Thanksgiving Mock Draft

[Cbus cardsfan]

It's Thanksgiving tomorrow and pretty much all the Cards fans have to look forward to is draft day 2012. Here's a first attempt for one:

Round 1: Jonathon Martin,OT Stanford: Kalil will likely be gone and the Cards will again settle for the 2nd best OT. However Martin seems much more polished the Levi was. Alt choice: RG III/Riley Reiff

Round 3: Ray-Ray Armstrong, SS Miami: they need a replacement for Wilson and Armstrong fits the bill. Another in a long line of good Hurricane safeties. He's probably the guy I want the most.

Round 4: Miles Burris, OLB SDST: can get after the QB and may rise up the draft boards throughout the process.

Round 5: DeVier Posey, WR Ohio State: he'd be a steal in round 5. He's probably a 2nd round talent but will only play 3 games this year because of suspension.

Round 6: Josh Oglesby, OT Wisconsin: the only thing keeping him from being drafted in the first two rounds is injury. He's had 6 knee operations but he is very talented and played RT for the Badgers(I'll take Wisky OL all day). He was the #1 OT in the country coming out of high school. He's big and athletic, if healthy could be a day 1 starter.

Round 7: Nathan Williams, OLB Ohio State: another injury risk. Healthy he could be a Chad Greenway type and can rush the passer. Great work ethic and has a non-stop motor but he can't stay on the field.

there's another conditional pick, I just don't know what round it falls.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'd like to see the Cardinals trade down for more picks. I believe the Cardinals will need another RB somewhere in the draft.

 

[Snakester]

I like Riley Reiff more. I still think we give whatever it takes to get Andrew Luck.

 

[Bodha]

No Kalil, no go. Trade, trade, trade. Lets get that 2nd back. Martin is a reach, no question about it. Rather have 2 solid players (1st and 2nd) than 1 50/50 star or bust.

I like Riley Reiff more. I still think we give whatever it takes to get Andrew Luck.

Youre out of your mind on both accounts.

Reiff is Brown 2.0

Itll take the treasures of Atlantis to make a move for Luck.

 

[GatorAZ]

Not sure i trust this team taking a tackle so high. Grimm can't scout or develop anyone these days... I like Armstrong but i think he has issues in coverage. If we could hit on our past draft picks we could pick for future need over current need like the Packers and Steelers and let them develop. Unfortunately there's glaring needs and rookies who will be thrown ino the fire right away. I should have an update on draft order later today.

I would be fine with a tackle if we sign a RT before the draft. Both edge spots need to be fixed badly.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

It takes 2 to trade, what makes anyone think a team is going to trade up in this draft? Aside from Luck and Kalil, there isn't many other players worth a top 10 pick.

 

[Buckybird]

It takes 2 to trade, what makes anyone think a team is going to trade up in this draft? Aside from Luck and Kalil, there isn't many other players worth a top 10 pick.

Justin Blackmon damn sure is

...and I'm started to think so is RGIII & Kendall Wright also. I know we won't draft a QB...but just saying.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Justin Blackmon damn sure is

...and I'm started to think so is RGIII & Kendall Wright also. I know we won't draft a QB...but just saying.

RGIII's size alone will keep him out of the top 10. He's also a project QB, will take him several years to adapt to a pro-style offense. The spread he plays at Baylor consists of 1 read, and if that's not open, he runs. Can't do that in the NFL, and that's why Kolb has struggled so much. Don't be fooled by his stats either, most of this throws are very easy, and his WR's are often open by 10 yards. He's a good prospect for sure, but if you watch film on him, you can see why his % rate is so high, and most of his throws you would not be able to get away with in the NFL.

 

[Assface]

My Thanksgiving mock:

Round 1: Turkey. Can't miss prospect, sure to be 1st overall pick.

Round 2: Mashed potatoes and gravy. We got our franchise entree in the 1st round, now to add the perfect complement.

Round 3: Ham w/ pineapple. Slides down the rankings a bit due to being a little unconventional. Great mid round steal.

Round 4: Homemade mac & cheese. Not a sexy pick but adds to the belly of the team.

Round 5: Green bean casserole. Feed the bean!

Round 6: Pumpkin pie. Terrific special teams player.

Round 7: Watching Thanksgiving day football games. The only action physically possible after rounds 1-6.

 

[Duckjake]

The spread he plays at Baylor consists of 1 read, and if that's not open, he runs. Can't do that in the NFL

Not even close to being true. Same nonsense we heard about Cam Newton.

Watch the games. RGIII finds the open guy all the time. He may be too small to succeed in the NFL but a one read and run QB he is not.

 

[Buckybird]

RGIII's size alone will keep him out of the top 10. He's also a project QB, will take him several years to adapt to a pro-style offense. The spread he plays at Baylor consists of 1 read, and if that's not open, he runs. Can't do that in the NFL, and that's why Kolb has struggled so much. Don't be fooled by his stats either, most of this throws are very easy, and his WR's are often open by 10 yards. He's a good prospect for sure, but if you watch film on him, you can see why his % rate is so high, and most of his throws you would not be able to get away with in the NFL.

While to some degree I agree others with you, others I don't.

1) Newton & Gabbert ran similar offenses to a degree. RGIII doesn't run as much as much as Newton did.

2) His accuracy is off the charts & IMO not even compareable to the 2 above.

3) His arm strength is as good or better than Newtons & Lockers and better than Gabberts & Ponders IMO

4) I've seen him repeatedly "throw guys open" & can't say I saw those guys do that.

5) size...a concern but he's as big DWash was as a rookie.

6) Gimmick offense-not many have been good pros out of Art Briles chunk the rock system

7) Easy throws? Never ever have I ever wistnessed guys more wide open than Cam Newtons Auburn teammates...he's been pretty solid as a rook.

Living in Texas I've seen RGIII over & over for 2 years & he's getting better. We'll see...but IMO if Locker & Gabbert can go in the top 10 & Ponder in the top 12 I'm pretty sure someone will be all over Griffin in the top 10.

 

[Assface]

Not even close to being true. Same nonsense we heard about Cam Newton.

Watch the games. RGIII finds the open guy all the time. He may be too small to succeed in the NFL but a one read and run QB he is not.

From what little I've seen RGIII throws the ball much, much better than one would expect from an option type QB. Regardless of what he shows on film, though, I'm pretty sure his draft stock is going to hinge on how he measures in at the combine. That's just how the NFL works.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Not even close to being true. Same nonsense we heard about Cam Newton.

Watch the games. RGIII finds the open guy all the time. He may be too small to succeed in the NFL but a one read and run QB he is not.

...also see Freeman with the Buccaneers. Forget about the issue with size, Griffith will be a starting QB in the league and a very good one

 

[Duckjake]

Gimmick offense-not many have been good pros out of Art Briles chunk the rock system

And we just traded DRC and a 2nd round pick and paid 20 million for one of them.

Oh wait. Kolb is the only QB that has graduated college who played in Art Briles chunk the rock system.

The only other QBs to play for Briles as HC are RGIII and Case Keenum.

 

[Chopper0080]

I am also of the mind that if Kalil is gone, we probably should trade back, but we haven't been great at that in the past.

I could stomach Martin as it fills a need at LT. I liked what I have seen, but his workouts might be the most telling. Some red flags...He has had the benefit of playing in a run system, and doesn't have to pass protect very often in games. Stanford runs a bunch of play action and big sets which limits the amount of speed rushers that he sees. Not many elite pass rushers in the Pac 12 this year, so has played against pretty weak competition. His QB gets rid of the ball quickly.

I wouldn't mind moving back and grabbing the OG from Stanford (DeCastro?) and then a RT (maybe kid from Oklahoma St.?) with the extra pick. It might not help the LT position specifically, but it fills two needs and improves our entire line.

Also not high on Reiff. Every time I watch an Iowa game, he seems to be on the ground after a majority of the plays.

Hey Cbus, I see what conference you watch.

 

[Chopper0080]

While to some degree I agree others with you, others I don't.

1) Newton & Gabbert ran similar offenses to a degree. RGIII doesn't run as much as much as Newton did.

2) His accuracy is off the charts & IMO not even compareable to the 2 above.

3) His arm strength is as good or better than Newtons & Lockers and better than Gabberts & Ponders IMO

4) I've seen him repeatedly "throw guys open" & can't say I saw those guys do that.

5) size...a concern but he's as big DWash was as a rookie.

6) Gimmick offense-not many have been good pros out of Art Briles chunk the rock system

7) Easy throws? Never ever have I ever wistnessed guys more wide open than Cam Newtons Auburn teammates...he's been pretty solid as a rook.

Living in Texas I've seen RGIII over & over for 2 years & he's getting better. We'll see...but IMO if Locker & Gabbert can go in the top 10 & Ponder in the top 12 I'm pretty sure someone will be all over Griffin in the top 10.

He is listed at 6'2", but he sure doesn't look it to me. I honestly would be shocked if he is taller than 6'0" at the combine, and like it or not, that becomes a huge issue.

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Not even close to being true. Same nonsense we heard about Cam Newton.

Watch the games. RGIII finds the open guy all the time. He may be too small to succeed in the NFL but a one read and run QB he is not.

I have watched plenty of film on him, not just highlights...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txEtv2cJS90

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHSzpz-6TnA&feature=related

Those are two full game tapes of just RGIII. Count how many times you can see him read through his progressions. In those two games combined, he only went past his 1st progression a handful of times, and you can see when his 1st guy isn't open, he tries to force the ball, or he will run. A lot of swing throws, a lot of slants, and some seam routes off play action, where his WR's are wide open. Again, Griffin has the same HC that Kolb had, and you can see it in Kolb, he reads his 1st WR, and then completely shuts down. Griffin is obviously a lot more athletic than Kolb which gets him out of trouble when he runs, but you can't do that in the NFL and last long.

 

[Chopper0080]

It will be interesting to see how the safety position falls on draft day. From the looks of it, this could be a very good crop.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

I agree about RGIII size being a concern. If he measures out at 6'2 he'll go high. If he measures at 6'0 then that would be a concern. However,as the guy pointed on the draft talk podcast at the National Football Post, his ability to move and throw form outisde negates that a bit. I don't know how much I buy that but he explains himself pretty well. I haven't seen enough of him to make a decision yet.

 

[Duckjake]

I have watched plenty of film on him, not just highlights...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txEtv2cJS90

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHSzpz-6TnA&feature=related

Those are two full game tapes of just RGIII. Count how many times you can see him read through his progressions. In those two games combined, he only went past his 1st progression a handful of times, and you can see when his 1st guy isn't open, he tries to force the ball, or he will run. A lot of swing throws, a lot of slants, and some seam routes off play action, where his WR's are wide open. Again, Griffin has the same HC that Kolb had, and you can see it in Kolb, he reads his 1st WR, and then completely shuts down. Griffin is obviously a lot more athletic than Kolb which gets him out of trouble when he runs, but you can't do that in the NFL and last long.

Odd that you would chose two games where RGIII threw for a combined 909 yards and 7 TDs to knock a guy. Amazing that he did that almost never looking past his 1st progression. If you are right that RGIII never goes past the primary receiver it could only mean one thing. There is no need for RGIII to go past his first read because that guy is open 75% of the time.

 

[Buckybird]

Odd that you would chose two games where RGIII threw for a combined 909 yards and 7 TDs to knock a guy. Amazing that he did that almost never looking past his 1st progression. If you are right that RGIII never goes past the primary receiver it could only mean one thing. There is no need for RGIII to go past his first read because that guy is open 75% of the time.

funny that guy seems to be Kendall Wright...alot!!! Luv him as an NFL WR

 

[MrYeahBut]

My Thanksgiving mock:

Round 1: Turkey. Can't miss prospect, sure to be 1st overall pick.

Round 2: Mashed potatoes and gravy. We got our franchise entree in the 1st round, now to add the perfect complement.

Round 3: Ham w/ pineapple. Slides down the rankings a bit due to being a little unconventional. Great mid round steal.

Round 4: Homemade mac & cheese. Not a sexy pick but adds to the belly of the team.

Round 5: Green bean casserole. Feed the bean!

Round 6: Pumpkin pie. Terrific special teams player.

Round 7: Watching Thanksgiving day football games. The only action physically possible after rounds 1-6.

what, no stuffing???? I'd trade down with the 5th round pick for it. I don't need no stinking veggies.



.

 

[Duckjake]

Again, Griffin has the same HC that Kolb had, and you can see it in Kolb, he reads his 1st WR, and then completely shuts down

This is a huge knock on Kolb. 4+ years in the NFL and he still plays like he did in college, not being able to get past his first read?

 

[MrYeahBut]

This is a huge knock on Kolb. 4+ years in the NFL and he still plays like he did in college, not being able to get past his first read?

Seems like the only time he looks at a 2nd read is if Fitz isn't the 1st read on a play

 

[AsUpRoDiGy]

Odd that you would chose two games where RGIII threw for a combined 909 yards and 7 TDs to knock a guy. Amazing that he did that almost never looking past his 1st progression. If you are right that RGIII never goes past the primary receiver it could only mean one thing. There is no need for RGIII to go past his first read because that guy is open 75% of the time.

I chose those games because they were semi-competetive teams, wouldn't be fair if I only watched him play rice, or some other horrible college team. He's a good QB for that system, they don't have a lot of difficult throws, and they utilize play action to get their WR's open pretty consistently. There's a reason why QB's from those type of systems don't adapt well to the NFL, and it's mainly because they're so used to reading their 1st WR, and then escaping the pocket if that option isn't open. The NFL will eat you alive if you can't read through your progressions, and a lot of those QB's from spread systems like Griffins, don't adapt well to Pro-Style offense where you sit in the pocket, and scan the entire field. I'm not saying Griffin can't become a Pro-QB, I'm just saying it's going to take a lot of coaching and time before he can step on an NFL field.