The Good, The Bad, -------

[Catfish]

While listening to the press conference announcing the promotion of Steve Keim to GM of the Cardinals, I was pleased to hear Keim say that QB was #1 to address, and that the O-Line was a big priority because we need to not only protect the QB, but we need to be able to run behind it. I consider that a good start in the fixing of the team.

Along with the good, however came the bad, which was uttered by Michael himself, when he said that he is pleased with the manner in which we had drafted players and wishes to continue in that vane. I certainly hope that he wasn't clearly touting the talent we have accumulated since Whiz came here, as we have most certainly not kept up with the talent level that Whiz started with.

I will with-hold on the ugly part of this presses, since in my estimation, that may come about if Michael does not improve on our drafting and our free agent acquisitions.

 

[earthsci]

I think that our drafting over the last 3 years has been pretty darned good. IMO the talent drain has been caused by our poor FA acquisitions. Seriously, who is a really good FA that we've acquired? Kerry Rhodes (trade, I know)...then who?

 

[JeffGollin]

In all fairness - as a fellow megalomaniac, I've played "If I were GM" and "sing-a-long with the draft picks" as each draft transpired and key personnel decisions were made.

With few exceptions, I agreed with around 85% of various personnel moves (They seemed like good ideas at the time).

Notable exceptions - (1) chronic neglect of the O-line, (2) passing up Suggs for BJ and Pace & (3) Tommy Knight. Even choosing Levi over AP seemed logical - with Peterson considered too much of an injury risk. ("Uh huh, sounds reasonable", many of us concluded).

Not to say we couldn't have done much better, but from a fans, standpoint, hindsight is 20-20 and some of us are now slamming the old regime despite not objecting to their moves at the time.

 

[GuernseyCard]

While listening to the press conference announcing the promotion of Steve Keim to GM of the Cardinals, I was pleased to hear Keim say that QB was #1 to address, and that the O-Line was a big priority because we need to not only protect the QB, but we need to be able to run behind it. I consider that a good start in the fixing of the team.

Along with the good, however came the bad, which was uttered by Michael himself, when he said that he is pleased with the manner in which we had drafted players and wishes to continue in that vane. I certainly hope that he wasn't clearly touting the talent we have accumulated since Whiz came here, as we have most certainly not kept up with the talent level that Whiz started with.

I will with-hold on the ugly part of this presses, since in my estimation, that may come about if Michael does not improve on our drafting and our free agent acquisitions.

Mr. Bidwill was lauding the consensus building process leading up to the draft.

 

[Russ Smith]

In all fairness - as a fellow megalomaniac, I've played "If I were GM" and "sing-a-long with the draft picks" as each draft transpired and key personnel decisions were made.

With few exceptions, I agreed with around 85% of various personnel moves (They seemed like good ideas at the time).

Notable exceptions - (1) chronic neglect of the O-line, (2) passing up Suggs for BJ and Pace & (3) Tommy Knight. Even choosing Levi over AP seemed logical - with Peterson considered too much of an injury risk. ("Uh huh, sounds reasonable", many of us concluded).

Not to say we couldn't have done much better, but from a fans, standpoint, hindsight is 20-20 and some of us are now slamming the old regime despite not objecting to their moves at the time.

Why was Peterson considered an injury risk, he didn't get hurt in college? Do you mean number of carries in college?

IIRC the people who defended that pick said we already have Edge, and we need a LT. I don't recall much concern about Peterson's health but maybe I'm misremembering.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Why was Peterson considered an injury risk, he didn't get hurt in college? Do you mean number of carries in college?

IIRC the people who defended that pick said we already have Edge, and we need a LT. I don't recall much concern about Peterson's health but maybe I'm misremembering.

He had broken his collarbone in his final year, I believe.

 

[vinnymac]

The draft has been 50/50. That is as good as it gets for most teams. Should they had drafted Peterson or Patrick Willis over Brown. Sure they should of. But the o-line was awful and the Cardinals addressed the o-line instead. Should they drafted Ryan Mallet over Ryan Williams or Rob Housler. IMO you betcha. They have hit on some good players in the later rounds in Hyphen, Acho, and Roberts. Free agentcy has not been so good. That we're they really need to improve on.

 

[Solar7]

He had broken his collarbone in his final year, I believe.

Yeah, this. There was some concern at some point that he wasn't going to play that year. Clearly he did, but that's what it was.

Frankly, I think the Cards have done a pretty solid job of drafting, and our FA acquisitions have been bad. To the point above, the only other really solid acquisition I can think of sans Rhodes was Paris Lenon, along with Richard Marshall. The rest has been awfully mediocre to just plain bad.

 

[Russ Smith]

He had broken his collarbone in his final year, I believe.

but he was cleared by the draft IIRC.

That's not typically an injury that's career threatening.

I don't think the Cards passed on him at all because of health, they just incorrectly thought they needed a LT more than a RB.

 

[Russ Smith]

Yeah, this. There was some concern at some point that he wasn't going to play that year. Clearly he did, but that's what it was.

Frankly, I think the Cards have done a pretty solid job of drafting, and our FA acquisitions have been bad. To the point above, the only other really solid acquisition I can think of sans Rhodes was Paris Lenon, along with Richard Marshall. The rest has been awfully mediocre to just plain bad.

He missed several games but he played in the bowl game that year against Boise State, 20 carries. So the idea that he might not play as a rookie is not true, he was already cleared to play in college.

Edit I found where he disclosed to NFL teams he reinjured the collarbone in the bowl game, Don Banks of SI said at least 2 NFL teams admitted they had some concerns he might miss some offseason work if he required a surgical procedure.

 

[Catfish]

Mr. Bidwill was lauding the consensus building process leading up to the draft.

I listened to it again, and your're correct GC. It was the consensus building he was referring to. Hopefully we will avoid any ugly out of this hire. The bad clearly belongs to me.

I personally like the hire, and have been a fan of Keim, especially in the past three years. You can see in each of these three years just how much he has meant to the organization and ownership. I look forward with anticipation to the hiring of a HC.

I really like Ray Horton, and believe that he is primed to become a good HC in this league. I am somewhat skeptical of his plan to fix the offense however, (if one can believe what has been said about that on this board). If that comes to be true, then Michael may be better suited to going outside the organization and hiring an offensive minded HC. Either way, I have a good feeling about what Michael has done so far, and the manner in which he has done it. I am happy to see we have the GM before we settle on a HC. I am also happy that Keim sat in on the interviews of the candidates that are in contention for the HC position.

 

[BigRedRage]

We draft well, no issues there. Most of our bonafide talent was drafted by us.

 

[earthsci]

He missed several games but he played in the bowl game that year against Boise State, 20 carries. So the idea that he might not play as a rookie is not true, he was already cleared to play in college.

Edit I found where he disclosed to NFL teams he reinjured the collarbone in the bowl game, Don Banks of SI said at least 2 NFL teams admitted they had some concerns he might miss some offseason work if he required a surgical procedure.

He missed four games as a sophomore and seven as a junior. The injury concern was there. Obviously not that much of a concern since he was the sixth pick and a lot of Cardinal fans, myself included, were unhappy that we passed on him. It was there though.

 

[BigRedRage]

I dont watch college and I remember reading a lot on here about peterson having lots of injuries and being a big injury risk and got on board with levi brown since the new cards staff wanted him the most. Bad move. The front office realized it too and right away draft Mr Wells, another injury prone RB who truly turned out to be injury prone.

 

[GuernseyCard]

I listened to it again, and your're correct GC. It was the consensus building he was referring to. Hopefully we will avoid any ugly out of this hire. I personally like the hire, and have been a fan of Keim, especially in the past three years. You can see in each of these three years just how much he has meant to the organization and ownership. I look forward with anticipation to the hiring of a HC.

I really like Ray Horton, and believe that he is primed to become a good HC in this league. I am somewhat skeptical of his plan to fix the offense however, (if one can believe what has been said about that on this board). If that comes to be true, then Michael may be better suited to going outside the organization and hiring an offensive minded HC. Either way, I have a good feeling about what Michael has done so far, and the manner in which he has done it. I am happy to see we have the GM before we settle on a HC. I am also happy that Keim sat in on the interviews of the candidates that are in contention for the HC position.

It's often said that a team takes on the personality of its H-C. When I heard Keim speak of the need for more 'physicality' on the O-line, it struck me that a 'hard as nails' HC might be his favourite. This may play in Horton's favour.

 

[JeffGollin]

It's often said that a team takes on the personality of its H-C. When I heard Keim speak of the need for more 'physicality' on the O-line, it struck me that a 'hard as nails' HC might be his favourite. This may play in Horton's favour.

I think of Horton more in terms of a "speed" and "aggressiveness" guy than I do a big, physical smashmouth advocate. But no problemo - if it works.

 

[Phrazbit]

Why was Peterson considered an injury risk, he didn't get hurt in college? Do you mean number of carries in college?

IIRC the people who defended that pick said we already have Edge, and we need a LT. I don't recall much concern about Peterson's health but maybe I'm misremembering.

I am not defending the draft pick but Peterson had several injuries in college.

Had surgery on his shoulder after his freshman year because the joint as a whole was weak, had ankle injuries his sophomore year, his JR year broke his collar bone on a non-contact diving into the endzone.

Again... none of that justifies our joke of a reach for our bust tackle, but Peterson had some real injury questions.

 

[D-Dogg]

but he was cleared by the draft IIRC.

That's not typically an injury that's career threatening.

I don't think the Cards passed on him at all because of health, they just incorrectly thought they needed a LT more than a RB.

That was not an incorrect assumption. They needed a LT more than a RB. But they didn't need THAT LT over THAT RB.

If Joe Thomas would have been on the board, that's a great choice to be making. Even with hindsight I can argue it.

 

[D-Dogg]

I am not defending the draft pick but Peterson had several injuries in college.

Had surgery on his shoulder after his freshman year because the joint as a whole was weak, had ankle injuries his sophomore year, his JR year broke his collar bone on a non-contact diving into the endzone.

Again... none of that justifies our joke of a reach for our bust tackle, but Peterson had some real injury questions.

I remember injuries being the reason I would have passed on him, and also how many carries he had in college as well. What's funny, is that issue with AP is what made me overlook the injury issues with Beanie and excited to draft him.

 

[WildBB]

I remember injuries being the reason I would have passed on him, and also how many carries he had in college as well. What's funny, is that issue with AP is what made me overlook the injury issues with Beanie and excited to draft him.

Monte Ball is another who some are saying has too many carries in college. Guy will produce.

 

[Catfish]

It's often said that a team takes on the personality of its H-C. When I heard Keim speak of the need for more 'physicality' on the O-line, it struck me that a 'hard as nails' HC might be his favourite. This may play in Horton's favour.

While Horton does not lack in this department, Haley is the prospect that really has this trait covered. It is hard to play a physical game if you don't have the fire in your belly.

Horton's strong suits are being able to think on the fly to make on-field adjustments, and to totally immerse himself in preparation to take on a particular offense. I did note, however, that his teams are not great tacklers. Many will simply not hit, and those that do, seldom wrap up the ball carrier.

I don't believe that Haley has as yet consented to participate in an interview, but it is clear that Michael would like to get that opportunity. There is a good history between the two, and Haley did light the fires in the belly of the offense.

So far as ability to identify a player's strengths and weaknesses, and to then coach to his strengths, Gruden, Horton, McCoy, and Haley have all shown the ability to do that. (That was Whiz' biggest drawback as a coach in my opinion).

 

[perivolaki]

Frankly, I think the Cards have done a pretty solid job of drafting, and our FA acquisitions have been bad. To the point above, the only other really solid acquisition I can think of sans Rhodes was Paris Lenon, along with Richard Marshall. The rest has been awfully mediocre to just plain bad.

The funny thing is that the Lenon and Marshall signings were generally criticized by almost everyone on this board.

 

[artp]

"Should they drafted Ryan Mallet over Ryan Williams or Rob Housler. IMO you betcha"

Thats a pretty good reach. R Mallet has done absolutely nothing in the NFL. There is no evidence that he ever will.

 

[Catfish]

"Should they drafted Ryan Mallet over Ryan Williams or Rob Housler. IMO you betcha"

Thats a pretty good reach. R Mallet has done absolutely nothing in the NFL. There is no evidence that he ever will.

Neither has Ryan Williams done anything to speak of, and Housler didn't exactly show as a headliner either. I am not saying we should have taken Mallet, (only that he probably did as much as these two did). Let's face it. OUR OFFENSE STUNK !!!

 

[LarryStalling]

I think that our drafting over the last 3 years has been pretty darned good. IMO the talent drain has been caused by our poor FA acquisitions. Seriously, who is a really good FA that we've acquired? Kerry Rhodes (trade, I know)...then who?

The left tackle before Levi and I forget his name. The cornerback that left this year after spending one year with us. Last year King was pretty good, not true this year.