Once and for all do we fire Keim poll

[HGC]

Unfortunately I agree with Chopper and feel this thing will get run into the ground before Keim gets the boot.

 

[jmt]

Keim, Kliff & Kyler aren’t going anywhere

 

[Dback Jon]

LOL A few months ago everyone was proclaiming him a genius for the Hopkins trade...

 

[BigRedRage]

I'm going to vote on next weeks once and for all instead

I came into this thread to post this and apparently I did it last year.

 

[Finito]

LOL A few months ago everyone was proclaiming him a genius for the Hopkins trade...

omg what a great draft what a great offseason

lose a few games and it’s fire everybody.

you think the Seattle fan base is calling to fire everybody since they’ve lost 4 of 5?

 

[Chopper0080]

omg what a great draft what a great offseason

lose a few games and it’s fire everybody.

you think the Seattle fan base is calling to fire everybody since they’ve lost 4 of 5?

It is fair for people to be skeptical when something unconventional is tried and it only generates moderate success. When things do bad you tend to go back to why these unconventional moves are unconventional.

When an inexperienced and small QB is struggling, it is natural to focus on the fact that he is inexperienced and small.

When a HC is hired with a losing historical record gets on a losing streak, it is natural to focus on his past record of losing.

When you have a GM who has missed on picks and had to eat dead money because of bad FA signings and the roster looks depleted, people tend to focus on those missed opportunities.

 

[JeffGollin]

Only fire him if we have a replacement who we think will help us more.

With that qualifier, I voted "yes, but finding the right guy to run the show is no small task.

One major obstacle - there's a lot of play by play commentary describing the Cardinal defense as "looking lost" with a bunch of guys wandering around wondering what to do.

Do we really want to make wholesale changes every other year or so? This team would be so much better if everyone was comfortable in their jobs.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Lol. No. He’s 100% not going anywhere. Keim is one of the best GM’s in football and by far the best one in the history of this franchise.

One of the best GMs in football looking at a FIFTH STRAIGHT SEASON of missing the playoffs... okay.

We don’t make the playoffs again this season and that will mean of the best GMs in football could only get his team to the playoffs TWO TIMES OUT OF EIGHT YEARS.

If that’s success for you, I’d hate to see failure.

 

[Cheesebeef]

omg what a great draft what a great offseason

lose a few games and it’s fire everybody.

you think the Seattle fan base is calling to fire everybody since they’ve lost 4 of 5?

has Seattle missed the playoffs the last FOUR SEASONS in a row? Nothing happens in a vacuum.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think you are riding Keim, Kliff, and Kyler until the wheels fall off. They seem like a package deal at this point.

sadly, I agree with this.

 

[Card'em]

If they lose the rest of their games and finish 6-10, the wheels are off, but I still think Bidwill gives both another year. Next year will be the make or break it time for both.

 

[Finito]

It is fair for people to be skeptical when something unconventional is tried and it only generates moderate success. When things do bad you tend to go back to why these unconventional moves are unconventional.

When an inexperienced and small QB is struggling, it is natural to focus on the fact that he is inexperienced and small.

When a HC is hired with a losing historical record gets on a losing streak, it is natural to focus on his past record of losing.

When you have a GM who has missed on picks and had to eat dead money because of bad FA signings and the roster looks depleted, people tend to focus on those missed opportunities.

idk call me crazy but I expect my 2nd year NFL head coach and my 2nd year QB to have growing pains.

Do you realize Kyler Murray might have 4000 yards passing and 1000 yards rushing this year? Something no QB in the history of the NFL has ever done and might have more rushing touchdown than INTS.

he might have a historical season in his 2nd freaking year and you would think he’s a POS the way guys talk around here. Can he get better of course he’s only in his second year, but he’s pretty damn good right now.

Some guys think oh my god we are so horrible we should fire everybody, Kyler is going to quit football and go back to baseball what a failed experiment

I’m sitting here looking and see we have four losses all by one score including three by just a field goal and had chances at the end of all those games. If we have a money kicker this season looks real different. I’m looking at a top ten offense that doesn’t really have a great RB or quality at WR. I’m looking at a kicker who’s cost us 3 games

where is this roster that you guys are seeing that’s supposed to be so dominate? Cause I don’t see it...yet.

It’s not our year it was never going to be our year.

 

[Chopper0080]

idk call me crazy but I expect my 2nd year NFL head coach and my 2nd year QB to have growing pains.

Do you realize Kyler Murray might have 4000 yards passing and 1000 yards rushing this year? Something no QB in the history of the NFL has ever done and might have more rushing touchdown than INTS.

he might have a historical season in his 2nd freaking year and you would think he’s a POS the way guys talk around here. Can he get better of course he’s only in his second year, but he’s pretty damn good right now.

Some guys think oh my god we are so horrible we should fire everybody, Kyler is going to quit football and go back to baseball what a failed experiment

I’m sitting here looking and see we have four losses all by one score including three by just a field goal and had chances at the end of all those games. If we have a money kicker this season looks real different. I’m looking at a top ten offense that doesn’t really have a great RB or quality at WR. I’m looking at a kicker who’s cost us 3 games

where is this roster that you guys are seeing that’s supposed to be so dominate? Cause I don’t see it...yet.

It’s not our year it was never going to be our year.

I am not disagreeing with you. I am just saying that if you had concerns when these guys were hired, and then things are trending south following mediocre success, it is easy to go back to those initial concerns.

Drafting short and inexperienced QBs does not have a history of success for people to lean on.

Hiring college HCs with a losing record in college and very little professional experience does not have a history of success for people to point to.

GMs who have a losing record overall, have gone through 3 HCs and 3 QBs in 4 years do not have a significant track record of turning things around.

It's not that they can't, but there isn't a ton historically that these will all figure themselves out.

 

[Finito]

I am not disagreeing with you. I am just saying that if you had concerns when these guys were hired, and then things are trending south following mediocre success, it is easy to go back to those initial concerns.

Drafting short and inexperienced QBs does not have a history of success for people to lean on.

Hiring college HCs with a losing record in college and very little professional experience does not have a history of success for people to point to.

GMs who have a losing record overall, have gone through 3 HCs and 3 QBs in 4 years do not have a significant track record of turning things around.

It's not that they can't, but there isn't a ton historically that these will all figure themselves out.

you WANT to see that

that’s a mental thing you want to be able to say see I told you so more than you want to see the team win.

so if I told you the cardinals would have a top ten offense and our QB would have a historical year would you have taken that?

offense isn’t our problem.

our defense and kicker have cost us waaaay more games than our offense had but whatever.

 

[PACardsFan]

idk call me crazy but I expect my 2nd year NFL head coach and my 2nd year QB to have growing pains.

Do you realize Kyler Murray might have 4000 yards passing and 1000 yards rushing this year? Something no QB in the history of the NFL has ever done and might have more rushing touchdown than INTS.

he might have a historical season in his 2nd freaking year and you would think he’s a POS the way guys talk around here. Can he get better of course he’s only in his second year, but he’s pretty damn good right now.

Some guys think oh my god we are so horrible we should fire everybody, Kyler is going to quit football and go back to baseball what a failed experiment

I’m sitting here looking and see we have four losses all by one score including three by just a field goal and had chances at the end of all those games. If we have a money kicker this season looks real different. I’m looking at a top ten offense that doesn’t really have a great RB or quality at WR. I’m looking at a kicker who’s cost us 3 games

where is this roster that you guys are seeing that’s supposed to be so dominate? Cause I don’t see it...yet.

It’s not our year it was never going to be our year.

Well said. I agree 100%. Average RB’s, below average WR group, and an average OL at best. And the D is below average being coached by a below average DC. Just 2 years ago, we were the worst Cardinal team in our history. And last year we won 5 games. This team isn’t even remotely a finished product. The only time they win is when Murray plays like a god. I’ll be thrilled if we win 8 games.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Well said. I agree 100%. Average RB’s, below average WR group, and an average OL at best. And the D is below average being coached by a below average DC. Just 2 years ago, we were the worst Cardinal team in our history. And last year we won 5 games. This team isn’t even remotely a finished product. The only time they win is when Murray plays like a god. I’ll be thrilled if we win 8 games.

Is no one at fault that we have a D that is below average, a below average DC coaching them, a below average WR group and average RBs and Offensive line?

also, do you guys ever pay attention to teams outside the Cardinals?

McKvay turned his team around with a terrible rookie QB in ONE year. Took them to the Super Bowl in year 2.

Shannahan took a team that had been awful for five years and had them one bomb away from winning the Super Bowl in year 2 with a QB who going into the season had started 10 NFL games. And in a season where they’ve had more injuries than any team I can remember they’re still playing hard and only a game behind us.

Doug Marrone took over an awful Buffalo team forever, got to the playoffs in year 2 with a 2nd year QB.

Doug Pederson got the Eagles who had floundered for years to a 13-3 record and a Super Bowl Title, in the coaches 2nd year, most with a 2nd Year QB and then a journeyman QB.

Brian Flores took over a dumpster fire just as bad as ours and has them at 8-4 and playoff bound in Year 2.

hell, even go back to Andy Reid in Philly. He came in with a rookie McNabb and they Eagles were really bad. First year 7-9, second year in the playoffs and NFC Title Game in Year 2.

And this goes on and on for a lot of the best HCs when they first start out.

Year 2 of a coach/number 1 pick or high pick QBs don’t always have “growing pains”. Most of the combos that end up having sustained success actually start getting ahead of the league in year 2 and have really good success.

now, it LOOKED like we were on our way towards that at the mid-point of the season. I think what troubles so many of us is that since then, it appears as if the rest of the league has figured our coach/combo out.

I’m still hoping we turn this around, win 3 of 4 and get into the playoffs. That will be a successful season no matter what happens there. But if we win 1 of our last 4, which is very possible, that means we end the season on a 2-6 thud. Teams in their second year should be moving forward as that season goes on, even if they don’t make the playoffs or super bowl
Like those examples mentioned above.

remains to be seen which way this team finished, but right now, they’ve got a downward trajectory when they should be getting better and figuring the league out, not the other way around.

 

[Finito]

Is no one at fault that we have a D that is below average, a below average DC coaching them, a below average WR group and average RBs and Offensive line?

also, do you guys ever pay attention to teams outside the Cardinals?

McKvay turned his team around with a terrible rookie QB in ONE year. Took them to the Super Bowl in year 2.

Shannahan took a team that had been awful for five years and had them one bomb away from winning the Super Bowl in year 2 with a QB who going into the season had started 10 NFL games. And in a season where they’ve had more injuries than any team I can remember they’re still playing hard and only a game behind us.

Doug Marrone took over an awful Buffalo team forever, got to the playoffs in year 2 with a 2nd year QB.

Doug Pederson got the Eagles who had floundered for years to a 13-3 record and a Super Bowl Title, in the coaches 2nd year, most with a 2nd Year QB and then a journeyman QB.

Brian Flores took over a dumpster fire just as bad as ours and has them at 8-4 and playoff bound in Year 2.

hell, even go back to Andy Reid in Philly. He came in with a rookie McNabb and they Eagles were really bad. First year 7-9, second year in the playoffs and NFC Title Game in Year 2.

And this goes on and on for a lot of the best HCs when they first start out.

Year 2 of a coach/number 1 pick or high pick QBs don’t always have “growing pains”. Most of the combos that end up having sustained success actually start getting ahead of the league in year 2 and have really good success.

now, it LOOKED like we were on our way towards that at the mid-point of the season. I think what troubles so many of us is that since then, it appears as if the rest of the league has figured our coach/combo out.

I’m still hoping we turn this around, win 3 of 4 and get into the playoffs. That will be a successful season no matter what happens there. But if we win 1 of our last 4, which is very possible, that means we end the season on a 2-6 thud. Teams in their second year should be moving forward as that season goes on, even if they don’t make the playoffs or super bowl
Like those examples mentioned above.

remains to be seen which way this team finished, but right now, they’ve got a downward trajectory when they should be getting better and figuring the league out, not the other way around.

I do pay attention

the Rams had 13 losing seasons before having a winning one with McVay and spent those losing seasons drafting guys like Goff and Gurley in the top 10.

those 49ers had 5 losing seasons and stock piled defensive lineman after defensive lineman and then they went 13-3 and now 5-7 and will probably finish with a losing record again giving them 6 out of 7 years finishing below 500. Is that sustained success?

look at the Browns right. Baker comes in and it’s like wow. His second year was horrible and now he’s balling.

I mean alot of the franchises you named were down a lot longer than we have been down. BA and Carson Palmer and the NFC title game wasn’t that long ago. Injuries ended what should of been a longer run but that’s the story.

We are in year 2 of the KK/Kyler run the seasons not over. I’m going to let it play out. If I want to point out guys who were late bloomers I could do that all day, if you want guys who were monsters right out of the gate you could also do that all day long. My point is you can find examples of anything if you want. There’s a million ways to get there

I mean Pete Carrol flamed our as the Jets head coach and BB was horrible in Cleveland and those probably the two best coaches in the NFL. You can put Andy Reid in there to as far as best coaches. he’s awesome.

 

[PACardsFan]

Is no one at fault that we have a D that is below average, a below average DC coaching them, a below average WR group and average RBs and Offensive line?

also, do you guys ever pay attention to teams outside the Cardinals?

McKvay turned his team around with a terrible rookie QB in ONE year. Took them to the Super Bowl in year 2.

Shannahan took a team that had been awful for five years and had them one bomb away from winning the Super Bowl in year 2 with a QB who going into the season had started 10 NFL games. And in a season where they’ve had more injuries than any team I can remember they’re still playing hard and only a game behind us.

Doug Marrone took over an awful Buffalo team forever, got to the playoffs in year 2 with a 2nd year QB.

Doug Pederson got the Eagles who had floundered for years to a 13-3 record and a Super Bowl Title, in the coaches 2nd year, most with a 2nd Year QB and then a journeyman QB.

Brian Flores took over a dumpster fire just as bad as ours and has them at 8-4 and playoff bound in Year 2.

hell, even go back to Andy Reid in Philly. He came in with a rookie McNabb and they Eagles were really bad. First year 7-9, second year in the playoffs and NFC Title Game in Year 2.

And this goes on and on for a lot of the best HCs when they first start out.

Year 2 of a coach/number 1 pick or high pick QBs don’t always have “growing pains”. Most of the combos that end up having sustained success actually start getting ahead of the league in year 2 and have really good success.

now, it LOOKED like we were on our way towards that at the mid-point of the season. I think what troubles so many of us is that since then, it appears as if the rest of the league has figured our coach/combo out.

I’m still hoping we turn this around, win 3 of 4 and get into the playoffs. That will be a successful season no matter what happens there. But if we win 1 of our last 4, which is very possible, that means we end the season on a 2-6 thud. Teams in their second year should be moving forward as that season goes on, even if they don’t make the playoffs or super bowl
Like those examples mentioned above.

remains to be seen which way this team finished, but right now, they’ve got a downward trajectory when they should be getting better and figuring the league out, not the other way around.

All fine and dandy, but none of the teams you mentioned were as bad as the 2018 Cardinals. I’ve been following this franchise since 1964 & the 2018 Cardinals were the WORST Cardinal team I ever watched. Also, those teams you mentioned were coached by what turned out to be very good HC. I’m not sold that KK is even an average HC. The Cardinals have made strides in 2 years, but this is NOT a finished product.

 

[TaylorSwift]

Before anyone gets fired/hired, Bidwill needs to bring in third party consultants who actually know football business/evaluation to properly assess the football team going forward and proceed from there.

I do think there will be a chance that the GM will the Dorsey, HC Bieniemy, Matt Nagy OC next year.

Just a feeling.

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

The financial hit that Keim has cost this team is unbelievable. Michael Bidwill has written checks to Sam Bradford, McCoy and Wilks that total tens of millions alone. Need to cut off the problem at the top

 

[GatorAZ]

omg what a great draft what a great offseason

lose a few games and it’s fire everybody.

you think the Seattle fan base is calling to fire everybody since they’ve lost 4 of 5?

Which draft are you referring to?

 

[Cheesebeef]

All fine and dandy, but none of the teams you mentioned were as bad as the 2018 Cardinals. I’ve been following this franchise since 1964 & the 2018 Cardinals were the WORST Cardinal team I ever watched. Also, those teams you mentioned were coached by what turned out to be very good HC. I’m not sold that KK is even an average HC. The Cardinals have made strides in 2 years, but this is NOT a finished product.

that is complete and utter BS. That Rams team before McKvay was ATROCIOUS. They were talking about running Goff out of town immediately.

The Niners? Went from last place to the Super Bowl.

Ah... forget it. Everything is fine and the only way this team should ever be measured is against itself.... you know... one of the worst franchises of all time. Teams who measure themselves in relation to other losers never become winners.

we should measure our success against what others have successfully done similarly in the league. Otherwise you’re just measuring yourself against your own ineptitude, especially because it’s been the same damn GM who can’t get us in the playoffs more than 25% of the time throughout his tenure.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Before anyone gets fired/hired, Bidwill needs to bring in third party consultants who actually know football business/evaluation to properly assess the football team going forward and proceed from there.

I do think there will be a chance that the GM will the Dorsey, HC Bieniemy, Matt Nagy OC next year.

Just a feeling.

no way. Stiff and Miller Keim are tied at the hip and I think they both get another year, no matter what transpires down the stretch. Not saying I’d agree with that. Just that it’s what I think happens.

 

[DVontel]

Yea, just by the coordinator hires.

Guy really gave Mike McCoy to Wilks & Vance Joseph to Kliff.

Both fired by the same organization mid season.

Keim clearly has no feel & just hire off of name-value. Bet he would hire Dan Quinn if given the chance instead of doing thorough research like the Rams did with Staley or Colts with Eberflus.

 

[Finito]

Which draft are you referring to?

everybody pretty much loved our last draft. You can’t even say people didn’t