Seattle Seahawks @ Arizona Cardinals Pre Game Thread. 12/01/24-12/07/24

[Harry]

Meh. He has had some good Tight Ends and pass catching backs. That isn't Kyler's problem.

Half the time their covering those guys with LBs

 

[Stout]

we're not losing 5 of our last 7

I should hope not! That's one hypothetical that needs to not happen lol

 

[PACardsFan]

At .500 I don’t think we are ahead of the plan. If anything I think it’s on schedule. At 6-4 I could understand people thinking we were ahead of schedule. But that’s in a very clear 20-20 rear view mirror now.

I also think many here are being deluded by being in the division race in terms of feeling like we are ahead of schedule. The reality is we are in a mediocre division this year. In other divisions we wouldn’t be in the race. We just be a mediocre .500 team. On schedule for year two of a (hopefully) successful rebuild.

Cardinals 6 losses have come against teams with a combined record of 56-19. And we were in 4 of those 6 games. Considering where this roster started last year, I would argue we are ahead of the plan. Just not far enough ahead that we cut corners on our long term goals.

 

[Ronin]

Kyle Odegard

@Kyle_Odegard
·
47m

J.J. Watt on his pick to win the chaotic NFC West:"I am still a Cardinal at heart. I'll go with the Cardinals."

 

[PDXChris]

Really disappointed that MHJ hasn't played like a #4 overall pick. Nabors, or even Brian Thomas, have gotten off to better starts on worse teams.

MHJ was trust into a #1 WR role from the first snap and was doubled teamed immediately. These other guys have other WRs around them. MHJ has 2nd year Micheal Wilson and Greg 5'7" Dortch. Yet, MHJ has the most TDs and 3rd highest average yards per reception. Nabers has the most targets with half the amount of TDs and the lowest average of the top rookies WRs. Thomas is absolutely killing it, but he was also the 3rd option in Jacksonville with Kirk and Gade Davis before they went on IR recently. He's regressed since from a statistical stand points.

This is the issues with major rebuilds. Rookies are expected to be stars on day 1, but both MHJ and Darius Robinson saw quite a bit of double teams in game 1. To the point some made, having a legit #2 or someone with outside speed will only help Kyler and MHJ.

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Look at this former #2 overall picks rookie year.

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He's on pace to have similar numbers to his dad's rookie season.

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He's also on pace to have a better season than this former #3 overall pick.

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[JosiahLee]

Everything is at stake on Sunday.

 

[kerouac9]

Overall the team may take a moral victory from a collapse like that would entail, but that doesn’t speak to establishing a winning culture, IMO. And it really won’t speak well for Kyler, moving forward.

All we heard all season was how tough our schedule is. If we were to collapse at the end of the season against the soft part of the schedule, that looks like a team stuck in mud or descending while making the first half look like a mirage.

Which sadly is the tale of our most important player’s entire career. And the more that pattern repeats itself, the longer the franchise will be in a holding pattern.

And for all those that will point to the Lions again, saying we’re following their same path following an 8-9 season will totally miss the fact that the Lions started their second season looking awful and then rose throughout the rest of the year, giving something to build on once they saw what was working. That’s very different than a total collapse against a soft schedule which will entail trying to figure out what went wrong and fixing just to get to back to mediocre and then also trying to get better as well.

Not being able to take advantage of seasons from hell for both the Rams and Niners would be tough for sure.

A collapse like that would likely put Gannon on a warm seat in 2025.

 

[Chopper0080]

Really disappointed that MHJ hasn't played like a #4 overall pick. Nabors, or even Brian Thomas, have gotten off to better starts on worse teams.

Nabers has already missed 2 games this year and might miss another this week.

MHJ is on pace to have 850 yards receiving on the year and potentially 10 TDs. He will be the 2nd highest receiving player on the roster.

The Cardinals only have two players over 425 receiving yards on the season. Only 4 players over 200. It's more of just a sad passing offense than anything.

 

[Minski]

No receiver can get in any sort of rhythm in this offense

 

[Russ Smith]

Dilemma dilemm. Game starts at 5am here on Monday morning and I'm able to watch it via Paramount Plus. But at that time I have to take Lucy's mom to the port so she can catch a boat to another island so I'll miss probably the first half of the game.

I'm not sure but I think Paramount has an option where you can pick up the game live, or start from the beginning. But I think I'll probably pick it up live when we get home, don't want to be that far behind.

 

[Cheesebeef]

MHJ was trust into a #1 WR role from the first snap and was doubled teamed immediately. These other guys have other WRs around them. MHJ has 2nd year Micheal Wilson and Greg 5'7" Dortch. Yet, MHJ has the most TDs and 3rd highest average yards per reception. Nabers has the most targets with half the amount of TDs and the lowest average of the top rookies WRs. Thomas is absolutely killing it, but he was also the 3rd option in Jacksonville with Kirk and Gade Davis before they went on IR recently. He's regressed since from a statistical stand points.

Thomas has regressed since those guys went on IR? How? In the last two games he’s had 160 yards and a Touchdown.

And you say Harrison came into a bad situation… and neglect to mentio Nabers came into a MUCH WORSE situation. Terrible QB, no running game, no great TE and he has smoked Harrison so far. Even missing two games, he’s STILL got the same numbers as Harrison despite missing two games and playing on the dumpster fire he’s on, facing double teams all season.

Come on. It’s easy to just say that so far Harrison has been outplayed by both of those guys. No need to contort yourself into a pretzel.

 

[PDXChris]

Thomas has regressed since those guys went on IR? How? In the last two games he’s had 160 yards and a Touchdown.

And you say Harrison came into a bad situation… and neglect to mentio Nabers came into a MUCH WORSE situation. Terrible QB, no running game, no great TE and he has smoked Harrison so far. Even missing two games, he’s STILL got the same numbers as Harrison despite missing two games and playing on the dumpster fire he’s on, facing double teams all season.

Come on. It’s easy to just say that so far Harrison has been outplayed by both of those guys. No need to contort yourself into a pretzel.

Below are games after Kirk went down. Those 2 and 3 reception games aren't great! He played better against Houston, but still had a 40% catch rate. I stand by what what I said about him regressing a bit after being the top WR now. His first 8 games were much better than his last 5. And looked at those scores!

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Nabers numbers make him look like a possession receiver and the Giants top two WR both came back. He's the only top rookie WR not averaging over 10 yards a catch.

MHJ is 19th the NFL with 14.8 yards per reception. Nabers teammate, Slayton is 29th with 14.0 and Nabers is 104th in the NFL with 9.9. Thomas is best in class with 16.6 for 7th place.

MHJ is 7th TDs with 7. Thomas is 11th with 6 and Nabers is 62nd with 3.

To say either of the guys are head and shoulders better than MHJ is pure opinion. Both of those guys are also on teams that play behind a lot and throw way more and as @Chopper0080 pointed out, we don't throw that much.

The WR rookie class is more typical this year. There is no Ja'marr Chase or Justin Jefferson in this class.

And I'm not saying MHJ is having a better season than them. They each have different strengths and MHJ is having a rookie season comparable to some generational talent. Plus, he the only one that is contributing on a team fighting for the playoffs.

I look forward to your stats disproving any of this.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Below are games after Kirk went down. Those 2 and 3 reception games aren't great! He played better against Houston, but still had a 40% catch rate. I stand by what what I said about him regressing a bit after being the top WR now. His first 8 games were much better than his last 5. And looked at those scores!

You must be registered for see images attach

Nabers numbers make him look like a possession receiver and the Giants top two WR both came back. He's the only top rookie WR not averaging over 10 yards a catch.

MHJ is 19th the NFL with 14.8 yards per reception. Nabers teammate, Slayton is 29th with 14.0 and Nabers is 104th in the NFL with 9.9. Thomas is best in class with 16.6 for 7th place.

MHJ is 7th TDs with 7. Thomas is 11th with 6 and Nabers is 62nd with 3.

To say either of the guys are head and shoulders better than MHJ is pure opinion. Both of those guys are also on teams that play behind a lot and throw way more and as @Chopper0080 pointed out, we don't throw that much.

The WR rookie class is more typical this year. There is no Ja'marr Chase or Justin Jefferson in this class.

And I'm not saying MHJ is having a better season than them. They each have different strengths and MHJ is having a rookie season comparable to some generational talent. Plus, he the only one that is contributing on a team fighting for the playoffs.

I look forward to your stats disproving any of this.

Your brain must get headaches doing this much mental gymnastics. The only place Harrison is better is on TDs and that’s because he plays on a VASTLY superior offense around him.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Below are games after Kirk went down. Those 2 and 3 reception games aren't great! He played better against Houston, but still had a 40% catch rate. I stand by what what I said about him regressing a bit after being the top WR now. His first 8 games were much better than his last 5. And looked at those scores!

You must be registered for see images attach

Nabers numbers make him look like a possession receiver and the Giants top two WR both came back. He's the only top rookie WR not averaging over 10 yards a catch.

MHJ is 19th the NFL with 14.8 yards per reception. Nabers teammate, Slayton is 29th with 14.0 and Nabers is 104th in the NFL with 9.9. Thomas is best in class with 16.6 for 7th place.

MHJ is 7th TDs with 7. Thomas is 11th with 6 and Nabers is 62nd with 3.

To say either of the guys are head and shoulders better than MHJ is pure opinion. Both of those guys are also on teams that play behind a lot and throw way more and as @Chopper0080 pointed out, we don't throw that much.

The WR rookie class is more typical this year. There is no Ja'marr Chase or Justin Jefferson in this class.

And I'm not saying MHJ is having a better season than them. They each have different strengths and MHJ is having a rookie season comparable to some generational talent. Plus, he the only one that is contributing on a team fighting for the playoffs.

I look forward to your stats disproving any of this.

Your brain must get headaches doing this much mental gymnastics. The only place Harrison is better is on TDs and that’s because he plays on a VASTLY superior offense around him.

 

[PDXChris]

Your brain must get headaches doing this much mental gymnastics. The only place Harrison is better is on TDs and that’s because he plays on a VASTLY superior offense around him.

Back to the old Cheese throwing insults and providing no substance or stats.

Don't bother responding, I'm in a much new better space and I'm just going to ignore you since you rather insult instead of providing actual data.

 

[HairZach]

MHJ was trust into a #1 WR role from the first snap and was doubled teamed immediately. These other guys have other WRs around them. MHJ has 2nd year Micheal Wilson and Greg 5'7" Dortch. Yet, MHJ has the most TDs and 3rd highest average yards per reception. Nabers has the most targets with half the amount of TDs and the lowest average of the top rookies WRs. Thomas is absolutely killing it, but he was also the 3rd option in Jacksonville with Kirk and Gade Davis before they went on IR recently. He's regressed since from a statistical stand points.

I'm going to push back on BTJ being 3rd receiving option, he was the #2 guy in Jacksonville from week 1 and starting week 5 he overtook Kirk as the #1. Gabe Davis was averaging 2 targets a game. BTJ's stats have started to regress due to dealing with injuries and injuries to Lawrence.
.

 

[DaHilg]

MHJ was trust into a #1 WR role from the first snap and was doubled teamed immediately. These other guys have other WRs around them. MHJ has 2nd year Micheal Wilson and Greg 5'7" Dortch. Yet, MHJ has the most TDs and 3rd highest average yards per reception. Nabers has the most targets with half the amount of TDs and the lowest average of the top rookies WRs. Thomas is absolutely killing it, but he was also the 3rd option in Jacksonville with Kirk and Gade Davis before they went on IR recently. He's regressed since from a statistical stand points.

This is the issues with major rebuilds. Rookies are expected to be stars on day 1, but both MHJ and Darius Robinson saw quite a bit of double teams in game 1. To the point some made, having a legit #2 or someone with outside speed will only help Kyler and MHJ.

You must be registered for see images attach

Look at this former #2 overall picks rookie year.

You must be registered for see images attach

He's on pace to have similar numbers to his dad's rookie season.

You must be registered for see images attach

He's also on pace to have a better season than this former #3 overall pick.

You must be registered for see images attach

And … in a run first offense, whose offensive coordinator has produced 2 100 yard WR in his 26-28 game tenure. And please IHKC ****, kyler has had several times in his career where a WR has eclipsed 100 yards in a game

 

[PDXChris]

I'm going to push back on BTJ being 3rd receiving option, he was the #2 guy in Jacksonville from week 1 and starting week 5 he overtook Kirk as the #1. Gabe Davis was averaging 2 targets a game. BTJ's stats have started to regress due to dealing with injuries and injuries to Lawrence.
.

Those are fair points! According their first depth chart, he was on the slot. You are right that he quickly over took Davis in the first week. Either way, he has regressed the last 5 weeks. Rookie WRs rarley have amazing end to end seasons. The cluster of rookies this season all seem to be excelling in different areas. It'll be interesting to see where they are all at one year from today. I don't know if MHJ will be a star, but right now, at least 7 rookies have potential.

 

[PDXChris]

And … in a run first offense, whose offensive coordinator has produced 2 100 yard WR in his 26-28 game tenure. And please IHKC ****, kyler has had several times in his career where a WR has eclipsed 100 yards in a game

I had to look up IHKC.

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[DaHilg]

I had to look up IHKC.

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Hilarious and true lol

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Not buying this. An overall of doubling your wins from the previous season. The progression of the D and playing some legit teams close all year with a chance to win? I’d say the team would feel good overall and realize they have something to truly build on. JMO. Fans don’t like to hear it but there are some moral victories in a sense.

But it would be par for the course with kylers second half swoons.

 

[akg102]

Give MHJ 120 targets over a 9-10 game stretch and see what his line looks like. Both he and Nabers are pedestrian right now.

 

[schutd]

I'm pretty sure I smoke as much but don't do edibles that often. I prefer more old school & smoke flower. I've probably also been smokin weed longer than he's been alive. Unless he was born before 1978.

When did we start calling it flower? Its like a code word, so you could talk about buds, without breaking some rule, like when you would go to head shop and ask to see the "water pipes", not the bongs.

I feel silly saying I smoke flowers.

 

[schutd]

Kyle Odegard
@Kyle_Odegard
·
47m

J.J. Watt on his pick to win the chaotic NFC West:"I am still a Cardinal at heart. I'll go with the Cardinals."

JJ Watt on his pick to win the AFC South: "Im actually a Texan at heart..."

 

[Bkbobo]

First, I feel we need and will win the game. Looking at remaining schedules, the Seahags have a tough path staying on top of the NFC West. I feel that they have more to lose tomorrow and may press. With that, I can see the defense get a couple of turnovers and that will the difference in the game. Go Cardinals!