2017-2018 Draft Prospects watch.

[ColdPickleNachos]

I don't get the Doncic hate. The athleticism concern is being hugely overblown. Here's footage from a game he played against Russell Westbrook and the Thunder in 2016 (as a young 17-year-old).

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Check out:

:23 - :34 He plays good defense on Westbrook.

1:06 - 1:19 He gets a chase-down block then goes coast-to-coast. It ends in a charge, but it's a good look at athleticism.

1:49 - 1:55 He drives by Victor Oladipo for the layup.

There are some ups and downs, but he certainly doesn't look like someone who doesn't belong athletically on an NBA court, and this was a year and a half ago! Not to mention, Real Madrid won the game.

 

[Hoop Head]

Assists in the Euroleague are tabulated a bit different than in the NBA and it's harder for players to get them. Their league leaders are typically around 4-5 a game but if they played in the NBA the same players that average the 4 or 5 there get around 8 or 9 in the NBA. Look at Rubio for an example there. He averaged 4.3 and 4.1 in his last seasons in the Euroleague but coming to the NBA they shot up to 8.2 for his rookie year. I imagine if Doncic is used as a PG in the NBA he'll have similar assist numbers to Rubio.

That said, I don't think anyone is advocating taking Doncic before Ayton but he's clearly one of the top 7 players in this draft and it's foolish to think he'll be a bust just because he's a Euro. I'd take Ayton and Bagley before him but I'd choose Doncic over Bamba and Jaren Jackson. I'm not sure about Young or Porter though. I like Young's game and fit with this team and Booker more than Doncic.

 

[SirStefan32]

Oh good Lord, now he is Mike Mikker/ Mike Dunleavy. It is amazing how prejudice (in this case against a white Eauropean players) can make somebody completely blind.

 

[Mainstreet]

Here is the way I view it.

Maybe Doncic will turn out to be everything he is supposed to be, but I would be uncomfortable if the Suns drafted him with the first pick. Lack of lateral quickness bothers me.

Maybe I would feel more comfortable if he was a 6'11" PF.

This is from NBA DraftNet:

Weaknesses: His biggest flaw is his lack of quickness and lateral speed, which affects his effectiveness in 1 on 1 defense against more explosive opponents ... Furthermore this also limits his offensive effectiveness in ISO situations when he has to rely on his body control and fakes to create the space for the shot or to draw contact ... He also needs to work on shot consistency, especially his mechanics and foot positioning ... Sometimes he lacks the killer instinct when facing weaker opponents ...

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/luka-doncic

This is from The Stepien:

Weaknesses / Questions

• Limited athletically, doesn’t just blow by guys on perimeter or rise above opponents at rim.
• Game is already very developed, where is room for growth in NBA?
• Who will he guard in NBA? May be a touch too slow for perimeter players and a touch too small for more traditional bigs, could get exposed in space versus quicker players.
• Questionable decision maker, goes for highlight passes that result in turnovers.
• How good of a shooter is he actually? Only shot 33.3% this past year from beyond arc, has a low and slow release that can be bothered.

https://www.thestepien.com/luka-doncic/

 

[Cheesebeef]

Oh good Lord, now he is Mike Mikker/ Mike Dunleavy. It is amazing how prejudice (in this case against a white Eauropean players) can make somebody completely blind.

Actually, it comes from watching more and more of his YouTube action that I came to that opinion.

And then 3rd went one step further and compared Miller/Donicic/Dunleavy stays before the NBA... thinking it would distinguish him, but made him look even more identical.

The fact that he’s an average at best athlete, who’s not a great shooter but has incredible basketball IQ and a Euro is just the clincher.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Here is the way I view it.

Maybe Doncic will turn out to be everything he is supposed to be, but I would be uncomfortable if the Suns drafted him with the first pick. Lack of lateral quickness bothers me.

Maybe I would feel more comfortable if he was a 6'11" PF.

This is from NBA DraftNet:



http://www.nbadraft.net/players/luka-doncic

This is from The Stepien:



https://www.thestepien.com/luka-doncic/

Oh cripes! Those guys are just prejudiced too, right @SirStefan32?!

 

[SirStefan32]

Here is the way I view it.

Maybe Doncic will turn out to be everything he is supposed to be, but I would be uncomfortable if the Suns drafted him with the first pick. Lack of lateral quickness bothers me.

Maybe I would feel more comfortable if he was a 6'11" PF.

This is from NBA DraftNet:



http://www.nbadraft.net/players/luka-doncic

This is from The Stepien:



https://www.thestepien.com/luka-doncic/

The Stepien also ranks his as a tier all by himself, unless something changed in the last couple of weeks.

 

[SirStefan32]

Oh cripes! Those guys are just prejudiced too, right @SirStefan32?!

See my post above. They (the Stepien guys) are so low on Doncic that they rank him as the only player in the first tier.

 

[Cheesebeef]

How about Embiid or Towns? Cousins and Porzingis coming off injuries too. Suns could really put a lot of assets in front of these teams.

Why would ANY of those guys be offered in trade... save Cousins and in his case, why in the world would you give up the number one pick in a loaded draft for a career long malcontent... who’s a FA... AND is coming off a torn Achilles?

 

[Mainstreet]

The Stepien also ranks his as a tier all by himself, unless something changed in the last couple of weeks.

I'm looking at the players lack of speed and lateral quickness... not really draft projection. He is ranked #1 by The Stepien and #5 by NBA Draft Net.

If the Suns drafted him #1, where would he play? His position seems to be a point forward.

 

[Cheesebeef]

See my post above. They (the Stepien guys) are so low on Doncic that they rank him as the only player in the first tier.

They also have Ayton listed FIFTH. Which is ridiculous.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

Here is the way I view it.

Maybe Doncic will turn out to be everything he is supposed to be, but I would be uncomfortable if the Suns drafted him with the first pick. Lack of lateral quickness bothers me.

Maybe I would feel more comfortable if he was a 6'11" PF.

This is from NBA DraftNet:



http://www.nbadraft.net/players/luka-doncic

This is from The Stepien:



https://www.thestepien.com/luka-doncic/

The weaknesses column is pretty contradictory IMO. It suggests that he is already so skilled that there isn't much room for growth in the NBA (as if there is a limit to skill). Then it goes on to talk about how he isn't that great of a shooter (that's a skill), then talks about how he needs to get better at decision making (something that would allow further growth at the NBA level).

So ultimately the only thing that weaknesses column questions is athletic ability and what that will do for his fit on the floor. Fortunately for the Suns I think they have the answer to that question as Luka could play point on offense and JJ could take on the opposing PG on defense (Book has shown some ability against PGs as well, especially in on ball situations).

 

[Mainstreet]

The weaknesses column is pretty contradictory IMO. It suggests that he is already so skilled that there isn't much room for growth in the NBA (as if there is a limit to skill). Then it goes on to talk about how he isn't that great of a shooter (that's a skill), then talks about how he needs to get better at decision making (something that would allow further growth at the NBA level).

So ultimately the only thing that weaknesses column questions is athletic ability and what that will do for his fit on the floor. Fortunately for the Suns I think they have the answer to that question as Luka could play point on offense and JJ could take on the opposing PG on defense (Book has shown some ability against PGs as we, especially in on ball situations).

So do you view him as a PG? I'm having trouble figuring out his position in the NBA.

Of course if he is that good you make a position for him.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

So do you view him as a PG? I'm having trouble figuring out his position in the NBA.

Of course if he is that good you make a position for him.

I view him as a PG on offense (Though I believe he would make for a very good wing as well), but on defense he will likely have to guard wings. At least this would be the make-up against teams with a very athletic PG IMO.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I view him as a PG on offense (Though I believe he would make for a very good wing as well), but on defense he will likely have to guard wings. At least this would be the make-up against teams with a very athletic PG IMO.

So... what happens when he has to guards wings... who are usually the most athletic players on the floor?

 

[Mainstreet]

I view him as a PG on offense (Though I believe he would make for a very good wing as well), but on defense he will likely have to guard wings. At least this would be the make-up against teams with a very athletic PG IMO.

I've come up with a new comparison... Chris Mullin.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mullich01.html

 

[Cheesebeef]

I've come up with a new comparison... Chris Mullin.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mullich01.html

Mullin’s not bad. But I don’t know if Mullin’s game would be as great against today’s athletes as it was back then. Don’t get me wrong... I still think he’d be good. But Dream Team Good? Not sure.

That said... no one in their right mind would take a guy who could be the next Chris Mullin over a guy who could be the next David Robinson.

 

[Mainstreet]

Mullin’s not bad. But I don’t know if Mullin’s game would be as great against today’s athletes as it was back then. Don’t get me wrong... I still think he’d be good. But Dream Team Good? Not sure.

That said... no one in their right mind would take a guy who could be the next Chris Mullin over a guy who could be the next David Robinson.

I'd take Ayton over Doncic as well.

The funny thing about Mullin he looked like he was playing slow motion as he weaved his way to the basket. Almost a bit like Hornacek as well.

 

[GatorAZ]

I'd take Ayton over Doncic as well.

The funny thing about Mullin he looked like he was playing slow motion as he weaved his way to the basket. Almost a bit like Hornacek as well.

That's cause he was drunk.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'd take Ayton over Doncic as well.

The funny thing about Mullin he looked like he was playing slow motion as he weaved his way to the basket. Almost a bit like Hornacek as well.

Both of those guys had a super slippery ability to get to basket. I see a lot of that in Booker actually.

 

[SirStefan32]

Why would ANY of those guys be offered in trade... save Cousins and in his case, why in the world would you give up the number one pick in a loaded draft for a career long malcontent... who’s a FA... AND is coming off a torn Achilles?

Well, we agree on something!

 

[SirStefan32]

They also have Ayton listed FIFTH. Which is ridiculous.

Well, that's your opinion. There are reasons to be cautious about him as well. Issues with his perceived lack of focus, desire to improve, and work ethic are well-known, and have been since the kid was in high school. Think 7'00 260 lb Michael Beasley.

THIS is what I mean when I talk about people exaggerating the weaknesses of players they don't like while ignoring the issues with the players they do like. Ayton has his issues, just like Docic, and Young, and Bagley, and Porter, and everyone else.

All that said, I'd still take Ayton, but the point is that none of the prospects are perfect.

 

[elindholm]

:23 - :34 He plays good defense on Westbrook.

That's the highlight by far; I agree that that was very good defense. Everything else is quite mediocre.

 

[SirStefan32]

So do you view him as a PG? I'm having trouble figuring out his position in the NBA.

Of course if he is that good you make a position for him.

He is a point guard. he can play alongside a point guard, but he is a point guard. If we didn't have Warren and Jackson, I'd be glad to have him as a SF.

 

[SirStefan32]

So... what happens when he has to guards wings... who are usually the most athletic players on the floor?

What happens when Booker has to defend someone? What happens when Harden has to defend someone? None of the prospects are perfect, including Doncic. You are always gambling on something. In Luka's case, you are gambling he will get you 35 points (scoring and assisting) while giving up 20. You take similar gambles with everyone else.