Monty…

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This is a ridiculous thread.

Monty did not make CP3 play like garbage the last 4 games. He is not responsible for Cam Payne completely losing his nba abilities.

Could he make a little better substitution decisions, sure. Is that the reason we got our ass kicked last night - Not at all.

I guess the question is whether CP3 just suddenly became an awful player or whether the mavs have succeeded in adapting the defense to denying him what he wants to do. While it’s obviously a combination of the two, watch what Dallas is doing. They have successfully figure out how to deny Paul and Booker the elbow middy. Think how many of those we’ve even seen those two take in the last 4 games. And they’re rotating baseline guy to take charges on the rolling center and then other two guys are playing passing lanes to 3 point line. It’s incredibly effective. Monty has to identify the counter move. I think it’s having the centers jump stop on the roll and either throwing up the bunny or hitting back door cutters from the corners. Puts a lot of stress on centers to execute but both aytin and mcgee have shown the ability to hit the bunny and make the pocket pass.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The Suns are missing Willie Green.

If I were Monty I would pick up the phone and ask him for some advice on how to better defend the Mavericks. He has a good basketball mind.

I don’t think willie gives him the formula bc he’s going to steal the mavs defense too. There’s still next season and beyond that willie has to face these suns.

 

[Mainstreet]

I don’t think willie gives him the formula bc he’s going to steal the mavs defense too. There’s still next season and beyond that willie has to face these suns.

I don't think Monty would ask Willie Green for help. That's the way he is.

However, I think if Willie were asked for help, he would give him enough to win the next game. Besides offenses and defenses are always evolving.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This suggests the possibility that the Mud have someone brilliant coordinating their defense. That either Jason Kidd or one of the assistant coaches is more clever than anyone knew. I'm going to look up who their assistant coaches are. ...Oh, great. They have a fired ex-Suns coach who might enjoy embarrassing them, and in any case has inside experience with Devin Booker. And there's always the fact that Jason Kidd is no idiot.

If I’m not mistaken I think the mavs became one of the better defensive teams down the stretch of the regular season.

Yup, gave up second lowest points per game in regular season and had 7th ranked defending rating (they were 21st last season). So they must have someone who is a pretty good defensive strategist.

Mavs stepping up their game on defense

The Dallas Mavericks are entering the playoffs as one of the better teams in the NBA on defense. The Mavs finished this season second in the league in the fewest points allowed at 104.7 ppg.

www.mavs.com

 

[AzStevenCal]

Monty has had 3 excellent seasons as the Suns head coach, exceeding virtually all expectations for the team. I'm not about to start thinking the Suns should start looking for a replacement because this year's playoffs haven't been as easy as I hoped.

I certainly won't condemn him for not playing Aaron Holiday. Holiday wasn't going to win any of the games in Dallas.

It's disappointing to lose but we've maintained home court and will hopefully trounce the Mavericks in game 7, like we have in basically every home game so far this series.

Maybe you're right that the outcome would have been the same with Holiday, I really don't know. But what if he'd used Holiday more throughout the second half of the season, allowing Paul and Booker to get a little more rest? Couldn't that have made a difference?

I know Holiday is undersized and it's made worse because he's really a combo guard not a point but it seems to me like he's helped us almost every time he's come into the game. Makes you wonder why in the world we went after him in the first place if we had no intention of using him, especially considering we had a clear need at guard.

 

[Hoop Head]

Maybe you're right that the outcome would have been the same with Holiday, I really don't know. But what if he'd used Holiday more throughout the second half of the season, allowing Paul and Booker to get a little more rest? Couldn't that have made a difference?

I know Holiday is undersized and it's made worse because he's really a combo guard not a point but it seems to me like he's helped us almost every time he's come into the game. Makes you wonder why in the world we went after him in the first place if we had no intention of using him, especially considering we had a clear need at guard.

Didn't Paul have 4 weeks off due to an injury? I'm not sure how much more time we could have given him to rest and heal up while also being in some rhythm for the playoffs.

I believe Booker missed a few games as well.

I'm all for load management but I don't think any Suns player other than Bridges played too much from the All-Star break to the playoffs. We've seen Booked and Paul get banged up this postseason but I don't think those injuries are avoidable.

While I would have liked to have seen more of Holiday, I doubt he would have passed either Payne or Shamet on the depth chart. Maybe Monty could have tried experimenting more with using him when one of those two is clearly off during the final stretch of the season but I think he was more concerned with trying to boost their confidence and sticking with what he'd done all season because Holiday was more of a luxury than a necessity off the bench.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Didn't Paul have 4 weeks off due to an injury? I'm not sure how much more time we could have given him to rest and heal up while also being in some rhythm for the playoffs.

I believe Booker missed a few games as well.

I'm all for load management but I don't think any Suns player other than Bridges played too much from the All-Star break to the playoffs. We've seen Booked and Paul get banged up this postseason but I don't think those injuries are avoidable.

While I would have liked to have seen more of Holiday, I doubt he would have passed either Payne or Shamet on the depth chart. Maybe Monty could have tried experimenting more with using him when one of those two is clearly off during the final stretch of the season but I think he was more concerned with trying to boost their confidence and sticking with what he'd done all season because Holiday was more of a luxury than a necessity off the bench.

Bridges might have been needed a bit less too if we'd continued to use Holiday and Biyombo. Paul did get a lot of games off but in the second half of the season he had too many games where he logged too many minutes (37,41,40,37,37,40,39,37,42,37).

 

[Mainstreet]

While I would have liked to have seen more of Holiday, I doubt he would have passed either Payne or Shamet on the depth chart. Maybe Monty could have tried experimenting more with using him when one of those two is clearly off during the final stretch of the season but I think he was more concerned with trying to boost their confidence and sticking with what he'd done all season because Holiday was more of a luxury than a necessity off the bench.

The Suns need Cam Payne to find his game because they are going to have trouble going much further without him. However, it wouldn't have taken much for Holiday to pass the current playoff version.

I really hope Payne has a good game 7 because the Suns need him.

It's almost too late to give Holiday a look now unless they advance.

 

[Zeem_Freeze]

I think it's clear that he is a great motivator. He is genuine, inspiring, he is a great guy, role model, and all that nice stuff.

It's also clear that he is very stubborn. He believes in his guys, which is a great thing, but he has to be more flexible and he has to make adjustments.

what about Monty benching Cam Payne in the playoffs? that runs contradictory to the "stubborn and inflexible narrative"

that said, Im also frustrated we have a game 7 tonight.... oh shiii Im nervous!

 

[82CardsGrad]

Bridges might have been needed a bit less too if we'd continued to use Holiday and Biyombo. Paul did get a lot of games off but in the second half of the season he had too many games where he logged too many minutes (37,41,40,37,37,40,39,37,42,37).

The Suns were shooting for the franchise season record in wins…
Hindsight is always laser-like 20/20…

While I have zero doubt that Monty himself, would be the first to admit he has areas to work on, speaking for myself I wouldn’t want any other head coach leading this team.
That doesn’t mean he’ll one day bring Phoenix a Championship. We all know there are a ton of ingredients that are required in order to get there. Heck, there have been coaches not of Monty’s caliber that have won a championship. Why is that? How does that happen? So many moving pieces to the puzzle.
IMHO, this current Suns team has the pure talent to do it. But that doesn’t mean Monty, or any other coach, can get that talent to play a peak performance night in and night out of a grueling post season run.
More specifically, I think CP3 is now without question, showing his age and is no longer able to consistently lead a team throughout the post season. My hope now os that since he’s played so poorly the past two games, that he can rally for a Game 7. If he isn’t a turnover machine, he won’t have to be one of our top scorers. Just dish and manage the game, and keep the TO’s to a max of 3.
I think Ayton will never be as dominant as Giannis, or Embid, or Jokic. But he seems to play well enough in the post season such that, if all of the other components are firing (Paul, Book, Bridges), our chances for winning post season games are very high.

So because Ayton can’t dominate and take over games, and because CP3 is sliding, a ton of pressure falls on Book.
In fact, at this point, I think our chances for winning go way down if Book isn’t our leading scorer. And again, like Paul, he MUST stop turning the ball over.

If Book, Ayton and CP3 play just close to their full potential, we should win. But it has to be all three…

IMHO, I believe Monty has gotten the maximum number of potential wins out of this team… I just don’t see where his coaching has caused this team to fall short. They might fall short… but I just don’t see Monty being the root cause.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

When Paul was out we went more heavily to the post game with Ayton. I don’t understand why we haven’t tried that more with Paul struggling.

 

[dscher]

Man… this is well put. We’ve compared this team to consummate teams like the 2014 Spurs or the 2004 Pistons, but those teams were LOADED with MF’ers. Stone cold killers. Some on offense, some on defense. Not to mention total SOBs on their sidelines coaching.

We just don’t have enough of those players and Monty, for as good as he is, isn’t Pop or Larry Brown. He sets the tone for the feel-good… for better or worse. And I hen the rubber meets the road, I fear it’s ultimately for worse.

We also lack the player who has elite athleticism AND the absolute WILL to force it down the other team’s throat. You gotta have one or the other… a team chock full of MF’ers or a Unicorn. Right now it looks like we’re just out of reach of both.

Basically, we have no raw athletes. Lol. If we are clicking on all cylinders, then that doesn't become painfully obvious. But since we aren't...it shows up big time. IMO

 

[82CardsGrad]

Basically, we have no raw athletes. Lol. If we are clicking on all cylinders, then that doesn't become painfully obvious. But since we aren't...it shows up big time. IMO

I would say Book and Bridges are very athletic. Even Ayton is extremely athletic for a 7 footer…

 

[Cheesebeef]

I would say Book and Bridges are very athletic. Even Ayton is extremely athletic for a 7 footer…

Book has decent athleticism and Bridges is a good athlete but neither are elite athletes as far as basketball is concerned.

Ayton does have elite athleticism but not the will to consistently use jt.

 

[Mainstreet]

When Paul was out we went more heavily to the post game with Ayton. I don’t understand why we haven’t tried that more with Paul struggling.

The Suns have turned the ball over too much to be effective. They have trouble getting the ball into the low post.

Paul and Booker had 13 turnovers in the last outing and Payne has not been himself for well over a month.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Book has decent athleticism and Bridges is a good athlete but neither are elite athletes as far as basketball is concerned.

Ayton does have elite athleticism but not the will to consistently use jt.

I agree with this… though, what/who is the standard for a NBA Elite Athlete?

 

[Mainstreet]

I agree with this… though, what/who is the standard for a NBA Elite Athlete?

Mostly they are players that can create their own shot.

 

[Raindog]

So much for this thread. The verdict is in... Monty sucks.

 

[AzStevenCal]

So much for this thread. The verdict is in... Monty sucks.

I think CP3 has been able to put into effect the offense and defense as he wants it to be and now that he can't, Monty's weaknesses are becoming more apparent.

 

[SirStefan32]

Is it OK to fire the reigning coach of the year? Asking for a friend.

 

[Hoop Head]

Is it OK to fire the reigning coach of the year? Asking for a friend.

George Karl had that happen in Denver. Dwayne Casey was fired afterwards as well in 2017-18, I believe.

 

[GatorAZ]

Is it OK to fire the reigning coach of the year? Asking for a friend.

Monty isn’t getting fired unless Jones is too and Sarver isn’t paying 4 different HC/GM’s into the future. I think they both got extended.

Hello purgatory my old friend.

 

[unseenaz]

ayton having 5 shots while booker and cp3 are a combined 5-22 is criminal. monty shares a ton of blame for this series.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Monty isn’t getting fired unless Jones is too and Sarver isn’t paying 4 different HC/GM’s into the future. I think they both got extended.

Hello purgatory my old friend.

Maybe not. I don't think Monty is stupid but he's clashed with CP3 before and I'm guessing he's surrendered a lot of control to let Paul have it his way this time around. With Chris nearing the end, maybe Monty will actually start coaching his own system. Maybe?

 

[NashDishesDimes]

I dont know how they get blown out in game 6, have 3 days off, and make no adjustments…

Oh nvm, he put torrey craig in the game (lucka wasnt even in the game)