Arizona Cardinals rookie film room: 5 plays that define Zach Allen

Harry

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This is why you can’t scout on YouTube. They actually couldn’t put together 5 really impressive plays. In play 1 he beats a TE block. Most decent linemen would. I’ll be surprised if the Cards see him holding the edge much. He’s technically sound and fairly strong, but he’s not agile. He’s best going straight ahead. I think they try to build him into an inside player focused on collapsing the pocket in passing downs. I think he’s a role player at best. In most years that’s fine in round 3. This wasn’t most years.
 

Krangodnzr

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This is why you can’t scout on YouTube. They actually couldn’t put together 5 really impressive plays. In play 1 he beats a TE block. Most decent linemen would. I’ll be surprised if the Cards see him holding the edge much. He’s technically sound and fairly strong, but he’s not agile. He’s best going straight ahead. I think they try to build him into an inside player focused on collapsing the pocket in passing downs. I think he’s a role player at best. In most years that’s fine in round 3. This wasn’t most years.

That's exactly what everyone else says.

Hes going to be a 5 tech, sometimes 3 tech.
 

CFLredzoned

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When I read his evals, it sounds like everything I read about Bosa - lacks speed and agility, makes up for it with power and technique, will be limited against certain OT. Clearly they're not the same guy though. But what separates the two?
 

Krangodnzr

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When I read his evals, it sounds like everything I read about Bosa - lacks speed and agility, makes up for it with power and technique, will be limited against certain OT. Clearly they're not the same guy though. But what separates the two?

Hes less quick, and bigger.

Much better suited to 3-4 DE, while Bosa is a better fit as a 4-3 DE.

If you look at team need, Allen is actually a better fit for the Cardinals than Bosa was.
 

Dr. Jones

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I think he is a run stuffing version of Markus Golden. Way more than a role player and will be the understudy to Brooks Reed.

Personally, I like him a lot more that I probably should.... And think that all of his overwhelming production will translate to the NFL.

I am also very intrigued with how he bats down passes.
 

Lagerfilled

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I think he is a run stuffing version of Markus Golden. Way more than a role player and will be the understudy to Brooks Reed.

Personally, I like him a lot more that I probably should.... And think that all of his overwhelming production will translate to the NFL.

I am also very intrigued with how he bats down passes.

Allen will NOT be cast in a 3-4 OLB/Edge role. He will be lined up next to Peters as the 3-4 DE/5 technique ala Calais Campbell.
 

Dr. Jones

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I see that also..... Don't overlook our lack of depth when dudes get tired. i bet he swings outside sometimes. Especially if we want to set a strong edge, or keep a mobile QB in the pocket consistently. We will see.
 

jf-08

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This is why you can’t scout on YouTube. They actually couldn’t put together 5 really impressive plays. In play 1 he beats a TE block. Most decent linemen would. I’ll be surprised if the Cards see him holding the edge much. He’s technically sound and fairly strong, but he’s not agile. He’s best going straight ahead. I think they try to build him into an inside player focused on collapsing the pocket in passing downs. I think he’s a role player at best. In most years that’s fine in round 3. This wasn’t most years.

The article basically said that these are the typical plays that you get from him. It wasn't a highlight reel. They said exactly what you are saying about him.
 

Krangodnzr

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Allen will NOT be cast in a 3-4 OLB/Edge role. He will be lined up next to Peters as the 3-4 DE/5 technique ala Calais Campbell.

I see the same thing. Allen is at his worst lining up on the edge unless he's taking on a weaker or slower player.

It's obvious that the Cardinals are looking at him as a 5 tech End. I wouldn't be surprised 5 years from now that Allen ends up being the best pick. Yes, that means that Murray busts, but I think Allen has a good shot at being a good player. He's tough, works hard, and is relentless.
 

Krangodnzr

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This is why you can’t scout on YouTube. They actually couldn’t put together 5 really impressive plays. In play 1 he beats a TE block. Most decent linemen would. I’ll be surprised if the Cards see him holding the edge much. He’s technically sound and fairly strong, but he’s not agile. He’s best going straight ahead. I think they try to build him into an inside player focused on collapsing the pocket in passing downs. I think he’s a role player at best. In most years that’s fine in round 3. This wasn’t most years.

A role player that the team REALLY needed. I think you are getting fixated on what he CAN'T do, instead of looking at what he can do.
 

dscher

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I think he is a run stuffing version of Markus Golden. Way more than a role player and will be the understudy to Brooks Reed.

Personally, I like him a lot more that I probably should.... And think that all of his overwhelming production will translate to the NFL.

I am also very intrigued with how he bats down passes.
Ding. I think this is exactly who they thought could replace Golden. Has alot of the same attributes as well..imo. I always like high motor guys though.
 

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Before he came to the combine, Zach Allen was viewed as a fringe 1st round prospect by a large number of scouts and pundits. You could tell he wouldn't blow up the combine, but his numbers were even worse than thought. He is very similar to JJ Watt in terms of style. Of course he is a bit smaller, weaker and slower than Watt as a prospect. But I see the same relentless, aggressive style and same advanced hand usage. Remember Watt, despite some great athletic combine numbers, was viewed as a stiff tweener and questionable scheme fit without the ability to bend. In retrospect, Watt didn't need any bend with his strong hands and initial quickness, because he beats opponents right off the snap no matter where he lines up. Now I'm not expecting Zach Allen to become anything close to Watt. But if you think of a Watt light, who can line up inside on passing down to cause havoc in the QB's face, as well as being a strong edge setter on run downs, that's what you get. His hustle alone will make him a fan favorite soon enough.
 

WildBB

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He was very active at BC making plays...bottom line. Non stop competitor. He'll vastly improve the run D at the very least which was pretty atrocious last year. I'll be watching this kid.
 

Harry

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Before he came to the combine, Zach Allen was viewed as a fringe 1st round prospect by a large number of scouts and pundits. You could tell he wouldn't blow up the combine, but his numbers were even worse than thought. He is very similar to JJ Watt in terms of style. Of course he is a bit smaller, weaker and slower than Watt as a prospect. But I see the same relentless, aggressive style and same advanced hand usage. Remember Watt, despite some great athletic combine numbers, was viewed as a stiff tweener and questionable scheme fit without the ability to bend. In retrospect, Watt didn't need any bend with his strong hands and initial quickness, because he beats opponents right off the snap no matter where he lines up. Now I'm not expecting Zach Allen to become anything close to Watt. But if you think of a Watt light, who can line up inside on passing down to cause havoc in the QB's face, as well as being a strong edge setter on run downs, that's what you get. His hustle alone will make him a fan favorite soon enough.

So about 30 watt?
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Ding. I think this is exactly who they thought could replace Golden. Has alot of the same attributes as well..imo. I always like high motor guys though.
I think you and Dr. Jones either (a) don’t understand the 3-4; or (b) have no idea what position Golden played. He is in no way supposed to play the position vacated by Golden.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Before he came to the combine, Zach Allen was viewed as a fringe 1st round prospect by a large number of scouts and pundits. You could tell he wouldn't blow up the combine, but his numbers were even worse than thought. He is very similar to JJ Watt in terms of style. Of course he is a bit smaller, weaker and slower than Watt as a prospect. But I see the same relentless, aggressive style and same advanced hand usage. Remember Watt, despite some great athletic combine numbers, was viewed as a stiff tweener and questionable scheme fit without the ability to bend. In retrospect, Watt didn't need any bend with his strong hands and initial quickness, because he beats opponents right off the snap no matter where he lines up. Now I'm not expecting Zach Allen to become anything close to Watt. But if you think of a Watt light, who can line up inside on passing down to cause havoc in the QB's face, as well as being a strong edge setter on run downs, that's what you get. His hustle alone will make him a fan favorite soon enough.
I think you’re setting him up for failure if you’re in any way shape or form comparing him to Watt. Even as “Watt light.”
 

dscher

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I think you and Dr. Jones either (a) don’t understand the 3-4; or (b) have no idea what position Golden played. He is in no way supposed to play the position vacated by Golden.
I agreed with k9 that he was ultimately a replacement for Nekemdiche. I guess with some of the tape I saw of him, he plays alot like Golden with his high motor....unlike diche. Did Golden not play ANY DE in the 3-4? :shrug:
 

DVontel

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Are you guys gonna compare every hard-nosed, limited-athletically DL to Markus Golden
 

Timm Rosenbach

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If this team had not been moved to a 3-4 because of Wilks, there was enough talent to be a very good defensive team last year. Bucannon was wasted and Reddick is probably never going to be a solid NFL starter because a. He was never very good in the first place and B. He has been jerked around by bad coaching. Need to get a space eating monster nose tackle next offseason and get some quick linebackers who hit hard. The bend but don’t break defense could become dominant in two off seasons. And then we will see whether Kliff K can work magic and turn this offense into a well oiled machine. Keim will be the scape goat if things don’t turn around quick
 

Veer

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I think you’re setting him up for failure if you’re in any way shape or form comparing him to Watt. Even as “Watt light.”
I compare him to Watt as a prospect. Nobody could tell that Watt would turn into an all-time great when he got drafted. Considering the huge amount of talent the 2011 draft held, Watt was viewed as a bad pick by most pundits. Watt is the prime example that you can get by without any bend and somewhat stiff-looking, if you have a good first step, excellent hands and non-stop motor. Zach Allen shares these traits with Watt. Their college film is similar. And no, you can't even expect Allen to turn into 10% the player Watt has become as a pro.

The comparison to Watt isn't meant to put pressure on Allen. It's just that they are quite similar as prospects. If you want a more reasonable comparison, I think of Brett Keisel. Same size, below average athleticism. Played upright, but won with hands and relentless spirit. Never a star, but had a great 10+ year career with the Steelers. Now Allen would already be a success if he turns out to be half the player Keisel was. Keisel was a similar, although much worse prospect than Allen. JJ Nelson compares to DeSean Jackson favorably, but he is a much worse player. They are just very similar. You get my point.
 

Krangodnzr

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I agreed with k9 that he was ultimately a replacement for Nekemdiche. I guess with some of the tape I saw of him, he plays alot like Golden with his high motor....unlike diche. Did Golden not play ANY DE in the 3-4? :shrug:

No. Golden was an edge player, 34 OLB.

Allen is an interior player, 34 DE.
 

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