Am I wrong about our defense?

[RedRob]

I was at every game last season and I have to say that I don't feel our defense is as bad as everyone (espescially local am radio) thinks.

Sure we had the blah blah ranked defense and all that crap. However, watching the GAMES it always seemed as if the defense hung in there. The number of 3 and outs before half time was ridiculous.

Remember the Super Bowl? Carolina looked untouchable till mid way through the 3rd quarter when it became obvious the D line was running on fumes. I'm not comparing the Cards D to Carolina, I am saying that you can't spend 35 - 40 minutes on the field and expect to hold teams to less than 300 yards of offense.

Let's assume our offense gets their act together. I can hear ESPN commentary saying something along the lines of "Denny Green has'nt been know for his defensive intellect but taking the Cards from 30th (or whatever it was) to 16th in the league is remarkable." And all of this for having a balanced team.

Does anybody have our defensive stats through the 1st and 2nd quarters last year? I distinctly remember how poorly we started games 2 seasons ago. Remember that pain in the ass stat we used to hear all the time "The Cardinals haven't scored on their first possession in the last 6 billion games." Last season we seemed to be in almost everygame at half time. In my opinion it was BECAUSE of the defense not in spite of it.

If anybody can prove this with stats I'll be most appreciative. And, I'll call doofus Dan Bickley and throw it at him.

I know we need help on D. It's my opinion that though that a decent offense would equate to 1 to 2 quality free agents.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Well, the last few teams I have seen out on the field have been awful. Sub-par corners trying to cover for way to long because our pass rush is non-exhistant. And a LB core with very little depth.

This year I like Macklin, I am really excited about bringing in Berry, and I think Dockett will prove to be a steal, along with Darby.

But until I see it on the field I am very nervous about our defense.

Peace

 

[slanidrac16]

Three keys to a good defense.

1. Turnovers
2. Stopping the run
3. Sacks

We must get to the + turnover. We have lost the +/- ratio for last last umpteen years.
We must get better at stopping the run especially on 1st down.
We need to get between 30-35 sacks.

Stas are misleading. Offensively if you're getting blown out opposing teams start to give up the short stuff. On defense if you're getting blown out most teams turn coservative to run the clock(except for the 49ers who we owe a beating).

Throw last year out. Opposing teams didn't respect ( nor should they have) our defensive or offensive schemes and game planning. Mac said it a million times in the paper," keep it close so we can give ourselves an opportunity in the 4th quarter." I think there will be games where we will be trying to hang on to win a game as opposed to trying to score to win a game.

 

[Wild Card]

Sure we had the blah blah ranked defense and all that crap. However, watching the GAMES it always seemed as if the defense hung in there. The number of 3 and outs before half time was ridiculous... Does anybody have our defensive stats through the 1st and 2nd quarters last year?... Last season we seemed to be in almost everygame at half time. In my opinion it was BECAUSE of the defense not in spite of it.

Rob:

Sorry, stats won't help make your case. Last year, the Cardinals were scored on by quarter as follows: Q1 122 pts; Q2 128 pts; Q3 102 pts; Q4 122 pts. Their defense gave up 452 points, or 28.3 ppg, worst in the league.

They allowed opponents to convert on third down 46.2 percent of the time (32nd). They surrendered an average of 344 yards per game (26th), 119.7 rushing (19th) and 224.3 passing (29th). They only picked off 13 INTs (T-25th), contributing to a net turnover total of -13 (30th). They sacked opposing QBs a mere 21 times (30th).

Granted, they played better on some Sundays--mostly, at home--than others. But this was clearly among the worst defenses in the NFL, by any measure.

Let's hope Darnell Dockett and Karlos Dansby can contribute as rookies. Let's hope that FA additions Bertrand Berry and David Macklin make a difference at their positions. Let's hope that Duane Starks and Kyle Vanden Bosch come all the way back from their most-recent injuries. If all/most of those things happen, the Cards defense could be much improved in 2004.

If not, even if Dennis Green is successful in retooling the offense by adding Larry Fitzgerald and reshuffling last year's roster, the Cards are gonna lose a lot of games. Again.

WC

 

[Skkorpion]

Adrian Wilson personally screwed up the entire defense on first and second downs and Marmie took care of the 3rd and longs with a 3 man rush and 8 man soft zone.

IMO, we'll be more improved on defense than offense.

 

[earthsci]

Geez, it would be so much easier just to be a Dolphin's fan.

 

[jmr667]

Mac said it a million times in the paper," keep it close so we can give ourselves an opportunity in the 4th quarter."

This should be a big difference this year. Basically this is just hoping something good happens in the 4th quarter. Maybe the other team makes a mistake, or maybe they are not in as good physical condition so they will wear out. A team with as little depth as the Cardinals to rotate effective backups so starters can take a breather can't bank on that.
Green will (hopefully) have legitimate plans for the games ahead of time. Come out targetting the other teams weaknesses, catch them off guard and put some points on the board before they can make adjustments. Then our defense can key on passing plays as teams try to play catch up. Should result in more sacks and turnovers this year too.

How's that for a burst of Monday morning optimism?

 

[DieHardCardFan]

I remember watching the games and thinking the same thing. I remember thinking if Blake would just hold on to the ball, or throw the damn ball, or why are we passing and never running! Then here comes out D for the 10th time in the quarter. I would be interested in knowing what the time of possesion break down is. It is only speculation on my part but I would guess that our D spend way more time on the field than most other teams.

Statistically our D stunk it up pretty bad. But in alot of cases it sure did appear that our O was partially responsible.

 

[Wild Card]

I would be interested in knowing what the time of possesion break down is. It is only speculation on my part but I would guess that our D spend way more time on the field than most other teams.

DieHard:

You'd be wrong. For the 2003 season, the Cardinals' average time of possession was 29:41. Their opponents' average was 30:19.

In selected games, you were right. Against Baltimore, the Cards had the ball for only 27:18, as opposed to the Ravens' 32:42. (Of course, the Ravens spent much of that game running the ball down the Cards' throats, which tends to eat clock.)

But the disparity in time of possession wasn't usually that great. And it was certainly no excuse for the defense's lackluster performance.

WC

 

[slanidrac16]

IMO, we'll be more improved on defense than offense.

Why? Is it because the defense was so bad that measurably it will be easier to improve on stats? Or do you feel the offense won't live up to expectations?

 

[slanidrac16]

Rob:

Sorry, stats won't help make your case. Last year, the Cardinals were scored on by quarter as follows: Q1 122 pts; Q2 128 pts; Q3 102 pts; Q4 122 pts. Their defense gave up 452 points, or 28.3 ppg, worst in the league.

They allowed opponents to convert on third down 46.2 percent of the time (32nd). They surrendered an average of 344 yards per game (26th), 119.7 rushing (19th) and 224.3 passing (29th). They only picked off 13 INTs (T-25th), contributing to a net turnover total of -13 (30th). They sacked opposing QBs a mere 21 times (30th).

Granted, they played better on some Sundays--mostly, at home--than others. But this was clearly among the worst defenses in the NFL, by any measure.

Let's hope Darnell Dockett and Karlos Dansby can contribute as rookies. Let's hope that FA additions Bertrand Berry and David Macklin make a difference at their positions. Let's hope that Duane Starks and Kyle Vanden Bosch come all the way back from their most-recent injuries. If all/most of those things happen, the Cards defense could be much improved in 2004.

If not, even if Dennis Green is successful in retooling the offense by adding Larry Fitzgerald and reshuffling last year's roster, the Cards are gonna lose a lot of games. Again.

WC

We need many things to happen to have a "unbelievable" season. However , I feel that this team will improve 20% across the board just on coaching alone. Is 20% enough improvement to make the playoffs? In a word, no. That would put us at around 7-9 for the season and statistically ranking in the in the lower to mid 20's. By that I mean, as an example 22nd against the pass, 23rd in points allowed, etc.
I do happen to think offensively we wil surprise many people although it might not happen coming right out of the box. It will take some time, but before this season is over we will be looked at as offensive power that opposing teams will not be looking forward to playing against down the stretch.

 

[ajcardfan]

I feel like the number one problem our defense has lacked for the last few seasons is generating big plays. Get more sacks, and more turnovers, then our numbers will improve across the board. How many times have we watched teams go on 15 play drives and take 7 minutes off the clock the last three seasons?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I feel like the number one problem our defense has lacked for the last few seasons is generating big plays. Get more sacks, and more turnovers, then our numbers will improve across the board. How many times have we watched teams go on 15 play drives and take 7 minutes off the clock the last three seasons?

I'll take that a step further aj and say that the number one problem with the cards defense has been a lack of a pass rush.

And when I say "lack" I mean "non existent".

For about the last three years, opposing QBs have been able to sit back in the pocket with a cup o' coffee and a cigarette. It was/is sickening. If we get less than 35 sacks this year again, we won't sniff the playoffs.

WC's stats prove my assertion that we were pretty decent against the run last year. And I don't think that is a major problem.

It starts up front. Berterand, Dockett, Bryant, Davis, Pace, Johnson,Wakefield and KVB have to start getting it done in terms of pass rushing.

 

[Chopper0080]

Now don't get me wrong, I am not saying our defense is or was good. But the one thing that I commented on last year and will bring up this year is that the Cardinals defense had to defend a lot of short field situations due to offensive inepptitude (i just put in a 11 hour day so I'm doubt that is spelled right). Given a long field the Cardinals defense was much better as with any team. IF, and this is a big if, the Cardinals can stay out of giving up the short field it will definitely help out the defense. I think two of the key stats for us this year will be turnovers (especially from the opposing 40 on in) and offensive time of possession. Both of these areas will help hide our defense until it gels enough to be semi-effective.

Do we have the opportunity to be semi-effective? Well it depends on many things but most importantly on big plays, and to make big plays you need playmakers. I see one current veteran, two potential veterans and two rookies. The one playmaker that I feel we have is Dexter Jackson at S. We have two potential ones in Berry at DE and Starks at CB. We have two rookies who I believe have the ability to make big plays in Dansby at OLB and Dockett at DT. Both could have an impact in rushing the QB though Dockett gets the edge because of his opportunity to play right away.

Respectable is as good as our defense will get this year in my opinion. I believe that our offense will definitely be a major part of making this happen.

 

[Wild Card]

... the one thing that I commented on last year and will bring up this year is that the Cardinals defense had to defend a lot of short field situations due to offensive ineptitude... Given a long field the Cardinals defense was much better as with any team. IF, and this is a big if, the Cardinals can stay out of giving up the short field it will definitely help out the defense.

Chopper:

No question that it's easier to defend a long field than a short one. But the average drive against the 2003 Cardinals defense was 31 yards. Only two teams--the Jets and Bengals--gave up more yards to their opponents on each possession. And the other team scored TDs on 27 percent of its drives against the Cards' D (worst in the NFL, tied with the Chargers).

The offense didn't help matters much. The Cards gained only 23 yards per possession, among the lower averages in the league. When offensive and defensive averages are combined, the Cards lost eight yards on each exchange of possession (worst in the NFL, tied with the Texans). In effect, they were going backward all year long.

(Drive chart data from Two Minute Warning: http://www.twominutewarning.com/dc03.htm )

It's simple, really. The offense has to get better. The defense has to get better. That's why they hired Dennis Green, right?

WC

 

[joeshmo]

A better Offense will inherently make the D slightly better, which means our D wasnt as bad as the stats show but we cannot deny that it was still a very bad D, no one can say anything to prove other wise all you have to do is just watch the games and one will know.

 

[Duckjake]

The Cardinals defense improved dramatically the day Dave McGinnis and Joe Greene were shown the door.

 

[MastersofCombat]

OMG a BLind Hypnotized Homer. LOL

We had a disgusting defense and the only thing you could hope for is that the other team wasnt quite on that day. Or that they would give up once they had a big lead thinking the game was over "Minnesota".
"That" Defense is 80% back this year, and as a Card fan dont have any idea why we didnt hit the free agent market harder in this area.
If we lose its here youll look this year. Last year they couldnt afford 1 turnover a game(unrealistic).. this year they should be better or Dennis will start the season 0-5.

 

[Wild Card]

"That" Defense is 80% back this year, and as a Card fan dont have any idea why we didnt hit the free agent market harder in this area.

MOC:

I don't know where you're getting the "80 percent" number. If Darnell Dockett and Karlos Dansby wind up starting (not unrealistic, for 2nd and 3rd-rounders who were thought by some to have 1st-round talent), Kyle Vanden Bosch and Duane Starks are healthy, and FAs Bertrand Berry and David Macklin start (as both are penciled in to do, for training camp at least), over 50 percent of the base defense starters will be changed from last year.

The offense is where next-to-nothing was done in the offseason, in terms of new players. Other than a rookie WR and a backup QB, that part of the roster looks like the same ol' same ol'. But there are some fresh faces, and improved talent, on the defensive side. Cause for some cautious optimism, IMO.

WC

 

[slanidrac16]

The offense will be our catylist......

to an exciting season. I just hope it can come together quickly.

What a great statistic by Wild Card! We lost an average of 8 yds per change of posession!. SOOOOO many times while watching the games last year I would tell my Son that we needed 2 or 3 first downs for field position, only to watch a 3 and out and see the opposition take over on the 50 yd lineafter the punt. Not every posession is going to result in points but our scheme and play calling last year were just terrible.

As far as he defense, I think we will gamble a little more which will result in more big plays against us but we will have more turnovers and sacks. If that is the case our offense will have an increased number of posessions. If we take advantage of those posessions we will win some games 31-28. If we don't we will be losing those games 28-24.

I see us involved in higher scoring games this year. It will really be exciting if this offense comes out flying. I don't see that happening right away, but teams facing us down the stretch may be in for a rude awakening. OHHHH, to be 6-6 heading into the last 4 games......

 

[Duckjake]

We had a disgusting defense and the only thing you could hope for is that the other team wasnt quite on that day. Or that they would give up once they had a big lead thinking the game was over "Minnesota".

I will be the first to agree that the Cardinals have had a disgusting defense, not only last year but every year since 1998.

I still believe it was coaching. However, for those of you who think it was, and still is, lack of talent could you point out which of these players lacks the talent for the Cardinals to have a decent D this season.

This is just my thrown together starting lineup and I don't want a debate over who should start. Just where is the weakness that can be attacked sucessfully by opposing offensive coordinators. That way I can get a head start on what positions to watch in college this year for April 2005.

DE Bertrand B. (Pace)
DT Dockett (Davis)
DT Bryant (Bell)
DE DJohnson
LB Thompson
MB McKinnon
LB Hayes (Fisher)
CB Starks (Barrett)
CB Macklin (committee)
S Wilson
S Jackson

 

[joeshmo]

Reasons for a better D this year(in no particular order):

1. Mackln
2. Berry
3. Dockett, Dansby
4. Healthy Starks(already running full speed in 7 on 7 drills)
5. Coaching
6. Game planning(teams wont know our calls this year)
7. A better Offense
8. A better Special teams

Reasons for concern(some more then others):

1. Can we count on Rookies, Dansby and Dockett?
2. Can Bryant make the Jump with better coaching?
3. Can Starks stay healthy?
4. Thompson has 2 strikes against him.
5. Can Hayes make the jump to starter this year?
6. KVB health
7. Can Pace and or DJ get any better from last year?
8. DT depth
9. Is Wilson a changed man?
10. Jackson's health
11. Can McKinnon hold up in this new attacking dline
12. We have never seen this D style and coaching in a game yet.
13. Is McCown turnover prone or has he learned his lesson?

Once the final depth chart and preseason is done we should have a lot better picture, becuae as of right now none of us have seen this type of defense with this type of players and this type of coaches and gameplan. Until that happens no one has a clue as to what this D can or will do. All we can do is a lot of speculating.

 

[MastersofCombat]

My feelings are this...
THe Cardinals drafting defensive players and they actually produce their rookie year?
hmm lets see
Cant really think of any 1st or 2nd rounders in their rookie year making it.
Andre Wadsworth
Raynoch Thompson
Tom Knight
Wendall Byrant
Vanden Bosch
Calvin Pace
Another LB we drafted cant think of his name...


SO tell me who was the last first or second rounder that was drafted and absolutly turned that position around that year??
Did Simeon Rice produce I think so but otherwise it would have to go back to
Aeneas WIlliams 2nd round? has it been that long?
Eric Hill or Ken Harvey?

See you cant count on Cardinal Defensive draft picks to do well their first year in the NFL.

 

[joeshmo]

See you cant count on Cardinal Defensive draft picks to do well their first year in the NFL.

Why not?

First, it isnt the same people making those picks. Second, we didnt reach for any of the picks unlike are strategy of years past. Third, if I am not mistaken our scouting department has been slowly overhauled the past 2-3 years. Fourth, real coaches who know how to coach(Green is gone, Yah). Fifth, real coaches who know how to game plan(teams wont know our calls anymore). Sixth, no more injury waiver problems and or really long hold outs which was a big hinderence on most of those players development.

Now I am not saying that our high defensive picks will make a big difference their first years but there is more proof that they will make a difference then in years past.

 

[MastersofCombat]

Well we do have a 2nd round pick LB again ....
Lets see if he starts ...