Seahawks and their 2nd ranked Rushing Defense...Smoke and Mirrors?

[RON_IN_OC]

So, do the Seahawks have a legitimate run defense??? Yes, they are ranked #2, but their pass defense is ranked 30th, yielding 291 ypg. I actually think this bodes well for the Cardinals and Max Hall. If Whis sticks to a run first game plan, I believe they will expose Seattle's run defense for the shamockery it is.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst..._NET_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

 

[MigratingOsprey]

2.9 YPC against while facing guys like gore & jackson .......... they have a much beefed up DL

if they struggle against the run this week it will be more because mebane doesn't play than anything

they are stout up front

 

[Catfish]

So, do the Seahawks have a legitimate run defense??? Yes, they are ranked #2, but their pass defense is ranked 30th, yielding 291 ypg. I actually think this bodes well for the Cardinals and Max Hall. If Whis sticks to a run first game plan, I believe they will expose Seattle's run defense for the shamockery it is.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst..._NET_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

Problem is-----Whiz's run-first game plan apparently doesn't exist. He has tried to throw the run open with DA. He went away from the run just when it was working against the Saints with Max at the helm and Beanie piling on runs of 6.5 and 2.5 yards on consecutive runs in the third quarter, then going for a pass on 3rd and one which propptly failed. This was done despite the Saints having 8 guys in the box to stop the run and couldn't. He has yet to run 50% of the time in any game since he has been HC. Apparently every coach on this team, (except Whiz), believes that we are a run-first team, because our O-line is set up that way, and we are carrying 4 tight ends on the 53 man roster.

 

[Longcolts]

Problem is-----Whiz's run-first game plan apparently doesn't exist. He has tried to throw the run open with DA. He went away from the run just when it was working against the Saints with Max at the helm and Beanie piling on runs of 6.5 and 2.5 yards on consecutive runs in the third quarter, then going for a pass on 3rd and one which propptly failed. This was done despite the Saints having 8 guys in the box to stop the run and couldn't. He has yet to run 50% of the time in any game since he has been HC. Apparently every coach on this team, (except Whiz), believes that we are a run-first team, because our O-line is set up that way, and we are carrying 4 tight ends on the 53 man roster.

Uhmm we ran 26 times and had 26 passing attempts in the Oakland game. I believe that makes 50% runs in at least one game.

 

[SacHawk]

It's legit. Have you considered that we're giving up 291YPG through the air because opposing Offenses have to throw on us? It's their only option.

Phillip Rivers threw for 455 yards the Chargers still lost. Coincidentally, you take out those 455 yards and that average of 291YPG goes waaay down.

You'll be forced to pass too, but Max Hall is no Phillip Rivers.

 

[schutd]

Its all chicken or egg stuff. Does the run defense allow so little because the secondary is so poor coaches KNOW they can throw on you and dont bother running? Or are coaches "forced" to throw on you because the run defense is so good? Im no stat geek but I imagine some YPC and att/gm vs pass att/gm would be helpful.

Or, we can just open some beers and watch the game.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

It's legit. Have you considered that we're giving up 291YPG through the air because opposing Offenses have to throw on us? It's their only option.

Phillip Rivers threw for 455 yards the Chargers still lost. Coincidentally, you take out those 455 yards and that average of 291YPG goes waaay down.

You'll be forced to pass too, but Max Hall is no Phillip Rivers.

Yeah, but our special teams are not the Chargers either. Frickin' gave that game to you guys.

way down to 290.5 ? Amazing.

 

[TJ]

It's legit. Have you considered that we're giving up 291YPG through the air because opposing Offenses have to throw on us? It's their only option.

Phillip Rivers threw for 455 yards the Chargers still lost. Coincidentally, you take out those 455 yards and that average of 291YPG goes waaay down.

You'll be forced to pass too, but Max Hall is no Phillip Rivers.

You're probably like the Cardinals of early last season. We led the league in run defense for a small portion of the season. In that span, we went up against Gore, MJD, and Addai. All of a sudden, teams found a way to torch us on the ground.

Offenses will adjust to the scheme and will have much more success against the ground. I dont think your coaching or players are good enough to respond.

 

[MigratingOsprey]

Yeah, but our special teams are not the Chargers either. Frickin' gave that game to you guys.

way down to 290.5 ? Amazing.

or maybe those two quick scores gave the chargers two extra possessions, little time for the defense to adjust and rest and put them in a position where they had to throw the ball and seattle went into a softer defensive position and less risky offensive game plan as they only needed to beat the clock at this point (what if seattle went on a pair of 6 minute drives that added 10 points ..... how would the chargers #s change then?)

the hawks were up 10-0 at half and that was with fumbling on the 7 inch line through the endzone and gaffing a chance to add a FG ..... could of very easily of been 20-0 at the half

you can what if things to death .... the reality is the hawks jumped on them early and held the lead for a solid home win

 

[stewdog1]

Is Breaston and Doucet back this week? That should help Max out a lot.

I'm not too concerned about their run defense as we haven't shown the ability to run well anyway.

 

[Russ Smith]

2.9 YPC against while facing guys like gore & jackson .......... they have a much beefed up DL

if they struggle against the run this week it will be more because mebane doesn't play than anything

they are stout up front

Yeah it doesn't appear to be just nobody runs because they don't have to when they're only giving up 2.9 YPC.

That's why I think this game could be a tough one for the Cards. On the road very loud stadium, rookie QB, and a defense that is going to make us throw the ball.

Not saying we can't win, but it's certainly not the ideal matchup for a Cards team I believe should be running more. In Arizona I think the Cards probably win, in Seattle it'll be tough.

 

[Duckjake]

Yeah it doesn't appear to be just nobody runs because they don't have to when they're only giving up 2.9 YPC.

That's why I think this game could be a tough one for the Cards. On the road very loud stadium, rookie QB, and a defense that is going to make us throw the ball.

Not saying we can't win, but it's certainly not the ideal matchup for a Cards team I believe should be running more. In Arizona I think the Cards probably win, in Seattle it'll be tough.

I have to agree with Russ. Both Arizona and Seattle appear to be the Rockies of the NFL this season. World beaters at home, dogs on the road. I know most NFL teams are better at home than on the road but the disparity in results for these two is large.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I think thier defense is legit at home. Especially when the 12th man is rocking the place. Gives the defense a huge advantage.

 

[40yearfan]

or maybe those two quick scores gave the chargers two extra possessions, little time for the defense to adjust and rest and put them in a position where they had to throw the ball and seattle went into a softer defensive position and less risky offensive game plan as they only needed to beat the clock at this point (what if seattle went on a pair of 6 minute drives that added 10 points ..... how would the chargers #s change then?)

the hawks were up 10-0 at half and that was with fumbling on the 7 inch line through the endzone and gaffing a chance to add a FG ..... could of very easily of been 20-0 at the half

you can what if things to death .... the reality is the hawks jumped on them early and held the lead for a solid home win

This game all depends on which Cardinal defense shows up this week. The one that showed up for the Atlanta game or the one that showed up for the Saints game.

 

[Russ Smith]

I think thier defense is legit at home. Especially when the 12th man is rocking the place. Gives the defense a huge advantage.

People don't realize what a huge advantage crowd noise is. NFL is so much about matchups these days and you get to the LOS, see a matchup you want and audible to a play to get it. WHen the crowd makes audibling tough, it's a HUGE advantage for a defense.

Played a big role in us beating New Orleans.

 

[kerouac9]

I think thier defense is legit at home. Especially when the 12th man is rocking the place. Gives the defense a huge advantage.

That's why you got to run the ball and get the crowd out of it. You can put the 12th man in the deep freeze. We've seen Thomas Jones rush for like 200 yards in Seattle and that stadium can get as quiet as it gets loud.

People don't realize what a huge advantage crowd noise is. NFL is so much about matchups these days and you get to the LOS, see a matchup you want and audible to a play to get it. WHen the crowd makes audibling tough, it's a HUGE advantage for a defense.

Played a big role in us beating New Orleans.

The communication between Hall and the WRs is important. Develop hand signals like Peyton Manning. It's not that hard.

I'm less worried about communication from the quarterback than I am with Levi Brown jumping offsides. In Levi's defense, he's on pace for a career low in sacks (8), false starts (4) and holding penalties (0). Part of that is that we haven't played anyone good on that side (John Abraham is clearly not the player he was three years ago), and that he doesn't have the target on his back (Brandon Keith does). But this week is a big test for him.

 

[chickenhead]

For our purposes it's not smoke and mirrors. The stats are what they are, we don't have a dominant ground game, and they have homefield advantage. We should expect a stout defense.

 

[Duckjake]

That's why you got to run the ball and get the crowd out of it. You can put the 12th man in the deep freeze. We've seen Thomas Jones rush for like 200 yards in Seattle and that stadium can get as quiet as it gets loud.



The communication between Hall and the WRs is important. Develop hand signals like Peyton Manning. It's not that hard.

I'm less worried about communication from the quarterback than I am with Levi Brown jumping offsides. In Levi's defense, he's on pace for a career low in sacks (8), false starts (4) and holding penalties (0). Part of that is that we haven't played anyone good on that side (John Abraham is clearly not the player he was three years ago), and that he doesn't have the target on his back (Brandon Keith does). But this week is a big test for him.

Is Seattle's Red Bryant any real threat ( I believe he will play across from Levi)? Don't know anything about him.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I'm less worried about communication from the quarterback than I am with Levi Brown jumping offsides. In Levi's defense, he's on pace for a career low in sacks (8), false starts (4) and holding penalties (0). Part of that is that we haven't played anyone good on that side (John Abraham is clearly not the player he was three years ago), and that he doesn't have the target on his back (Brandon Keith does). But this week is a big test for him.

Yep.

My biggest concern with the crowd noise is the OL.

 

[MigratingOsprey]

Is Seattle's Red Bryant any real threat ( I believe he will play across from Levi)? Don't know anything about him.

Probably not on his own .... he's a big body and can be a load coming off the edge ... he's given good chase a few times this year, but really isn't going to close and get a lot of sacks

He can help collapse a side of the pocket, pushing guys in so that the QB has to move towards the pass rushers on the other side or occupy enough lineman where the hawks can send a pass rusher behind him and every now and again he will break through on his own

Strong against the run though

 

[kerouac9]

Is Seattle's Red Bryant any real threat ( I believe he will play across from Levi)? Don't know anything about him.

As Osprey said, not really. Levi can handle bull rushers most of the time. It's the speed guys who can set the edge that he really has a hard time with. Fortunately, Seattle doesn't have ANY of those kinds of players.

What we will have to be careful of on offense, though, is the stunts and delayed blitzes that have given us fits in the past. That's one thing that San Francisco killed us with last season, and this offensive line has had a hard time adjusting to. When a DE comes around the defensive tackle, it's sometimes like the OL has no idea what to do. Their linebackers also have a lot of speed; don't be surprised to see the Seahawks bring a lot of five- and six-man blitzes and challenge Max Hall to find the open guy.

 

[Duckjake]

As Osprey said, not really. Levi can handle bull rushers most of the time. It's the speed guys who can set the edge that he really has a hard time with. Fortunately, Seattle doesn't have ANY of those kinds of players.

What we will have to be careful of on offense, though, is the stunts and delayed blitzes that have given us fits in the past. That's one thing that San Francisco killed us with last season, and this offensive line has had a hard time adjusting to. When a DE comes around the defensive tackle, it's sometimes like the OL has no idea what to do. Their linebackers also have a lot of speed; don't be surprised to see the Seahawks bring a lot of five- and six-man blitzes and challenge Max Hall to find the open guy.

Are these the situations where we see the offensive tackles blocking down toward the Center and a defender comes from the outside unblocked? Not as a result of a whiff on an attempted block but because no one was there to block him.

 

[MigratingOsprey]

Fortunately, Seattle doesn't have ANY of those kinds of players.

I wouldn't sleep too much on Chris Clemmons (4.5 sacks) ... he's been getting pretty consistent pressure this year - they also rotate in Raheem Brock (2 sacks) and Dexter Davis (1 sack) ..... total about half of the teams 17 sacks have come from their RDE position (which wouldn't affect Brown, but that is where they will come with the faster, shifty kind of pass rusher)

the LBs have brought pressure on occasion - but aside from the DL if the hawks are coming with the blitz it will either be a S or an extra corner back who has subbed in for a LB (Milloy has 3 sacks, babs 1.5, roy lewis 1) ....... the LBs have combined for 2 sacks

 

[kerouac9]

Are these the situations where we see the offensive tackles blocking down toward the Center and a defender comes from the outside unblocked? Not as a result of a whiff on an attempted block but because no one was there to block him.

Depends on where the defender comes from. If the defender was on the outside to begin with, no. But if the defender was on the inside and then came around where no one saw them, probably.

I can't believe how many plays we run where offensive linemen are just standing around in the middle of the play when there are defenders near them. It's unconscionable. It's worse than dogfighting.

 

[Catfish]

Uhmm we ran 26 times and had 26 passing attempts in the Oakland game. I believe that makes 50% runs in at least one game.

OK so that's what------1 game out of the more than 50, (not counting pre-season games), that we ran as much as we passed-----I think I made my point.