Trading down is a joke.

[slanidrac16]

If you are a team that plans on "making the playoffs this year", as we have heard DG say, then the thought of trading down is totally absurd. Think about it.
Lets assume the player DG wants (Fitz) is gone. If Dennis Green thinks Roy Williams( as an example) is just about as good as Fitz, then why in the world trade down and risk the chance of losing him? If Dennis Green is correct in his assessment, then Roy Williams would turn out to be very worthy of the #3 pick. If DG is wrong in his assessment , then would it be any consilation to say "well at least we didn't take him with the #3 pick"?
My thoughts of "making the playoffs this year" is a pipe dream. That being said, I think we will be much more competitive and a much more exciting team than last year. We may even go 7-9 !!! I believe we should wheel and deal like crazy.
Swap with the Browns For #7, #37 and Northcutt.
Now we have #7, #33, and #37.
Swing a deal with the Steelers. They move up to get Rivers. We get #11 and #44.
Now we have #11, #33, #37, #44.
Keep it going . The Patriots see someone they REALLY like slipping to #11. They offer #25 and #32 for #11.
Now we have #25, #32, #33, #37 and #44.
The results? Heres 1 example. Make up your own and see what you come up with. Throw #65 in there for good measure.
25. CB-Will Poole
32. OG-Vernon Carey
33. WR-Micheal Clayton
37. DT-Donnell Washington
44. LB-Teddy Lehman
65. RB-Tatum Bell
We plug cb,dt,and lb on the defensive side. We plug wr,og,rb and 2 return specialiist on the offensive side, AND we still have round 4 thru 7 to go.
Sure seems better than just #3 and #33.
I know this is exagerated, but my point is, in reality, will 1 or 2 players turn this franchise around in 1 year? Trading down from #3 to #7? Is that really a dynamic way to turn this franchise around?

 

[so far away]

If you are a team that plans on "making the playoffs this year", as we have heard DG say, then the thought of trading down is totally absurd. Think about it.
Lets assume the player DG wants (Fitz) is gone. If Dennis Green thinks Roy Williams( as an example) is just about as good as Fitz, then why in the world trade down and risk the chance of losing him? If Dennis Green is correct in his assessment, then Roy Williams would turn out to be very worthy of the #3 pick. If DG is wrong in his assessment , then would it be any consilation to say "well at least we didn't take him with the #3 pick"?
My thoughts of "making the playoffs this year" is a pipe dream. That being said, I think we will be much more competitive and a much more exciting team than last year. We may even go 7-9 !!! I believe we should wheel and deal like crazy.
Swap with the Browns For #7, #37 and Northcutt.
Now we have #7, #33, and #37.
Swing a deal with the Steelers. They move up to get Rivers. We get #11 and #44.
Now we have #11, #33, #37, #44.
Keep it going . The Patriots see someone they REALLY like slipping to #11. They offer #25 and #32 for #11.
Now we have #25, #32, #33, #37 and #44.
The results? Heres 1 example. Make up your own and see what you come up with. Throw #65 in there for good measure.
25. CB-Will Poole
32. OG-Vernon Carey
33. WR-Micheal Clayton
37. DT-Donnell Washington
44. LB-Teddy Lehman
65. RB-Tatum Bell
We plug cb,dt,and lb on the defensive side. We plug wr,og,rb and 2 return specialiist on the offensive side, AND we still have round 4 thru 7 to go.
Sure seems better than just #3 and #33.
I know this is exagerated, but my point is, in reality, will 1 or 2 players turn this franchise around in 1 year? Trading down from #3 to #7? Is that really a dynamic way to turn this franchise around?

I can't argue with you're point in general but I certainly don't think we can stockpile that many picks. The whole thing starts with Cleveland and Gallery being there for our pick. The best thing about trading down in this draft is that it's so deep with talent, the worst thing about this draft is that everyone knows that.

 

[football karma]

slan--

maybe I read it wrong, but it seems like you completely changed your mind halfway through your post.

The first six lines sound like "do not trade down", and then you go on to advocate trading down three times from #3 overall to #25. Wow.

After last year's experience, I cant beleive anyone is really thrilled with trading down.

The Cards passed on an impact defensive player, and ended up trading down into an area of the draft (beyond just their selections) that really didnt produce impact players of any dimension.

From picks #12 (Jimmy Kennedy to the Rams) to pick 32 (Tyler Brayton to the Raiders), there were only 3 players that produced meaningfully -- Boller of the Ravens, Nick Barnett of the Packers, and Dallas Clark of the Colts. That is 3 out of 21, or a 14% hit rate. Not that the rest are busts, but to think that the Cards are going to inject 4 or 5 rookie starters into the lineup and be better is unrealistic.

 

[so far away]

slan--

maybe I read it wrong, but it seems like you completely changed your mind halfway through your post.

The first six lines sound like "do not trade down", and then you go on to advocate trading down three times from #3 overall to #25. Wow.

After last year's experience, I cant beleive anyone is really thrilled with trading down.

The Cards passed on an impact defensive player, and ended up trading down into an area of the draft (beyond just their selections) that really didnt produce impact players of any dimension.

From picks #12 (Jimmy Kennedy to the Rams) to pick 32 (Tyler Brayton to the Raiders), there were only 3 players that produced meaningfully -- Boller of the Ravens, Nick Barnett of the Packers, and Dallas Clark of the Colts. That is 3 out of 21, or a 14% hit rate. Not that the rest are busts, but to think that the Cards are going to inject 4 or 5 rookie starters into the lineup and be better is unrealistic.

Are suggesting that we would've gone to the playoffs last year with that 1 impact defensive player instead?

 

[slanidrac16]

slan--

maybe I read it wrong, but it seems like you completely changed your mind halfway through your post.

The first six lines sound like "do not trade down", and then you go on to advocate trading down three times from #3 overall to #25. Wow.

After last year's experience, I cant beleive anyone is really thrilled with trading down.

The Cards passed on an impact defensive player, and ended up trading down into an area of the draft (beyond just their selections) that really didnt produce impact players of any dimension.

From picks #12 (Jimmy Kennedy to the Rams) to pick 32 (Tyler Brayton to the Raiders), there were only 3 players that produced meaningfully -- Boller of the Ravens, Nick Barnett of the Packers, and Dallas Clark of the Colts. That is 3 out of 21, or a 14% hit rate. Not that the rest are busts, but to think that the Cards are going to inject 4 or 5 rookie starters into the lineup and be better is unrealistic.

You read it exactly right.
Why trade down? Take the damn player you want at #3 and be done with it.
If you are willing to trade down , then trade down with the thought of filling our many needs with a look toward the future.
Do we want to look back at this draft a few years from now and say "wow we could have had Roy Williams, but traded down to take a "bust " in Taylor or vice-versa? Do we want to risk trading down for 1 of the 9 so called "blue chip players" only to have that player turn out to be a QB that we really don't want? Because if we wanted him, then why not just take him at #3?
If we are sold on the 7,8,or 9 blue chippers, then just take the one you WANT at #3 and not the 1 you're left with at #7.
To me there are only 3 blue chip players on Denny Greens list. Fitz, Winslow, and Taylor. Assuming that to be true, then we will get 1 of those players and there will be no trade down. If we trade down then Denny Green has been blowing smoke the whole time.

 

[football karma]

so far -- I dont know if the Cards would have gone to the playoffs, but at this point, it seems the Cardinals would have been a whole lot better off with Suggs than the combo of Bryant/Pace.

I guess my point is that the Cardinals traded out of the spot where the following players were taken/available: Jon Sullivan, Byron Leftwich, Jordon Gross, Kevin Willliams, Terrel Suggs and Marcus Trufant. All but Sullivan played very well and made an impact their rookie season (ironically, of all those players, Sullivan is the one the Cards liked best. Yikes.) Thats 5 of 6, or 83%.

Slan -- I agree completely with you. Green has said -- first, that there are 7 impact players, and then lately, said that there are 3 that have seperated themselves from the rest. The only way I think the Cards should trade down is if at #3, all three are still on the board, and they know that the team trading up isnt going to take one of them, and they move no lower than #7. Otherwise, take the guy you want the best and move on.