The 2017-2018 Around the NBA thread

[Hoop Head]

I honestly thought Smack Shack was for people talking smack?

This appears to be an around the NBA thread and I thought that's precisely what I was talking about, another NBA team?

If that's NOT the point of this thread I apologize but I've never seen anybody say that before.

I always assumed the "Around the NBA" threads were for news throughout the season that didn't involve the Suns or were big enough on their own to deserve their own threads. That's how they've been every year up until the Warriors became champs and contenders over the last 2-3 years though. I could be wrong and I'm fine admitting that. It's not that I dislike your posts, if there was a Warriors thread I would follow it because they're an exciting team to watch but like I said, I thought this thread was mainly news related rather than game recaps. If you're going to post about every Warriors game though why not start a thread for that? Since they are the top team in the league I think others would post in there also.

I know there's always a new Lakers season thread each year in the Smack Shack. I was never sure why it was there instead of here with other NBA stuff but I figured it had to do with this being a Suns sub-forum and with the Lakers being rivals no one wanted to see it amongst the Suns stuff regularly and it makes more sense there than the "Everything Else" sub-forum since it is sports related but not Suns related. Also with the Lakers and Suns being rivals of sorts there would be plenty of trash talk as well, if both teams were relevant in the NBA but they've only been competing with each for ping-pong balls, not wins, over the last 5-6 years.

Not attacking you, hope you don't take it that way, as I said I enjoy your posts but wasn't sure if this thread would be the best place if you are going to talk about the majority of Warrior games because then why not have a Warriors season thread like the Lakers one?

 

[Cheesebeef]

I always thought this was just a general NBA thread... and Russ is talking general NBA. And he's talking about two of the most interesting/polarizing subjects in the NBA... that people here are responding to in conversation.

This page doesn't get enough traffic as it is. I think it's folly to run Russ to another part of the board that no one reads while he's initiating conversation here.

All that said, of the course the Suns are the ONLY team who's made Lonzo look really good so far.

 

[Russ Smith]

I always assumed the "Around the NBA" threads were for news throughout the season that didn't involve the Suns or were big enough on their own to deserve their own threads. That's how they've been every year up until the Warriors became champs and contenders over the last 2-3 years though. I could be wrong and I'm fine admitting that. It's not that I dislike your posts, if there was a Warriors thread I would follow it because they're an exciting team to watch but like I said, I thought this thread was mainly news related rather than game recaps. If you're going to post about every Warriors game though why not start a thread for that? Since they are the top team in the league I think others would post in there also.

I know there's always a new Lakers season thread each year in the Smack Shack. I was never sure why it was there instead of here with other NBA stuff but I figured it had to do with this being a Suns sub-forum and with the Lakers being rivals no one wanted to see it amongst the Suns stuff regularly and it makes more sense there than the "Everything Else" sub-forum since it is sports related but not Suns related. Also with the Lakers and Suns being rivals of sorts there would be plenty of trash talk as well, if both teams were relevant in the NBA but they've only been competing with each for ping-pong balls, not wins, over the last 5-6 years.

Not attacking you, hope you don't take it that way, as I said I enjoy your posts but wasn't sure if this thread would be the best place if you are going to talk about the majority of Warrior games because then why not have a Warriors season thread like the Lakers one?

Definitely didn't take it as an attack, was just generally surprised because I thought I was actually following the general format of this thread.

With one exception which anybody whose seen me post on ASFN over the years recognizes, I don't do short posts brevity is not my thing.

 

[Russ Smith]

All that said, of the course the Suns are the ONLY team who's made Lonzo look really good so far.

That is for sure. 5 games, he has 22 points in the 4 non Sun games 29 against the Suns

 

[Cheesebeef]

That is for sure. 5 games, he has 22 points in the 4 non Sun games 29 against the Suns

thanks for making me vomit right before I go to bed Russ...

 

[3rdside]

Long can be long for the position you play as well. Bender at SF or PF is long.

I am 5-9 with a 6-2 wingspan. Not long.

Strong point about bender.

And height matters of course - Tyler ulis, even with a(n imaginary) 6'4" wingspan is never going to be long - but point guards who are 6'2" with 6'10" wingspans are definitely long.


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[Errntknght]

Statistically, Ulis ranks well in defense at the rim. Of course you don't want your point guards doing a lot of defending at the rim, so that is the first thing you look at is how frequently do they do it. According to the tracking data, Ulis is 13th best at avoiding it, among the 58 PGs who played a 1000 minutes or more. Its not a perfect stat because when the PG gets blown by so badly that he's no long defending his man near the rim, he gets a pass. Brandon Knight got lots of passes, for example, but I don't think I've ever seen Ulis get blown by. They also get a pass on a play where they get screened out of the finish - and no one avoids that all the time. The other thing you get from the tracking data is what percent of the time are they scored against when they are defending there. Ulis does even better on that stat - tied with Ish Smith for 3 and 4th best percentage. The average % against for those 58 PGs was 57.9; Ulis and Ish clocked in at 51.9. The stat isn't perfect there either because PGs get a lot of help at the rim.

I don't want to overplay this stat because the smaller PGs like Ulis and Ish have their men pull up and shoot over them. Still you'd rather a jump shot than a layup.

Looking up and down the list I noticed another potential flaw in the stat. Three of the five PGs that defend the most shots of the rim are Avery Bradley, Kris Dunn and Patrick Beverley who are generally regarded as good defenders. Maybe it means they aren't good but it could mean they pickup other players frequently because they are good defenders. Interpreting stats can be a tricky business!

 

[Hoop Head]

Looking up and down the list I noticed another potential flaw in the stat. Three of the five PGs that defend the most shots of the rim are Avery Bradley, Kris Dunn and Patrick Beverley who are generally regarded as good defenders. Maybe it means they aren't good but it could mean they pickup other players frequently because they are good defenders. Interpreting stats can be a tricky business!

I think part of why those guys end up at the high end of defending at the rim has to do with them being really quick also, getting back first on fast breaks and getting scored on despite it being a 3 on 1 or 2 on 1 advantage. At least in the case of Bradley and Beverly they're tasked with guarding larger opponents also since they are good defenders, they'll guard SG's instead of opposing PG's because the coach hopes they can slow them down or shut them down. I wouldn't say either is overrated on the defensive end, especially Bradley. I watched him a good amount last year and he was a strong defender for the Celtics and one of the keys to them being able to rely on IT so much because they had Bradley out there guarding the best guard on the opposing team which allowed them to hide Thomas a bit more.

Regarding Ulis, he stays close on his man defensively which prevents them from pulling up and shooting over him. If you don't give a player much room to elevate for a jump shot they won't take it or at least can't take a quality look.

 

[Errntknght]

Just because my stat program allows me to calc team averages for defense at the rim I gave it a try. I don't know just what to make of the number of challenges at the rim because it's bad to have opponents shooting in close but it is good to challenge them when they do - and that stats don't give data on unchallenged shots at the rim. But the percentage of makes at the rim is better the lower it is... almost certainly...

Anyway the teams with the lowest percentage makes at the rim by opponents are:
SA .489
Utah .503
NYK .512
Atl .514
GSW .515
Por .517
Mem .518
Mia .519
Pho 520
.
.
Det .554
Was .558
Min .559
Sac .566
Dal .568
LAL .569
Orl .570

Well, SA and Utah leading the pack is in line with my thinking but NYK in 3rd! Almost as shocking is Phoenix at 9th. I know I kept saying last year our defense was not nearly as bad as our offense but I didn't expect this. I guess it was offset by being last in defense against 3's. The bottom dwellers seem about right

 

[Hoop Head]

One of the big problems with our defense last year, at least from the eye test, is we gave up way too many open 3's. We sucked at defending the perimeter. We're better this year, without looking at the stats. I was impressed seeing them hold Utah to only 1 3 through 10 attempts, I believe, in the first half but they got sloppy in the 4th and started allowed more open 3's.

 

[Russ Smith]

One point on small guys like Ulis is it could be their stats look better because they might be getting more help which could be why the Suns gave up so many 3's.

 

[Mainstreet]

The Thunder's charter plane receives a large nose dent. See pictures at the link below.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...om&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=editorial

 

[Errntknght]

One point on small guys like Ulis is it could be their stats look better because they might be getting more help which could be why the Suns gave up so many 3's.

Perhaps that's true to a small extent... usually the guys that help them are not perimeter defenders.

 

[Russ Smith]

Perhaps that's true to a small extent... usually the guys that help them are not perimeter defenders.

Right but you only have 5 defenders, if one of your inside guys has to drop down to help down low, it cuts your rotation by one to get out and cover the 3.

It depends on the coaching philosophy but some coaches are willing to give up some open 3's to cover up inside.

 

[3rdside]

I haven't seen it written anywhere - and it's a bit oogie boogie - but that was a nasty stroke of karmic retribution with Boston / IT and the Haywood injury; IT was treated very badly there....I'm just waiting for the Joel embiid injury to follow.


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[Ronin]

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[Ronin]

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[JCSunsfan]

The Thunder's charter plane receives a large nose dent. See pictures at the link below.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...om&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=editorial

THAT? From a bird?

 

[Finito]

Watched the Bucks vs Hawks game(the Bucks broadcast)

The announcers were talking about how Giannis sits in the back of the plane by himself watching film and even at breakfast this morning he had the iPad out. Only 22 years old he's insane

 

[Russ Smith]

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Apparently the refs saw that incident the same way I did, Beal started it, Green reacted, Beal reacted again and then Oubre came in for no apparent reason and in pulling Klay Thompson away actually hit him in the head. They also suspended 2 bench players for the Wizards who came off the bench..

 

[GatorAZ]

Looks like Cleveland and Golden St are shutting it down until May.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Kinda feel vindicated about being a Sabonis fan in the draft. He is producing for Indy.

 

[Superbone]

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Not this night.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Tristan Thompsons stat line against the Knicks.

19 minutes. 1 point, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 turnover, 4 fouls. $15.3 million this season.

Klutch Sports.

 

[Hoop Head]

Tristan Thompsons stat line against the Knicks.

19 minutes. 1 point, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 turnover, 4 fouls. $15.3 million this season.

Klutch Sports.

And they wouldn't trade him for Melo, at least that's what was reported after Melo was sent to OKC. I don't buy that for a minute, I think that was Rich Paul floating a crazy rumor out there to try and build value in TT.