Sorting through the Draft

[kerouac9]

Great analysis Harry. It's always good to get your perspective.

1- R. Coopers #'s his Sr. yr. were pedestrian. (Maybe another reason you can be skepticle about Tebow). He had 18 rec. 261 yds. 14.5 avg. 3 TD's.
He did have some good big game catches, like you said though.

2- Why is L. Joseph rated so high when he projects to 3-4 DE. He'd be nothing but Docketts replacement eventually.

3- Meanwhile a true NT (Cam Thomas)you have rated in our 4th round. If he's there 2nd they may pounce. Definately 3rd.

4- Like your overall analysis of round by round targets. Williams (DT Tenn) should be long gone by the time we're on the clock but stranger things have happened. I've heard they're interested in him. Odrick is an extremely intruiging prospect. So is Brian Price whom you don't mention. I'd like to hear your take on him. He was VERY productive in college.

5- I also like Kyle Wilson. We'd have to look at him strongly if certain others are not availabe. Suddenly Hughes is a bit underrated and he very well could be our pick at 26 if we get no offers to move down. I think we're very flexable this year and have multiple players at need positions rated closely together.

6- Spikes , like Gerald Hayes, would be a coup iin the 3rd round. We have to look at that. Getting him and a NT there would be a great draft IMO. An extra 3rd for moving down and grabbing a WR would be beneficial as well.

Please explain how Thomas is a "true NT". He wasn't even a standout on his college team.

 

[PJ1]

Surprised no Sean Lee in the mix of your LB choices.

 

[Stout]

I just wanted to add a quick point. I didn’t mean to imply that I see Odrick as a hall-of-fame NT. What I do think is that he can play the position. Everyone needs to keep in mind where the Cards draft. Wilfork and other such comparisons do not apply. Guys like that won’t be there when the Cards select. They won’t be there by the 4th pick. So, at that point in the draft the Cards want a player who can start for years. Odrick is that guy. He can play in the middle, but he can also play end in a 3-4 and how long is Dockett going to be a Cardinal? Odrick fits in a 4-3 as well. He’s the most versatile defensive lineman in the draft. The Cards still have 2 rush linebackers already on the team, so how deep do you go? Yes they could go ILB, but that seems awfully early for someone who’s likely a 2 down player. The best fit for value might well be a cornerback, but the Cards strongly feel they need help in the middle and Odrick is at least a short-term, partial solution. He also has exceptional long-term value; more so than Williams in my opinion. The Cards will never be big spenders, so they need to keep drafting players capable of contributing year after year. Odrick fits that mode.

None of what you have said about Odrick gives any credence to the idea that he could play there. He doesn't have the build for it or the bulk for it, and he's not going to gain those in order to play the Nose. He's a 3-4 DE or a 4-3 DT. In no way, shape or form is Odrick a NT. If he was then I, a Penn State homer, would be clamoring to draft him.

 

[WildBB]

Please explain how Thomas is a "true NT". He wasn't even a standout on his college team.

On your list who are the NT's in this draft? There aren't that many that qualify. Thomas would. Most pundits agree on that.

I didn't see NC a lot. I might have been tuned into 1 or maybe 2 of their games. He just was not one of the people you focused on. He was a plugger and played with four All conference DLmen.

Heres his breakdown> Allthough you've proably read some yourself.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=75016&draftyear=2010&genpos=DT

He"s been impressive by all accounts in the post season games and combine> To me he'd be a great value in round 3. His Pro potential is there.

 

[kerouac9]

On your list who are the NT's in this draft? There aren't that many that qualify. Thomas would. Most pundits agree on that.

I didn't see NC a lot. I might have been tuned into 1 or maybe 2 of their games. He just was not one of the people you focused on. He was a plugger and played with four All conference DLmen.

Heres his breakdown> Allthough you've proably read some yourself.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=75016&draftyear=2010&genpos=DT

He"s been impressive by all accounts in the post season games and combine> To me he'd be a great value in round 3. His Pro potential is there.

As I said in this thread: Terrance Cody. He's a true NT because he played the position in college and you know he can do it. Everyone else is a projection no more likely to work out there than Alan Branch.

Whis agrees with me (http://blog.azcardinals.com/2010/04/19/building-two-draft-boards/):

Whisenhunt said it is difficult to judge nose tackles, not only because few tackles play a straight nose in college but also because if they have weight issues, it’s impossible to know how they will deal with such things on the professional level. “Just because you’re 6-foot-3, 330 pounds doesn’t mean you can play nose,” Whisenhunt said.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Good idea K9. In no particular order.

Cam Thomas: (6'4" 330 lbs)

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Al Woods: (6'4" 309 lbs)

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Terrence Cody: (6'4" 354 lbs)

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Torrell Troup: (6' 3" 314 lbs)

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Dan Williams: (6'2" 327 lbs)

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Jeff Owens: (6'3" 300 lbs)

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To tell you the truth, I would be happy to walk away with any of these 6 guys. They definately pass the NT eye test.

 

[kerouac9]

Thanks, Rugby. It looks to me that Cody, Troup, and Williams definitely have the frame to play the position. It's hard to tell on Woods because he's in shorts.

Cam and Owens look narrow to me.

 

[Stout]

The only real pictures I could find of Linval Joseph were in photo galleries on the school's website. They aren't great pics to show his frame, and I can't copy them. Still, I think I agree that he doesn't look like a guy who would transition to NT.

I want one of these three guys in the 2nd round: Mount Cody (probably have to trade up) or Torrell Troup. If Dan Williams is available in the 1st, I'd definitely want him, unless Spoon or McClain are available.

Give me McClain/Spoon in the first and Cody/Troup in the 2nd. I might even take Cody in the 1st, but only if we can't trade back. If McClain or Spoon are available at 26, take them. If we can't, try to trade back. If we can't, take either Cody or Williams.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Give me McClain/Spoon in the first and Cody/Troup in the 2nd.

Troup is predicted to go late 3rd or early 4th.

So, save your 2nd round pick for something else.

 

[Stout]

Troup is predicted to go late 3rd or early 4th.

So, save your 2nd round pick for something else.

Predicted, yes, but I really doubt he falls to the 3rd. The NFL now has a whole bunch of 3-4 teams, and guys that teams really, really think can transition to be a big fatty NT are few and far between. I think there will be a huge run on NT prospects in the 2nd round, and I think he's one of them.

 

[Cardiac]

Predicted, yes, but I really doubt he falls to the 3rd. The NFL now has a whole bunch of 3-4 teams, and guys that teams really, really think can transition to be a big fatty NT are few and far between. I think there will be a huge run on NT prospects in the 2nd round, and I think he's one of them.

This is my concern as well. What we have going for us is that this is a very deep draft so if teams go BPA then some of the NT's may fall closer to where their value truly is. I for one don't want to go into this season with just Watson at NT.

 

[Monty]

To go by the Whiz quote that K9 himself has posted you shouldnt go by size but by skill set and the projection of whether a players abilities transition well to playing the NT position.Out of the list that Rugby has posted ive seen Thomas, Troup and Cody play and out of those three id say both Cody and Thomas could play the position. Thomas certainly has the sturdy lower half of the body needed but not only that he has the ability to occupy space very well which he did very well in the UNC game i saw. He also looked impresive in the Snr Bowl and his main skills including the fact that he's a strong run stuffer and can command double teams well all project to a legit NT prospect. Id be happy taking him in the third if he is there.