Report: Yanks break off talks for RJ...

sly fly

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Yankees pull out of discussions for Big Unit
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Ken Rosenthal /
Posted: 46 minutes ago



The Yankees, unwilling to meet Arizona's current trade demands for left-hander Randy Johnson, have broken off talks with Arizona, The Sporting News has learned.

The abrupt shift by the Yankees might only be a ploy to create leverage in future discussions. But for now, the Yankees will shift their focus to free-agent pitchers — including, perhaps, right-hander Pedro Martinez.
The Diamondbacks, in turn, could play their own form of hardball with Johnson, threatening to keep him unless he waives his no-trade clause for another team.

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The Yankees are believed to be Johnson's first choice. However, the Red Sox, Angels, Cardinals, White Sox also are interested in Johnson. The Diamondbacks, still reeling from their ill-fated trade of right-hander Curt Schilling and acquisition of first baseman Richie Sexson last off-season, are trying to exact a high price from the Yankees. Yankees right-hander Javier Vazquez is at the center of the package that Arizona would receive.

If the Yankees are indeed serious abandoning their quest for Johnson, their free-agent pursuits could include not just Martinez, but also left-handers Eric Milton and Al Leiter and right-handers Carl Pavano, Jaret Wright and Jon Lieber. They likely would add one of those pitchers even if they acquired Johnson.

Johnson, 41, is owed $16 million next season in the final year of his contract and likely would require a contract extension to waive his no-trade clause. The Yankees are willing to meet that condition, but their talks with the Diamondbacks broke down when the teams could not reach agreement on either an exchange of money or players.

Vazquez, 28, is owed $35.5 million over the next three seasons, or $19.5 million more than the Diamondbacks owe Johnson. That difference is one sticking point. The Diamondbacks want the Yankees to cover all of it, according to a source with knowledge of the negotiations. The Yankees are willing to pay about two-thirds.

The bigger dispute is over players.

In addition to Vazquez, the source says, the Diamondbacks initially asked the Yankees to acquire one of 10 pitchers from another club for inclusion in the deal. The 10 pitchers on the D-Backs' wish list were the A's Tim Hudson and Barry Zito, Marlins' A.J. Burnett, Dodgers' Edwin Jackson, Devil Rays' Scott Kazmir, Rangers' Kenny Rogers, Blue Jays' Ted Lilly, Tigers' Jeremy Bonderman, Marlins' A.J. Burnett and Rockies' Jason Jennings and Shawn Chacon.

The Diamondbacks told the Yankees that they would not participate in three-way discussions, forcing the Yankees to obtain one of those pitchers — Chacon being by far the most available — without additional help. They also asked the Yankees for several prospects in addition to Vazquez, the second pitcher and the $19.5 million.

When those talks went nowhere, the Diamondbacks amended their request to Vazquez, reliever Tom Gordon and left-hander Brad Halsey, plus the $19.5 million and prospects. The Yankees said they wound not trade Gordon, and countered with a proposal of Vazquez, Halsey, lefthander Alex Graman and a prospect that the Diamondbacks had wanted, along with a significant cash payment, believed to be between $10 million and $15 million.

The Diamondbacks made two last bids on Tuesday, asking for Vazquez, Gordon and Halsey plus the $19.5 million or Vazquez, the Rockies' Chacon, Halsey, prospects and $19.5 million. The Yankees called the Rockies about Chacon, and the Rockies provided a list of names they would consider in trade discussions, according to a major-league source.


Senior writer Ken Rosenthal covers baseball for Sporting News. Email him at [email protected].
 

MaoTosiFanClub

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Rosenthal vs. Gammons for the hot-stove scoop of the winter. My money's on Rosenthal.

Assuming this rumor is true, it's just more proof how stupid Joe Jr. truly is. No GM in their right mind is going to trade "Vazquez, Shawn Chacon, Halsey, prospects and $19.5 million" for Randy Johnson at age 41. RJ is good, but he's not that good. At least this appears to be somewhat of an admittance of how bad he got hosed in the Schilling deal. Yankees fans must be irate. Joe G. asks for garbage for Schilling and everything under the sun for RJ. What a *******.
 

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Quote:
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In addition to Vazquez, the source says, the Diamondbacks initially asked the Yankees to acquire one of 10 pitchers from another club for inclusion in the deal. The 10 pitchers on the D-Backs' wish list were the A's Tim Hudson and Barry Zito, Marlins' A.J. Burnett, Dodgers' Edwin Jackson, Devil Rays' Scott Kazmir, Rangers' Kenny Rogers, Blue Jays' Ted Lilly, Tigers' Jeremy Bonderman, Marlins' A.J. Burnett and Rockies' Jason Jennings and Shawn Chacon.
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I really can't get over this. How freaking stupid is Joe Jr? For one, if the Yankees could get half these picthers, then why would they trade them to the D-Backs? Secondly, since when to Tim Hudson and Shawn Chacon belong on the same list?
 
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sly fly

sly fly

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MaoTosiFanClub said:
Rosenthal vs. Gammons for the hot-stove scoop of the winter. My money's on Rosenthal.

Assuming this rumor is true, it's just more proof how stupid Joe Jr. truly is. No GM in their right mind is going to trade "Vazquez, Shawn Chacon, Halsey, prospects and $19.5 million" for Randy Johnson at age 41. RJ is good, but he's not that good. At least this appears to be somewhat of an admittance of how bad he got hosed in the Schilling deal. Yankees fans must be irate. Joe G. asks for garbage for Schilling and everything under the sun for RJ. What a *******.

Moorad is calling the shots here. Let's be real.
 

Ryanwb

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They asked for Kenny Rogers?? The guy is 40
 

AZZenny

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Maybe Moorad is involved, but this smells all over of classic Joe.

btw, Bob Nightengale says Moorad getting approved to invest in the team is now a long shot. Selig is such a ****** and he wants so badly to beat the DBacks to death. Does he even realize his nemesis Colangelo doesn't work here anymore?

Does anyone know who the last potential investor to be turned down was?
 

Kolo

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Assuming this rumor is true, it's just more proof how stupid Joe Jr. truly is. No GM in their right mind is going to trade "Vazquez, Shawn Chacon, Halsey, prospects and $19.5 million" for Randy Johnson at age 41. RJ is good, but he's not that good. At least this appears to be somewhat of an admittance of how bad he got hosed in the Schilling deal. Yankees fans must be irate. Joe G. asks for garbage for Schilling and everything under the sun for RJ. What a *******.
________________

In other words, Joe Jr. is a moron if he doesn't get enough back in a trade, and he's a moron if he asks for too much. That's fair. I'm glad they're trying to fleece the Yankees. This is how deals should get done. The Yankees have pulled back, and when the Diamondbacks concede a point or two, the Yankees will come back and they'll meet somewhere in the middle.

Hopefully.
 

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Hugh Jass said:
Assuming this rumor is true, it's just more proof how stupid Joe Jr. truly is. No GM in their right mind is going to trade "Vazquez, Shawn Chacon, Halsey, prospects and $19.5 million" for Randy Johnson at age 41. RJ is good, but he's not that good. At least this appears to be somewhat of an admittance of how bad he got hosed in the Schilling deal. Yankees fans must be irate. Joe G. asks for garbage for Schilling and everything under the sun for RJ. What a *******.
________________

In other words, Joe Jr. is a moron if he doesn't get enough back in a trade, and he's a moron if he asks for too much. That's fair. I'm glad they're trying to fleece the Yankees. This is how deals should get done. The Yankees have pulled back, and when the Diamondbacks concede a point or two, the Yankees will come back and they'll meet somewhere in the middle.

Hopefully.

I don't think it is to much to ask for. The Yankees were up 3-0 on the Sox and lost. They had not pitcher to come in and close the deal. George Steini is pissed off. It isn't a fair trade but desperate people do desperate things.
 

coyoteshockeyfan

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AZZenny said:
Maybe Moorad is involved, but this smells all over of classic Joe.


Thats funny, I could have sworn that classic Joe won. A lot.
 

MaoTosiFanClub

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Hugh Jass said:
In other words, Joe Jr. is a moron if he doesn't get enough back in a trade, and he's a moron if he asks for too much. That's fair. I'm glad they're trying to fleece the Yankees. This is how deals should get done. The Yankees have pulled back, and when the Diamondbacks concede a point or two, the Yankees will come back and they'll meet somewhere in the middle.

Hopefully.

I'm hoping RJ to NY would happen also because we all know the Yanks are going to give up the most for RJ (obviously not this much though). What worries me is the Yanks and A's getting together next weekend to try and work out a Tim Hudson deal. Yanks trade for Hudson and sign say Al Leiter and Carl Pavano and suddenly New York is out of the RJ sweepstakes.

That leaves us with Anaheim, St. Louis, and Boston. The Halos and the Cardinals have old-school GMs who will not mortgage their future for one player and the Red Sox have a GM who is about 100x smarter than Joe.

These trade offers Joe threw back at the Yankees are borderline ridiculous. Yes Joe, we want you to hose the Yanks, but your demends sound eerily similar to the ones we see on the Cardinals board where people say we should trade Ray Thompson and James Hodgins for Aaron Brooks.
 

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ESPN Insider is reporting that a Kenny Lofton-Felix Rodriguez swap is nearly done. I'm guessing this would make Gordon more expendable. This trade could still happen, but I'm guessing the amount of prospects or dollars will somewhat change from the original DBack desire of 4 prospects and $19.5 million.
 

KingLouieLouie

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The best ideal scenario would be for the original deal involving Johnson being dealt to the Yankees for Vasquez/Gordon/prospect + cash to happen, and then the Dbacks would trade Gordon + some of that cash (or also a minor tier Dback prospect) to the the Marlins (who to me have the one of the deepest farm system in all of baseball) for highly touted 1B prospect Jason Stokes (definitely ML ready) and LH starter Scott Olsen (who I mentioned along with Stokes this past summer in that trade proposal I posted on here and eventually emailed to Sports Zone on KDUS).....

Olsen was in AA-ball last season, however, I look for him to advance quickly through the ranks (especially if the Dbacks acquire him)......

The Marlins lost Benitez just this past week and yes...they're usually in the "cost-cutting" mode, however, Gordon with cash would be an excellent bargain for them since they should be near the top again next season in the NL East or Wild Card contention....

Here's the link from that post... plus...I'll requote both those prospects assessments written before last season....
http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/showthread.php?t=33789

Jason Stokes, 1B. This kid has a high ceiling and boasts dramatic raw power. Selected in the second round of the 2000 draft, Stokes began to show his prowess in Utica in 2001, where he pounded six home runs and drove in 19 runs in just 35 games. It was however in his second season at Kane County (A) where he challenged for the Triple Crown in the Midwest League, elevating his batting average to .341 with 27 HR and 75 RBI, all the while fighting through a painful cyst problem on his left wrist. He finally underwent surgery, which included a bone graft at the tail end of 2002 and after a slow start rebounded with nice numbers for Jupiter (A) in 2003. Stokes finished with 17 homers and 89 RBI in 121 games. However, the Marlins saw a slip in his batting average to .258, which could be attributed to his wrist injury the previous year.
Scott Olsen, LHP. This may be somewhat of a shocker, as this kid was a relative unknown in high school. However, the Marlins saw enough in him to take him in the sixth round of the 2002 amateur draft. The 6’4, 170 pound lefty is very lanky, but has been a sponge at absorbing tutoring at the minor league level. Unimpressive in his first pro season, Olson rebounded nicely in 2003 for Class A Greensboro with a 7-9 record and 2.81 ERA, fanning 129 batters in 128.1 innings. He improved his mechanics last year, which resulted in a livelier fastball. He improved the quality of his slider in his second year and opted to remove the curve ball, at least temporarily, from his repertoire. He also has a very nice changeup, which is very important for a lefthander. Olson also has a quality sinker. It would surprise no one if he finishes at Double A this year.
I still like Eric Reed, however, I dont believe the Marlins would part w/him along w/the others just for Gordon + cash and the Dbacks had acquired Reggie Abercrombie (who is relatively similar to Reed).....
 
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I'm pretty sure (but not positive) that was the package the D-Backs wanted for Finley but Florida wouldn't budge on Olsen. Do you think they would go for it with Gordon? We'd likely have to throw in a mid-tier prospect.
 
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KingLouieLouie

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MaoTosiFanClub said:
I'm pretty sure that was the package the D-Backs wanted for Finley but Florida wouldn't budge on Olsen. Do you think they would go for it with Gordon? We'd likely have to throw in a mid-tier prospect.
I'm the one who suggested Olsen since he would fit the long-term rotation perfectly (they really dont have too many LH starting pitching prospects who are close to the ML level), so I honestly dont know if the Dbacks had inquired about him specifically....

I know Gordon alone wouldnt be adequate, however, the amount of cash the Dbacks would be willing to sacrifice could weigh in quite favorably....

Stokes would obviously replace Sexson at 1B.....

KDUS mentioned something I didnt know...that Shea Hillenbrand is still under contract with the Dbacks (I thought his contract had expired this past season)... If so...the Dbacks could include Hillenbrand in that package (he still has a relatively marginal contract and I believe it's a 1-year deal, so the Marlins could trade him at the deadline so they wouldnt have to absorb any more cost for him)......

I would honestly prefer Hillenbrand over Glaus at 3rd since at least Shea's been healthy for the past couple seasons....True, Hillenbrand isnt a power threat, but I like how consistent he is for putting the ball in play....

I do project Tracy to be converted to 1B or OF if the Dbacks fail to acquire a 1B....Tracy doesnt have an arm suited for 3B, however, I'm still impressed with his ability to spray the ball to all fields (and his occasional power)....

I read how the Dbacks have an interest in both Jermaine Dye and Royce Clayton (both are good stop-gaps until the likes of Jackson, Quentin, Kroeger, Santos, etc at ready at their respective positions).....

I wonder what the health status of Hammock, Villareal, Valverde, and Kata are? I still envision Villareal becoming a starter and Valverde/Aquino to be the "closers by committee".....Also for Hammock and Kata to play a role very similar to what Counsell has done (which he himself ironically has been linked to returning back to the Dbacks)....

I dont see the fascination in them checking into Dellucci since they several already on the roster that fit his profile (obviously dont have the hot girlfriends he's has (has)).......

If they got Vasquez and landed either Ramon Ortiz/Matt Clement (also pick-up Shawn Estes) with Stokes, Clayton, and Dye...the Dbacks could easily contend in the NL West....

They could manage to sign most or all of those players since they're cutting $26 million from their payroll (Johnson's $16 mil and also taking into consideration the $10 mil they offered to Sexson)..... Yes, Vasquez has a higher contract, but the sum the Yankees could extend to the Dbacks could well about cover that......
 

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MaoTosiFanClub said:
ESPN Insider is reporting that a Kenny Lofton-Felix Rodriguez swap is nearly done. I'm guessing this would make Gordon more expendable. This trade could still happen, but I'm guessing the amount of prospects or dollars will somewhat change from the original DBack desire of 4 prospects and $19.5 million.


A done deal
 

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KLL said:
I do project Tracy to be converted to 1B or OF ... I'm still impressed with his ability to spray the ball to all fields (and his occasional power).
I like Tracy, but please don't throw in the towel so easily.

You need more than "spray(ing) the ball to all fields" at 1B, or as a corner outfielder, to build a championship caliber team, unless you have power hitters at each of those other positions, or at 3B, for balance in the lineup.
 

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