This assumption that Leonard Davis is worth something in trade

[Ed Burmila]

Sounds an awful lot like all the posts the past about how LJ Shelton was worth "at least" a 1st.

Or who can forget the gem about Bryant Johnson bringing no worse than a 2nd or 3rd?

Leonard Davis is fat, lazy, and has more false starts than good games. I seriously question the judgment of anyone who watched this team and thinks he is the best OL we have. He plays well in spurts and mails it in the rest of the time. If he's not mailing it in, then I guess he's just too damn slow. Sure you can point to some instances where he played well, but there were a half dozen other games this year when the man across from Big just ran right around him play after play.

In honor of Nidan's "reality check" post I think this is Reality Check Part II: no one is going to give us a draft pick for the honor of paying this tub of lard $6,000,000 or more per season.

Damn this board is fickle. Six weeks ago his nickname was "False Start" and he was the worst player on the team. Now he's our best lineman and we're going to get valuable assets for him on the trade market.

He'll probably walk as a UFA and we can all have a good laugh at whatever team is stupid enough to hand him big bucks.

 

[Evil Ash]

Sounds an awful lot like all the posts the past about how LJ Shelton was worth "at least" a 1st.

Or who can forget the gem about Bryant Johnson bringing no worse than a 2nd or 3rd?

Leonard Davis is fat, lazy, and has more false starts than good games. I seriously question the judgment of anyone who watched this team and thinks he is the best OL we have. He plays well in spurts and mails it in the rest of the time. If he's not mailing it in, then I guess he's just too damn slow. Sure you can point to some instances where he played well, but there were a half dozen other games this year when the man across from Big just ran right around him play after play.

In honor of Nidan's "reality check" post I think this is Reality Check Part II: no one is going to give us a draft pick for the honor of paying this tub of lard $6,000,000 or more per season.

Damn this board is fickle. Six weeks ago his nickname was "False Start" and he was the worst player on the team. Now he's our best lineman and we're going to get valuable assets for him on the trade market.

He'll probably walk as a UFA and we can all have a good laugh at whatever team is stupid enough to hand him big bucks.

You can laugh and still get something in return. Its what is known as having a plan (something that the Cardinals aren't known for).

Take advantage of another teams desperation for an OT and get something for him.

 

[Russ Smith]

Sounds an awful lot like all the posts the past about how LJ Shelton was worth "at least" a 1st.

Or who can forget the gem about Bryant Johnson bringing no worse than a 2nd or 3rd?

Leonard Davis is fat, lazy, and has more false starts than good games. I seriously question the judgment of anyone who watched this team and thinks he is the best OL we have. He plays well in spurts and mails it in the rest of the time. If he's not mailing it in, then I guess he's just too damn slow. Sure you can point to some instances where he played well, but there were a half dozen other games this year when the man across from Big just ran right around him play after play.

In honor of Nidan's "reality check" post I think this is Reality Check Part II: no one is going to give us a draft pick for the honor of paying this tub of lard $6,000,000 or more per season.

Damn this board is fickle. Six weeks ago his nickname was "False Start" and he was the worst player on the team. Now he's our best lineman and we're going to get valuable assets for him on the trade market.

He'll probably walk as a UFA and we can all have a good laugh at whatever team is stupid enough to hand him big bucks.

But if nobody would trade for him, why would anybody hand him big bucks?

 

[Ed Burmila]

You can laugh and still get something in return. Its what is known as having a plan (something that the Cardinals aren't known for).

Take advantage of another teams desperation for an OT and get something for him.

I see your point, but we tried that with Shelton. It didn't work.

Other teams may be desperate but they also have VCRs. They've watched plenty of tape on Davis and I can't imagine too many of them (maybe Matt Millen!) who are stupid enough to think he's worth much.

 

[Redsz]

Damn this board is fickle. Six weeks ago his nickname was "False Start" and he was the worst player on the team. Now he's our best lineman and we're going to get valuable assets for him on the trade market.

Woah! Who is saying he is our best linemen? That honor would goto Lecky or Duece.

 

[Ed Burmila]

But if nobody would trade for him, why would anybody hand him big bucks?

Russ, come on. You know that handing a free agent $4 million a year means nothing anymore (see Brown, Milford). Handing over draft picks is another story altogether.

 

[Evil Ash]

I see your point, but we tried that with Shelton. It didn't work.

Other teams may be desperate but they also have VCRs. They've watched plenty of tape on Davis and I can't imagine too many of them (maybe Matt Millen!) who are stupid enough to think he's worth much.

He was voted a Pro Bowl alternate BY THE COACHES

Somebody would trade for him especially if they watched film of him since our Oline was coming together 7 weeks ago

 

[Ed Burmila]

Woah! Who is saying he is our best linemen? That honor would goto Lecky or Duece.

Check out all the Graves threads....RG is already being strung up if he doesn't franchise Davis and "get something" for him.

 

[Russ Smith]

I see your point, but we tried that with Shelton. It didn't work.

Other teams may be desperate but they also have VCRs. They've watched plenty of tape on Davis and I can't imagine too many of them (maybe Matt Millen!) who are stupid enough to think he's worth much.

Ed we tried that after Green publicly benched Shelton and made it perfectly clear he wanted to cut him. Remember the Jurecki rumor that the Cards stopped him from cutting Shelton his first year here as coach? You do stuff like that you kill trade value for a player. WIth Big, if we wanted to trade him hopefully we'd sign him, and then go out and trade him, without burying him and then trying to trade him.

 

[Ed Burmila]

Somebody would trade for him especially if they watched film of him since our Oline was coming together 7 weeks ago

OK. No point in arguing since time will tell. I hope you're right, because one thing's for sure - I don't want to see him around here next season.

 

[Ed Burmila]

Ed we tried that after Green publicly benched Shelton and made it perfectly clear he wanted to cut him. Remember the Jurecki rumor that the Cards stopped him from cutting Shelton his first year here as coach? You do stuff like that you kill trade value for a player. WIth Big, if we wanted to trade him hopefully we'd sign him, and then go out and trade him, without burying him and then trying to trade him.

Yes, but they also used Darren Urban to plant a story that Big Davis was a fat, lazy SOB and the team had no interest in getting him back. That was mid-season after we lost 8 in a row.

So isn't that the same thing? Even though Graves backpedalled a little today...

 

[Mr.Dibbs]

Davis is different than Shelton in many reasons, and I'm not thinking we are getting a 1st or 2nd rounder, but a 3rd is within the realm of possibilities for these reasons:

1- weak FA group

2- Davis has been moved around so much, nobody has seen his potential if he is left at one position

3- His size puts him in a class of his own

 

[Evil Ash]

OK. No point in arguing since time will tell. I hope you're right, because one thing's for sure - I don't want to see him around here next season.

I'd prefer to keep him since we actually have a decent Oline for the first time in a decade. I just can't ignore averaging 4.2 yards a carry for Edge since the time the Oline was formed (including games against the Chargers starters)

However if we decided to let him, I want a plan in place. Not the "We're letting a good player go and we're praying for a replacement in the draft" type strategy over the years that worked oh so well for us in the past.

 

[Ed Burmila]

Davis is different than Shelton in many reasons, and I'm not thinking we are getting a 1st or 2nd rounder, but a 3rd is within the realm of possibilities for these reasons:

1- weak FA group

2- Davis has been moved around so much, nobody has seen his potential if he is left at one position

3- His size puts him in a class of his own

I agree with point #2. But size doesn't mean much (Aaron Gibson and Mike Williams of Texas were enormous, and totally sucked) without talent.

The FA group isn't exactly terrible. I wouldn't say "weak" because there are some good players available. But teams could also say "Screw it, let's just draft someone" rather than pay a disappointing guy like Davis.

 

[Ed Burmila]

I'd prefer to keep him since we actually have a decent Oline for the first time in a decade. I just can't ignore averaging 4.2 yards a carry for Edge since the time the Oline was formed (including games against the Chargers starters)

However if we decided to let him, I want a plan in place. No the "We're letting a good player go and we're praying for a replacement in the draft" type strategy over the years that worked oh so well for us in the past.

OK we can agree on that. No "Pete Kendall" strategy, i.e. we'll cut him and replace him with some bum off the street. If they want to let him walk they better have someone else to step in.

I would not be surprised, however, if Davis goes bye-bye followed by signing Eric Steinbach to play RG and moving Lutui to tackle. Lutui probably WAS the best lineman down the stretch.

 

[Redsz]

Check out all the Graves threads....RG is already being strung up if he doesn't franchise Davis and "get something" for him.

I think the general opinion is letting BIG go without compensation or a plan in place to replace him would be incredibly stupid.

 

[Evil Ash]

OK we can agree on that. No "Pete Kendall" strategy, i.e. we'll cut him and replace him with some bum off the street. If they want to let him walk they better have someone else to step in.

I would not be surprised, however, if Davis goes bye-bye followed by signing Eric Steinbach to play RG and moving Lutui to tackle. Lutui probably WAS the best lineman down the stretch.

I agree on Lutui being our best lineman down the stretch but I can't see him playing tackle at the NFL level.

 

[Goodyear Card]

The days of the massive OT are over. Today's DE are too quick for the massive OT. Smaller quicker OT are needed to counter the speed of the DE.

 

[Rats]

Yes, but they also used Darren Urban to plant a story that Big Davis was a fat, lazy SOB and the team had no interest in getting him back. That was mid-season after we lost 8 in a row.

So isn't that the same thing? Even though Graves backpedalled a little today...

Loney, the Offensive line coach said Big grades out as the best lineman the Cardinals had this season. I think we will listen to that guy over Ed telling us how on his VCR( do people still have these?) Big is a total loss and no one will give us anything for him. There are not enough options out there for the Cardinals to be cutting ties with there Best Olineman when they can't spend all the cap money they have anyways. Pay him and if there is not a better LT play him there. He is no longer on the blindside and he does well in the run blocking schemes.

 

[Ed Burmila]

I agree on Lutui being our best lineman down the stretch but I can't see him playing tackle at the NFL level.

Well the LT in our system isn't a weakside guy. I'm biased. I think the sky is the limit for Lutui ever since I saw him at USC a few years back.

He may not be cut out to play OT, but he couldn't be worse than Davis in pass protection if they stick him out there.

 

[Ed Burmila]

Loney, the Offensive line coach said Big grades out as the best lineman the Cardinals had this season. I think we will listen to that guy over Ed telling us how on his VCR( do people still have these?) Big is a total loss and no one will give us anything for him. There are not enough options out there for the Cardinals to be cutting ties with there Best Olineman when they can't spend all the cap money they have anyways. Pay him and if there is not a better LT play him there. He is no longer on the blindside and he does well in the run blocking schemes.

I'm not pulling this out of thin air. I realize that Mr. Rats is one of the "I am committed to disagreeing with every single thing Ed says" board members, but the organization - Graves and Loney included - were moaning about how much Davis sucked 8 weeks ago. It's not my fault you can't remember that far back. Maybe laying off the booze will help that memory.

 

[Mitch]

Ed...I totally agree with you here...LD will get no trade action if the Cards franchise him...I have been saying that myself for a couple of weeks...

IMO, there's no way he is worth $11M a year...and quite frankly it looks like he doesn't even want to be here.

The compensation the Cards get for him is the $11M they save on the cap to use toward a handful of impact players.

 

[Evil Ash]

Well the LT in our system isn't a weakside guy. I'm biased. I think the sky is the limit for Lutui ever since I saw him at USC a few years back.

He may not be cut out to play OT, but he couldn't be worse than Davis in pass protection if they stick him out there.

Since the Oline was formed 7 weeks ago, Big has been unreal in pass protection. The player that had problems in pass blocking during that time was Wells.

He still needs to fix that damned false start problem he has but that could be fixed with a disciplarian coach that actually follows through on his promises (ie "Stop doing that or I'll bench your ass" and then actually doing it).

Green talked about his discipline but it was all talk

 

[Ed Burmila]

DeMarcus Ware and Greg Ellis took turns running around Davis (and Wells, to be fair). I wouldn't say that he has been exactly flawless in the last 7 weeks.

He played better down the stretch. But they ALL played better down the stretch. Our disagreement seems to be that I think he went from horrible to acceptable, and you think he went from acceptable to good. I'm just not convinced that he's a "wow" guy. Even when he was much better he wasn't what we expected when we paid him $36,000,000.

 

[Evil Ash]

Well the LT in our system isn't a weakside guy. I'm biased. I think the sky is the limit for Lutui ever since I saw him at USC a few years back.

He may not be cut out to play OT, but he couldn't be worse than Davis in pass protection if they stick him out there.

I can remember Green and maybe Graves complaining about Big but not Loney. Loney had him graded out as our best lineman since he got here

I'm sure the false starts pissed him off to no end but he still thought highly of him