What if there was no draft?

slanidrac16

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I read where there's a possibility the college draft system could end in 2011 if this CBA situation isn't solved.

I got to thinking, so what? Of course us draftniks would suffer, but if there was a salary cap, what would be the harm? Wouldn't this actually ease the problem that the draft currently creates? If a player is drafted #1 he is going to make 50 mil. However, without a draft teams would make offers to various players but they still would be restricted by the amount of cap space they have.
So a guy like Jerry Jones couldn't just go out and sign the 5 highest rated players in college. A team like Miami who had a 1-15 record would not be hamstrung and forced to spend 50 mil on 1 player.

They 1 drawback I see is for poor teams or small market teams having a more difficult time drawing players to come play for them. Hence certain teams would be forced to "overpay" to get them to come. After all, if you are a kid coming out of college and was offered X amount of dollars by 2 or 3 teams obviously there would be teams that would be more attractive to that player. A team like Buffalo might not be as attractive as the Cowboys, at least not for the same money. Therefore, Buffalo would have to sweeten the pot.

Just food for thought during the "dog days". I'm interested in everyone's thoughts on this.
 

Pariah

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What if there is no draft? The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Being a fan of a "poor" team, this notion should scare the bejeezus out of you.

Why would a player like DRC want to come play for the Cards when the Pats need a CB or 3?
 

Duckjake

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What if there is no draft? The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Being a fan of a "poor" team, this notion should scare the bejeezus out of you.

Why would a player like DRC want to come play for the Cards when the Pats need a CB or 3?

yeah that. You'd have a situation like the one that allowed the New York Yankees to win 20 World Series Titles in 40 years.
 

football karma

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How about this scenario:

Instead of a draft, you have an auction:

For example, teams would get a set amount of "points" to bid for players. You could bid all your points for one player, or simply get ten or twelve players by bidding a small amount each for value guys.

If you want, points could be given out equally, or they could be given out on a sliding scale with the worst teams getting more and the better teams getting less ( i.e. just convert everyone's draft picks into points via the draft trade chart).

Instead of slotting, rookie contracts could be based on their point total.

The bidding could be done any number or ways: live, blind or Dutch auction.

It would certainly add an element of suspense on "auction day".
 

cardsfanmd

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How about this scenario:

Instead of a draft, you have an auction:

For example, teams would get a set amount of "points" to bid for players. You could bid all your points for one player, or simply get ten or twelve players by bidding a small amount each for value guys.

If you want, points could be given out equally, or they could be given out on a sliding scale with the worst teams getting more and the better teams getting less ( i.e. just convert everyone's draft picks into points via the draft trade chart).

Instead of slotting, rookie contracts could be based on their point total.

The bidding could be done any number or ways: live, blind or Dutch auction.

It would certainly add an element of suspense on "auction day".
Interesting idea, but IMo when it panned out, it would be a more complicated version of the draft, with the same end results.
 

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Free agency made the draft very important. Before FA a first round pick could set on the bench for years,only seeing little playing time.
 

LoyaltyisaCurse

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If there was no draft, you would see like 5 of the top 10 prospects signing with one team...
 
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slanidrac16

slanidrac16

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What if there is no draft? The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Being a fan of a "poor" team, this notion should scare the bejeezus out of you.

Why would a player like DRC want to come play for the Cards when the Pats need a CB or 3?

How do you see us as a poor team? New stadium, sell outs, concession, parking, naming rights, Super Bowls.....we are no longer a "poor" team. We may not have the following like some teams but this organization can no longer be considered a poor team.

And if the Pats signed DRC ( which they could have chosen) they wouldn't be able to sign somebody else,
There would still have to be some peramiters if there wasn't a draft. Teams would still be limited to 7 players and a salary cap.
So the Patriots would not be able to sign DRC, McFadden, Dorsey, Long and Mayo unless all those guys were willing to play for a lot less just to be a Patriot.
Just playing the devils advocate here. I don't see your fears if this were to happen.
 
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slanidrac16

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yeah that. You'd have a situation like the one that allowed the New York Yankees to win 20 World Series Titles in 40 years.

No you wouldn't. Baseball doesn't have a salary cap. I know this talk about the CBA mentions the end of the draft and an uncapped league. I'm am going under the presumption as still having a salary cap but no draft.
So you would have 32 teams perhaps persuing 1 player. He would field offer from numerous teams eventually signing with the team that offered the most OR the team he most like to play for. As I stated in the above post. If the Cowboys signed McFadden, they wouldn't be able to sign Dorsey, Long, DRC, and Ryan too because they wouldn't be able stay under the cap, nor could they outbid everybody for all the players.

Many believe one of the biggest problems the NFL faces is the salaries that the rookies get. I don't know if this would hurt or help that situation.
Personally, I don't think it's as big a problem as some may say. The top 10 draftees do get a huge chunk of money but teams do have an option to trade down. Then why don't they? Because they really can operate as things are.
 
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slanidrac16

slanidrac16

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How about this scenario:

Instead of a draft, you have an auction:

For example, teams would get a set amount of "points" to bid for players. You could bid all your points for one player, or simply get ten or twelve players by bidding a small amount each for value guys.

If you want, points could be given out equally, or they could be given out on a sliding scale with the worst teams getting more and the better teams getting less ( i.e. just convert everyone's draft picks into points via the draft trade chart).

Instead of slotting, rookie contracts could be based on their point total.

The bidding could be done any number or ways: live, blind or Dutch auction.

It would certainly add an element of suspense on "auction day".

In essence that's the way it is now except that in the place of "points" there are "$$$$$$". Miami "paid" the most points this year although they could have traded done and spent less "points" on more players.

My point is , within a salary cap, what if the draft was just like free agency? Teams would still be limited to 7 players. There is even a scenario where a team could trade a signing opportunity for an extra one next year. Thus , the Cards only sign 6 players and trade one "option signing" to the Giants for and extra signing option next year. Thus , this year the Cards sign 6 players, the Giants sign 8 players. Next year the Cards would have 8 opportunities and the Giants would only have 6.
 

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The top 10 draftees do get a huge chunk of money but teams do have an option to trade down. Then why don't they? Because they really can operate as things are.

You're kind of flawed in that thinking. Teams can't simply "trade down" these days, because you have to have someone that is willing to trade up. Teams aren't willing to give up proper value for high picks, because they're not only giving up something in a trade, but they're now stuck with a huge contract for an unproven player.

If the league were to begin abandoning the draft, there is a legitimate concern that high market teams would be able to constantly pick up the top 5-10 players. Even in your scenario, in which teams would still be subject to a salary cap, the successful teams would be able to refill their rosters with the top talents very consistently.

As someone mentioned, the general lack of parity in college football can be attributed to the tendency for top players to gravitate to top programs. Many teams would eventually benefit from their own success.
 

cgolden

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How do you see us as a poor team? New stadium, sell outs, concession, parking, naming rights, Super Bowls.....we are no longer a "poor" team. We may not have the following like some teams but this organization can no longer be considered a poor team.

And if the Pats signed DRC ( which they could have chosen) they wouldn't be able to sign somebody else,
There would still have to be some peramiters if there wasn't a draft. Teams would still be limited to 7 players and a salary cap.
So the Patriots would not be able to sign DRC, McFadden, Dorsey, Long and Mayo unless all those guys were willing to play for a lot less just to be a Patriot.
Just playing the devils advocate here. I don't see your fears if this were to happen.
I think he was saying "poor" as results on the field poor. I doubt incoming players care much about concessions, parking, naming rights or whether or not Super Bowls are hosted at their home stadiums.
 

Pariah

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How do you see us as a poor team? New stadium, sell outs, concession, parking, naming rights, Super Bowls.....we are no longer a "poor" team. We may not have the following like some teams but this organization can no longer be considered a poor team.
It's a "poor" team in this scenario because we can't draw players like a "rich" team can, ie. a winner.



And if the Pats signed DRC ( which they could have chosen) they wouldn't be able to sign somebody else,
There would still have to be some peramiters if there wasn't a draft.
Then you should have specified the parameters. I was simply commenting on the scenario you laid out--no draft. Yes, the pats could have drafted DRC, but they didn't because the draft forces them to make a choice. Without that forced selectivity, they could potentially get not only Mayo and DRC, but Rivers and McKelvin, too.
 

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Does anyone actually think that it'll come to this. I can't imagine that either side would want no salary cap, longer free agency periods and no draft. I have to think they'll get a new deal done in plenty of time. The NFL is too big of a money maker for all involved for them to fall into the pit that the NHL did.
 

cardsloco

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No you wouldn't. Baseball doesn't have a salary cap. I know this talk about the CBA mentions the end of the draft and an uncapped league. I'm am going under the presumption as still having a salary cap but no draft.
So you would have 32 teams perhaps persuing 1 player. He would field offer from numerous teams eventually signing with the team that offered the most OR the team he most like to play for. As I stated in the above post. If the Cowboys signed McFadden, they wouldn't be able to sign Dorsey, Long, DRC, and Ryan too because they wouldn't be able stay under the cap, nor could they outbid everybody for all the players.

Many believe one of the biggest problems the NFL faces is the salaries that the rookies get. I don't know if this would hurt or help that situation.
Personally, I don't think it's as big a problem as some may say. The top 10 draftees do get a huge chunk of money but teams do have an option to trade down. Then why don't they? Because they really can operate as things are.

Big market teams would still get the best players. The players could sign for less, knowing that endorsements and apperances in the bigger markets would make up the difference. You also couldn't get any stud players to go to cities like Kansas City, Green Bay, and Minnesota when they could choose to live in Miami, New York, or San Diego. Money is big, but franchises like ours, that constantly lose, would have trouble appearing attractive to players as well.
 

cgolden

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Big market teams would still get the best players. The players could sign for less, knowing that endorsements and apperances in the bigger markets would make up the difference. You also couldn't get any stud players to go to cities like Kansas City, Green Bay, and Minnesota when they could choose to live in Miami, New York, or San Diego. Money is big, but franchises like ours, that constantly lose, would have trouble appearing attractive to players as well.

Great point about endorsements. How many times have we heard about the amount of money that Leinart lost by coming to Arizona instead of coming out the previous year and being in San Fran.
 

Pariah

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Great point about endorsements. How many times have we heard about the amount of money that Leinart lost by coming to Arizona instead of coming out the previous year and being in San Fran.
To be fair, most of that is the difference between being the #1 overall and nearly falling out of the top 10 (i forget exactly where we picked...9?)
 

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I think it would change alot

Those that are picked in the top 25 price tags would go down significantly

Those that are picked in the 25-100 price tags would go up. Pretty much stay the same if around 25, but those later on in this range will receive similar contracts rather than ones 1/3. Or maybe they go down a bit, but overall the price range of 25-100 would be rather similar wherever the actual price point ends up.

Those players that are once in a decade tag (like 5 or so), would get into a bidding war. So some of those perceived rare guys might get even more than a #1 would get.

Those players picked after 100 price tags would go down significantly and be treated more like how UDFA's are treated, not 4th-5th round picks.

People like jones wouldn't get 5 top 1st round picks, spending 40-50 million on them, but I'd bet he'd go out and sign 5 or so guys in the 10-20 million dollar range...equivalent to having 5 picks sandwiched between 20th-75th.

Some clubs would do things like this, and then they're 'done'. ~255 players don't have to be picked. There will be plenty of supply, and not much demand. So those players (ranked 101+) prices will go down significantly. More lower end veterans stay in the league, especially with the good clubs. Age disparity between teams would increase.

I think there is more of a chance for failure, and cap hell. If a gm/owner misses on those half of those five jones type 20-75th ranked players over a couple of years, the cap hell would be pretty extreme.

Especially when these could be teams that generally don't pick in the top 10, so generally don't have the opportunity to kill their cap with 1-2-3 wasted picks. Also with fewer players picked up, it might be harder to fill the gaps if they bomb/get injured.

I do think though on average, those that spend more will have an advantage. But a better advantage would be trying to find a bunch of 3-5th round picks that can contribute for far less than 10-20 mill contracts. So you'll have the jones' doing one way, and some shrewd gm's/scouts that will get the same production for far less of a cost.

I also see it much easier to get into cap hell for those jones'. Because not only can you screw up your cap 'a la redskins' in free agency, but you would then be able to do the same with college players...maybe even both the same year(s).

I don't think not having a draft would happen though. I think it's a negotiating tool, and if negotiations break down, and somehow we don't have a lockout/strike...not having an NFL draft would probably be a one year scenario. But might as well have fun thinking about it.

The college situation is a bit different, you have players from 5,000-10,000 high schools going to 100-200 NCAA football teams. Granted alot of teams year in and year out are good..but still most of those wins come against low talent teams....even in major conferences. The disparity of talent from say USC and NAU is far more than patriots of '07 to miami of '07. Even then it seems every year the have's and have not's gap shrinks. Every year there are surprises, so I don't believe it would drastically skew the system.

Meanwhile you have 300 players or so vying for 32 teams. Money is the main issue. I don't think you'll see rookies who haven't earned a dime acting like karl malone and gary payton when they joined the lakers. I.E. this won't be like how NBA guys like that, or grant hill with the suns come on-board to win. If that did happen, it would be with veterans and not rookies. You may be able to get some prospects a small bit cheaper, so that they can win, but ultimately another 10 percent from another team will change alot of prospects minds from becoming cowboys to becoming buffalo bills.

I think it puts a greater onus on having a shrewd gm who always goes for value and has a keen eye for talent.
I think in certain scenarios it can help good teams re-stock or get pushed over the edge, but also be how some teams fall from the top. Some owner like jones' and snyder, might do good some years, and it looks unfair, but over time, they'll fail too, and it might then be harder to get out of.

I don't feel the cardinals would be in a serious disadvantage, but we would be slightly disadvantaged since we don't make what jerry jones makes. If we were still in SDS I'd be much more concerned.

Jokingly: now's the time to trade draft picks in 2010 and beyond now before they're worthless because they don't exist lol.

There's also only so many endorsements to go around. Like Leinart, I doubt anyone in NY would be clamoring to get him. Mistakes happen, and although it could very well influence 10 prospects a year or so. There are far more than 10 prospects in a draft. There is competition between the top places, so it's more like an oligarchy and not a monopoly...which means it isn't quite so sign-sealed-delivered, and bidding wars can still erupt between the major players. I actually think because of our weather it would be a plus, although we'd be disadvantaged...a plus because compared to other teams not at the top of the food chain, we'd raise up the ladder. Others like said before minnesota, green bay, buffalo types would be hurt more and move down the ladder.

That said, money talks, and they could get some of these guys. Some might be from there, and even might be currently a good team to help attract them. I'm sure if it was this year, minnesota might be considered a good choice..but in future years, probably not unless they win 10-12 games the year b4.

I think this could create even bigger swings. Some teams get better much more quickly. Some cheaply, some expensively. Those that do it expensively might also fall, faster on average then normally. Those that are shrewd can get good quality guys for cheaper than through the nfl draft system and stay good...for longer on average.

I doubt this happens, but if it does, I'd look at the above scenarios to occur. Plus alot more not thought of. Who knows what else they could implement. An NBA style, if cut, you still count on the cap...signing bonus or not. Bigger rosters? Expanded practice team? 18 regular season games? Lots of things that could change things. In fact even the wr push out rule could affect how offenses run...relegate some guys to being halfway useless, and others much more important. Or they might just call more pass interferences because you bumped them, thus a foul, so you might not get the td, but you are sitting on the 1 yard line. Be interesting to see how things play out on all these fronts, but there is still a lot of variability into what a uncapped year or no nfl draft would actually look like from so far out timewise right now. jmo.
 
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JeffGollin

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What if there was no draft?
What if New York City was Beirut?

Actually, I've had similar such fantasies involving, not only the draft but other aspects of pro football as well.

- Why not simply lump all the prospects together and draw them out of a hat and assign them to the various teams, lottery style?

- Why not jumble the divisions each year - either by lottery drawing or according to W&L seedings? With air travel all but eliminating geographic boundaries anyway, you might see the Cardinals competing in the "Halas Division" one year along with the Giants, Colts and Bucs and in the "Lombardi Division" the next along with NE, Chicago and the Steelers. Each year would bring a new "surprise" for the fans.

- Or why not go crazy and have a lottery drawing for all veteran players as well as draft picks - so that the Cards wound up with Peyton Manning one year and Jeff Garcia the next.

In other words, we'd be trading off tradition for a fresh beginning each season.

Nahhh! Let's just keep it the way it is.
 

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