Running game could be source of problems

BullheadCardFan

Go for it
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2005
Posts
62,621
Reaction score
26,891
Location
Bullhead City, AZ
April 14, 2007

Running game could be source of problems

Scott Bordow, Tribune Columnist

NFL minicamps are kind of like life in Las Vegas. What happens in April stays in April.

Games aren’t won or lost by what transpires on a spring morning. Story lines that seem important today will be minimized come July.

But when the Cardinals assembled Friday for the first time under new coach Ken Whisenhunt, there was one intriguing topic that could pick up speed come training camp.

Is Edgerrin James a good fit for Arizona’s offense?

It might seem a silly question.

James somehow ran for 1,159 yards last year behind one of the worst offensive lines in the NFL. He’s in the second year of a four-year, $30 million deal. He’ll turn 29 on Aug. 1 — doesn’t it seem like he’s older? — and as he said Friday, “I’m in the good years now.”

He and Whisenhunt, who wants to re-establish Arizona’s running game, would appear to be the perfect marriage of player and coach.

There’s just one nagging detail.

They have different ideas on the best way to run the ball.

James long has preferred the zone blocking, one-back set he used in Indianapolis and last year under Dennis Green. It plays to his strengths, which are to run laterally along the line of scrimmage, wait for a hole to develop then use his superior vision and cut-back ability to pick up yards.

Whisenhunt, on the other hand, has brought to Arizona the power-running game the Pittsburgh Steelers have successfully employed over the years. He signed fullback Terrelle Smith as a lead blocker, and James, more often than not, will be asked to follow Smith into holes rather than pick his own running lanes.

The difference may appear minute. But think about it for a second: Would Barry Sanders have been as dynamic a runner had the Detroit Lions asked him to quit doing the jitterbug and get to the hole already?

James has gained 10,385 yards in his career running one way. Now he’s being asked to run another way. It’s a story worth watching.

“It’s going to be different,” quarterback Matt Leinart said. “Edge is not used to that.”

Both Whisenhunt and James, as you might imagine, say they’re not concerned.
Whisenhunt: “I think he will adjust fine to it. He’s a talented running back.”

James: “I heard a lot of people saying I’m just used to the one back, but in college (the University of Miami) I had a fullback in front of me. It’s nothing. I can go out and play however we do it. As long as we are consistent with what we do, it’s nothing to adjust to.”

There’s another wrinkle to the story. Whisenhunt reiterated Friday that he’d like to take some of the load off James, who ran the ball 337 times last season. That would mean more work for backup Marcel Shipp.

But what if the Cardinals have the opportunity to take Oklahoma tailback Adrian Peterson with the No. 5 pick in the April 28 draft? If they select Peterson that high, they’ll want him to play, and James might find his carries slashed more than he likes.
“They don’t need a running back,” James said. “But if you have a lot of money and you want to buy something you go buy it.”

As James laughs easily, you wonder whether he’ll be as magnanimous if the Cardinals do take Peterson.

Maybe there won’t be a story here come fall. Peterson could be gone when Arizona goes on the clock. James might pick up the offense easily and run for 1,300 yards or so.

If that’s the case, forget you ever read this column.

But if Peterson does show up in Arizona, and James does have some difficulty running behind a fullback, don’t be surprised. You’ve been warned.

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/87798
 

Mulli

...
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2004
Posts
52,529
Reaction score
4,601
Location
Generational
Forget I ever read the column? That shouldn't be very difficult.
 

PJ1

ASFN Icon
Joined
Sep 21, 2002
Posts
12,125
Reaction score
5,171
Location
Nashville TN.
So both Whiz and Edge say no problem but this is still a story? Don't get it.
 

RON_IN_OC

https://www.ronevansrealty.com
Joined
Mar 10, 2004
Posts
26,867
Reaction score
34,764
Location
BirdGangThing
That was a lame article. I expect this kind of blah from the Republic, not the Trib.
 

ajcardfan

I see you.
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
38,287
Reaction score
24,889
I guess he was hoping for a problem, there wasn't one, so he decided to write the column anyhow.
 

Mitch

Crawled Through 5 FB Fields
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Posts
13,405
Reaction score
2,982
Location
Wrentham, MA
I actually think this article has potential merit. Right now everyone's fine...but...we all saw last year how Edge griped about his number of carries, to the detriment of the team, IMO. Edge likes calling his own shots...which is why there could be problems...not just in terms of carries, but as the article rightly points out, Edge's running style does not match up with Whiz's philosophy. Whiz wants downhill runners, plain and simple. No dancing...no lateral RB slides, waiting for a hole to open in zone blocking schemes.

If the Cards do draft Adrian Peterson...this would likely exacerbate the situation to the point where Edge would become an even more outspoken malcontent and would probably demand a trade...the thing is, though...Edge's market value has dropped...the Colts weren't all that keen about re-signing him (and we all saw that a rookie, Joseph Addai, played just fine in Edge's spot)...and Edge's performance last year (regardless of the yards) wasn't really all that impressive. His durability was...but he really didn't finish off runs consistently well at all and he didn't show a breakway burst or so-called "great vision" in the open field.

Then...there's the whole issue of off-season training away from Arizona and his adamant disdain for playing in pre-season games (which really no veteran wants to do--but, the Cardinals are putting in a new system and have to get their timing and cohesiveness down...in addition to the assignments)...

To me, Edge has been more of a deterrant than an asset. He came in talking like he's bigger than the team and he acted like it.

Plus...he is no longer a star. Not in the manner in which he runs.
 
Last edited:

vinnymac

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Mar 24, 2005
Posts
3,022
Reaction score
0
James is still an elite back. If the big uglies are not getting any push in the running game, then it doesn't matter who is back there. He is going to get creamed. The writer is right. To get 1159 yards behind last season offensive line is pretty good. There isn't any worries about James preforming behind a fullback. A fullback is what he needs. That Tobey Kieth song reminds of James situation" Not as good as I once was, But I am good once as I ever Was." He going to just as good this season as he was last season. It would be to James's favor if Adrian Peterson was drafte. Maybe even Tony Hunt, Penn. St. runningback. He seems to be a back that matches Whisenhunt style. Personally I like Micheal Bush from Louisville. He reminds me of Steven Jackson.
 

lobo

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Posts
3,310
Reaction score
230
Location
Inverness, Il
Forget I ever read the column? That shouldn't be very difficult.

You never uttered truer words. If that tripe is the best that guy can write he better look for work at Wal-Mart as a greeter.

It is one of those stupid "See I told ya'" articles that are totally forgetabble and you will certainly not hear the writer say after Edge has a quality 1200 or so yard season, "sorry I was totally wrong."
 

BigRedArk

ASFN Lifer
Joined
May 19, 2003
Posts
2,718
Reaction score
233
Location
Norh Little Rock, Arkansas
The great thing about Peterson possibly being in Cardinal Red is that he would give us a definite home-run threat that we don't now have. It would be hard to pass on him if he's there even if the choice is between him and Joe Thomas I say.
 

Treesquid PhD

Pardon my Engrish
Joined
Apr 12, 2005
Posts
4,844
Reaction score
105
Location
Gilbert
I actually think this article has potential merit. Right now everyone's fine...but...we all saw last year how Edge griped about his number of carries, to the detriment of the team, IMO. Edge likes calling his own shots...which is why there could be problems...not just in terms of carries, but as the article rightly points out, Edge's running style does not match up with Whiz's philosophy. Whiz wants downhill runners, plain and simple. No dancing...no lateral RB slides, waiting for a hole to open in zone blocking schemes.

If the Cards do draft Adrian Peterson...this would likely exacerbate the situation to the point where Edge would become an even more outspoken malcontent and would probably demand a trade...the thing is, though...Edge's market value has dropped...the Colts weren't all that keen about re-signing him (and we all saw that a rookie, Joseph Addai, played just fine in Edge's spot)...and Edge's performance last year (regardless of the yards) wasn't really all that impressive. His durability was...but he really didn't finish off runs consistently well at all and he didn't show a breakway burst or so-called "great vision" in the open field.

Then...there's the whole issue of off-season training away from Arizona and his adamant disdain for playing in pre-season games (which really no veteran wants to do--but, the Cardinals are putting in a new system and have to get their timing and cohesiveness down...in addition to the assignments)...

To me, Edge has been more of a deterrant than an asset. He came in talking like he's bigger than the team and he acted like it.

Plus...he is no longer a star. Not in the manner in which he runs.

You know there comes a point where try hard guys who get 700 yards really don't do it for me anymore. Edge didn't exceed anyones expectations, but despite all the issue he still blew away anything a fan favorite like Shipp could ever dream of.

I mean I am glad Shipp actually discovered what an end zone is again, but if Whiz thinks Shipp is going to ever carry a team to anything other than 4-12 I think he is sadly mistaken.

The Cardinals need Edge it's really that simple.
 

cardsfanmd

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 16, 2007
Posts
13,948
Reaction score
4,097
Location
annapolis, md
Thats was an absolutely worthless article IMO. He might has well have written about the debate within the organization to draft Brady Quinn if he is available.
 

Herdman

Rookie
Joined
Mar 27, 2004
Posts
51
Reaction score
0
Where there is a hole there are yards to gain

As long as the fullback doesn't run into the back of the Oline because no holes were created, then there is no issue. If the fullback isnt locking up with a linebacker, then Edge will be stopped for minimal or no gain again this year. What this style also does is put more emphasis on the guards versus the tackles. I still think against modern defenses that you need tackles to have quickness and speed to protect the perimeter, which means your beef needs to be inside. Edge can still go lateral after he breaks through the first hole at the line of scrimmage. Actually, that is where he may be more effective than most of us are envisoning.​
 

joeshmo

Kangol Hat Aficionado
Joined
Feb 23, 2004
Posts
17,247
Reaction score
1
One Edge. His teammates love the guy, Colts players even showed up to training camp last year wearing Edge jerseys. Edge even threw a super bowl party for the Colts players in Miami. He was really happy for them. Shows the kind of guy he is.

Edge mentioned in a recent article that while he wants his touches he thinks the coaches didnt run him at the right times, especially when the D was keying on the run. I think he was talking about the Bears game.

He knew he wasnt getting it done at the goal line so he asked the coaches to give Shipp the ball at the goal line. It was he who suggested to the coaches that Shipp get more touches inside the 20. He wants his carries yes, but he also wants to win. Man what an ego this guy has.

He also balked at the media stating he doesnt like running behind a fullback and making way more then it actually is, by saying and a paraphrase, "I ran behind a FB in college, it didnt bother me then why would it bother me now."

he showed up to camp in great shape according to Wiz and according to the print writters he looked really quick. He is a pro and knows how to workout in the offseason.

I really dont understand the flack this guy gets.
 

Skkorpion

Grey haired old Bird
LEGACY MEMBER
Supporting Member
Joined
May 9, 2002
Posts
11,026
Reaction score
5
Location
Sun City, AZ
If he looked like Aeneas Williams or Kyle VandenBosch, you'd never hear a negative word about the guy.

Disagree, and I know I've suggested in other threads that Edge might be benched before the end of the season. Edge, in my opinion, is done this year. He won't be with us next year.
 

Crazy Canuck

ASFN Icon
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
10,077
Reaction score
0
Disagree, and I know I've suggested in other threads that Edge might be benched before the end of the season. Edge, in my opinion, is done this year. He won't be with us next year.


An opinion informed by what?
 

ajcardfan

I see you.
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
38,287
Reaction score
24,889
Disagree, and I know I've suggested in other threads that Edge might be benched before the end of the season. Edge, in my opinion, is done this year. He won't be with us next year.

Every player has critics of his on-field performance. What I'm referring to are the strange accusations about him being a bad influence and a selfish player. I've seen not even a hint of that from his teammates and coaches. I honestly think this criticism from the fans comes from his look and the fact that he's from the U.
 

BigRedArk

ASFN Lifer
Joined
May 19, 2003
Posts
2,718
Reaction score
233
Location
Norh Little Rock, Arkansas
One Edge. His teammates love the guy, Colts players even showed up to training camp last year wearing Edge jerseys. Edge even threw a super bowl party for the Colts players in Miami. He was really happy for them. Shows the kind of guy he is.

Edge mentioned in a recent article that while he wants his touches he thinks the coaches didnt run him at the right times, especially when the D was keying on the run. I think he was talking about the Bears game.

He knew he wasnt getting it done at the goal line so he asked the coaches to give Shipp the ball at the goal line. It was he who suggested to the coaches that Shipp get more touches inside the 20. He wants his carries yes, but he also wants to win. Man what an ego this guy has.

He also balked at the media stating he doesnt like running behind a fullback and making way more then it actually is, by saying and a paraphrase, "I ran behind a FB in college, it didnt bother me then why would it bother me now."

he showed up to camp in great shape according to Wiz and according to the print writters he looked really quick. He is a pro and knows how to workout in the offseason.

I really dont understand the flack this guy gets.

I agree joe. The man is a pro and I'm glad he is a Cardinal. As much as I like AP and would love to see him in Tempe/Glendale next year I kinda hope he isn't there at 5 just for the fact that I have doubts if he and Edge would work in the same backfield. Then again I could be wrong too.:)
 

cardsfanmd

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 16, 2007
Posts
13,948
Reaction score
4,097
Location
annapolis, md
Disagree, and I know I've suggested in other threads that Edge might be benched before the end of the season. Edge, in my opinion, is done this year. He won't be with us next year.
I disagree. If last year showed us nothing else, I think it proved how good edge is. The fact that he was able to gain the yardage he did behind such a poor line really improved his stock in my eyes. You guys can say what you want about his three yard gains, but many of them would have been three yard losses for a less talented RB.
 

artp

Registered
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
1,085
Reaction score
7
Location
Little Rock
Its a strange article in that Bordow laments the fact that James only ran for 1159 yds last season and later states that james may run for 1300 yds this season and we can forget the whole thing. Thats only 9 more yds/game.
I am in agreement that this will be James last year as the starter in Arizona. I don't think he will be the RB when we make the Playoffs. Thats why I like drafting RB A Peterson if we get the chance.
 
OP
OP
BullheadCardFan

BullheadCardFan

Go for it
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2005
Posts
62,621
Reaction score
26,891
Location
Bullhead City, AZ
One Edge. His teammates love the guy, Colts players even showed up to training camp last year wearing Edge jerseys. Edge even threw a super bowl party for the Colts players in Miami. He was really happy for them. Shows the kind of guy he is.

Edge mentioned in a recent article that while he wants his touches he thinks the coaches didnt run him at the right times, especially when the D was keying on the run. I think he was talking about the Bears game.

He knew he wasnt getting it done at the goal line so he asked the coaches to give Shipp the ball at the goal line. It was he who suggested to the coaches that Shipp get more touches inside the 20. He wants his carries yes, but he also wants to win. Man what an ego this guy has.

He also balked at the media stating he doesnt like running behind a fullback and making way more then it actually is, by saying and a paraphrase, "I ran behind a FB in college, it didnt bother me then why would it bother me now."

he showed up to camp in great shape according to Wiz and according to the print writters he looked really quick. He is a pro and knows how to workout in the offseason.

I really dont understand the flack this guy gets.
I have to agree .. Edge has worked hard, ran hard and came into camp in shape and with a good attitude ..

I think the rest of the running in preseason and other stuff will get worked out between him and Whiz .. I actually see Edge giving in more to Whiz and going along with system ..
 

Redrage

Hall of Famer
Joined
Apr 4, 2003
Posts
1,008
Reaction score
65
Location
Charlotte, NC
April 14, 2007

Running game could be source of problems

Scott Bordow, Tribune Columnist

The difference may appear minute. But think about it for a second: Would Barry Sanders have been as dynamic a runner had the Detroit Lions asked him to quit doing the jitterbug and get to the hole already?


http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/87798

Oh, Mr. Bordow. Barry Sanders had his best year in '97 and he was running behind a fullback then. Also, in '98 he had a stupendous year running behind a fullback (per Bobby Ross's design).

Way to disprove your own point there, Scott.
 

Jetstream Green

Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Posts
29,471
Reaction score
16,632
Location
San Antonio, Texas
the article is pure crap

sorry, but I don't care how much Edge grips as long as he showed the hard effort running he showed last year to the end of the season with no playoffs in sight to play for. Edge is not a good back , he is a freaking great back. First Cardinal back to reach 1000 yards since when ever behind a horrible line says enough for me. Was Edge upset last year...SURE! HE HATES LOSING!!!
 

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
551,147
Posts
5,384,435
Members
6,309
Latest member
Broncosfan
Top