Thinking About Dice

George O'Brien

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Up to a week ago the general consensus was the Suns would simply let the contract for Antonio McDyess expire and not really try to re-sign him. But in the last four games his stats have been pretty good. His rebounding in the last three games has been 8 rpg and over 50% shooting:

Against the T-Wolves - 5 rebounds in 13 minutes
Against the Bucks - 8 points (4 of 6) and 7 rebounds in 26 minutes
Against the Cavs - 10 points (5 of 10) and 7 rebounds in 34 minutes
Against the Sixers - 7 points (3 of 7) and 10 rebounds in 34 minutes

Against the Sixers, in spite of a huge rebounding game by Dalembert, the Suns actually outrebounded Philadelphia 40-33. Dice has worn down near the end of the last two games, but his overall play has been quite good including an impressive block against the Sixers. He admits that he is not in regular playing shape, so he could get better as he plays more.

Could he become the Dice that played in Denver? After he left Phoenix, Dice had become a dominating player with post up moves, jump shots, and a better all round game than he had when he was with the Suns. Dice was so good that the Knicks gave up the rights to Nene and Camby to get him.

I would doubt he would come back 100%, but then who thought Camby would ever produce. I'm beginning to think Dice will be close enough to what he once was that the Suns really should try to re-sign him.

If you look at his size, 6'9" 245 he is too small to be a starting center and he had problems against Dalembert and Ilgauskas. But even without being in top shape, he is playing as well as Jake on defense and rebounding, plus he is rediscovering his jump shot.

That one block was revelation. If he gets some of his hop back, the Suns could easily have the most athletic front line in the NBA.

I'm not sure how much I would spend, but I think it would be a huge mistake to let him leave if the money is not too far out of line.
 

se7en

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He's definitely improving. But I think we'll need the rest of this season to even get a slight feel for how durable or good he's able to play. But promising so far for sure.
 

F-Dog

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I haven't seen the last two games so I won't make any conclusions, but one thing that bothers me is the ORB by opposing centers. Dalambert wound up with 10 ORB last night--probably the biggest single factor in Philly's win--and Ilgauskas had 6 ORB in just over a half the night before. Not surprisingly, both centers wound up scoring a lot of points, too.


It's hard to believe that Voskuhl wouldn't have done a better job defending those guys and especially boxing them out. (Although I obviously can't say whether that would make up for McDyess' seeming advantage on offense.)
 

Chaplin

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se7en said:
He's definitely improving. But I think we'll need the rest of this season to even get a slight feel for how durable or good he's able to play. But promising so far for sure.

You mean all 10 games? :p
 
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George O'Brien

George O'Brien

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Brian Skinner did not have any offensive rebounds on Saturday.

Ilgauskas is a very good offensive rebounder, so 6 offensive rebounds is not outrageous. He averages 3.5 offensive boards a game and had 10 offensive boards against the Bulls, 4 against the Pacers, 5 against the Rockets, 7 against the Knicks, and 8 against the Nets.

Dalembert has been coming on strong lately, although he is not usually the offensive rebounder that Ilgauskas is. The problem was that the refs simply ignored the 3 second rule and he would just camp under the basket. One time I counted 6 seconds he was in the paint and it was never called. In any case, most of the offensive rebounds was in the first half and the Suns adjusted - but unfornately the Sixers started hitting all their outside shots.

For the season, the Suns are a dismal -3.2 in rebounding. The Sixers are only -.4 rebounding, yet the Suns out rebounded them by 7. The Cavs are +4.4 rebounding but only had one more board that the Suns.

None the less, I agree that the Suns need to work more on blocking out. I have felt that White blocks out better than anybody but he is awfully foul prone. As for Jake, he averages only 5.2 rpg and only has had more than 10 rebounds three times this season. Based on the results of the last four games, I would say Dice has been pretty good.
 

F-Dog

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George O'Brien said:
Brian Skinner did not have any offensive rebounds on Saturday.

Ilgauskas is a very good offensive rebounder, so 6 offensive rebounds is not outrageous. He averages 3.5 offensive boards a game and had 10 offensive boards against the Bulls, 4 against the Pacers, 5 against the Rockets, 7 against the Knicks, and 8 against the Nets.

Dalembert has been coming on strong lately, although he is not usually the offensive rebounder that Ilgauskas is. The problem was that the refs simply ignored the 3 second rule and he would just camp under the basket. One time I counted 6 seconds he was in the paint and it was never called. In any case, most of the offensive rebounds was in the first half and the Suns adjusted - but unfornately the Sixers started hitting all their outside shots.

For the season, the Suns are a dismal -3.2 in rebounding. The Sixers are only -.4 rebounding, yet the Suns out rebounded them by 7. The Cavs are +4.4 rebounding but only had one more board that the Suns.

None the less, I agree that the Suns need to work more on blocking out. I have felt that White blocks out better than anybody but he is awfully foul prone. As for Jake, he averages only 5.2 rpg and only has had more than 10 rebounds three times this season. Based on the results of the last four games, I would say Dice has been pretty good.

6 ORB in a half is somewhat outrageous, even for Ilgauskas. If he'd played in the second half, that game would have been much closer.

I recall that Jake does a lot of boxing out while he's in there--he takes his man out of the play, and the others go get the ball.


I agree that it looks like the Suns have been doing a good job overall with their rebounding (although shooting a high % takes away opposing DRB, making the Suns look more impressive than they may actually have been); ORB by the opposing center looks to be something of a localized thing. The problem is that that type of rebound usually seems to be followed by a quick, high-percentage shot, so we're talking about a difference of say, 10-15 PPG if the Suns can find a way to keep opposing centers off of the offensive glass.
 
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George O'Brien

George O'Brien

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F-Dog said:
I agree that it looks like the Suns have been doing a good job overall with their rebounding (although shooting a high % takes away opposing DRB, making the Suns look more impressive than they may actually have been); ORB by the opposing center looks to be something of a localized thing. The problem is that that type of rebound usually seems to be followed by a quick, high-percentage shot, so we're talking about a difference of say, 10-15 PPG if the Suns can find a way to keep opposing centers off of the offensive glass.

I disagree that Voskuhl is that good at blocking out, but other than that I agree completely that the Suns need to focus on defensive rebounding. This means not only blocking out, but having everyone back rebounding. There were times when the Suns were effectively outnumbered on the defensive boards.

Another thing that concerns me is that the Suns did not push the ball hard enough on the break. The Sixers set a wide perimeter on the break defense, yet neither Barbosa nor Johnson tried to attack it the way the Sixers attacked when they had the ball.
 

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