All-Star picks

[capologist]

NBA.com has posted Charles Barkley’s, Kenny Smith’s, and Magic Johnson’s picks for the All-Star team.

Note the situation with the Western Conference guards. Barkley picks Carmelo Anthony and Peja Stojakovic. Smith also picks Anthony and Stojakovic. Johnson picks Kobe Bryant and Stojakovic.

The thing is, Anthony and Stojakovic are both listed on the All-Star ballot as forwards, and both in fact play more at forward than at guard.

But it’s tough to pick guards in the West, especially with Stephon Marbury now out of the conference.

I let the numbers make the picks, and this is what I came up with:

<pre> Western Conference Eastern Conference <br><br>F Kevin Garnett F Jermaine O'Neal <br>F Tim Duncan F Shareef Abdur-Rahim <br>C Yao Ming C Ben Wallace <br>G Sam Cassell G Jason Kidd <br>G Kobe Bryant G Tracy McGrady <br><br>F Andrei Kirilenko F Ron Artest <br>F Elton Brand F Donyell Marshall <br>F Peja Stojakovic F Kenyon Martin <br>C Shaquille O'Neal C Jeff Foster <br>C Brad Miller G Baron Davis <br>G Manu Ginobili G Paul Pierce <br>G Andre Miller G Stephon Marbury </pre>

The Eastern Conference’s center position is even worse than the West’s guards. Jeff Foster?! Yecch. But the East doesn’t have a legitimate candidate for the backup center spot, so Foster gets the pick, like basketball’s version of Howard Dean. He just edges out such luminaries as Dan Gadzuric, Mehmet Okur, and Zydrunas Ilgauskas.

No Suns make the cut (unless you count Steph as sort of an honorary Sun). Shawn looks good, but the forward position in the West is ultra-competitive.

 

[green machine]

Carmello is having a good rookie season, but no way is he an all star! He's not even shooting %40

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by green machine
Carmello is having a good rookie season, but no way is he an all star! He's not even shooting %40

i think a lot of it is the difference hes made in denver.

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by capologist

I let the numbers make the picks, and this is what I came up with:

<pre> Western Conference Eastern Conference <br><br>F Kevin Garnett F Jermaine O'Neal <br>F Tim Duncan F Shareef Abdur-Rahim <br>C Yao Ming C Ben Wallace <br>G Sam Cassell G Jason Kidd <br>G Kobe Bryant G Tracy McGrady <br><br>F Andrei Kirilenko F Ron Artest <br>F Elton Brand F Donyell Marshall <br>F Peja Stojakovic F Kenyon Martin <br>C Shaquille O'Neal C Jeff Foster <br>C Brad Miller G Baron Davis <br>G Manu Ginobili G Paul Pierce <br>G Andre Miller G Stephon Marbury </pre>

man i wish miller could make the AS game but he has no shot - too many awesome west pgs.

 

[green machine]

Originally posted by NugzFan
i think a lot of it is the difference hes made in denver.

He has made a difference, true, but so have Andre Miller and Voshon Leonard. It's like saying Kidd was the sole reason for New Jersey's resurgence, while ignoring a healthy K-Mart, Kittles, Van Horn, and so on...

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by green machine
He has made a difference, true, but so have Andre Miller and Voshon Leonard. It's like saying Kidd was the sole reason for New Jersey's resurgence, while ignoring a healthy K-Mart, Kittles, Van Horn, and so on...

i didnt say he was the ONLY reason - hes a big reason. and hes a big name.

its not like the all star game is composed of the 12 best players anyways.

 

[green machine]

Originally posted by NugzFan
i didnt say he was the ONLY reason - hes a big reason. and hes a big name.

its not like the all star game is composed of the 12 best players anyways.

You're right, the All Star game is about names. And that is something that bugs me.

I expect fans to vote for names. I expect analysts to vote for the best possible players.

 

[SunsTzu]

Originally posted by NugzFan
i think a lot of it is the difference hes made in denver.

Amare made a big impact on the Suns last year, that didn't help him get into the AS game. I think AS should be about production and ROY should be influenced by impact if the race is close. Much like last year.

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by SunsTzu
Amare made a big impact on the Suns last year, that didn't help him get into the AS game. I think AS should be about production and ROY should be influenced by impact if the race is close. Much like last year.

well amares rookie season wasnt as good as melos is right now.

 

[SunsTzu]

He shot at a better % and got more rebounds being the 3rd option. Plus he was doing it in the west against top pf.

I'm not saying Amare deserved it last year, but he deserved it as much as Melo does this year. Melo just is not a top 5 forward in the west right now.

 

[capologist]

Originally posted by NugzFan
man i wish miller could make the AS game but he has no shot - too many awesome west pgs.

I agree that he won’t make the team, but I disagee with the reason. Steve Francis is not “awesome.” He’s just going to be voted in by the fans, and it’s ridiculous.

Originally posted by green machine
He has made a difference, true, but so have Andre Miller and Voshon Leonard.

And Marcus Camby, who spent most of last season on IR. And Earl Boykins. There are eight players averaging at least 15 minutes per game for the Nuggets this season: Anthony, Miller, Lenard, Camby, Boykins, Nenê, John Barry, and Francisco Elson. Of those eight, only two were on the team last year, one of those two spent most of the season on IR, and the other was a rookie. This is a completely new team.

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by SunsTzu
He shot at a better % and got more rebounds being the 3rd option. Plus he was doing it in the west against top pf.

I'm not saying Amare deserved it last year, but he deserved it as much as Melo does this year. Melo just is not a top 5 forward in the west right now.

dude, amare plays PF. melo is SF. you are comparing apples and oranges.

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by capologist
I agree that he won’t make the team, but I disagee with the reason. Steve Francis is not “awesome.” He’s just going to be voted in by the fans, and it’s ridiculous.

agreed

 

[arthurracoon]

Originally posted by NugzFan
dude, amare plays PF. melo is SF. you are comparing apples and oranges.

EXACTLY!!!


So how can you say that:

Originally posted by NugzFan
well amares rookie season wasnt as good as melos is right now.

How can you compare apples and oranges?

 

[F-Dog]

I like your computer's choices for the WC, cap.

I'm not so sure about Dre Miller (especially since he tanked last season on purpose)--I'd probably pick Bibby ahead of him. Since Steve Francis is going anyway, it wouldn't matter.



In the East, I would move PP to small forward, and take Donyell Marshall and S A-R out entirely; Donyell wasn't all-star caliber with Chicago, and I think Rahim's numbers belie his lack of impact.

That leaves room for Iverson and another forward--I guess you could shoehorn LeBron James into that spot.

 

[frdbtr]

the thing that bugs me about the all star game is it's a beauty contest. I don't think that Yao Ming should be an all star. He is a decent player but should not be an all star yet. On the other hand, Andre Kirelinko (sp?) will probably not make it and he is playing all star ball in the very least right now.

 

[devilalum]

Originally posted by F-Dog
I like your computer's choices for the WC, cap.

I'm not so sure about Dre Miller (especially since he tanked last season on purpose)--I'd probably pick Bibby ahead of him. Since Steve Francis is going anyway, it wouldn't matter.



In the East, I would move PP to small forward, and take Donyell Marshall and S A-R out entirely; Donyell wasn't all-star caliber with Chicago, and I think Rahim's numbers belie his lack of impact.

That leaves room for Iverson and another forward--I guess you could shoehorn LeBron James into that spot.

LBJ will probably get voted in thanks to the NBA media machine but no way he deserves it THIS YEAR. There are at least 12 Eastern Conf. vets that deserve it more and have paid their dues.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Well the media machine only affects the fans vote for starters. Coaches are rarely obsessed with the media's view.

In the eastern conference, you can make a case for him. In the west, no way, but there just isn't the talent in the east to put up a hard competition.

 

[Joe Mama]

I saw that the other day. Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith basically cheated by putting Anthony at guard. IMO Sam Cassell should definitely be starting in the Western Conference. The other starter is not so easy to come up with because the guards in the Western Conference haven't been that great this season. Steve Francis will probably be voted in and starter even though he probably doesn't deserve to be there at all. I would probably start Gary Payton alongside Cassell.

I'm not sure Yao Ming deserves to be an all-star at all much less a starter. I would start Shaquille O'Neal with Brad Miller as the backup.

Joe Mama

 

[capologist]

Originally posted by F-Dog
In the East, I would move PP to small forward, and take Donyell Marshall and S A-R out entirely; Donyell wasn't all-star caliber with Chicago, and I think Rahim's numbers belie his lack of impact.

That leaves room for Iverson and another forward--I guess you could shoehorn LeBron James into that spot.

Actually, that leaves room for Iverson and Carter, both of whom are going to be voted in. So you still need to take out another player to make room for James.

Originally posted by frdbtr
Andre Kirelinko (sp?) will probably not make it and he is playing all star ball in the very least right now.

Why do you think he won’t make it? I’ll be surprised if the Western Conference coaches don’t select him as a reserve.

Originally posted by thegrahamcrackr
Well the media machine only affects the fans vote for starters. Coaches are rarely obsessed with the media's view.

Actually, the way it works is this: The fans vote for the five starters. The coaches then vote for seven reserves. Then, if any of those players are unable to participate in the game (for example, due to injury), the commissioner selects replacements. He is, of course, completely guided by marketing considerations.

If there is room for a replacement in the East this year, there is little question that James will get the call —unless he has already been added to the team by the coaches, which I wouldn’t rule out. His 20/6/6 numbers are All-Star quality, and he has even lead his team to a reasonable record since the Ricky Davis trade.

Originally posted by Joe Mama
I'm not sure Yao Ming deserves to be an all-star at all much less a starter.

I think Yao is does deserve to make the team, though perhaps not as a starter. He’s certainly more deserving than his teammate, Steve Francis. His numbers are solid: 15.7 ppg, .522 FG%, 9.3 rpg, 1.6 apg, 1.9 bpg. He does this all in only 32.6 mpg on a low-scoring team^{<a href="#YaoNote">*</a>}. And his numbers would be even more impressive if his team would just give them ball where he is effective with it and let him do the things he does so well, instead of making him set screens for Stevie 20 feet from the hoop.

I would start Shaquille O'Neal with Brad Miller as the backup.

I agree that Miller also deserves to be there. I think there should be three centers on this year’s team.

<br>

<small>^{<a name="YaoNote">*</a>} Players on low-scoring teams tend to have lower stats than players on high-scoring teams, but that doesn’t suggest inferiority. Consider the Mavericks and the Rockets. The Mavericks are 24-16, score an average of 102.8 per game, and allow an average of 100.3 per game. The Rockets are 23-16, score an average of 87.3 per game, and allow an average of 83.6 per game. So the performances of the two teams so far this season have actually been very similar. The Mavs’ players have much better stats than the Rockets’ players, but can not be said to be having a much better season.</small>

 

[Joe Mama]

Cap, upon further review I could read a Yao Ming should be an All-Star. I'm surprised at what a quiet year he is having though. Last year he was probably the biggest story of the NBA season.

Joe Mama

 

[sly fly]

Lebron James over Stephon in the East.

Leaving LeBron off that list is criminal.

 

[capologist]

Well, it is just a computer thing. It’s not like the machine actually watches the games.

On balance, Steph’s stats (20.1ppg, .434 FG%, .318 (3P%), 8.8apg, 3.4rpg, 1.8spg, 3.1tpg) are slightly better than LeBron’s (20.4ppg, .417 FG%, .273 (3P%), 6.2apg, 5.9rpg, 1.6spg, 3.9tpg). Also working again LeBron is an abysmal record (not that Steph’s is all that much better).

Still, LeBron has been moving quickly up the ratings since the Davis trade, and will probably pass Steph before the season is through.

BTW, after today’s games, Gadzuric edged ahead of Foster. Exciting race, that.

 

[NugzFan]

Originally posted by arthurracoon
EXACTLY!!!


So how can you say that:



How can you compare apples and oranges?

because he is having a better one. its like saying duncan is better than cuttino mobley.

i was referring to stuff like rebounds...duh amare should have more!

 

[cly2tw]

Originally posted by capologist

Still, LeBron has been moving quickly up the ratings since the Davis trade, and will probably pass Steph before the season is through.

The way Steph has been playing in the last 4 games, it's not gonna happen. Steph has the shooters he needed all along. When the teammates get a good feel about how they best play off of his penetration, he will even have more space to score himself! And he is mature enough to have no problem with van Horne anymore.