The 2017-2018 Around the NBA thread

[Cheesebeef]

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Meanwhile, Lonzo is completely his father’s bitch, basically refusing to answer if he likes playing for Walton, saying he’d like playing for anyone.

I wanted Lonzo BAD in the draft, and still think he can mature into a very good player, but if he can’t separate himself from his father, or shut him up, he’s gonna be a cancer on any team he plays.

 

[Superbone]

Meanwhile, Lonzo is completely his father’s bitch, basically refusing to answer if he likes playing for Walton, saying he’d like playing for anyone.

I wanted Lonzo BAD in the draft, and still think he can mature into a very good player, but if he can’t separate himself from his father, or shut him up, he’s gonna be a cancer on any team he plays.

He bought his father a $500,000 Rolls Royce. He's not separating himself from his father. What a circus. Perfect for LA. They deserve each other.

 

[elindholm]

Here's what Luke Walton should have said:

"LaVar Ball is a passionate Lakers fan and we appreciate his support. Like many fans, he thinks he knows more than the coaching staff or the front office personnel. Part of what makes following a professional sports team so much fun is the opportunity to imagine yourself in a position of power. We encourage that imagination from all of our fans, because it shows how engaged they are. But most fans understand, when you get right down to it, that they don't know what they're talking about. LaVar may not have gotten there yet, but he's a smart guy and he'll figure it out soon.

"All of our players have friends and family members who care about them deeply and want to see them perform well. A father will be a fan of his son first and the team second. Certainly I understand that from my relationship with my own father, who LaVar may have heard of. Lonzo is a big part of the Lakers' future, and his development is one of my top priorities as head coach. We're very excited about what Lonzo already brings to the table, and we know he's only going to get better."

 

[BC867]

Here's what Luke Walton should have said:

"LaVar Ball is a passionate Lakers fan and we appreciate his support. Like many fans, he thinks he knows more than the coaching staff or the front office personnel. Part of what makes following a professional sports team so much fun is the opportunity to imagine yourself in a position of power. We encourage that imagination from all of our fans, because it shows how engaged they are. But most fans understand, when you get right down to it, that they don't know what they're talking about. LaVar may not have gotten there yet, but he's a smart guy and he'll figure it out soon.

"All of our players have friends and family members who care about them deeply and want to see them perform well. A father will be a fan of his son first and the team second. Certainly I understand that from my relationship with my own father, who LaVar may have heard of. Lonzo is a big part of the Lakers' future, and his development is one of my top priorities as head coach. We're very excited about what Lonzo already brings to the table, and we know he's only going to get better."

Classy! Or Luke could have said, LaVar Ball is taking advantage of his son's celebrity status (as an NBA player) to be quoted in the Press. When he gets a job as an NBA Head Coach, he will have earned that privilege. Right now, he is just a pseudo-Kardashian, who can hold public attention only by doing outrageous things.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Here's what Luke Walton should have said:

"LaVar Ball is a passionate Lakers fan and we appreciate his support. Like many fans, he thinks he knows more than the coaching staff or the front office personnel. Part of what makes following a professional sports team so much fun is the opportunity to imagine yourself in a position of power. We encourage that imagination from all of our fans, because it shows how engaged they are. But most fans understand, when you get right down to it, that they don't know what they're talking about. LaVar may not have gotten there yet, but he's a smart guy and he'll figure it out soon.

"All of our players have friends and family members who care about them deeply and want to see them perform well. A father will be a fan of his son first and the team second. Certainly I understand that from my relationship with my own father, who LaVar may have heard of. Lonzo is a big part of the Lakers' future, and his development is one of my top priorities as head coach. We're very excited about what Lonzo already brings to the table, and we know he's only going to get better."

he's in such a tough situation. As a coach, who knows the franchise is all in on Lonzo, he can't just destroy Lavar likes Lavar deserves to be destroyed if he knows Lonzo is still in his pocket.

what a disaster for the Lakers... who's fans and media STILL believe they're getting LeBron in the off-season. Which makes total sense... why wouldn't Lebron want to go the West, where it's much tougher, to play on the worst team, who's a circus because of one of the player's father. Sounds perfect, right?

I love this.

 

[Russ Smith]

Meanwhile, Lonzo is completely his father’s bitch, basically refusing to answer if he likes playing for Walton, saying he’d like playing for anyone.

I wanted Lonzo BAD in the draft, and still think he can mature into a very good player, but if he can’t separate himself from his father, or shut him up, he’s gonna be a cancer on any team he plays.

He didn't refuse to answer he said he plays for anyone. Then they asked him what he meant by that, what did he think of Lute Walton, and he said it's not up to him to talk about that stuff he just plays. I guess I wish he'd been like Kuzma and said I strongly support Luke, but that's not Lonzo it never has been he's a very low key kid.

He's not even remotely a cancer on his team they proved that after the Denver game when his coach and teammates all stood up for him when Jamal Murray showed him up at the end of the game. Walton specifically called out Murray after the game I don't think he has an issue with Lonzo.

I keep saying it, Larry Fitzgeralds dad has been doing this for over a decade, it hasn't caused the Cardinals any issue. Now I'm not comparing Rookie Lonzo to Fitz, he's obviously not nearly as good, but he's the same kind of personality Fitz was at at a similar age, he wasn't outspoken he just played. as Fitz got older he was a bit more outspoken and occasionally contradicted his dad.

I recall a few years ago we played on MNF and Larry only had 1 catch and his dad went off on Twitter about it after the game. Fitz responded by saying he didn't agree with his dad, we won the game that's all I care about. My guess is that's what Lonzo thinks too. He doesn't want to talk about his dad he wants to talk about the games, they broke a 9 game losing streak and all people are talking about is Lavar.

I think the reality is that at a time when Lonzo is playing by far the best basketball of his young career, people are still talking about Lavar.

In his last 7 games he's 44-100 from the floor and 24-56 from 3(43%), 8 rpg, just under 8APG. He's had double doubles in 3 of those 7 games, and people aren't really noticing because his dad is still a distraction. And I pointed out elsewhere the Better Business Bureau is blasting Big Baller Brand which potentially could impact Lonzo financially and can certainly harm his "brand" which impacts his future earnings potential.

I think Lavar is harming Lonzo more than he's harming the Lakers, the 9 losses in a row were why Luke was getting some heat.

 

[Russ Smith]

If you want to see the whole Lavar issue in a nutshell watch todays Outside the Lines on ESPN. It's unreal, they play snippets of 3 NBA coaches blasting ESPN for giving Lavar a live microphone, and then 2 seconds later Bob Ley says to Ramona Shelburne so it's clear from those comments the Lakers have a Lavar problem and NBA coaches are furious about Lavar Ball.

no they're not, Stan Van Gundy specifically said in that comment ESPN showed, I have no problem with Lavar Ball, all 3 said the same thing, the problem is ESPN is giving him the platform. Steve Kerr said it's not just an ESPN deal but we're not covering the game anymore it's a spectacle, it's glitz and flash over substance now and the media needs to be aware of what they're doing. And yet here's Bob Ley somehow listening to that and then concluding the coaches are mad at Lavar, not mad at ESPN?

They also disclosed what really happened, Lavar made the comment to Jeff Goodman offline, Goodman "pressured" him to go on air and make the comment and Lavar eventually agreed to do so stressing I have not discussed this with Lonzo or anybody in the Lakers organization this is just my opinion. ESPN ran the interview and then started reporting the "highlights" of it which are the clips everyone is commenting on. They had someone on from SBNation and she outright said ESPN created a story, put it on the air and then by using clips with no context created a controversy.

 

[Cheesebeef]

He didn't refuse to answer he said he plays for anyone. Then they asked him what he meant by that, what did he think of Lute Walton, and he said it's not up to him to talk about that stuff he just plays. I guess I wish he'd been like Kuzma and said I strongly support Luke, but that's not Lonzo it never has been he's a very low key kid.

Jesus Russ... Kuzma didn't do anything super-charged. He said what a professional says about their coach. Lonzo played the bitch and basically threw Walton under the bus. That doesn't have jack squat to do with being low-key. It's has to do with either cowardice or worse.. agreeing with his dad.

He's not even remotely a cancer on his team they proved that after the Denver game when his coach and teammates all stood up for him when Jamal Murray showed him up at the end of the game. Walton specifically called out Murray after the game I don't think he has an issue with Lonzo.

Yeah... that all happened PRE-Lonzo bitching out on his coach. And I didn't say Lonzo himself was a cancer... his family and what comes with it IS.

I keep saying it, Larry Fitzgeralds dad has been doing this for over a decade, it hasn't caused the Cardinals any issue. Now I'm not comparing Rookie Lonzo to Fitz, he's obviously not nearly as good, but he's the same kind of personality Fitz was at at a similar age, he wasn't outspoken he just played. as Fitz got older he was a bit more outspoken and occasionally contradicted his dad.

Except this isn't REMOTELY the same situation because a) when Fitz was younger, there was no such thing as Twitter and b) Fitz's Dad isn't even in the same league as Lavar as far as visibility. So when Fitz's Dad said something, maybe it was covered for a second... in Phoenix... and no where else. Lavar is headline news, which makes his son cowering at his knees a problem that needs to be rectified if he doesn't want to be linked in with his Dad's crap.

I recall a few years ago we played on MNF and Larry only had 1 catch and his dad went off on Twitter about it after the game. Fitz responded by saying he didn't agree with his dad, we won the game that's all I care about. My guess is that's what Lonzo thinks too. He doesn't want to talk about his dad he wants to talk about the games, they broke a 9 game losing streak and all people are talking about is Lavar.

I think the reality is that at a time when Lonzo is playing by far the best basketball of his young career, people are still talking about Lavar.

In his last 7 games he's 44-100 from the floor and 24-56 from 3(43%), 8 rpg, just under 8APG. He's had double doubles in 3 of those 7 games, and people aren't really noticing because his dad is still a distraction. And I pointed out elsewhere the Better Business Bureau is blasting Big Baller Brand which potentially could impact Lonzo financially and can certainly harm his "brand" which impacts his future earnings potential.

I think Lavar is harming Lonzo more than he's harming the Lakers, the 9 losses in a row were why Luke was getting some heat.

He's letting his Dad be a distraction and fanning the flames by tacitly agreeing him, Russ. A true leader of men doesn't let that happen, no matter what age you are.

It's okay to just say:

"Yes... Lonzo is acting like a cowering bitch right now and I hope that changes."

I know you won't, but it really is okay to criticize players you love when they need to change and change fast.

 

[Russ Smith]

Jesus Russ... Kuzma didn't do anything super-charged. He said what a professional says about their coach. Lonzo played the bitch and basically threw Walton under the bus. That doesn't have jack squat to do with being low-key. It's has to do with either cowardice or worse.. agreeing with his dad.



Yeah... that all happened PRE-Lonzo bitching out on his coach. And I didn't say Lonzo himself was a cancer... his family and what comes with it IS.



Except this isn't REMOTELY the same situation because a) when Fitz was younger, there was no such thing as Twitter and b) Fitz's Dad isn't even in the same league as Lavar as far as visibility. So when Fitz's Dad said something, maybe it was covered for a second... in Phoenix... and no where else. Lavar is headline news, which makes his son cowering at his knees a problem that needs to be rectified if he doesn't want to be linked in with his Dad's crap.



He's letting his Dad be a distraction and fanning the flames by tacitly agreeing him, Russ. A true leader of men doesn't let that happen, no matter what age you are.

It's okay to just say:

"Yes... Lonzo is acting like a cowering bitch right now and I hope that changes."

I know you won't, but it really is okay to criticize players you love when they need to change and change fast.

You said "if he can’t separate himself from his father, or shut him up, he’s gonna be a cancer on any team he plays." IMO that means you're saying he's a cancer on the Lakers right now because he hasn't separated himself from his father or shut him up and he plays on that team. If that's not what you meant you worded it poorly.

Meanwhile the team has now won 2 games in a row, Lonzo was +33 last night in the win over the Kings, Fox was -26 against him. Lonzo had 11 assists 11 boards and only 5 points, or he would have had his 3rd triple double. For the 2nd straight game Luke Walton joked about the Lavar stuff after the game, after the first win he joked that he sat Lonzo at one point because Lavar was bad mouthing Walton, last night he made another joking reference.

The reality is ESPN is creating a story that's not there and claiming it's causing problems, but it's not causing problems the team has won 2 straight now that they have Lonzo and Lopez back healthy.ESPN sent Jeff Goodman to Lithuania to cover the whole Gelo and Melo go to Lithuania "story" which is what Steve Kerr was criticizing saying that's not even a sports story it's entertainment. While there Goodman was sitting with Lavar who made a comment about Luke having lost the Lakers, Goodman asked Lavar to say it on the record. He eventually agreed to after making it clear it was HIS opinion, he didn't get it from Lonzo or anybody else and he hadn't talked to the Lakers about it. Goodman aired it, they are showing clips of the interview. The person from SB Nation who was on OTL yesterday made that completely clear to Bob Ley, you guys made this story it was not a story it was an off the record comment that your reporter turned into an interview because it would generate controversy.

I wish Lonzo had come out stronger against it but it doesn't surprise me at all that he didn't, that's his personality, and given that the team has won 2 straight since that happened I'd say it's pretty speculative to suggest it's having any negative impact on the Lakers. If anything it created a circle the wagons situation where the team is rallying around Walton.

Lavar has a big mouth, last year UCLA lost a game and he came out saying they had too many slow white guys, and people criticized Lonzo for not coming out and saying something. Then they asked Bryce Alford about it and he said nobody on the team took it seriously, but added that Lonzo had made it clear to the team that's not how HE felt. It's entirely likely he has come out in support of Walton to the team in the lockerroom where it really matters, if you saw the game last night they're certainly not playing like a team that's mad at him,

Just because Lavar Ball is a blowhard, and a dying sports Network in ESPN is using him to try and create ratings, does not mean Lonzo has to go on tv and counter everything he says. If you paid attention the Lakers TEAM POLICY on Lavar Ball is don't give him oxygen, which means don't respond to what he says. Shelburne who covers them for ESPN was on yesterday and she confirmed that, the lakers coaches, and players are all being told not to respond to what Lavar says, they're supposed to let Magic and Pelinka deal with him privately, which they've already done twice.

FYI Twitter started in 2006, Fitz' dad has been on twitter, since 2010, but given that Fitz senior is a reporter that has been printed in newspapers and been on live radio for years, before Fitz even turned pro, I don't even think that's relevant. Mitch repeatedly on the football board has blasted Fitz for not calling his dad out in public, so have others, it never seemed to be an issue. He had a very public venue to air his opinions and he did, yes it wasn't nearly as big as Lavar but again that's ESPN's fault, it's why a half dozen NBA coaches called out ESPN for running that story.They are giving Lavar a platform, just to create controversy they're literally following him around asking him to say things on the record to generate stories for ESPN.

If players on the lakers start coming out saying this is harming the team I'll change my opinion, none of them have said so. This is a media generated controversy it blew up because of ESPN and then Bill Plaschke threw gas on the fire saying the Lakers should trade Lonzo to show support for Walton, the same Plaschke who on ESPN less than a week ago suggested Luke Walton should be on the hot seat in LA because the team was losing too many games.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm going to need CliffsNotes for @Russ Smith and @cheesebeef.

 

[Russ Smith]

I'm going to need CliffsNotes for @Russ Smith and @cheesebeef.

My short version is there's literally no evidence this "controversy" is causing any problems. They're 2-0 since Lavar did that interview.


The NBA coaches have a problem with ESPN, that's what Carlisle said, ESPN even asked him are we not supposed to report negative stories on coaches and he said no, you need to pay attention to your sources and don't give a blowhard like that an open mic to talk into. It's a fabricated controversy that Plaschke threw gas onto. After the game last night Luke Walton specifically credited Lonzo with pushing the pace so the Lakers can get out and run, if he's unhappy with Lonzo he's doing a great job of hiding it.

I should add, if ANYBODY in the world knows what Lonzo is going through it's Luke Walton, whose father Bill is one of the more outspoken people on the planet, and who more than once has blasted the Laker organization since Luke got there.

 

[SirStefan32]

My short version is there's literally no evidence this "controversy" is causing any problems. They're 2-0 since Lavar did that interview.


The NBA coaches have a problem with ESPN, that's what Carlisle said, ESPN even asked him are we not supposed to report negative stories on coaches and he said no, you need to pay attention to your sources and don't give a blowhard like that an open mic to talk into. It's a fabricated controversy that Plaschke threw gas onto. After the game last night Luke Walton specifically credited Lonzo with pushing the pace so the Lakers can get out and run, if he's unhappy with Lonzo he's doing a great job of hiding it.

I should add, if ANYBODY in the world knows what Lonzo is going through it's Luke Walton, whose father Bill is one of the more outspoken people on the planet, and who more than once has blasted the Laker organization since Luke got there.

Oh come on, you are not going to compare Bill Walton, a lovable old stoner hippy, to the mountain of douchebaggery and asshattery that's Lavar Ball! That is ridiculous. Lavar, as well as his oldest son, are human pieces of garbage.

 

[Russ Smith]

Oh come on, you are not going to compare Bill Walton, a lovable old stoner hippy to the mountain of douchebaggery that's Lavar Ball! That is ridiculous. Lavar, as well as his oldest son are human pieces of garbage.

The same Bill Walton that spent an entire season on air campaigning to get Ben Howland fired? the same Bill walton who routinely blasted Steve Alford for playing his son too much etc.

Bill's different than Lavar but if you don't think he regularly says things on air that embarass his sons you're not watching enough Pac 12 games.

Even most UCLA fans I know have gotten to where they want to turn the sound off when Bill works a UCLA game.

I'd love for you to explain why Lonzo Ball is a "human piece of garbage?" What exactly has HE done, not what his father did what he did?

 

[hcsilla]

When I hear Bill Walton, I'm always wondering how a former NBA star player can be so ignorant as he is.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

If players on the lakers start coming out saying this is harming the team I'll change my opinion, none of them have said so. This is a media generated controversy it blew up because of ESPN and then Bill Plaschke threw gas on the fire saying the Lakers should trade Lonzo to show support for Walton, the same Plaschke who on ESPN less than a week ago suggested Luke Walton should be on the hot seat in LA because the team was losing too many games.

“One Lakers player said the situation has become a distraction for the team at times. But his frustration was directed mostly at the media for fueling the hype around it, and he was annoyed that Walton, whom he strongly supports, had been dragged into the toxicity”


http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...agic-johnson-need-hold-lavar-ball-accountable

 

[Mainstreet]

Oh come on, you are not going to compare Bill Walton, a lovable old stoner hippy, to the mountain of douchebaggery and asshattery that's Lavar Ball! That is ridiculous. Lavar, as well as his oldest son, are human pieces of garbage.

Well...

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They both can drive you nuts.

 

[Russ Smith]

“One Lakers player said the situation has become a distraction for the team at times. But his frustration was directed mostly at the media for fueling the hype around it, and he was annoyed that Walton, whom he strongly supports, had been dragged into the toxicity”


http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...agic-johnson-need-hold-lavar-ball-accountable

Hmm so ESPN gets blasted by the NBA coaches association and responds by writing a story that quotes an unnamed player who says most of his frustration is directed at the media.

that's a far cry from Lonzo is a cancer

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Hmm so ESPN gets blasted by the NBA coaches association and responds by writing a story that quotes an unnamed player who says most of his frustration is directed at the media.

that's a far cry from Lonzo is a cancer

You said you hadn’t seen a player comment that it was affecting the team. Here’s a player saying it’s a distraction. And while “most” of the frustration may be pointed to the media it’s not all and you’re conveniently ignoring the fact that the media wouldn’t have any fodder absent Lavar’s big mouth and Lonzo’s TERRIBLE response to he question. If an owner gave that level of a response in “support” of a coach you’d know without a shadow of a doubt that coach was getting canned.

Lonzo may not be his father, but his cowtowing yo his father and not being his own man is going to come back and bite him in the ass. I’m sure his teammates are sick of the circus already. And the only way that stops is if Lonzo stops it.

 

[Russ Smith]

You said you hadn’t seen a player comment that it was affecting the team. Here’s a player saying it’s a distraction. And while “most” of the frustration may be pointed to the media it’s not all and you’re conveniently ignoring the fact that the media wouldn’t have any fodder absent Lavar’s big mouth and Lonzo’s TERRIBLE response to he question. If an owner gave that level of a response in “support” of a coach you’d know without a shadow of a doubt that coach was getting canned.

Lonzo may not be his father, but his cowtowing yo his father and not being his own man is going to come back and bite him in the ass. I’m sure his teammates are sick of the circus already. And the only way that stops is if Lonzo stops it.

you seem to be having trouble reading today including reading your own posts. I very clearly said players, plural, because if you talked to players on EVERY team in the NBA right now, including the best ones like the Warriors, Celtics, Cavs, Rockets, you'd be able to find at least one guy on each team who's upset about something or thinks there's distractions on the team.

If Lonzo was an owner I'd agree his comment was wrong, but he's not an owner he's a 20 year old rookie player who went asked said I will play for anyone.

I wish he'd said something stronger but I don't think that makes him a cancer to not say it and I don't think there's any evidence it's distracting the team. if it is, they need more distractions they've played significantly better since Lavar made those comments.

AS for Lonzo stopping it I'd submit you haven't followed this circus long enough if you think that's possible. This is who Lavar Ball is, he's been doing this for years now, it's just now ESPN has discovered how easy it is to get attention by putting a mic in front of Lavar and letting him talk. Basically since the shoplifting incident in China, they've had a reporter following Lavar around. So you have the FB reality show people following him, and Jeff Goodman now is the 3rd different reporter ESPN has assigned to Lavar duty. I don't think he's going to stop because Lonzo asks him to.

 

[Phrazbit]

The same Bill Walton that spent an entire season on air campaigning to get Ben Howland fired? the same Bill walton who routinely blasted Steve Alford for playing his son too much etc.

Bill's different than Lavar but if you don't think he regularly says things on air that embarass his sons you're not watching enough Pac 12 games.

Even most UCLA fans I know have gotten to where they want to turn the sound off when Bill works a UCLA game.

I'd love for you to explain why Lonzo Ball is a "human piece of garbage?" What exactly has HE done, not what his father did what he did?

That isn't really a parallel. When Bill Walton is ripping on UCLA it is from the perspective of a former player, kind of like how Suns fans get sick of hearing Barkley talk about the Suns, even during the Nash years he killed him. Bill has let Luke do his own thing, he never went after Lute Olsen or UofA.

 

[Russ Smith]

That isn't really a parallel. When Bill Walton is ripping on UCLA it is from the perspective of a former player, kind of like how Suns fans get sick of hearing Barkley talk about the Suns, even during the Nash years he killed him. Bill has let Luke do his own thing, he never went after Lute Olsen or UofA.

Of course he didn't he spent those years going after UCLA for hiring lavin. Luke went to UA in large part because Bill correctly determined Lavin couldn't coach and he didn't want his sons to go play for a terrible coach.

It went way beyond just a guy talking about his former school, he actually got warned to keep it civil on air because he was getting so personal going after Howland. I've heard from multiple UCLA insiders that some of the coaches UCLA pursued after firing Howland specifically brought up Walton as an example of why they were hesitant to go after the job.

Everyone knew Howland had to go but Bill was so personal about it he actually managed to generate sympathy for a guy who's not very easy to like.

it's one of the reasons the flying banners stuff a couple of years ago bugged me so much, I'm not a true believer in Steve alford either but the last thing UCLA needs is fans making it harder to hire a new coach by attacking the current coach in that fashion.

My point was if anybody in coaching knows what it's like to deal with a controversial dad it's Luke Walton.

 

[Phrazbit]

My point was if anybody in coaching knows what it's like to deal with a controversial dad it's Luke Walton.

I disagree. LaVarr is doing things that are having a major impact on Lonzo's life. The idiocy around "BBB" alone has probably cost him millions already. While Bill Walton was a loudmouth it has never effected Luke's trajectory.

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

Maybe the Lakers subreddit is a better place for this...

 

[Russ Smith]

I disagree. LaVarr is doing things that are having a major impact on Lonzo's life. The idiocy around "BBB" alone has probably cost him millions already. While Bill Walton was a loudmouth it has never effected Luke's trajectory.

Agree with that.

That's my primary issue with what Lavar is doing, he's harming Lonzo financially, and he's likely done serious harm to Gelo and Melo by essentially making it unlikely either one of them gets a college education when both could have used basketball to get a free education.

 

[Phrazbit]

Agree with that.

That's my primary issue with what Lavar is doing, he's harming Lonzo financially, and he's likely done serious harm to Gelo and Melo by essentially making it unlikely either one of them gets a college education when both could have used basketball to get a free education.

For sure. And I'm on your side about it being hard to cast Lonzo as scum. It's easy to tell someone else to castoff a person that is causing them mysery... but it's difficult when you're the subject of the conversation and the headache is your parent... and you're still basically a kid.