"Why not go small? They're going to beat us on the boards anyway."

[BC867]

With that quote, Mike D'Antoni is now officially a Suns head coach.

"Why not go small? They're going to beat us on the boards anyway."

True, we're missing Amare and Zarco. True, we played a team with strength up front.

But it just sounds so uninspiring.

How I'd love to see us with management that is committed to being strong, and working consistently to get there.

But, alas, another Head Coach content with leading the Phoenix Wuss.

 

[newfan101]

We'll, I wouldn't go that far. You forgot Harvey was ill as well. However, I'm not quite sure why he would make that quote. It almost sounds like a backhanded attempt to criticize his big men for not getting the job done on the boards. But he essentially only played two big guys the whole night. I would have liked him to at least try playing Scott Williams at power forward with a center before giving up so easily and going small.

I'm sure he doesn't want to make excuses, but if 3 of your big men are out and you're not playing a 4th (Scott Williams), why make such an uninspired comment?

For once I agree with you BC.

 

[msdundee]

Not only was Amare out, Ben Wallace was in. I think D'Antini's comment gave equal importance to both factors. Wallace more than deserves his present standing in the All-Star voting, he's a rebounding machine.

 

[George O'Brien]

I could not understand why Williams did not get any minutes. All the guards played.

A couple of thoughts about White and Voskuhl.

Ever since they got him, I have been saying White needs to lose weight to get quicker. Last night it was like his feet were planted in cement when compared to Ben Wallace.

My complaint about Voskuhl is that he is not physical enough and last night was a case in point. He was totally ineffective on the defense end. Also, his hand strength is inadequate as shown by how often rebounds get knocked out of his hands.

Getting Amare back will help, but the Suns are still in need of a real center.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by George O'Brien

Getting Amare back will help, but the Suns are still in need of a real center.

And again, we've been harping on this for years.

Who?

Who is a "real" center?

I still find it hilarious that people keep complaining about us needing a "real" center, when in reality, there are only 2 left. The best rebounders in the NBA are power forwards (and one small forward).

We can complain about not having a "real" center all we want, but the fact is, ANY team wanting a "real" center is plain out of luck--they don't exist anymore.

Our center position is not as big a problem as in past years. It's a problem, yes, but unless you have Shaq, Yao or even Vlade/Brad Miller, it's always going to be a problem--and that applies to 25 other teams as well.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Originally posted by Chaplin
And again, we've been harping on this for years.

Who?

Who is a "real" center?

Chris Kaman

 

[SirStefan32]

The problem is not that we don't have a "real center". The problem is that we have 3 freaking guards + undersized SF on the floor at the same time.

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by Chaplin
And again, we've been harping on this for years.

Who?

Who is a "real" center?

I still find it hilarious that people keep complaining about us needing a "real" center, when in reality, there are only 2 left. The best rebounders in the NBA are power forwards (and one small forward).

We can complain about not having a "real" center all we want, but the fact is, ANY team wanting a "real" center is plain out of luck--they don't exist anymore.

Our center position is not as big a problem as in past years. It's a problem, yes, but unless you have Shaq, Yao or even Vlade/Brad Miller, it's always going to be a problem--and that applies to 25 other teams as well.

I would be happy to play an out of position PF like Ben Wallace at center and Duncan would fit just fine. Who would else would I like (not that we could get them or afford them) that might be useful to the Suns at center:

Magloire - Hornets
Dampier - Warriors
Foster - Pacers
O'Neal - Pacers
Ratliff - Hawks
Grant - Heat
Camby - Nuggets

Even Greg Ostertag would be an improvement.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Originally posted by SirStefan32
The problem is not that we don't have a "real center". The problem is that we have 3 freaking guards + undersized SF on the floor at the same time.

Well, 2 of the guards are oversized.

JJ is like 6'8
Penny is 6'7 I think


Overall this team is pretty tall. Or should I say "long" compared to most squads.


The only time we do not have a height advantage is when Marion is playing against freakishly tall SFs like Wallace and Lewis.

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by thegrahamcrackr
Well, 2 of the guards are oversized.

JJ is like 6'8
Penny is 6'7 I think


Overall this team is pretty tall. Or should I say "long" compared to most squads.


The only time we do not have a height advantage is when Marion is playing against freakishly tall SFs like Wallace and Lewis.

I disagree. Shawn Marion is basically as small as small forward to get nowadays. Hardaway and JJ are 6-7 and maybe 6-8 respectively. That's really the only size advantage the Phoenix Suns ever have. Amare Stoudemire is shorter than a lot of the power forwards in the NBA, and none of the centers are tall.

I guess if Zarko Cabarkapa is playing small forward he will have a size advantage a lot of the time.

Joe Mama

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by George O'Brien
I would be happy to play an out of position PF like Ben Wallace at center and Duncan would fit just fine. Who would else would I like (not that we could get them or afford them) that might be useful to the Suns at center:

Magloire - Hornets
Dampier - Warriors
Foster - Pacers
O'Neal - Pacers
Ratliff - Hawks
Grant - Heat
Camby - Nuggets

Even Greg Ostertag would be an improvement.

If that's your list, why not Amare Stoudemire at Center??

And Jeff Foster is NOT any better than Little Jake and even Jahidi.

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by Chaplin
If that's your list, why not Amare Stoudemire at Center??

And Jeff Foster is NOT any better than Little Jake and even Jahidi.

I don't think Jeff Foster is the starting center we would all like, but I'm not sure I wouldn't prefer him over Little Jake. I've liked what I've seen from Jeff Foster. Statistically speaking they are very similar except that Foster averages almost 3 more rebounds and 2 less personal fouls per game. Foster also has better range on his shot which is to say he can actually hit a midrange jumper.

Joe Mama

 

[SirStefan32]

Originally posted by thegrahamcrackr
Well, 2 of the guards are oversized.

JJ is like 6'8
Penny is 6'7 I think


Overall this team is pretty tall. Or should I say "long" compared to most squads.


The only time we do not have a height advantage is when Marion is playing against freakishly tall SFs like Wallace and Lewis.

Guards may be oversized, but they are still guards, and not power forwards.

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by SirStefan32
Guards may be oversized, but they are still guards, and not power forwards.

Considering their size, I don't think the Suns shooting guards rebound all that well. JJ has his nights, but he should be getting 6+ every night rather than just every so often. (His rebounds when playing guard are much lower than when he plays SF). His rebounds per minute are around those of Jacobsen who has minimal hop but seems to hustle more.

Penny's rebounding this season per minute is well below what he did last year.

Getting rebounds by the guards is a matter of focus and effort. This has not been happening.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by Joe Mama
I don't think Jeff Foster is the starting center we would all like, but I'm not sure I wouldn't prefer him over Little Jake. I've liked what I've seen from Jeff Foster. Statistically speaking they are very similar except that Foster averages almost 3 more rebounds and 2 less personal fouls per game. Foster also has better range on his shot which is to say he can actually hit a midrange jumper.

Joe Mama

What about the "experience factor"? If Little Jake had the same amount of experience as Foster, would their statistics be so much different?

 

[George O'Brien]

Originally posted by Chaplin
What about the "experience factor"? If Little Jake had the same amount of experience as Foster, would their statistics be so much different?

Foster is a lot better on defense. He is part of the reason the Pacers did not break the bank to keep Brad Miller.

I love the energy Voskuhl brings to the game and he is becoming a decent pick and roll guy. But his limitations drive me crazy:

1. He cannot defend the post without help and lacks the strength to keep most post players out of the paint.

2. He cannot rebound in traffic and often gets the ball knocked out of his hands.

3. He has no back to the basket low post moves.

4. He has no mid range jump shot.

5. He makes lots of silly fouls.
Voskuhl is getting better, but he is no where near as effective as Foster is.

 

[Joe Mama]

Originally posted by Chaplin
What about the "experience factor"? If Little Jake had the same amount of experience as Foster, would their statistics be so much different?

Experience factor? Foster has one more year experience, and they've played virtually the same minutes.

If Jake Voskuhl is the starting center this team is going nowhere. He is at very best a backup.

Joe Mama

 

[BC867]

If only that described our teams!

'Saw a bit in the paper today, which said, "The Kings have used the same starting lineup in 29 of their first 30 games ... The Kings haven't had a losing month since April 2002."

How I wish the Suns and Diamondbacks had that same mentality.

It's dependent, of course, on injuries. But I believe that, if a ballplayer comes to the arena or park every game, knowing his role, and having devoted full practice to it, he'll be better at it, and less prone to injury as well.

Jerry made reference recently to the importance of each player knowing his role. We'll see if it was lip service or if he really meant it ... upon the return of Amare and Zarco ... and then if the D'backs repeat their 130 different starting lineups next season.

 

[George O'Brien]

Re: If only that described our teams!

Originally posted by BC867
'Saw a bit in the paper today, which said, "The Kings have used the same starting lineup in 29 of their first 30 games ... The Kings haven't had a losing month since April 2002."

How I wish the Suns and Diamondbacks had that same mentality.

It's dependent, of course, on injuries. But I believe that, if a ballplayer comes to the arena or park every game, knowing his role, and having devoted full practice to it, he'll be better at it, and less prone to injury as well.

Jerry made reference recently to the importance of each player knowing his role. We'll see if it was lip service or if he really meant it ... upon the return of Amare and Zarco ... and then if the D'backs repeat their 130 different starting lineups next season.

It's a lot easier to have a stable lineup if all your players are good.

Actually the starting lineup is less important than the rotation. If a players knows he will get 18 to 22 minutes a game, he is likely to be better prepared than if he gets 10 one night and the 30 the next. However, what may be equally important is that his teammates will know how to adjust to him being in the lineup.

For example, Penny will give the Suns a chance to run alley oop plays and he is usually pretty good at 18 foot jumpers, but needs help if he playing a quick opponent. Barbosa goes to the basket much better than Penny, but won't make lob passes and is better prepared to play tight man coverage. They need to know who needs help and who doesn't, what the player will do on offense and where to go to get ready for the rebound.