Minnesota? The Lakers could barely win last year against the T-Pups despite blatantly obvious pro-Laker reffereeing.

I was one of the people who got mad when posters kept saying the refs gave the Spurs the first round series. I generally like to believe that, despite refereeing, the team that deserves to win should find a way to do so. However, there are rather obvious moments when a single deciding incident can change things(Andre Miller).

I agree except that I had no problem with people complaining about the referees when it was deserved. It was stretches during that Phoenix Suns/San Antonio Spurs first round series that were absolutely horribly officiated. It went both ways, but I thought it was worst during the first couple of games in San Antonio.

Was it Game 4 of the Lakers/T-Wolves series where the referees got the Lakers into overtime and nearly won the game for them? It was awful.

Look, everybody knows the superstars get preferential treatment. I think the difference last season with the Lakers and Spurs was that the referees treated Tim Duncan equally or even better than Shaquille O'Neal. The referees are starting to get fed up with Shaq's bulldozer technique. They are not allowing it as often when it is blatant. That, IMO, is the big difference.

How long as it until the 2003-04 season starts? I'm already tired of waiting.

Joe Mama

 

[fordronken]

The L.A. Times reported today(sorry, I don't have the link) that Payton has serious interest in the Lakers and spoke at length with Phil Jackson, along with continuing daily conversations with Shaquille O'Neal. He is reportedly very good friends with both O'Neal and Magic Johnson.

It seems like everything is falling into place. If they sign the two of them, will it even matter how Devean George does?

 

[elindholm]

I really don't think Malone will do them much good -- what's he going to do, spot up for threes? -- but Payton would help them a lot.

 

[fordronken]

Well, what Malone can do that other people mentioned in this thread like P.J. Brown can't, is stand fifteen feet from the basket, clearing more space for O'Neal and consistently hit those mid range jump shots.

 

[Errntknght]

No one is questioning Malone's ability to shoot the ball but there are number of other aspects to consider. If he is going to be a significant part of the offense then he is going to have to learn the triangle - a non-trivial task. (I don't see Phil putting in the two man game that Malone thrived on for years.) How well will he do in a secondary role, actually a tertiary role? How much gas is left in the tank? Karl may even have some problems adjusting to the Lakers defensive schemes since he has played his whole NBA career under Sloan.

I'd take P. J. over him in a minute - he plays very good defense and has under three coaches, rebounds and gets his points without plays being run for him. He'll even surprise you from 15 feet if you leave him open. Basically, he's used to fitting in and doing the dirty work. In fact, he's exactly the kind of PF the Lakers have been looking for since Phil came to town.

Of course, I'll be happy if the Lakers get Malone instead... I don't know how to put it more strongly than that since I don't care for the player or the team.

 

[Chaplin]

The thing is, Malone will not be in a secondary role--he will be the THIRD option on the Lakers.

Plus, for all intents and purposes, reports are that he really would like to break the scoring record. That will NOT happen in Los Angeles.

 

[Joe Mama]

Here's the problem with PJ Brown. I agree that he is a very good fit on the Lakers, but he isn't going to settle for the veterans minimum like Malone has reportedly agreed to do. So if you believe the current reports out of Los Angeles it's either Gary Payton and Karl Malone or PJ Brown. I'm not sure all those egos (the players and Jackson's) can work together, but I'd still rather take my chances with the Hall of Fame combination than just Brown.

Joe Mama

 

[jbeecham]

Well the Payton & Malone to the Lakers scenario just got more likely: http://espn.go.com/nba/columns/stein_marc/1577421.html

Agent: Payton won't be returning to Milwaukee
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Marc Stein
ESPN.com

The agent for Gary Payton said Sunday that the All-Star guard has narrowed his list of prospective employers for next season to three teams, headlined by the Los Angeles Lakers.

It's a list that does not include the Milwaukee Bucks, according to agent Aaron Goodwin, even though the Bucks can outbid anyone for the 34-year-old free agent.

Amid ongoing talks with Lakers officials, who are limited to offering Payton a starting salary of just under $5 million, Goodwin told ESPN.com that the recently dethroned champions are "absolutely" Payton's preference. The only other teams Payton will consider, according to Goodwin, are Portland and Miami.

The Lakers also are said to be the first choice of Utah forward Karl Malone, who is reportedly waiting to see if L.A. lands Payton before agreeing to sign for a mere $1.5 million next season. That's the most the over-the-cap Lakers can offer Malone if they use their $4.9 million salary-cap exception on Payton.

"Gary is looking at teams he can excel with," said Goodwin, who expects a firm decision from Payton within the next day or two.

Asked specifically about Milwaukee, Goodwin said: "He won't be back, no."

No team can sign a free agent until July 16, but committing to join the Lakers would enable Payton -- in Goodwin's words -- "to be the first guy to put his money where his mouth is and take less to play for a championship."

In Payton's case, signing with the Lakers would represent a pay cut of more than $7 million from his $12.6 million salary earned last season with Seattle and Milwaukee.

Malone would then be looking at a pay cut of nearly $18 million if he elects to leave the Jazz for Hollywood -- from $19.3 million last season to the $1.5 million figure.

Malone's willingness to accept such a drastic reduction, however, would be more understandable if Utah is only offering him a starting salary of $5-$6 million to stay, as some insiders suggest. It's unlikely Malone would be willing to return to the Jazz for less than the $8 million earned by John Stockton in his final season.

Payton turns 35 on July 23; Malone turns 40 the following day. Although the idea that both could fit into the Lakers' limited budget sounds like a long shot, the upside to playing in L.A. at drastically reduced rates is that both would have a shot at the championship ring neither has won … along with the shared opportunity to help restore the Lakers to glory.

Two teams on Payton's list -- the Lakers and Miami -- put the Bucks at risk for losing Payton without compensation, after Milwaukee acquired the nine-time All-Star at mid-season in a stunning trade for franchise pillar Ray Allen.

A costly mistake by Miami guard Anthony Carter early last week has apparently given Miami an estimated $11 million in salary-cap room to pursue free agents, instead of an expected $7 million. Carter and his representatives failed to notify the Heat by June 30 that he would invoke the final year left on his contract, at a salary of $4.1 million.

It remains to be seen, however, whether Heat coach Pat Riley would pursue a veteran like Payton or focus on the best young prospects on the open market, such as Golden State point guard Gilbert Arenas or Los Angeles Clippers center Michael Olowokandi. It's believed that the Heat is trying to infuse their roster with youth and athleticism. That's why center Alonzo Mourning, in another comeback attempt from his longstanding kidney problesm, is expected is sign with Dallas or another title contender.

The Bucks would undoubtedly prefer to strike a sign-and-trade arrangement with Payton rather than lose him for nothing, but the Lakers have no discernible assets to offer in a trade outside stars Shaquille O'Neal and Kobe Bryant.

Portland, by contrast, has plenty of assets to interest Milwaukee or any team -- Rasheed Wallace, Bonzi Wells and Zach Randolph, to name three -- but Payton would have to reach an agreement to sign with the Trail Blazers and work with the Bucks to construct a trade that satisfies both parties.

 

[jbeecham]

I think Malone & Payton are pathetic if they join the Lakers just so that they can win a ring (which they probably will because they'll have 4 all-stars in the starting lineup). It's basically like they are saying that they'll never be good enough to win without riding Shaq & Kobe's coattails. I think if this happens then attendance & TV ratings are going to go down again all across the nation except in LA. Maybe they can get Reggie Miller to be their starting SF for the veteran minimum so he can win a ring too.