2019 2nd round pick for Rosen is Andy Isabella WR

[overseascardfan]

I am talking about reporters not you

Some reporters have said he is having an amazing camp catching the ball

Some have said others have.

I am just in a wait and see

I’ve heard reports that Kirk has been the most impressive WR in camp. I guess it’s all in the eye of the beholder. It’s nice to hear that as a group the WR corp has been impressive so far.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Why is that I am so freaking skeptical of this guy being worth where we took him. He's a good kid, and he is freaking fast and put up good numbers but for some reason I see a number 3 WR. I know he performed well against Georgia, but I also see him performing against them in semi garbage time because nobody had to waste time putting a emphasis shutting him down because they where going to beat UMass anyways. I think he's a body catcher too, more often than not, but at least he can still catch... I am rooting to be totally wrong about him but his hype is something I do not get

 

[Zeno]

Why is that I am so freaking skeptical of this guy being worth where we took him. He's a good kid, and he is freaking fast and put up good numbers but for some reason I see a number 3 WR. I know he performed well against Georgia, but I also see him performing against them in semi garbage time because nobody had to waste time putting a emphasis shutting him down because they where going to beat UMass anyways. I think he's a body catcher too, more often than not, but at least he can still catch... I am rooting to be totally wrong about him but his hype is something I do not get

I see a number 3 WR too but I don't think that is a bad thing at all.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Why is that I am so freaking skeptical of this guy being worth where we took him. He's a good kid, and he is freaking fast and put up good numbers but for some reason I see a number 3 WR. I know he performed well against Georgia, but I also see him performing against them in semi garbage time because nobody had to waste time putting a emphasis shutting him down because they where going to beat UMass anyways. I think he's a body catcher too, more often than not, but at least he can still catch... I am rooting to be totally wrong about him but his hype is something I do not get

If I was doing a best ball league I would take him late. I see some down weeks and a couple top 10 finishes where he breaks a couple

 

[82CardsGrad]

I think it's safe to assume that he will likely develop slowly... showing some flashes in his first season, but also showing lots of opportunities for growth. I think the hope here is that Andy at some point in year 2 or 3, begins to resemble a Julian Edelman type... Edelman is actually a bit bigger (slightly taller and about 10 pounds heavier)...But the questions for Andy will be - is he as tough as Edelman and can he develop into a consistently high-quality route runner.
Time will tell...

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I think it's safe to assume that he will likely develop slowly... showing some flashes in his first season, but also showing lots of opportunities for growth. I think the hope here is that Andy at some point in year 2 or 3, begins to resemble a Julian Edelman type... Edelman is actually a bit bigger (slightly taller and about 10 pounds heavier)...But the questions for Andy will be - is he as tough as Edelman and can he develop into a consistently high-quality route runner.
Time will tell...

He is already WR 3 in Kliff's offense. I think his floor is 700 yards

 

[BurqueCardFan]

Why is that I am so freaking skeptical of this guy being worth where we took him. He's a good kid, and he is freaking fast and put up good numbers but for some reason I see a number 3 WR. I know he performed well against Georgia, but I also see him performing against them in semi garbage time because nobody had to waste time putting a emphasis shutting him down because they where going to beat UMass anyways. I think he's a body catcher too, more often than not, but at least he can still catch... I am rooting to be totally wrong about him but his hype is something I do not get

All we need him to be is a good #3. Something in the mold of a John Brown but hopefully healthy. We already have a #1 & #2 (Fitz/Kirk). Hopefully Butler and/or Johnson develop to where at least one of them can move into a vacant spot whenever Fitz retires.

 

[82CardsGrad]

All we need him to be is a good #3. Something in the mold of a John Brown but hopefully healthy. We already have a #1 & #2 (Fitz/Kirk). Hopefully Butler and/or Johnson develop to where at least one of them can move into a vacant spot whenever Fitz retires.

I agree... I said an Edelman "type" guy... If he ever developed beyond a #3 talent, THAT would be incredible. I think Kirk has a shot of being a solid, if not great #2. And in the perfect world, Butler would ascend to our #1... Johnson is interesting and some seem extremely high on him. Would almost be too perfect if things worked out where one of Butler/Johnson earned the #1 spot, Kirk solidified himself at #2 and Izzy developed into a solid #3...

 

[Solar7]

He is already WR 3 in Kliff's offense. I think his floor is 700 yards

Dude are you becoming my arch nemesis? I was literally about to defend Isabella because of KK's enthusiasm for him during the draft, but his floor is 700 yards? The 7th WR taken, from UMass, is going to do no worse than that? Insanity.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Dude are you becoming my arch nemesis? I was literally about to defend Isabella because of KK's enthusiasm for him during the draft, but his floor is 700 yards? The 7th WR taken, from UMass, is going to do no worse than that? Insanity.

I am looking at it from a Fantasy Football projections standpoint.

It's the offense not the WR. I am saying that the WR 3 in Kingsbury's offense should average at minimum 44 yards a game or this has gone incredibly sideways. The WR 3 is going to play on 90% of the offensive snaps. The average offense in the NFL ran 1007 snaps last year.

So lets assume Kingsbury ends up with that number of snaps. So that WR 3 will be on the field for 900 offensive snaps. We will say that WR 3 averages 12 yards per catch, roughly WR 50 in ranking last year.

So that WR would need 58 catches to get to 700 yards being WR 50 in per catch. So with 900 potential plays the WR 3 needs just 58 catches at WR 50 performance to get there.

I will say that if we end up with strictly average offensive performances with Kingsbury's system then stuff has gone sideways.


Now for Isabella specifically, he is going to have 2 or 3 games where he hits big ones based on his speed and Murray's love for the deep ball. So let's say 3 games of 90 yards. That means in the remaining 13 games he needs to average 33 yards.

The only way the WR 3 in this offense doesn't get at least 700 yards is if we suffer a major injury to the QB or that WR.

Hopefully that all made sense. If Isabella doesn't get the WR 3 job then adjust him down accordingly

 

[Jetstream Green]

I am looking at it from a Fantasy Football projections standpoint.

It's the offense not the WR. I am saying that the WR 3 in Kingsbury's offense should average at minimum 44 yards a game or this has gone incredibly sideways. The WR 3 is going to play on 90% of the offensive snaps. The average offense in the NFL ran 1007 snaps last year.

So lets assume Kingsbury ends up with that number of snaps. So that WR 3 will be on the field for 900 offensive snaps. We will say that WR 3 averages 12 yards per catch, roughly WR 50 in ranking last year.

So that WR would need 58 catches to get to 700 yards being WR 50 in per catch. So with 900 potential plays the WR 3 needs just 58 catches at WR 50 performance to get there.

I will say that if we end up with strictly average offensive performances with Kingsbury's system then stuff has gone sideways.


Now for Isabella specifically, he is going to have 2 or 3 games where he hits big ones based on his speed and Murray's love for the deep ball. So let's say 3 games of 90 yards. That means in the remaining 13 games he needs to average 33 yards.

The only way the WR 3 in this offense doesn't get at least 700 yards is if we suffer a major injury to the QB or that WR.

Hopefully that all made sense. If Isabella doesn't get the WR 3 job then adjust him down accordingly

Which also means my perception of Isabella as just a number 3 WR is also skewed if I consider the offense he's in. If he is competent at that role, his importance holds far more value for Kingsbury's offense than the number 3 for a more traditional offense... meaning his reason for a second selection cannot be judged by the status quo

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Yeah I can agree with that.

 

[Solar7]

I am looking at it from a Fantasy Football projections standpoint.

It's the offense not the WR. I am saying that the WR 3 in Kingsbury's offense should average at minimum 44 yards a game or this has gone incredibly sideways. The WR 3 is going to play on 90% of the offensive snaps. The average offense in the NFL ran 1007 snaps last year.

So lets assume Kingsbury ends up with that number of snaps. So that WR 3 will be on the field for 900 offensive snaps. We will say that WR 3 averages 12 yards per catch, roughly WR 50 in ranking last year.

So that WR would need 58 catches to get to 700 yards being WR 50 in per catch. So with 900 potential plays the WR 3 needs just 58 catches at WR 50 performance to get there.

I will say that if we end up with strictly average offensive performances with Kingsbury's system then stuff has gone sideways.


Now for Isabella specifically, he is going to have 2 or 3 games where he hits big ones based on his speed and Murray's love for the deep ball. So let's say 3 games of 90 yards. That means in the remaining 13 games he needs to average 33 yards.

The only way the WR 3 in this offense doesn't get at least 700 yards is if we suffer a major injury to the QB or that WR.

Hopefully that all made sense. If Isabella doesn't get the WR 3 job then adjust him down accordingly

I appreciate your math and walking me through it, but let's look at this another way...

In 2018, only 40 receivers broke the 700 yard receiving mark. Only one of ours did (Fitz), and only three players listed as the #3 or below broke that plateau. You have Calvin Ridley, and the murky situations of Chris Godwin and Adam Humphries who are a little off, because DeSean Jackson missed a lot of games.

For a WR #3 to break the 700 yard mark is a huge anomaly even on great offenses, and for a rookie WR to break 700 yards is an anomaly in itself, even if he's a starter. Add in this being a rookie head coach and rookie QB, to expect to hit the ground running with a dynamic offense in the likes of the Falcons is a big stretch.

 

[Solar7]

@Chris_Sanders, just crunching the numbers a bit more, I think the ceiling of this offense's WRs (this year) is a 1,000 yard WR, a 700 yarder, and 500 yarder. Give or take a couple hundred yards, maybe distribute those a little differently between whichever players, but we would probably be over the moon to get 2,200 yards from our top three, because it would only mean Kyler would need to throw for 800 more yards between TEs, RBs, and 4th/5th WRs to make it to 3,000 yards passing, which I think we could all say would be very successful.

 

[Krangodnzr]

@Chris_Sanders, just crunching the numbers a bit more, I think the ceiling of this offense's WRs (this year) is a 1,000 yard WR, a 700 yarder, and 500 yarder. Give or take a couple hundred yards, maybe distribute those a little differently between whichever players, but we would probably be over the moon to get 2,200 yards from our top three, because it would only mean Kyler would need to throw for 800 more yards between TEs, RBs, and 4th/5th WRs to make it to 3,000 yards passing, which I think we could all say would be very successful.

3000 is successful? That's only 187.5 yards per game.

I expect more than that. 3600 or more.

 

[wit3card]

@Chris_Sanders, just crunching the numbers a bit more, I think the ceiling of this offense's WRs (this year) is a 1,000 yard WR, a 700 yarder, and 500 yarder. Give or take a couple hundred yards, maybe distribute those a little differently between whichever players, but we would probably be over the moon to get 2,200 yards from our top three, because it would only mean Kyler would need to throw for 800 more yards between TEs, RBs, and 4th/5th WRs to make it to 3,000 yards passing, which I think we could all say would be very successful.

If Kyler throws for 3-3.5 k yards we will have this kind of numbers so I would be happy if Kyler can achieve 3k+ and maybe 22TD and only 10 INT something like that.

 

[Solar7]

3000 is successful? That's only 187.5 yards per game.

I expect more than that. 3600 or more.

It would be a top ten rookie QB performance in the past ten years. Like, how much more can you expect? Breaking 3,000 would make me happy about the potential of Kyler. That’s without rushing too.

 

[Krangodnzr]

It would be a top ten rookie QB performance in the past ten years. Like, how much more can you expect? Breaking 3,000 would make me happy about the potential of Kyler. That’s without rushing too.

Andy freaking Dalton passed for more his rookie year. So did Russell Wilson.

As inept as Rosen was last year, he would've come close to 3000 yards if he started all 16 games.

 

[Solar7]

Andy freaking Dalton passed for more his rookie year. So did Russell Wilson.

As inept as Rosen was last year, he would've come close to 3000 yards if he started all 16 games.

Andy Dalton is coming up on being a ten year starter in this league. He's a solid QB that would be a favored starter over anyone not named Palmer or Warner in Arizona history. I have no clue why you're talking about him like he's Kent Graham or something. Dalton is a mid-tier starter in this league and has been for years.

Russell Wilson is a Hall of Famer that had a great team around him. Stop pretending like he is the baseline - he's not.

Eclipsing 3,000 yards passing and say, 400 yards rushing would be considered a major success for Kyler Murray.

 

[DVontel]

Andy Dalton sucks.

 

[Solar7]

Andy Dalton sucks.

"Sucks" as in would be in our Ring of Honor if he retired today, given our team's standards at the position.

 

[DVontel]

"Sucks" as in would be in our Ring of Honor if he retired today, given our team's standards at the position.

So he sucks less than most of the QBs in our history.

He still sucks.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Interestingly the Vegas over / under on Murray's passing yards is 2940 yards.

I may be all fired up on Kingsbury's offense right now but smarter people than me agree with Solar.

 

[Solar7]

So he sucks less than most of the QBs in our history.

He still sucks.

Lol you'll be lucky if Kyler has as long and successful of a career as he has.

 

[DVontel]

Lol you'll be lucky if Kyler has as long and successful of a career as he has.

If Kyler has a similar career to Dalton, it would be a MAJOR disappointment. Don’t lie to yourself.

I don’t get your love for these sub-par/average at best QBs like Dalton, Cousins, & Stafford.