Wow just when it seemed Lute had righted the ship

[Russ Smith]

Story in today's paper that Reger Dowell's father is claiming Lute pulled his scholarship offer after they got the verbal from Gaddy, and after re-assuring them that Gaddy would NOT affect Dowell.

If true that really is a risky move by Lute, I realize kids get recruited over all the time but there's sort of an unwritten rule in recruiting just like you don't run kids off scholarship(unless you're Tim Floyd) you don't pull offers that have been accepted. What normally happens is you convince the kid that things have changed and he probably won't play and ultimately the kid will decide to renege so that he can find another school, but just pulling the offer makes the school look a lot worse.

The end result is the same but the accepted method makes the kid feel like he at least had some choice in the matter, and considering how recently Dowell got his offer this is highly unusual. Dowell's father said he was told by UA they wanted to use the ride to go after a big.

ahh crap meant to put this in the UA board, can someone please move it?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Definitely a bush league move by Lute even though it's probably best for both parties. With Gaddy in Arizona doesn't need another guard and Dowell doesn't play at Arizona until his junior year at the earliest.

 

[Russ Smith]

Definitely a bush league move by Lute even though it's probably best for both parties. With Gaddy in Arizona doesn't need another guard and Dowell doesn't play at Arizona until his junior year at the earliest.

From what I've read, the reason the Dowell family is so mad is they verballed to Alabama before and then de-committed when Bama recruited over Reger. he realized he wasn't going to play so he recanted his verbal.

So he was quite careful to make sure Lute got that he didn't want to be in that situation again, Lute promised, even after Gaddy, and then pulled it anyways. And apparently someone else connected to UA called to apologize and told him I don't agree with this it's embarassing for us.

Again sorry this is in the ASU board meant to put it in UA group.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Not surprising, Lute's friends at UA are hard to come by these days. This would be a long-term issue if Lute was going to be aorund for awhile but with his days numbered (three more years at most) I don't see it being much of a problem down the road.

Needless to say this was a detestable move by Lute. I don't care how much he's been burned recently with people rescinding their commitments to him he needs to be above this kind of behavior. Although nothing Lute does these days should come as a suprise anymore.

 

[Renz]

Lute is in a no-win situation here. If he doesn't honor the scholarship offer, then he's a lying jerk. If he does honor it then he gets bashed by those same people for not being able to recruit the best players anymore.

Of course, all the UCLA boards will scream the former. Even though we only have one side of the story, the Lute bashers will pick up the standard and start the march again.

 

[overseascardfan]

Russ, have you heard anything new involving Stover. Just read a post on GOAZCATS.com that someone close to the Stover recruitment mentioned that Stover will commit to U of A by Friday. Source also told the guy that Andy Brown is a lock for U of A as well and will commit within a couple of weeks. Maybe this is why they revoked Dowell's scholarship, yes? Also would they be able to bring in Brandt along with Stover and Brown by using an '10 schollie?

 

[Russ Smith]

Lute is in a no-win situation here. If he doesn't honor the scholarship offer, then he's a lying jerk. If he does honor it then he gets bashed by those same people for not being able to recruit the best players anymore.

Of course, all the UCLA boards will scream the former. Even though we only have one side of the story, the Lute bashers will pick up the standard and start the march again.

Well it was unusual for him to offer Dowell and it's quite clear from what the dad said he did it because he was tired of waiting on Gaddy. The problem is he assured the Dowell's that Gaddy wouldn't impact the offer and then now yanks it.

So Lute is in a no win situation for one reason, he lied to Reger Dowell.

 

[Russ Smith]

Russ, have you heard anything new involving Stover. Just read a post on GOAZCATS.com that someone close to the Stover recruitment mentioned that Stover will commit to U of A by Friday. Source also told the guy that Andy Brown is a lock for U of A as well and will commit within a couple of weeks. Maybe this is why they revoked Dowell's scholarship, yes? Also would they be able to bring in Brandt along with Stover and Brown by using an '10 schollie?

I think Stover will pick UA but a lot of UCLA fans think otherwise and think this Dowell thing will be the last straw. Stover visited UCLA over the weekend I think a lot of UCLA fans were hoping that and this story will be enough.

I just think the kid is going to see Morgan and Gordon(neither of whom are good enough to leave before Stover gets to college), see UCLA's pursuit of Josh Smith in 2010, and realize I am not going to play much there. At UA his competition is Withey, he's much better than Jacobson and honestly I won't be surprised to see Jacobson leave next, if they get Stover he'll never play.

UCLA is recruiting Stover as a backup and a possible bridge from Morgan to Smith(if they get him). They're telling him he can play right away and he will, but not much. The guy has talent but he's very mechanical and needs to get stronger, I think he'd be behind Morgan and Gordon as a frosh and probably as a soph(I expect them both to stay at least 3 years unless Morgan really blows up offensively).

We'll see, his mother was posting on BRO premim the UCLA scout site, she didn't say who she was and didn't drop any hints but the fact that she was posting there tells you that the family was at least checking into both schools then(this was last week). She hasn't posted there since the visit.

I think he's going to UA, ASU is completely out now as is Stanford from what the family has said.

 

[Renz]

Well it was unusual for him to offer Dowell and it's quite clear from what the dad said he did it because he was tired of waiting on Gaddy. The problem is he assured the Dowell's that Gaddy wouldn't impact the offer and then now yanks it.

So Lute is in a no win situation for one reason, he lied to Reger Dowell.

Okay, Russ. Because the parents of recruits are always on the up-and-up right?

Maybe Lute did "lie", but we only have one side of the story. Of course, that's all the UCLA fans need to re-start the anti-Lute machine.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Oh poor Lute! They should really stop picking on him... I can't wait to see what he does next, Lute's just in IDGAF mode these days.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

So Lute is in a no win situation for one reason, he lied to Reger Dowell.

True, but Lute did make a decision that was best for the program considering their big man needs and probably best for Dowell considering he wouldn't play at Arizona until his junior year at the earliest. And let's be honest here - Lute isn't getting paid one of the highest salaries in college hoops to be Captain Nice Guy, he's getting paid to win basketball games. I personally would've oversigned and dumped a couple players currently on the roster instead of Dowell (AJac, one of the late signees, or Zane Johnson) but the fact remains that Arizona needed bigs and didn't have the scholarships. Bush league move, but probably in the best interest of all parties.

I can't wait to see what he does next

Um, sign the best class in the Pac-10?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

And let's also mention that shortly after Taylor King accepted a scholarship offer from UCLA, Ben Howland essentially quit recruiting King once he got older and became a marginal recruit forcing him to re-open his recruitment. This kind of stuff happens all the time in college recruiting even with the holier-than-thou UCLA Bruins.

 

[Russ Smith]

Okay, Russ. Because the parents of recruits are always on the up-and-up right?

Maybe Lute did "lie", but we only have one side of the story. Of course, that's all the UCLA fans need to re-start the anti-Lute machine.

I think it's because the whole thing made no sense. Dowell wasn't considered the normal UA recruit, it was also widely reported(Mao said several times) that Gaddy wasn't happy when UA took Dowell's verbal. So it seemed to be an odd choice, then along comes Gaddy and they drop him. Obviously since UA can't comment on unsigned recruits they can't defend themselves but I don't see any reason to assume Mr. Dowell is just out to get Lute Olson here.

The kid already had a verbal that went south because he got recruited over and he reneged and openly admitted it was his choice. They didn't accuse Mark Gottfried of yanking the ride. I suppose it's possible he didn't want to be the kid who reneged on 2 verbals but given the odd behavior from Lute in the last 18 months or so I think it's a bit wishful thinking to just assume Reger and his dad are lying?

To add look at the Negedu situation where Lute ripped that kid apart after he left. If he can do that to a kid that was actually an elite recruit that could have helped UA why would it surprise me that he would pull an offer from a kid like dowell who nobody expected to be all that good?

 

[Russ Smith]

And let's also mention that shortly after Taylor King accepted a scholarship offer from UCLA, Ben Howland essentially quit recruiting King once he got older and became a marginal recruit forcing him to re-open his recruitment. This kind of stuff happens all the time in college recruiting even with the holier-than-thou UCLA Bruins.

Well given that Taylor and his dad both admit that's not what happened I'd dispute that. He committed in 8th grade and de-committed as a soph so it was about 2 years as a commit not shortly.

http://articles.latimes.com/2005/may/14/sports/sp-king14



Mater Dei Coach Gary McKnight said that King’s wavering was about more than wanting to make visits to other schools and talk to other famous coaches.

“I think, in Taylor’s case, he’s concerned about some of the other people UCLA is recruiting, they’d guard the same people he would guard, they’d play the same spot Taylor would play. He is a little concerned about the personnel situation and he wants to take a step back,” McKnight said.

King is playing for the Southern California All-Stars this summer and the next stop for the team is the Bob Gibbons Tournament of Champions this month in North Carolina, where King and his father will make unofficial visits to Duke and North Carolina.

And how about UCLA, his most favorite team way back in 2003?

“They’re still recruiting me,” King said. “I might still go there. I’m looking for up-tempo teams, fastbreak teams, just run. That’s what I want to do. Just run.”



In the same article his dad admits he probably pushed too hard for the verbal to UCLA in the first place. Howland isn't allowed to comment at that age but has admitted since then he regrets taking the verbal that young. King was 15 but only an 8th grader.

To me I never liked taking that commit and I hope they never do again. They're in a similar situation now with Kendall Williams who committed early(soph) and now appears like he may not be a UCLA level recruit. We'll see what happens there my expectation is if he's not good enough Ben will tell him you aren't going to play much and he'll decide to pick another school. When he took the job he did that with a Lavin recruit the kid went to New Mexico or somewhere and then got into a serious car accident. The kid readily admits Howland told him we'll honor the scholarship but if I were the coach then I would not have recruited you, I don't see you playing much.

I think Howland did Stanback wrong and Chace apparently tells people he felt misled and mistreated, but I don't think he did anything wrong with Taylor King beyond just taking the verbal in the first place. Steve King has even admitted that it was his idea, not UCLA's, which contradicted the story at the time that Howland wanted to make news.

In fact if you google you'll find several quotes from Steve King about talking to UCLA after Taylor left Duke. If UCLA had forced him to de-commit, why would he consider UCLA again when looking to transfer?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Howland didn't force him to de-commit, they just pretty much stopped recruiting him (and that's been widely reported). It's like the guy who stops calling his girlfriend or returning her calls so he doesn't "technically" have to break up with her while forcing her hand.

 

[Russ Smith]

Howland didn't force him to de-commit, they just pretty much stopped recruiting him (and that's been widely reported). It's like the guy who stops calling his girlfriend or returning her calls so he doesn't "technically" have to break up with her while forcing her hand.

Well the story that I hear is that King was a 2-3 when UCLA took the verbal but as he grew, UCLA decided he was more of a 4, not athletic enough for 2-3 anymore. So Howland told him they considered him a 4, he didn't want to play 4, so he de-committed. When McKnight talked about other kids UCLA was recruiting that concerned Taylor, he was specifically talking about James Keefe and Chace Stanback. Remember that class was just Love and Stanback, Keefe was in the prior class, a good friend of King's, and a 4. King knew UCLA was also offering Stanback(ironically instead of James Harden), so he was concerned about that.

I'm sure UCLA had less contact with him, how much I don't know he did have a verbal they probably didn't feel the need to recruit him hard when he'd already committed. But I do agree their opinion of him changed, but his dad has publicly admitted that when Ben told them they viewed him as a 4, that concerned them. Ironically Coach K told him he wouldn't play 4, he believed him, and then spent the year playing backup 4 at Duke and of course transferred.

Do I think Ben encouraged King to look elsewhere sure, look at my original post in this thread that's precisely what most coaches do when they have a verballed kid who gets recruited over. They tell the kid I don't think you'll play and usually the kid decides to leave. That way at least the kid doesn't feel forced out, and Taylor King has never once said he was forced out.

Given how outspoken Steve King has been over the years if Taylor's situation was comparable to this one I have to believe Steve would have gone and told Diane Pucin that instead of the article I linked. He would have been much more direct than Dowell's dad was, he doesn't mince words.

 

[abomb]

Does Lute realize that you can bed a woman without marrying her right?

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

From what I gather Lute is a traditional guy who thinks laying random females is distasteful and unbecoming as a Christian with a family. And he's really not capable of doing such anyhow, he's the biggest celebrity in Tucson and word would get around by 10am if he was doing the walk of shame out of strange women's houses. If I were him I'd import my women from Phoenix.

I can't imagine this woman doing the same number on him that Torretti did. I assume they've known each other for awhile so it's probably something born out of friendship and not a GOP meeting. But then again, who knows with Lute these days...

 

[Arizona's Finest]

Maybe I am in the minority here but I really don't feel bad for this kid at all. College basketball and UA basketbal specifically is a million dollar business and the creme de le creme are going to get what they want. We got screwed by Jennings last year - why should I feel bad if we had to play poker with this kid to wait out Gaddy?

Howland can play the high hand all he wants - until we catch UCLA i have no use for the moral card. I want to get our spot at the top back period and Gaddy helps us do that. I am not naive enough to think these kids don't play the system and are all righteous and in good faith in dealing with these programs anyway.

The kid Dowell will catch on somewhere else and if he is any good - it will probably be a better situation for him. I mean he could have just been that guy who sits on the bench for two years only to transfer like we have every year. At least now he gets a head start.

I like this cutthroat Lute. Keep packing in the recruits big guy and get your program back.....