17.7 million left to spend....what do you hope the Cardinals do with the remaining monies?

[ASUCHRIS]

Except...that he was above average outside the slot so "belief" doesn't matter in the equation.

I'd be curious to see where you get that info.

The Athletic's Jones: Arizona Cardinals still in need of another cornerback

Despite adding a rookie CB this NFL Draft, the Cardinals still have a need at cornerback, according to The Athletic's Lindsay Jones.

arizonasports.com

"should allow veteran Byron Murphy to spend more time in the slot, where he’s one of the NFL’s better inside corners, but this still looks like a vulnerable position that opponents, particularly receiver-heavy rivals like the (Los Angeles) Rams, could exploit."

Kliff Kingsbury Keeping Eye on CB Competition; Wants Byron Murphy Jr. in Nickel

Arizona Cardinals head coach Kliff Kingsbury singled out cornerbacks as a group with a lot of competition at training camp.

www.si.com

Care for more quotes?

Kingsbury acknowledged Murphy's success in the slot and noted that he wants to keep the four-year defensive back in the nickel.

Murphy was thrown into the fire on the outside to start the 2019 season, but found a home in the slot in 2020. Last year, he spent 495 snaps in the slot and 392 outside, according to Pro Football Focus.

"Byron played really good when he's played the nickel, so I don't want to lose him in there completely," Kingsbury said. "He's definitely a very good outside guy as well, but his playmaking inside has been tremendous for us, so we want to be able to continue to rotate him in there."

Defensive coordinator Vance Joseph added, "Being a slot corner is tough because it's a combination of being a safety, a linebacker and a corner. It's the toughest coverage job on the field because it's a three-way go every single snap: vertical, in and out. He's very good at it."

 

[Chopper0080]

I would love to keep Murphy. I think he is a good player and we are better with him on our roster than off of it. That said, if he wants over 12 mil per season, it becomes more complicated.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I'd be curious to see where you get that info.

The Athletic's Jones: Arizona Cardinals still in need of another cornerback

Despite adding a rookie CB this NFL Draft, the Cardinals still have a need at cornerback, according to The Athletic's Lindsay Jones.

arizonasports.com

"should allow veteran Byron Murphy to spend more time in the slot, where he’s one of the NFL’s better inside corners, but this still looks like a vulnerable position that opponents, particularly receiver-heavy rivals like the (Los Angeles) Rams, could exploit."

Kliff Kingsbury Keeping Eye on CB Competition; Wants Byron Murphy Jr. in Nickel

Arizona Cardinals head coach Kliff Kingsbury singled out cornerbacks as a group with a lot of competition at training camp.

www.si.com

Care for more quotes?

Kingsbury acknowledged Murphy's success in the slot and noted that he wants to keep the four-year defensive back in the nickel.

Murphy was thrown into the fire on the outside to start the 2019 season, but found a home in the slot in 2020. Last year, he spent 495 snaps in the slot and 392 outside, according to Pro Football Focus.

"Byron played really good when he's played the nickel, so I don't want to lose him in there completely," Kingsbury said. "He's definitely a very good outside guy as well, but his playmaking inside has been tremendous for us, so we want to be able to continue to rotate him in there."

Defensive coordinator Vance Joseph added, "Being a slot corner is tough because it's a combination of being a safety, a linebacker and a corner. It's the toughest coverage job on the field because it's a three-way go every single snap: vertical, in and out. He's very good at it."

And this proves he isn't an above average cornerback how?

He gave up an 87.6 QB Rating last year. That's a good corner, and now it's just the village idiots proclaiming he isn't a good player.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I would love to keep Murphy. I think he is a good player and we are better with him on our roster than off of it. That said, if he wants over 12 mil per season, it becomes more complicated.

I think you're underrating what the new going rate is going to be to keep good corners.

I'd wager between 15-17 will get the job done.

 

[Chopper0080]

I think you're underrating what the new going rate is going to be to keep good corners.

I'd wager between 15-17 will get the job done.

I am not underrating the going rate, but I am putting a value on a CB who is best in nickel and marginal outside. That value to me, especially in a zone system, is probably about 12 mil. Your range is for a top 10 CB and while I like Murphy, he hasn't been close to that. Maybe a new defensive coach changes that. If Marco Wilson and Robert Alford and Antonio Hamilton can work in this system, why pay 15-17 mil on Murphy? At that rate just move Jalen into the slot or draft a nickel CB.

Do I think that Murphy could get a Kirk level offer if he hits the open market? Probably as he is one of the better options available.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I am not underrating the going rate, but I am putting a value on a CB who is best in nickel and marginal outside. That value to me, especially in a zone system, is probably about 12 mil. Your range is for a top 10 CB and while I like Murphy, he hasn't been close to that. Maybe a new defensive coach changes that. If Marco Wilson and Robert Alford and Antonio Hamilton can work in this system, why pay 15-17 mil on Murphy? At that rate just move Jalen into the slot or draft a nickel CB.

20 million is the new 12 million.

My range is a cut below the over $20 million that Jaire, Denzel, and Jalen are getting paid. The next group of corners are going to go above $20 million.

Do I think that Murphy could get a Kirk level offer if he hits the open market? Probably as he is one of the better options available.

This board tends to underrate our players. Murphy allowed an 87 QB Rating, and thats not considering all the other problems around him that drove up his QB Rating at the end of the season.

Put better pieces around Murphy and I think he can be a real good player.

 

[QuebecCard]

20 million is the new 12 million.

My range is a cut below the over $20 million that Jaire, Denzel, and Jalen are getting paid. The next group of corners are going to go above $20 million.

This board tends to underrate our players. Murphy allowed an 87 QB Rating, and thats not considering all the other problems around him that drove up his QB Rating at the end of the season.

Put better pieces around Murphy and I think he can be a real good player.

Well, then it becomes chicken or the egg what came first?

Don't think I'd want to pay either $15m+.

 

[Chopper0080]

20 million is the new 12 million.

My range is a cut below the over $20 million that Jaire, Denzel, and Jalen are getting paid. The next group of corners are going to go above $20 million.

This board tends to underrate our players. Murphy allowed an 87 QB Rating, and thats not considering all the other problems around him that drove up his QB Rating at the end of the season.

Put better pieces around Murphy and I think he can be a real good player.

If you have to put better pieces around a top CB, he isn't a top CB. Murphy should have it easy as he played last year with low hanging fruit at the other CB position. If he was targeted it was because other teams believed he was beatable. If he was the top player you claim, he would not have been targeted as much. In fact, his QB rating allowed was only marginally better than the previous year when he was across from Peterson and his comp% was the almost the same.

And for the 20 is the new 12...it isn't. JC Jackson just got his new deal this year and it was 16.5 per year. He is significantly better than Murphy. One more year isn't going to result in a significantly worse player getting paid 3.5 mil per year more. Murphy might get offered 16 mil per year but you let him go at that rate.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

And this proves he isn't an above average cornerback how?

He gave up an 87.6 QB Rating last year. That's a good corner, and now it's just the village idiots proclaiming he isn't a good player.

Lol, either you don't get the point or you're ignoring it. Let's try to explain this with an analogy.

Christian Kirk - nice player! He's also proven to be most effective in the slot. Paying him to be a top WR is the same mistake in paying Murphy top corner money. They are simply not amongst the best at their position, and don't have the flexibility to be great inside and out.

Nobody is saying he isn't a good player - he's an above average slot, and at best average outside corner. Paying top dollar for that just isn't very wise.

 

[Harry]

There is a reason Suh isn't signed. He didn't look that good last season. IMO.

He can’t play a bunch of downs but used correctly he can still impact a drive or goal line stand.

 

[Krangodnzr]

If you have to put better pieces around a top CB, he isn't a top CB. Murphy should have it easy as he played last year with low hanging fruit at the other CB position. If he was targeted it was because other teams believed he was beatable. If he was the top player you claim, he would not have been targeted as much. In fact, his QB rating allowed was only marginally better than the previous year when he was across from Peterson and his comp% was the almost the same.

Never claimed that. He is an above average corner, no more, no less.

And for the 20 is the new 12...it isn't. JC Jackson just got his new deal this year and it was 16.5 per year. He is significantly better than Murphy. One more year isn't going to result in a significantly worse player getting paid 3.5 mil per year more. Murphy might get offered 16 mil per year but you let him go at that rate.

It will when the salary cap is projected to grow larger than it did last year, which is why Murray is the 2nd highest paid QB in the league.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Lol, either you don't get the point or you're ignoring it. Let's try to explain this with an analogy.

Christian Kirk - nice player! He's also proven to be most effective in the slot. Paying him to be a top WR is the same mistake in paying Murphy top corner money. They are simply not amongst the best at their position, and don't have the flexibility to be great inside and out.

Nobody is saying he isn't a good player - he's an above average slot, and at best average outside corner. Paying top dollar for that just isn't very wise.

LOL I do get it, I just don't agree.

Player value isn't in a vacuum. If Kirk were a free agent and the Cardinals didn't have as many receiving options they would have paid him. The Cardinals are fairly bare at CB. Wilson was mostly not good last year. Hamilton is a nice 3rd CB on a one year deal.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

If Kirk were a free agent and the Cardinals didn't have as many receiving options they would have paid him.

Dude - they traded a 2nd rounder to replace him! Outside of Nuk, you have Moore who flashed potential, and the corpse of AJ Green.

The Cards had a desperate need at WR, and instead of paying Kirk, they gave up a huge piece and will likely be forced to pay Brown as well.

The Cardinals are fairly bare at CB. Wilson was mostly not good last year. Hamilton is a nice 3rd CB on a one year deal.

Yes - we have a desperate need at corner, but paying a guy like Murphy top money isn't the answer. Keim should do what he does best - make a trade for a top corner that plays on the outside, not overpay Murphy.

(Also - you PAY Hump because he plays LT!)

 

[dreamcastrocks]

If you have to put better pieces around a top CB, he isn't a top CB. Murphy should have it easy as he played last year with low hanging fruit at the other CB position. If he was targeted it was because other teams believed he was beatable. If he was the top player you claim, he would not have been targeted as much. In fact, his QB rating allowed was only marginally better than the previous year when he was across from Peterson and his comp% was the almost the same.

And for the 20 is the new 12...it isn't. JC Jackson just got his new deal this year and it was 16.5 per year. He is significantly better than Murphy. One more year isn't going to result in a significantly worse player getting paid 3.5 mil per year more. Murphy might get offered 16 mil per year but you let him go at that rate.

Problem with letting Murphy go, is now you have exactly 0 corners you can trust, when you need at least 3 to really be successful in the NFL.

 

[Shane]

Dude - they traded a 2nd rounder to replace him! Outside of Nuk, you have Moore who flashed potential, and the corpse of AJ Green.

The Cards had a desperate need at WR, and instead of paying Kirk, they gave up a huge piece and will likely be forced to pay Brown as well.

Yes - we have a desperate need at corner, but paying a guy like Murphy top money isn't the answer. Keim should do what he does best - make a trade for a top corner that plays on the outside, not overpay Murphy.

(Also - you OVERPAY Hump because he plays LT!)

Hump isn’t overpaid it averages 16 million not the 20+ Initially reported… in fact it’s a good deal.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Hump isn’t overpaid it averages 16 million not the 20+ Initially reported… in fact it’s a good deal.

True, I'll edit. I was ok with 20M too.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Problem with letting Murphy go, is now you have exactly 0 corners you can trust, when you need at least 3 to really be successful in the NFL.

Get one star shut down corner, and fill in around them. Paying a guy like Murphy means you won't be able to pay for an actual star.

(Insert joke about Keim drafting a corner in the first round)

 

[Chopper0080]

Problem with letting Murphy go, is now you have exactly 0 corners you can trust, when you need at least 3 to really be successful in the NFL.

Alford played 70% of snaps last year.
Marco Wilson 83%
Antonio Hamilton 29%
Jace Whitaker 23%

and we finished with 11 wins. There are always vet CBs available. We run a pretty safe zone scheme. There is no need to pay Byron Murphy 16 mil.

 

[kerouac9]

Alford played 70% of snaps last year.
Marco Wilson 83%
Antonio Hamilton 29%
Jace Whitaker 23%

and we finished with 11 wins. There are always vet CBs available. We run a pretty safe zone scheme. There is no need to pay Byron Murphy 16 mil.

Antonio Hamilton is 29, BTW.

 

[Chopper0080]

Never claimed that. He is an above average corner, no more, no less.

It will when the salary cap is projected to grow larger than it did last year, which is why Murray is the 2nd highest paid QB in the league.

"Put better pieces around Murphy and I think he can be a real good player."

Since we are getting into semantics I quoted you exactly. If Murphy was a "real good player" he wouldn't need better pieces around him.

And comparing Murray's contract extension and Murphy's potential one is a false equivalency. Murray was a number one pic, was a rookie of the year, is a QB, and has made two pro bowls. Byron Murphy has done none of these things and therefore is not in the rotation of players who trade top contracts at their positions.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Alford played 70% of snaps last year.
Marco Wilson 83%
Antonio Hamilton 29%
Jace Whitaker 23%

and we finished with 11 wins. There are always vet CBs available. We run a pretty safe zone scheme. There is no need to pay Byron Murphy 16 mil.

Well, we must be in a great position going forward then...

 

[QuebecCard]

Dude - they traded a 2nd rounder to replace him! Outside of Nuk, you have Moore who flashed potential, and the corpse of AJ Green.

The Cards had a desperate need at WR, and instead of paying Kirk, they gave up a huge piece and will likely be forced to pay Brown as well.

Yes - we have a desperate need at corner, but paying a guy like Murphy top money isn't the answer. Keim should do what he does best - make a trade for a top corner that plays on the outside, not overpay Murphy.

(Also - you PAY Hump because he plays LT!)

A 'corpse' who averaged 16+ YPC and likely would have had over 1000 yards total if not for covid.

Dig up another grave, Keim.

 

[Krangodnzr]

"Put better pieces around Murphy and I think he can be a real good player."

Since we are getting into semantics I quoted you exactly. If Murphy was a "real good player" he wouldn't need better pieces around him.

Good. Don't misquote me though.

I said put better pieces around him and he would be a real good player... you're missing the nuance of what I am saying here.

And comparing Murray's contract extension and Murphy's potential one is a false equivalency. Murray was a number one pic, was a rookie of the year, is a QB, and has made two pro bowls. Byron Murphy has done none of these things and therefore is not in the rotation of players who trade top contracts at their positions.

Again you're missing the point. If you follow NFL media even a little bit, you'd see that it was a considerable narrative that Murray was overpaid.

But he won't be considered overpaid in a year or two when the new TV money hits.

Neither will Murphy at $16 Million.

 

[Chopper0080]

Good. Don't misquote me though.

I said put better pieces around him and he would be a real good player... you're missing the nuance of what I am saying here.

Again you're missing the point. If you follow NFL media even a little bit, you'd see that it was a considerable narrative that Murray was overpaid.

But he won't be considered overpaid in a year or two when the new TV money hits.

Neither will Murphy at $16 Million.

Disagree that putting better pieces around Murphy will make him significantly different than what he currently is. We were 13th in the NFL in sacks and Murphy was an average at best outside CB and good inside CB. Not really feasible to put "more around him" from a pass rush standpoint and is certainly not something that paying him 16 mil per year makes easier. And putting better CBs around another CB just makes that CB more of a target. Your assertion is incorrect.

I understand your argument about Kyler, but Murphy is not the CB equivalent to Kyler. That means that overpaying Murphy is just overpaying an average player. It's paying Jared Goff 33 mil. Is that cheaper now than some newer NFL QB contracts? Sure, but you are still paying Goff 33 mil.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Disagree that putting better pieces around Murphy will make him significantly different than what he currently is. We were 13th in the NFL in sacks and Murphy was an average at best outside CB and good inside CB. Not really feasible to put "more around him" from a pass rush standpoint and is certainly not something that paying him 16 mil per year makes easier. And putting better CBs around another CB just makes that CB more of a target. Your assertion is incorrect.

I understand your argument about Kyler, but Murphy is not the CB equivalent to Kyler. That means that overpaying Murphy is just overpaying an average player. It's paying Jared Goff 33 mil. Is that cheaper now than some newer NFL QB contracts? Sure, but you are still paying Goff 33 mil.

Right....and again...you're missing my point. $16 million isn't even the top contract for a corner. $21 million is. And the next good corner hitting free agency likely gets $22 million. So $16 million is more like good not great cornerback money.

$16 million won't be an overpay next year.